Would you support a 'Christian Zone'?
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only a sojourner
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Tulc, if you don't mind what is the name of the community you are living in and where is it? I've spent a little time at JPUSA in Chicago.
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only a sojourner
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There are many Christian communities (communes) across the US, Europe and elsewhere. Jesus People USA (JPUSA) is in Chicago and has a website. I believe its population numbers somewhere around 400 and dates back to the Jesus Movement. It works with the homeless population, operates shelters. It published Cornerstone Magazine and Cornerstone Press also published various books often by resident authors. Grr Records and JPUSA was also the home of Glen Kaiser, the Rez Band, the Crossing (a Celtic folk band). JPUSA welcomes visitors but they will put you to work, perhaps in the kitchen or in their homeless shelter. When I was last there because of my background in casework/ social work I worked with the elderly. There were many people always visiting from countries from all around the world, especially Europe. Chicago is also a very interesting city to visit.
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Ringo84
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I know the Bible says that we are to be "in the world, not of", but I think some Christians take that too far. It never says that we are to separate ourselves, as though we're just too good for this sinful world. That's not what Jesus did.
On the "secular" side, legislation should not reflect religious belief, because government has no business meddling in religious affairs. Issues of divorce, church attendance and the like are matters left to the church. If some people can't handle that, they need a refresher course on the Constitution.
On the "secular" side, legislation should not reflect religious belief, because government has no business meddling in religious affairs. Issues of divorce, church attendance and the like are matters left to the church. If some people can't handle that, they need a refresher course on the Constitution.
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...zone where everyone has to agree with me. Hey, isn't there a name for that - dictat...something.
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Dave Ellis
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Sounds great. Do you support a zone like this for every different denomination of Christianity?
How about every different religion? How about every denomination of every other religion?
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Really? I'd be interested to hear more, if you'd be interested to tell?Hey, I've lived in a Christian commune of around 400 people since 1978 and we've never torn anyone apart, heck, we've never even tried to burn anyone at the stake!
tulc(has seen his share of burned coffee though)
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tulc
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Well...until one group decides to "Remove The Infidels Who Are Polluting Our Land!!" and tries to do so by fire and blood. In the beginning people might get along but all it takes is a couple of people "getting serious about God!" to decide that that nice piece of land next door to mine would be much better belonging to a "true believer!" rather then some infidel/heretic and then the knives would come out. What's needed is for the people in one group to see that while they don't believe like the other group that group is still a citizen of the same country. When everyone breaks up into "this is MY group and I don't have to deal with "those people!"" mentality you're just begging for a pogrom.
tulc(just a thought)
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revanneosl
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The idea of a Christian zone or commune is OK - although I doubt it's common over here where I live, much because of lack of proper facilities, it's difficult to for example rent several apartments side-by-side or near each other (I don't think it should be required to take huge joint bank loan and buy a bunch of tenant-ownerships because it seems overkill), and also because of the lack of religiosity. This is not even a thought I've had often or entertained.
But what I do aim at is to find a few local friends (just two would suffice for a long period of time), one of which should be a new girlfriend (whom I might marry but perhaps not live together with), who would have prior knowledge and prior comprehension about religious matters, who would research together with me, and we would discuss and help others. I would like at least one of these persons, preferably all of them to be much younger than myself so that I could pass on my work to one of them when I get too old to continue to research and would eventually die, together with that I would give all my books to the person of course. I may sound like I'm dictating things, but my idea with all this is that it's pretty expensive to buy books but they can last, expensive to publish books, and time consuming to do all this but at the same time fascinating and invigorating, plus it may take a while for the book that I would publish to sell and I would like someone whom I would trust reap the money from the sales after I die. I know there are some companies that just keep a very large percentage of the sale of every book and charge less initially, but I've been thinking of a company that lets You keep all the money minus the debit-/creditcard processing fee, provided of course that it's possible to deal with them about who should get the money from the sales and that its possible to transfer the money earned without huge money transfer costs - i.e. that they don't require for example a U.S. bank account. The neat thing about that company is that they have actual channels for promoting the book that You pay for.
Now, wouldn't that be something?:
But what I do aim at is to find a few local friends (just two would suffice for a long period of time), one of which should be a new girlfriend (whom I might marry but perhaps not live together with), who would have prior knowledge and prior comprehension about religious matters, who would research together with me, and we would discuss and help others. I would like at least one of these persons, preferably all of them to be much younger than myself so that I could pass on my work to one of them when I get too old to continue to research and would eventually die, together with that I would give all my books to the person of course. I may sound like I'm dictating things, but my idea with all this is that it's pretty expensive to buy books but they can last, expensive to publish books, and time consuming to do all this but at the same time fascinating and invigorating, plus it may take a while for the book that I would publish to sell and I would like someone whom I would trust reap the money from the sales after I die. I know there are some companies that just keep a very large percentage of the sale of every book and charge less initially, but I've been thinking of a company that lets You keep all the money minus the debit-/creditcard processing fee, provided of course that it's possible to deal with them about who should get the money from the sales and that its possible to transfer the money earned without huge money transfer costs - i.e. that they don't require for example a U.S. bank account. The neat thing about that company is that they have actual channels for promoting the book that You pay for.
Now, wouldn't that be something?:
We could totally recreate medieval Europe
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Foamhead
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No, not fair enough.
I once had a roommate who was black. One Friday, in a rush, I accidentally left my check on my dresser and went away for the weekend. When I got back, my check was gone. He came to me and admitted he forged my signature and then signed his under it and cashed it at a store. He asked me to forgive him. Rent was going to be due, so I told him that I would forgive him, but he was going to have to find a way to pay the rent. The next night I came home from work and his stuff was gone.
If I was to say all, or even most black men were thieves, would that be right or wrong of me? Most people would say it is wrong because I would be lumping all of the black men into a group over what one did.
I had a girlfriend once who cheated on me. She was the one feeling guilty and confessed to me. I do believe in forgiveness and as much as that hurt, I forgave her. Until she did it a second time. But if I was to state that women in general were cheating wh@%es, that would be wrong of me to generalize them over what one did.
Yet so many people find it is completely okay to say Christians are self-righteous, greedy, judgmental, etc... and a community of them would simply filter out the good and it would be better off for human beings? You may believe that is true, but the fact is, because you had some bad experience with some pseudo-Christian or have read history where religious idiots did horrible things in the name of God, that must be how all Christians are. The truth is you have absolutely no idea what a true Christian is!
I have known many good Christians who would simply blow your mind how good of people they are if you knew them. I have also known several pseudo-Christians who just because they go to Church they think they know it all and are better than others.
Churches that get millions or billions off the people fall into one of two categories. Not one. The one you recognize is greedy. This is a bad church and the pastor is not of God just because he says he is. The other is it happens to be a great Church that keeps its eyes on God, and because of that, people flock to it. Because Christians believe in the Church and are a giving lot in general, the Church prospers.
To be Christian is to strive to be Christ-like. To love everyone, not persecute. To help others. To be giving and generous, not greedy. To forgive, not be judgmental.
The problem is, the world has this image that Christians have to be perfect or they are not Christians. That if they sin, they are nothing but hypocrites. The truth is, that is so far from the truth it is almost laughable. Christians are not better than anyone else. We are human and therefore we are prone to sin. We have problems just like everyone else. Some have addictions. Some have hot tempers. Some have compulsive needs to lie, steal, smoke, drink, swear. You name a problem, there is a good Christian out there somewhere with that problem. Being a Christian does not mean we do not sin. It means we STRIVE not to sin. It also means that wheh we do sin, we feel bad for it in our hearts. A true Christian feels terrible when they sin because they have let God down. But best of all, a real Christian will also be forgiven for his sins when he asks God for that forgiveness.
The truth is, it is a harder life to be a good Christian than to not be one. To put it simple, if you are not a Christian, Satan doesnt give a crap about ya! He already has you! lol
No this is not getting into the preaching thing. I am not a preacher. I am just trying to point out how badly some of you misunderstand what a true Christian is and how you hate Christians so much because of what some others did because they said they are Christians. Well I can say I am a donkey all I want, and sometimes I will admit my wife thinks I am one in a different sense, but however much I say it, doesnt mean its true.
Middle Eastern men killed over 2000 people on 9/11 and most of us dont blame the entire people for what a few radical terrorists did. But for some reason some people do evil in the name of God and its okay to think that is what Christianity is.
The funny thing is you will persecute the Christians for being judgmental but you dont see anything wrong with coming to a Christian forum and being judgmental yourself.
As for the Christian Zone? IF this zone was filled with true Christians, it would flourish. But if you fill it with pseudo-Christians, the type you are familiar with, then it would do exactly as you thought. Personally I would love to have a very Christian oriented town to go home to every night after working All day in this messed up world. There would be a lot less crime and the neighbors would be a lot more friendly.
Thieving roommates a cheating girlfriends don't form their own cartel of supers PACs and political advocacy groups.
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beaverpond
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I know this is supposed to be hypothetical and we know there are groups out there that actually exist like this. Not long ago this was actually brought up in our church about doing something like this and many of us rejected the idea for the plain and simple reason that we are supposed to go out spread God's word to all of the uttermost. How can we do that if we are staying in one spot? We are not going out into the surrounding communities. We are not going out into the other lands (foreign lands). We are not sharing God's word with people who are not saved, we are supposed to help bring people of all ages to believe in God...we can't do that in a commune. There is so much that we are supposed to do that being in commune that we cannot do that God commands of us.
It would be like throwing out the Bible and saying this is what we are going by now...these are the laws we are going to follow as Christians. While we are following many of them, we would not be following all of them. It is like saying we choose to follow these laws that God laid out, but we don't agree with these so we are not going to follow these any longer.
So by living off on a private piece of property, yes and saying it is a religious order that you or whoever is saying they are following God...you are actually establishing a cult because you are choosing what laws of God you choose to follow.
It would be like throwing out the Bible and saying this is what we are going by now...these are the laws we are going to follow as Christians. While we are following many of them, we would not be following all of them. It is like saying we choose to follow these laws that God laid out, but we don't agree with these so we are not going to follow these any longer.
So by living off on a private piece of property, yes and saying it is a religious order that you or whoever is saying they are following God...you are actually establishing a cult because you are choosing what laws of God you choose to follow.
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Oh! That's actually something I can get behind. I have my bags packed!We could totally recreate medieval Europe
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