End times time frames by chapter and fit

[Douggg]

@keras, until I hear from you regarding my post #60, I think this is your projected fit. You have the 1260 days in the wrong place, as well as the 3 1/2 days the two witnesses bodies lay dead.

Also, you have a misconception that the great tribulation begins on the mid-point of the seven years.... resulting in your error that the 1290 days and the 1335 days extend beyond the day that Jesus returns.

And since you do not believe that the 2300 days (the length as 2300 days) of Daniel 8:14 is a legitimate prophecy time frame, I had nothing to show for your projected fit of it.

 

[Douggg]

@keras

 

[keras]

@Douggg, Don't you ever sleep? It daytime in New Zealand now; must be night for you?

I will concede that your charts have some use, but they must be 100% correct and I have yet to see one of yours that qualifies..
The chart in #62 is wrong, as there are not two different 'women' kept protected for the same period. Rev 12:6 & 14, are about the same people and the same time period, starting when the beast conquers the Holy peoples and ending at the Glorious Return.

Chart in #61, is correct, excepting for Ezekiel 39:9, which begins about a year before Daniel 9:27. Also when the clean up starts.

It is not possible for you to give up trying to fit 2300 days into the end times?
To not accept all the modern translations of Daniel 8:14, puts you in the dinosaur category.

 

[Douggg]

The chart in #62 is wrong, as there are not two different 'women' kept protected for the same period. Rev 12:6 & 14, are about the same people and the same time period, starting when the beast conquers the Holy peoples and ending at the Glorious Return.

There are not two women in Revelation 12. The woman throughout Revelation 12 is Israel.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they (the two witnesses) should feed her (the word of God) there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

Then in Revelation 12:6-7 the war in the second heaven resulting in Satan being cast down to earth, having but a short time left. The time, times, half time of Revelation 12:14, which he attempts to persecute the woman - Israel.

 

[Douggg]

Chart in #61, is correct, excepting for Ezekiel 39:9, which begins about a year before Daniel 9:27. Also when the clean up starts.

Begins about a year before Daniel 9:27 ? Based on what ?

 

[Douggg]

It is not possible for you to give up trying to fit 2300 days into the end times?
To not accept all the modern translations of Daniel 8:14, puts you in the dinosaur category.

None of the translations have "1150" days in the text. None of the translations have "1150 mornings"and "1150 evenings".

 

[keras]

There are not two women in Revelation 12. The woman throughout Revelation 12 is Israel.

Only one 'woman', as there is only one people of God.
The 'woman' only ever represents the Holy people of God, the Spiritual Israelites. Proved by Rev 12:17, -those who believe in Jesus.
The 2 Witnesses do not go into the wilderness.
There is no reason for the 'woman' to be taken to safety during the first half of the final 7 years.

Note that the first half or the final 7 year is not mentioned, except in Daniel 9:27, which simply states it will pass.
This is because it will be a peaceful time and one clue as to how long after the G/M attack, the agreement of Dan 9:27, is made - is the 7 month burying of Gog and his armies.

Begins about a year before Daniel 9:27 ? Based on what ?

It is just my estimate. Maybe sooner, but what is certain, is that the G/M attack and destruction, cannot be simultaneous with Daniel 9:27.

None of the translations have "1150" days in the text. None of the translations have "1150 mornings"and "1150 evenings".

I and many other careful studiers of history and the Bible, can divide 2300 by 2 and he result fits a Temple desecration which happened about 2200 years ago.

 

[Douggg]

It is just my estimate. Maybe sooner, but what is certain, is that the G/M attack and destruction, cannot be simultaneous with Daniel 9:27.

The seven years of Ezekiel 39:9 are after the Gog/Magog attack and destruction.

Gog/Magog attack and destruction - then Ezekiel 39:9 and Daniel 9:27.

 

[Douggg]

Only one 'woman', as there is only one people of God.
The 'woman' only ever represents the Holy people of God, the Spiritual Israelites.
The 2 Witnesses do not go into the wilderness.
There is no reason for the 'woman' to be taken to safety during the first half of the final 7 years.

The woman is Israel. Not "Spiritual Israelites".

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

The Jews came out the nations after WW2 and settled into the land of Israel, as God made it possible. The two witnesses will testify in Jerusalem, the land of Israel.

The wilderness of Revelation 12:14 is the mountains in the land of Israel. The Jews flee there once the abomination of desolation is setup in the middle part of the seven years.

I and many other careful studiers of history and the Bible, can divide 2300 by 2 and he result fits a Temple desecration which happened about 2200 years ago.

Dividing any number by 2 is possible.

The little horn person in Daniel 8 is time of the end as is the transgression of desolation act of Daniel 8:14.

Daniel 8:17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Not only that, but you have the little horn's time, times, half time of Daniel 7:25 ending the day that Jesus returns.

 

[Douggg]

@keras

In Revelation 11:2-3, if those two time frames coincided with each other, then there would be no need for saying 1260 days in verse 3.

The 42 months of verse 2 coincide with the 42 months in Revelation 13:5 of the beast's rule. The second half of the 7 years.

The 1260 days is the first half of the 7 years. You have the 1260 in the wrong place.

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Also, in your projected fit, if the 3 1/2 days end the day Jesus's return, would people all around the world be making merry and exchanging gifts, celebrating the deaths of the two witnesses at that time ?

 

[keras]

The woman is Israel. Not "Spiritual Israelites".

This is where you go off the rails,
The determination to have an ethnic Israel, as is needed for the 'rapture to heaven' theory to work, is at the root of error and confusion.

Jesus promised Salvation to all who would accept it and Paul made it quite clear that ethnicity is of no value in becoming an Israelite of God. Ephesians 2:11-18 Literally; an Overcomer for the Lord, seen in each of the 7 Church's of Revelation 2 & 3

Revelation 12:17 proves that all the references to the 'woman', simply mean the Christian peoples.
Rapture believers also fail to read and understand the many Prophesies that tell of the virtual demise of Jewish Israel. Luke 19:27, +

Also, in your projected fit, if the 3 1/2 days end the day Jesus's return, would people all around the world be making merry and exchanging gifts, celebrating the deaths of the two witnesses at that time ?

Why not? It is possible, there will be communications.

This chart is correct, perhaps add in the first half of the final 7 years: -The world will be peaceful for 3 1/2 years.

 

[Douggg]

This is where you go off the rails,
The determination to have an ethnic Israel, as is needed for the 'rapture to heaven' theory to work, is at the root of error and confusion.

keras. the resurrection/rapture to heaven has no connection to Revelation 12.

The woman throughout all of Revelation 12 is Israel.

keras wrote: Revelation 12:17 proves that all the references to the 'woman', simply mean the Christian peoples.

No, not the Christian people in general, but Jews (the remnant of the woman Israel) who will have become Christians. The Jews are noted for trying to keep the commandments of God.

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

keras. the resurrection/rapture to heaven has no connection to Revelation 12.

The woman throughout all of Revelation 12 is Israel.

keras wrote: Revelation 12:17 proves that all the references to the 'woman', simply mean the Christian peoples.

No, not the Christian people in general, but Jews (the remnant of the woman Israel) who will have become Christians. The Jews are noted for trying to keep the commandments of God.

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Christians in general (Jew and Gentile believers who belong to Christ) are noted for keeping the commandments of God and having the testimony of Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. 5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

The woman is the Israel of God or Spiritual Israel (not national Israel) whose children are Jesus Himself (Rev 12:5) and those who "have the testimony of Jesus" which are those "which keep the commandments of God", which are those who are "born of God", which are those who are in the church with Jesus Christ as the cornerstone.

 

[Douggg]

Christians in general (Jew and Gentile believers who belong to Christ) are noted for keeping the commandments of God and having the testimony of Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. 5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

The woman is the Israel of God or Spiritual Israel (not national Israel) whose children are Jesus Himself (Rev 12:5) and those who "have the testimony of Jesus" which are those "which keep the commandments of God", which are those who are "born of God", which are those who are in the church with Jesus Christ as the cornerstone.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The her is Israel. Her seed is talking about bloodline, descendants of the 12 tribes of Israel.

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Revelation 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. Isaiah 9:6 Unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given - referring to Jesus.

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is the nation of Israel.


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[keras]

The her is Israel. Her seed is talking about bloodline, descendants of the 12 tribes of Israel.

Getting a note of desperation now.

The 'Seed' is Jesus; Galatians 3:16

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is the nation of Israel.

S.I. and I have thoroughly, utterly and completely disproved that idea.
Your gripping onto it is understandable, as the truth wrecks virtually the entire paradigm of your and of millions of other deceived rapture believers.
But if any belief is undeniably shown to be wrong, to not change it is...........

 

[Douggg]

Getting a note of desperation now.

The 'Seed' is Jesus; Galatians 3:16

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

keras, Abraham is a "he" not a "her". Revelation 12:17, the remnant of her seed.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is the nation of Israel.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The her is Israel. Her seed is talking about bloodline, descendants of the 12 tribes of Israel.

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Revelation 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. Isaiah 9:6 Unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given - referring to Jesus.

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is the nation of Israel.

Please address what I said in post 73 specifically and then I will address this post. I responded specifically to what you had said, but you did not respond specifically to what I said. You always think I'm the only one who has to address the other's points, which is completely unfair and very rude.

 

[Douggg]

Please address what I said in post 73 specifically and then I will address this post. I responded specifically to what you had said, but you did not respond specifically to what I said. You always think I'm the only one who has to address the other's points, which is completely unfair and very rude.

Speaking of not responding, you have not responded to my question that I have asked you a couple of times regarding your claim that there is not going to be another physical temple in Jerusalem which the Antichrist will desecrate.

My question was....

Where do you think the false prophet and the beast-king (the Antichrist) and Satan will be when Jesus returns in Revelation 19 to cast the false prophet and the beast-king into the lake of fire? And where Satan will be when the angel descends down from heaven, binds Satan with a chain and casts Satan into the bottomless pit ?

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You wrote in post #73....

"The woman is the Israel of God or Spiritual Israel (not national Israel) whose children are Jesus Himself (Rev 12:5) and those who "have the testimony of Jesus" which are those "which keep the commandments of God", which are those who are "born of God", which are those who are in the church with Jesus Christ as the cornerstone."

My response is that the bible does not say the "Israel of God" in the text of Revelation 12, nor "Spiritual Israel" in the text of Revelation 12.

You are trying to re-define who the woman is in Revelation 12:1-5 who gave birth to Jesus.

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is Israel.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Speaking of not responding, you have not responded to my question that I have asked you a couple of times regarding your claim that there is not going to be another physical temple in Jerusalem which the Antichrist will desecrate.

My question was....

Where do you think the false prophet and the beast-king (the Antichrist) and Satan will be when Jesus returns in Revelation 19 to cast the false prophet and the beast-king into the lake of fire?

First of all, I don't share your belief that the beast and false prophet (second beast) are individual human beings. So, in my view, they are all over the world when Jesus returns because the beast represents the world government or world political power at any given time in history (the head that "is" at the time Revelation was written was the Roman empire) while the false prophet or second beast represents all of the false religion of the world which opposes the one true God and Christianity and supports the world system that opposes God.

John 15:19 If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.

1 John 2:15 Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them. 16 For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.

The world (this evil world and its governments and its ways) hates us. The beast makes war with the saints.

Satan is the one who gives power to the beast (Rev 13:4). So, the answer to the question of where the false prophet, beast and dragon (Satan) will be when Jesus returns is everywhere, generally speaking.

And where Satan will be when the angel descends down from heaven, binds Satan with a chain and casts Satan into the bottomless pit ?

I don't know exactly where Satan was when Jesus died and took away the power of death from Satan with His death on the cross, leading to the freeing of many people from slavery to the fear of death because of having the hope of eternal life because of His death and resurrection.

Hebrews 2:14 Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death—that is, the devil— 15 and free those who all their lives were held in slavery by their fear of death.

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You wrote in post #73....

"The woman is the Israel of God or Spiritual Israel (not national Israel) whose children are Jesus Himself (Rev 12:5) and those who "have the testimony of Jesus" which are those "which keep the commandments of God", which are those who are "born of God", which are those who are in the church with Jesus Christ as the cornerstone."

My response is that the bible does not say the "Israel of God" in the text of Revelation 12, nor "Spiritual Israel" in the text of Revelation 12.

Nor does it say "Israel", but that's what you believe. So, what you're saying here is pointless. The only offspring that are mentioned that the woman had were Jesus Himself (Rev 12:5) and those who belong to Christ, which are those who have the testimony of Jesus and are born of the Spirit and keep God's commandments (Rev 12:17).

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

So, the woman is the Israel of God because her children make up the church which has Jesus Christ as its cornerstone (Ephesians 2:19-22).

I showed you this scripture already which show who they are who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus and you didn't even respond to that. I'm backing up my view of who is being referenced in Revelation 12:17 with scripture and you are not.

You are trying to re-define who the woman is in Revelation 12:1-5 who gave birth to Jesus.

No, I am not. Why are you saying that? You think you can just make claims like this while doing nothing to back it up? Think again.

The woman throughout Revelation 12 is Israel.

Prove it. I would never just take your word for anything.

 

[Douggg]

First of all, I don't share your belief that the beast and false prophet (second beast) are individual human beings. So, in my view, they are all over the world when Jesus returns because the beast represents the world government or world political power at any given time in history (the head that "is" at the time Revelation was written was the Roman empire) while the false prophet or second beast represents all of the false religion of the world which opposes the one true God and Christianity and supports the world system that opposes God.

Do you believe that Jesus returns to stand on the Mt. of Olives splitting it in half as it says in Zechariah 14:4 ? The Mt. of Olives is directly across from the temple mount. - where the beast-king, the false prophet , and Satan will be.

I don't think I have heard anyone, other than you, say that the beast-king and the false prophet are not singular individual persons.