There is no Free Will PERIOD

[Panthers]

There is no free will, PERIOD.

We were all designed to make mistakes, perfectly.
As, true perfection is the ability to distinguish what is perfect,
from what is not.

Rocks are perfect, they are not broken slates.

 

[BeyondET]

Alright I free willed a post, hmm I wonder if I was predestined to not know what to say.

 

[BNR32FAN]

There is no free will, PERIOD.

We were all designed to make mistakes, perfectly.
As, true perfection is the ability to distinguish what is perfect,
from what is not.

Rocks are perfect, they are not broken slates.

If we don’t have free will why did God give commandments?

 

[Neogaia777]

Either you’re pretending not to understand or you’re not capable of understanding the problem here. If God controls everything we do then whether He gives a commandment or not is completely irrelevant because WE CANT CHOOSE TO OBEY OR DISOBEY. According to what you’re teaching here WE HAVE NO CHOICE, IT’S GOD WHO CHOOSES WHAT WE WILL DO.

From our perspective, nothing has changed regardless.

 

[BNR32FAN]

There is no free will, PERIOD.

We were all designed to make mistakes, perfectly.
As, true perfection is the ability to distinguish what is perfect,
from what is not.

Rocks are perfect, they are not broken slates.

How do we disobey God if He controls everything we do?

 

[BNR32FAN]

From our perspective, nothing has changed regardless.

You keep on running from the question. If you can’t answer it then I would suggest you reevaluate your thoughts on this subject.

 

[BeyondET]

How do we disobey God if He controls everything we do?

Ahh, a master of puppets.

 

[Neogaia777]

Either you’re pretending not to understand or you’re not capable of understanding the problem here. If God controls everything we do then whether He gives a commandment or not is completely irrelevant because WE CANT CHOOSE TO OBEY OR DISOBEY. According to what you’re teaching here WE HAVE NO CHOICE, IT’S GOD WHO CHOOSES WHAT WE WILL DO.

And your wrong. There is only one of two choices in that case, etc. To obey, or disobey, etc. And how does God already knowing change any of that for us when we still don't know, etc? You still have to make choices and/or choose anyway.

Ok, let's say you were going to choose to obey, but then you found out this information that I am telling you about right now, etc, does that mean your now going to try to change your choices to all be worse, or bad, or to all now disobeying because of this?

If so, then just exactly why would you do that really, etc?

Would you not just simply choose what you were just normally always going to choose anyway?

God Bless.

 

[Neogaia777]

You keep on running from the question. If you can’t answer it then I would suggest you reevaluate your thoughts on this subject.

Whatever man.

I have answered plenty so far in this thread.

Maybe you need to pay more attention to what I am saying?

 

[Rose_bud]

My answer goes to the premise of your question--i.e., that man is the measure of goodness and justice--rather than to the question itself. God addresses that premise in:

"Your ways are not my ways.
My ways are higher (better) than your ways" (Isa 55:8-9).

Hey Clare

You've mentioned this passage a few times, I thought I'd offer a different perspective

This was not God's charge to man's unfairness as you mentioned but rather a promise of fruitfulness to those who would heed His call.
Isaiah 55 presents a beautiful promise from God, inviting all to come and drink from the living waters of salvation, freely offered through Christ. This was an invitation, a call to wisdom, urging the Jews to turn away from wickedness and seek God's forgiveness. By surrendering to Christ, the embodiment of God's covenant promise, mirroring the reliable promise made to David. As David was a witness to the nations, so too will they be witnesses to the world, testifying to God's redemption and love (I see the disciples in view here). The prophet emphasizes the importance of seeking God while He is near, assuring that He will forgive and fulfill His plan to covenant with those who surrender to Christ. That is His ways and plans that is higher than ours, His ability to fulfill His promise.

 

[BNR32FAN]

And your wrong. There is only one of two choices in that case, etc. To obey, or disobey, etc. And how does God already knowing change any of that for us when we still don't know, etc? You still have to make choices and/or choose anyway.

If we make a choice then that means we have free will. It means that we made a decision which is an example of us exercising our will.

 

[Panthers]

If we don’t have free will why did God give commandments?

This goes back to the divine order.

#1 Father
#2 Son
#3 Servant
#4 Slave
#5 Prop

Moses was a servant, and the Israelites were slaves.

Servants have 3 commandments.

Slaves Have 10

Super Slaves have over 600.

 

[Neogaia777]

If we make a choice then that means we have free will. It means that we made a decision which is an example of us exercising our will.

If God already knows, then it can't be a real true choice technically.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Ok, let's say you were going to choose to obey, but then you found out this information that I am telling you about right now, etc, does that mean your now going to try to change your choices to all be worse, or to now disobeying because of this?

If so, then just exactly why would you do that really, etc?

Making a choice is exercising your will.

 

[Aaron112]

YHVH knew those mistakes 253,etal, would be posted today,
before He Created the world.

 

[BNR32FAN]

This goes back to the divine order.

#1 Father
#2 Son
#3 Servant
#4 Slave
#5 Prop

Moses was a servant, and the Israelites were slaves.

Servants have 3 commandments.

Slaves Have 10

Super Slaves have over 600.

So we can choose to obey or disobey God’s commandments?

 

[Neogaia777]

Making a choice is exercising your will.

If God already knows, then it can't be a real true choice, or an exercising of just all your own true will technically.

 

[Aaron112]

If we make a choice then that means we have free will. It means that we made a decision which is an example of us exercising our will.

Yes, amen, it is so.
Some choose to agree with the choice of the enemy.
A few are able to choose to agree with Jesus and the Father.

 

[BNR32FAN]

If God already knows, then it can't be a real true choice, or an exercising of just all your own true will technically.

Knowing what decision I WILL MAKE doesn’t change the fact that I MADE THE DECISION.

 

[BNR32FAN]

If God already knows, then it can't be a real true choice, or an exercising of just all your own true will technically.

What you don’t seem to understand is that what we do from now until eternity is shaping what God has already foreknown. We are actually dictating what God foreknew at creation by the decisions we make.