Hamas-Israel News Thread

[Ana the Ist]

So you want to kill all the babies in Gaza in case they turn out to hate Jews. Maybe call it operation Herod.

Would you find it a more appropriate response if Israel did some sort of proportional attack on Palestine where they send in a few hundreds soldiers after a focus rocket strike in a residential area and then raped women and children and murdered 1500 of them along with their babies before grabbing a couple of hundred hostages and returning to Israel to torture them?

'Tortured and paraded around Gaza:' Abducted Israeli-German raver confirmed dead

***

www.haaretz.com

Would that be better or worse than what they're doing now?

 

[RocksInMyHead]

It's those 30 year olda that have been raiaed to hate and want to kill Jews in the anti-Semetic education system. The media has also educated them.

And these kids that were 10 or so at the time have been raised in a system that tells them everyday to hate and want to kill Jews. You actually think they are less inclined to want to?

And yet they still didn't vote for Hamas. Need a hand with those goalposts?

70% under 30? Where did all those Palestinians go that voted for Hamas? They all die? Like I said that was only 20 years ago. The 30 year olds at the time would only be 50 now. The 40 year olds 60.

Some have died, some have left, and, as mentioned previously, the population has grown significantly.

At least 53% of Palestinians support Hamas. So it sounds like they would just get voted in again.

More like 30%: What Palestinians Really Think of Hamas

 

[Robban]

"Fighting evil is a very noble activity,
when it must be done.

But it is not our mission in life.
Our job is to bring in more light."

Lubavitcher Rebbe.

Do a test, take an empty bottle without a cork,
stand in a dark room, place the cork in the bottle.

Turn on the light, where has the darkness gone that was in the bottle?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Both sides are guilty of teaching hate and intolerance.

Israeli Textbooks and Children’s Literature Promote Racism and Hatred Toward Palestinians and Arabs

Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, September 1999, pages 19-20 Special Report Israeli Textbooks and Children’s Literature Promote Racism and Hatred...

www.wrmea.org

​

I only read the last link...but is there some context that you can provide?

Calling Palestinians murders and cruel is just historically accurate. They are murders (see October 7th and the first and second intifada, as well as the hundreds of rockets they launch into Israel yearly) and cruel is rather accurate too....since they torture the hostages they've taken and celebrate every time a Jewish person is murdered by a Palestinian.

Also, since Israeli children are often the targets of Palestinian terrorist kidnappings....there's value in teaching them to be afraid of them so that they run and scream for help if someone tries to kidnap them.

I noticed you didn't mention what Palestinians teach their children in school...

https://www.israelhayom.com/2022/09/07/palestinian-schoolbooks-deny-holocaust-legitimize-munich-massacre/

It revealed that history books in PA and UNRWA schools laud and legitimize the tragedy, in which Palestinian terrorists murdered 11 Israeli athletes, describing it as "resistance" to Zionism, and "Zionist interests abroad."

It also showed that textbooks on World War II omit the Holocaust entirely. They cover the main events in detail, such as the German invasion of Poland, the Battle of Britain, the attack on Pearl Harbor, and the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, but not a word about the Wannsee Conference, concentration camps, or any other events related to the Holocaust.

Surprisingly, the German government is the main funder of the Palestinian education system, including textbooks. The PA Education Ministry's budget for the implementation of their plan comes from Germany, as well as Norway, Finland, and Ireland.
Isn't that lovely? They use foreign aid to spread hatred and antisemitism. It's a shame our president has sent them foreign aid at all.

After international criticism, the PA and European authorities made changes to all textbooks for grades 1-12, but IMPACT-se officials say the content became more radicalized, "with hundreds of extreme examples that were introduced systematically that encourage harming civilians, jihad, violence, and incitement against Israel and Jews, in all classes and on all subjects."

See? It's actually productive for Israelis to teach their children that Palestinians are violent, dangerous, and murderers. After all, the Palestinians teach their children that terrorism and murdering Jews is a good thing.

"Moreover, the new books deliberately omit all the previous attempts for peace with Israel since the Oslo Accords. Antisemitic messages were also found in the books," they said.
Palestinian children are taught to believe that Judaism is a racist religion and that Jews control the media, politics, and finances. Jews are depicted as liars, corrupt, and "enemies of Islam at all times and places," and as such should be eliminated.

The enemies of Islam at all times and all places and as such should be eliminated.

I wonder why the Israelis teach their children that Palestinians are violent, dangerous, cruel murderers? It's kind of hard to teach Israeli history without those facts.

Honestly, not mentioning the Holocaust at all is a step up from what they used to teach children. I know they used to teach children that the Holocaust was a hoax perpetrated by the Jewish conspiracy to steal Palestine and they used the "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" as a reference.

 

[Ana the Ist]

"Fighting evil is a very noble activity,
when it must be done.

But it is not our mission in life.
Our job is to bring in more light."

Lubavitcher Rebbe.

Do a test, take an empty bottle without a cork,
stand in a dark room, place the cork in the bottle.

Turn on the light, where has the darkness gone that was in the bottle?

I don't think that's how light works.

 

[Robban]

I don't think that's how light works.

Ohr Ein Sof.
Endless light.

A name of G-d in classic Jewish texts.

 

[Occams Barber]

Do a test, take an empty bottle without a cork,
stand in a dark room, place the cork in the bottle.

Turn on the light, where has the darkness gone that was in the bottle?

Your Lubavitcher Rebbe may be fascinated to know that his question has already been answered (I'm assuming the Reb is still with us?)
1
.When light is turned off in a room, the photons already in the room will eventually collide with a particle in the wall/air/furniture. That particle will absorb the photon, and this particle's speed will now increase (vibration, rotation, linear, or combination off all 3). Now there are two options: either the particle will re-emit a photon and lose speed or bounce into another particle and transfer some speed to it. Since the particles in the room are always bouncing and rubbing up against one another, after a few repetitions of absorb->re-emit->reabsorb, all the photon energy in the room will have eventually just been converted to speed energy. This happens very fast, which is why it looks like the light just disappeared instantly
2
4
5
.When a photon is absorbed, the energy, which is contained in the warps, is consumed by the absorber
6
. Therefore, photons do not die out, but their energy can be transferred to other particles.


OB

 

[rjs330]

Nope, there just wasn't as many Palestinians in Gaza when the vote took place as there are today. The population of Gaza was only around 1.3 million in 2006 compared to 2+ million today.


Not likely. In a poll taken just four months ago, 69% of Palestinians said Hamas doesn't deserve to represent the Palestinian people

Oh let's get in a poll war shall we? I would actually consider a poll like that except we know that the Palestinians educate their kids to hate and kill the Jews. So I don't think their poll is very trustworthy.

Denied by the doctors in those hospitals
DR. MADS GILBERT: I will ask President Netanyahu to put on the table the proofs and the evidence that there is a control and command center for the Palestinian resistance in Shifa Hospital. We have heard these claims since 2009. We have twice been threatened to leave Shifa Hospital, in 2009 and 2014, because the Israelis were going to bomb it because it was a command center. Now, I have been working in Shifa for 16 years, 16 years on and off, in very hectic periods, very hectic periods. I’ve been able to walk freely around. I take lots of pictures. I video, film. I’ve been sleeping in the hospital during bombardment. I’ve been all over. I’ve never been restricted, controlled. Nobody has ever controlled my picture and documentation material. So, well, if there is a command center, show us. You have pictures and X-ray films of all Gaza, all the tunnels, everything. So, why is it that these 16 years of threats that Shifa is a command center has not been given any evidence at all that it de facto is? Now, if it was a military command center, I would not work there, because I obey to the Geneva Convention, number one.
from “This Has to Stop”: Doctors Denounce Israel’s Targeting of Gaza Hospitals

Oh I totally believe him..... Probably a sympathizer. Either that or Hamas threatened him and his family.

 

[JosephZ]

I noticed you didn't mention what Palestinians teach their children in school...

That was already mentioned in the post I was responding too. Notice I said "both sides".

I wonder why the Israelis teach their children that Palestinians are violent, dangerous, cruel murderers? It's kind of hard to teach Israeli history without those facts.

It's a fact that the vast majority of Palestinians are not violent, dangerous, or cruel murderers; therefore, teaching that they are would be incorrect.

 

[rjs330]

So you want to kill all the babies in Gaza in case they turn out to hate Jews. Maybe call it operation Herod.

Me? You think I want to kill all the babies in Gaza? What a bizarre take.

 

[rjs330]

Both sides are guilty of teaching hate and intolerance.

Israeli Textbooks and Children’s Literature Promote Racism and Hatred Toward Palestinians and Arabs

Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, September 1999, pages 19-20 Special Report Israeli Textbooks and Children’s Literature Promote Racism and Hatred...

www.wrmea.org

​

You have one small Jewish country surrounded by her enemies who all want her and her people destroyed. They all know it and live with it everyday if the year. Including terrorism attacks. And you expect them to say nice things about the people who are trying to exterminate them?

Every claim made about the Arabs is true there. Not one single thing mentioned in that article was a lie.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Note that if you're a Palestinian in Gaza who isn't too good at three point turns an Israeli tank will blow you up and kill you.

The video is available on Youtube - search for "Israeli tank blows up car" on Youtube.

It aired on the PBS NewsHour. It certainly seems clear the car, whoever its occupants were, was turning to go back.

 

[rjs330]

It's a fact that the vast majority of Palestinians are not violent, dangerous, or cruel murderers; therefore, teaching that they are would be incorrect.

Maybe not, but can you tell the difference before it's too late? What are they supposed to say? I know kids the Palestinians have been shooting rockets at us for years now. And we've have people kidnapped, tortured and murdered and raped by Palestinians. But not all Palestinians do that. Just some of them?

How do you know which ones are the dangerous ones? Well when you get hit by a rocket or kidnapped, raped, tortured and murdered them you'll know then.

Kind of like fighting Hamas. How do know which ones the terrorist? No idea. They aren't dressed any different. I guess you just have to wait until he shoots you first. Then you'll know. Maybe too late.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Kind of like fighting Hamas. How do know which ones the terrorist? No idea. They aren't dressed any different. I guess you just have to wait until he shoots you first. Then you'll know. Maybe too late.

Ashli Babbitt wasn't dressed any different from a lot of Trump supporters. Are you suggesting [I am not suggesting] the authorities don't have to wait for any overt acts before opening fire?

 

[Ana the Ist]

More like 30%: What Palestinians Really Think of Hamas

I don't know what kind of surveys "Arab Barometer" does...but I do know Gallup and they do accurate polls.

Palestinians Lack Faith in Biden, Two-State Solution

Ahead of Hamas' recent attack on Israel, most Palestinians distrusted Biden's ability to mediate peace, and support for a two-state solution dropped to 24%.

news.gallup.com

In the months and weeks leading up to the Oct. 7 attack, about one in four Palestinians (24%) living in the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem said they supported a two-state solution to the conflict, with an independent Palestinian state existing alongside Israel.

I suspect "Arab Barometer" might be a little biased.

 

[Ana the Ist]

That was already mentioned in the post I was responding too. Notice I said "both sides".

It didn't provide examples...neither did you. You only provided examples of what Israel teaches...much of it appears to be guilty of accuracy and nothing more.

It's a fact that the vast majority of Palestinians are not violent, dangerous, or cruel murderers; therefore, teaching that they are would be incorrect.

It's a fact most Nazis didn't murder people either....but they were definitely cruel and supported murderers....and that made them dangerous to jews.

I don't blame jews for not ignoring the warning signs this time around.

 

[BPPLEE]

Ashli Babbitt wasn't dressed any different from a lot of Trump supporters. Are you suggesting [I am not suggesting] the authorities don't have to wait for any overt acts before opening fire?

Climbing through a window while unarmed is an overt act?

 

[Gene2memE]

Maybe not, but can you tell the difference before it's too late? What are they supposed to say? I know kids the Palestinians have been shooting rockets at us for years now. And we've have people kidnapped, tortured and murdered and raped by Palestinians. But not all Palestinians do that. Just some of them?

"I know kids the Israelis have been bombing us for years now. And we've have people kidnapped, tortured and murdered and raped by Israelis. But not all Israelis do that. Just some of them? "

Turn about is fair play.

(And yes, the Israelis have done those things. And that's just the government. If you're doubtful, read some of the reports from PCATI - an Israeli NGO - on the state of torture in Israel)

How do you know which ones are the dangerous ones? Well when you get hit by a rocket or kidnapped, raped, tortured and murdered them you'll know then.

Kind of like fighting Hamas. How do know which ones the terrorist? No idea. They aren't dressed any different. I guess you just have to wait until he shoots you first. Then you'll know. Maybe too late.

This has been the difficulty with fighting non-conventional forces for centuries. It's been a problem in this particular geographic area for at least 90 years - the British were complaining about it on the Jewish and Arab sides all the way back to the conflicts of the early 1930s.

You CAN'T tell the difference between a terrorist/freedom fighter and a member of the general public. So, when taking military action you have to take the most care you can to discriminate between them.

That's not what the IDF is doing. It's hitting residential buildings and refugee areas in Gaza. And then its making the rubble bounce, even when rescue efforts are underway. 12,000 tons of bombs have already been dropped, on an area that's roughly the same size as Las Vegas. To put that into context, that's 1/7th of the tonnage dropped in the first Gulf War.

The IDF is committing clear cut violations of the principles of war under international law. This includes the principles of military necessity, proportionality, humanity and discrimination.

I'm not arguing that Hamas is the good guys here. I'd like to see them totally dismantled. Israel has a right to respond to attacks and to shape that response as best it sees fit within the boundaries of international law. But, it's in a horrible position here and the Israeli government has decided that collective reprisals are a 'military necessity'.

I support Israel, and I support the destruction of Hamas. But, I don't support this way of doing it. What it's mostly going to accomplish is killing a lot more people and ensuring an ever increasing cycle of violence.

 

[JosephZ]

It didn't provide examples...neither did you.

The member I was responding to had given examples earlier of how Palestinian children are taught to hate Jews. It wasn't necesary for those examples to be repeated.

 

[Vanellus]

It aired on the PBS NewsHour. It certainly seems clear the car, whoever its occupants were, was turning to go back.

I didn't want to directly link it in case it broke any forum rule. No dead bodies are seen but reportedly three people were killed.