The fascinating reformed theology paradox of Hebrew 6:4-6

[Mercy Shown]

So Ro 8 is true only in certain circumstances, not across all God's word and, therefore, has no bearing outside Ro?

Is gravity true across God's earth, or only in certain circumstances?

“I could just as easily reverse your question and ask why you believe Hebrews 6:4–6 applies only under certain circumstances. The issue isn’t that Scripture fails to agree with itself, but that human interpretation sometimes pits one passage against another.

Take your gravity example: some people think astronauts float in orbit because there’s no gravity, when in fact it’s gravity itself that holds them in orbit. Gravity hasn’t failed—people’s understanding of it has. In the same way, God’s Word is consistent; it is our reasoning that can become inconsistent.

Predestination means the destination is ordained, but Scripture also shows that a response of faith is necessary. If you refuse to get on the vehicle God provides to take you to that destination, you won’t arrive. Romans 8 demonstrates God’s sovereign purpose and assurance for those in Christ, while Hebrews 6 provides a sober warning against rejecting that grace. Both stand true, not in contradiction, but in harmony.”

 

[Clare73]

Predestination means the destination is ordained, but Scripture also shows that a response of faith is necessary.

As Scripture likewise shows that faith is a gift (Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3) which God works in you, without which gift working in you no one can believe, and with which gift working in you is necessarily to believe.

 

[Mercy Shown]

As Scripture likewise shows that faith is a gift (Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3) which God works in you, without which gift working in you no one can believe, and with which gift working in you is necessarily to believe.

Yes, but a gift can be rejected.

1. Faith is linked to God’s universal offer​

• Romans 12:3 – “…God has dealt to every man the measure of faith.”
  This doesn’t mean everyone uses it in the same way, but that the capacity to believe has been given universally.
• Hebrews 11:6 – God “rewards those who diligently seek Him.” That implies everyone has the ability to respond — seeking or not seeking is the choice.

2. Faith comes by hearing God’s word, and the word goes out to all​

• Romans 10:17 – “Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
• Just a few verses earlier: Romans 10:18 – Paul says the message “has gone out to all the earth.”
• So, the means to produce faith (God’s word) is available to all people.

3. God calls all people to believe​

• Acts 17:30 – God “commands all people everywhere to repent.”
• If only a few had the ability to respond, this call would be meaningless.
• John 1:9 – Christ is “the true Light, which gives light to every man coming into the world.” That light is the spark that makes faith possible for everyone.

4. Some accept, some reject​

• Mark 6:6 – Jesus “marveled at their unbelief” in Nazareth. He could only marvel if they had the real opportunity to believe.
• Luke 8:12–15 (parable of the sower) – Everyone hears the word, but the difference is in the soil (the heart’s response). The potential for faith is there for all.

5. Faith is a gift — but a gift meant for all​

• Ephesians 2:8–9 – “By grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God.”
  → Salvation (by grace through faith) is the gift — and since grace has appeared to all (Titus 2:11), the capacity for faith is likewise available to all.

 

[Clare73]

Yes, but a gift can be rejected.

That is so patheticly human. . .I can't reject what is operating within me.

God's gifts are not static realities outside yourself, they are his effective operation within you, transforming you from within.

 

[Mercy Shown]

That is so patheticly human. . .I can't reject what is operating within me.

God's gifts are not static realities outside yourself, they are his effective operation within you, transforming you from within.

Simply repeating the premise does not make it more convincing. If something is truly a gift, then by its very nature it must be capable of being either received or rejected. Otherwise, it ceases to be a gift and becomes an imposition.

Think of it this way: if someone gives me a gift, I can choose to accept it with gratitude or to set it aside and refuse it. That freedom is part of what makes it a gift. If I cannot reject it, then it is not something freely given, but something enforced upon me without my consent.

The Bible itself consistently presents God’s grace in this way:

• John 1:11–12 – “He came to His own, and His own received Him not. But to all who received Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God.” → Notice the distinction: some did not receive, others did. The gift was offered, not imposed.
• Revelation 22:17 – “Whosoever will, let him take of the water of life freely.” → A universal invitation that assumes willingness and choice.
• Joshua 24:15 – “Choose you this day whom you will serve…” → Even in the Old Testament, God frames covenant relationship as a matter of choice, not compulsion.
• Hebrews 4:2 – “The message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.” → The gift of God’s word was present, but it was not effective

 

[Clare73]

Simply repeating the premise does not make it more convincing. If something is truly a gift, then by its very nature it must be capable of being either received or rejected.

I guess God didn't get the memo on gifts. . .

 

[Mercy Shown]

I guess God didn't get the memo on gifts. . .

1. Grace can be received in vain

“We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.”
— 2 Corinthians 6:1

Paul’s warning only makes sense if it is possible for someone to receive God’s gift of grace but ultimately reject or nullify it through unbelief or disobedience.

2. The Spirit can be resisted

“Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.”
— Acts 7:51

The Holy Spirit is a gift (Acts 2:38), yet Stephen testifies that Israel resisted Him, showing that God’s gift is not irresistibly imposed.

3. The gift of salvation can be neglected or refused

“How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord…?”
— Hebrews 2:3

Salvation is offered, but people may “neglect” it, failing to embrace God’s gift.

4. The invitation can be rejected

Jesus’ parable of the wedding banquet shows people refusing God’s invitation:

“And they would not come… But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise.”
— Matthew 22:3–5

God’s gift (the kingdom) was genuinely offered, yet rejected.

5. Grace can be fallen from

“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.”
— Galatians 5:4

Here Paul speaks of people who once had access to God’s grace but abandoned it.

6. The Word can be received, then rejected

In the parable of the sower, some “receive the word with joy” but later fall away:

“They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy… but in time of temptation fall away.”
— Luke 8:13

The bible says a lot about people falling away. Especially Paul. What is it that you imagine they were falling away from?

 

[ARBITER01]

1. Grace can be received in vain

“We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.”
— 2 Corinthians 6:1

Paul’s warning only makes sense if it is possible for someone to receive God’s gift of grace but ultimately reject or nullify it through unbelief or disobedience.

2. The Spirit can be resisted

“Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.”
— Acts 7:51

The Holy Spirit is a gift (Acts 2:38), yet Stephen testifies that Israel resisted Him, showing that God’s gift is not irresistibly imposed.

3. The gift of salvation can be neglected or refused

“How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord…?”
— Hebrews 2:3

Salvation is offered, but people may “neglect” it, failing to embrace God’s gift.

4. The invitation can be rejected

Jesus’ parable of the wedding banquet shows people refusing God’s invitation:

“And they would not come… But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise.”
— Matthew 22:3–5

God’s gift (the kingdom) was genuinely offered, yet rejected.

5. Grace can be fallen from

“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.”
— Galatians 5:4

Here Paul speaks of people who once had access to God’s grace but abandoned it.

6. The Word can be received, then rejected

In the parable of the sower, some “receive the word with joy” but later fall away:

“They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy… but in time of temptation fall away.”
— Luke 8:13

The bible says a lot about people falling away. Especially Paul. What is it that you imagine they were falling away from?

I just wanted to let you know, I think your outlines on scripture are superb, but some folks on here are not able to receive/believe them.

Until The Holy Spirit reveals some of these truths to people, they will continue to follow what it is they currently understand,... or want to believe in.

Rather than waste a whole heap of time trying to assert a point that people are continuing to reject, it might be prudent to pull back. This message board is not all that conducive to actually helping many people learn anymore. If the political sections on here were removed the whole thing would fall apart from non-use. Just saying.

 

[Clare73]

1. Grace can be received in vain

The gift of the indwelling Holy Spirit is not a "grace" (ability or power). . .the Holy Spirit is the source of grace.

And one has no choice in the matter, for the indwelling Holy Spirit is the result of the Holy Spirit's sovereign choice (as unaccountable as the wind, Jn 3:3-8) to spiritually regenerate (rebirth) and indwell a person.

“We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.”
— 2 Corinthians 6:1
Paul’s warning only makes sense if it is possible for someone to receive God’s gift of grace but ultimately reject or nullify it through unbelief or disobedience.
2. The Spirit can be resisted
“Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.”
— Acts 7:51
The Holy Spirit is a gift (Acts 2:38), yet Stephen testifies that Israel resisted Him, showing that God’s gift is not irresistibly imposed.
3. The gift of salvation can be neglected or refused
“How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord…?”
— Hebrews 2:3
Salvation is offered, but people may “neglect” it, failing to embrace God’s gift.
4. The invitation can be rejected
Jesus’ parable of the wedding banquet shows people refusing God’s invitation:
“And they would not come… But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise.”
— Matthew 22:3–5
God’s gift (the kingdom) was genuinely offered, yet rejected.
5. Grace can be fallen from
“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.”
— Galatians 5:4
Here Paul speaks of people who once had access to God’s grace but abandoned it.
6. The Word can be received, then rejected
In the parable of the sower, some “receive the word with joy” but later fall away:
“They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy… but in time of temptation fall away.”
— Luke 8:13

The bible says a lot about people falling away. Especially Paul. What is it that you imagine they were falling away from?

There is no general answer. . .present a specific verse to be examined.