SDA please explain the failed prediction of Ellen White (SDA Prophet)

[tall73]

I feel compelled to ask @bob Ryan: how do you reconcile the above text with your avowed belief in the co-eternality and co-equality of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit? Is it the case that the coequality of the Father and the Logos is not itself eternal but temporal? Also, how can the above be reconciled with John 1:1-5, which clearly establishes that it was through the Son all things were made, which would include created beings like the archangels including the fallen archangel which became the devil*, so I fail to see why God would need to gather together various eternal beings to present His son to them. This also clashes with the concept of eternality itself, since God and the angels exist beyond time, how could this, as a discrete event in linear time, even happen? Every eternal being whose attendance was desired would have to temporarily enter into creation in order to receive such a revelation, but upon exiting and returning to eternity, the nature of eternity is such that the knowledge of the event would always have been known. Note that Psalms 90:4 and 2 Peter 3:8 correspond to the nature of eternity I am referring to.

*It must be stressed that the aforementioned writing is correct in that the downfall of the devil was according to his own choice, since God created him with free will, for to create beings without free will Is contrary, I would argue, to the idea of God as being purely loving, since free will is required in order for us to truly love God in the fullest sense of the word. Furthermore, I would argue that God being infinitely good does not create evil, but rather evil exists as a result of intelligent beings choosing not to love God but to set themselves against Him for various petulant, intransigent and self-centered reasons.

There is an ongoing debate to this day within Adventism in that while the fundamental beliefs now outline a more or less Trinitarian view, this was not the case with many of the pioneers. And some very conservative Adventists indicate that it was not for Ellen White either.

I should stress that the great majority of modern Adventists take a more Trinitarian view.

I would say that over time her statements certainly came closer to Trinitarian statements.

Here is a quote from MInistry Magazine, by an Adventist professor and historian, regarding the early SDA church:

Adventists and change

By saying that the Bible is our only creed, Adventism's founders revealed a profound understanding of the dynamic nature of present truth.

www.ministrymagazine.org

Most of the founders of Seventh-day Adventism would not be able to join the church today if they had to subscribe to the denomination's Fundamental Beliefs. 1

More specifically, most would not be able to agree to belief number 2, which deals with the doctrine of the Trinity. For Joseph Bates the Trinity was an unscriptural doctrine, for James White it was that "old Trinitarian absurdity," and for M. E. Cornell it was a fruit of the great apostasy, along with such false doctrines as Sunday-keeping and the immortality of the soul.2

In like manner, most of the founders of Seventh-day Adventism would have trouble with fundamental belief number 4, which holds that Jesus is both eternal and truly God. For J. N. Andrews "the Son of God ... had God for His Father, and did, at some point in the eternity of the past, have beginning of days." And E. J. Waggoner, of Minneapolis 1888 fame, penned in 1890 that "there was a time when Christ proceeded forth and came from God,... but that time was so far back in the days of eternity that to finite comprehension it is practically without beginning." 3

Neither could most of the leading Adventists have agreed with fundamental belief number 5, which implies the personhood of the Holy Spirit. Uriah Smith, for example, not only was anti- Trinitarian and semi-Arian, like so many of his colleagues, but also like them pictured the Holy Spirit as "that divine, mysterious emanation through which They [the Father and the Son] carry forward their great and infinite work." On another occasion, Smith pictured the Holy Spirit as a "divine influence" and not a "person like the Father and the Son."

 

[tall73]

@The Liturgist @prodromos @Leaf473

Some additional Christological considerations:

The Scriptures state plainly that God knows the end from the beginning, and He will accomplish all His purpose:

Isaiah 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, 10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose

Yet when describing the plan of salvation Ellen White wrote that Jesus was risking "failure" and "eternal loss", and staking His own "eternal existence", imperiling heaven, etc.

----
Ellen White General Conference Bulletin {GCB December 1, 1895, Art. B, par. 23}

Remember that Christ risked all; tempted like as we are, he staked even his own eternal existence upon the issue of the conflict. Heaven itself was imperiled for our redemption. At the foot of the cross, remembering that for one sinner Jesus would have yielded up his life, we may estimate the value of a soul.

Desire of Ages {DA 131.2}

Never can the cost of our redemption be realized until the redeemed shall stand with the Redeemer before the throne of God. Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss.

Desire of Ages {DA 49.1}

Yet into the world where Satan claimed dominion God permitted His Son to come, a helpless babe, subject to the weakness of humanity. He permitted Him to meet life's peril in common with every human soul, to fight the battle as every child of humanity must fight it, at the risk of failure and eternal loss.
-----

Christ did indeed leave His heavenly home. Christ indeed was born a baby, and grew in wisdom, stature and favor with God and man.

Christ was indeed tempted as the Scriptures state. Christ did indeed have to endure terrible pain and terrible treatment, all for us.

But was there a RISK of FAILURE in the plan?

Risk of failure is something we face as humans because we do not know the future. It could go either way. This was not at all the case with God and with the plan of salvation.

Christ was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world. Prophecy after prophecy about Jesus' sacrifice are written in Scripture, and were fulfilled.

There was a one hundred percent chance of Jesus dying for us. There was a zero percent chance of Christ failing and losing His own eternal existence.

Ellen White states:

"He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss."

She presents the pre-incarnate Son of God taking on the notion of risk, as though the plan of salvation just might not work. Did God know or didn't He?

Isa 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me,

Isa 46:10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose"

 

[Leaf473]

@The Liturgist @prodromos @Leaf473

Some additional Christological considerations:

The Scriptures state plainly that God knows the end from the beginning, and He will accomplish all His purpose:

Isaiah 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, 10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose

Yet when describing the plan of salvation Ellen White wrote that Jesus was risking "failure" and "eternal loss", and staking His own "eternal existence", imperiling heaven, etc.

----
Ellen White General Conference Bulletin {GCB December 1, 1895, Art. B, par. 23}

Remember that Christ risked all; tempted like as we are, he staked even his own eternal existence upon the issue of the conflict. Heaven itself was imperiled for our redemption. At the foot of the cross, remembering that for one sinner Jesus would have yielded up his life, we may estimate the value of a soul.

Desire of Ages {DA 131.2}

Never can the cost of our redemption be realized until the redeemed shall stand with the Redeemer before the throne of God. Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss.

Desire of Ages {DA 49.1}

Yet into the world where Satan claimed dominion God permitted His Son to come, a helpless babe, subject to the weakness of humanity. He permitted Him to meet life's peril in common with every human soul, to fight the battle as every child of humanity must fight it, at the risk of failure and eternal loss.
-----

Christ did indeed leave His heavenly home. Christ indeed was born a baby, and grew in wisdom, stature and favor with God and man.

Christ was indeed tempted as the Scriptures state. Christ did indeed have to endure terrible pain and terrible treatment, all for us.

But was there a RISK of FAILURE in the plan?

Risk of failure is something we face as humans because we do not know the future. It could go either way. This was not at all the case with God and with the plan of salvation.

Christ was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world. Prophecy after prophecy about Jesus' sacrifice are written in Scripture, and were fulfilled.

There was a one hundred percent chance of Jesus dying for us. There was a zero percent chance of Christ failing and losing His own eternal existence.

Ellen White states:

"He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss."

She presents the pre-incarnate Son of God taking on the notion of risk, as though the plan of salvation just might not work. Did God know or didn't He?

Isa 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me,

Isa 46:10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose"

I was just about to write this part here, when I read it in your post

Christ was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

@The Liturgist @prodromos @Leaf473

Some additional Christological considerations:

The Scriptures state plainly that God knows the end from the beginning, and He will accomplish all His purpose:

Isaiah 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, 10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose

Yet when describing the plan of salvation Ellen White wrote that Jesus was risking "failure" and "eternal loss", and staking His own "eternal existence", imperiling heaven, etc.

----
Ellen White General Conference Bulletin {GCB December 1, 1895, Art. B, par. 23}

Remember that Christ risked all; tempted like as we are, he staked even his own eternal existence upon the issue of the conflict. Heaven itself was imperiled for our redemption. At the foot of the cross, remembering that for one sinner Jesus would have yielded up his life, we may estimate the value of a soul.

Desire of Ages {DA 131.2}

Never can the cost of our redemption be realized until the redeemed shall stand with the Redeemer before the throne of God. Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss.

Desire of Ages {DA 49.1}

Yet into the world where Satan claimed dominion God permitted His Son to come, a helpless babe, subject to the weakness of humanity. He permitted Him to meet life's peril in common with every human soul, to fight the battle as every child of humanity must fight it, at the risk of failure and eternal loss.
-----

Christ did indeed leave His heavenly home. Christ indeed was born a baby, and grew in wisdom, stature and favor with God and man.

Christ was indeed tempted as the Scriptures state. Christ did indeed have to endure terrible pain and terrible treatment, all for us.

But was there a RISK of FAILURE in the plan?

Risk of failure is something we face as humans because we do not know the future. It could go either way. This was not at all the case with God and with the plan of salvation.

Christ was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world. Prophecy after prophecy about Jesus' sacrifice are written in Scripture, and were fulfilled.

There was a one hundred percent chance of Jesus dying for us. There was a zero percent chance of Christ failing and losing His own eternal existence.

Ellen White states:

"He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss."

She presents the pre-incarnate Son of God taking on the notion of risk, as though the plan of salvation just might not work. Did God know or didn't He?

Isa 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me,

Isa 46:10 declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose"

I'm not sure you're right here. Christ in his human body did not know the end from the beginning. He had to trust the father. If there was no risk to Christ what was at stake by him giving up his eternal presence and limiting himself to a human body and being tempted. What's was the point of that

 

[tall73]

I'm not sure you're right here. Christ in his human body did not know the end from the beginning.

As an example, Christ did not know the day or hour of His coming.

However, she is talking about Him leaving heaven--pre-incarnation, and their being risk. Did God know what would happen? Did He know the end from the beginning?

He had to trust the father.

And God knew He would....because He knows the end from the beginning. And the Son knew He would.

If there was no risk to Christ what was at stake by him giving up his eternal presence and limiting himself to a human body and being tempted.

What was at stake? It was not a "risk" that Jesus would take on lack of omni-presence, be able to suffer, be tempted, and die for us. It was a certainly. And it was also a certainty that He would succeed before the plan was ever enacted because God knows the end from the beginning and will accomplish all His purpose.

What's was the point of that

What was the point of Jesus condescending to save you?

John 3:6 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

As an example, Christ did not know the day or hour of His coming.

However, she is talking about Him leaving heaven--pre-incarnation, and their being risk. Did God know what would happen? Did He know the end from the beginning?




And God knew He would....because He knows the end from the beginning. And the Son knew He would.



What was at stake? It was not a "risk" that Jesus would take on lack of omni-presence, be able to suffer, be tempted, and die for us. It was a certainly. And it was also a certainty that He would succeed before the plan was ever enacted because God knows the end from the beginning and will accomplish all His purpose.



What was the point of Jesus condescending to save you?

John 3:6 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.

Then there was no risk.

 

[Leaf473]

Then there was no risk.

That would kind of fit in with the thread title imo.

Not so much a failed prediction, but a doctrinal inaccuracy.

 

[tall73]

Then there was no risk.

Yes, there was a cost, but not a risk.

Sophia7 and I were discussing this text on the subject:

Philippians 2:5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, 7 but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. 8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. 9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, 10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Jesus willingly took on lowering Himself, suffering, death, to accomplish our salvation. But the timing, and the plan were all known and would not fail.

Romans 5:6 For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. 8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.

Galatians 4:4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Yes, there was a cost, but not a risk.

then explain. what was the purpose of the temptaions? If there was no potention for sin then there is no point and no risk.

 

[tall73]

then explain. what was the purpose of the temptaions? If there was no potention for sin then there is no point and no risk.

Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

Jesus did undergo temptation, and thirst, and weakness, and pain, and all that goes with His human nature. and because of that He can sympathize with us. But do you think that God, before sending Him, didn't know what the result would be, and that He would not sin, despite temptation?

When Jesus in the garden was tempted to turn back did God not know He would say "They will not Mine be done? before it happened?

 

[tall73]

Hebrews 2:5 For He has not put the world to come, of which we speak, in subjection to angels. 6 But one testified in a certain place, saying:

“What is man that You are mindful of him,
Or the son of man that You take care of him?
7 You have made him [d]a little lower than the angels;
You have crowned him with glory and honor,
[e]And set him over the works of Your hands.
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet.”


For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him. 9 But we see Jesus, who was made [f]a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.
10 For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both He who [g]sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren, 12 saying:

“I will declare Your name to My brethren;
In the midst of the assembly I will sing praise to You.”

13 And again:

“I will put My trust in Him.”
And again:

“Here am I and the children whom God has given Me.”

14 Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.


Jesus restored Adam's lost dominion, and destroyed the power of death by taking on flesh and blood.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

Jesus did undergo temptation, and thirst, and weakness, and pain, and all that goes with His human nature. and because of that He can sympathize with us. But do you think that God, before sending Him, didn't know what the result would be, and that He would not sin, despite temptation?

When Jesus in the garden was tempted to turn back did God not know He would say "They will not Mine be done? before it happened?

what God knew is not the issue. I will spot you that. BUT there is still the issue of risk. you did not answer it. Was there the potential for sin?

 

[tall73]

what God knew is not the issue. I will spot you that. BUT there is still the issue of risk. you did not answer it. Was there the potential for sin?

What God (and the pre-incarnate Son) knew is the issue.

How could there be risk in sending the Son if God knew the Son would accomplish His will? And the Son also knew that before the incarnation. Because God knows the end from the beginning.

So while Jesus did in His human nature feel temptation, it was not risk. Risk is the possibility of danger in an unknown future. God already knew the future.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

What God (and the pre-incarnate Son) knew is the issue.

How could there be risk in sending the Son if God knew the Son would accomplish His will? And the Son also knew that before the incarnation. Because God knows the end from the beginning.

because he forgot all that when he became human

So while Jesus did in His human nature feel temptation, it was not risk. Risk is the possibility of danger in an unknown future. God already knew the future.

 

[tall73]

because he forgot all that when he became human

The exact nature of what Jesus knew and didn't know is a bit hard to pin down. I already noted He indicated He did not know the day and hour of the coming of the Son of Man. He grew in wisdom and stature and favor with God and Man. But He could also say He saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

However, look at the statement again:
---
Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss.
---

When Jesus left heaven for us, He knew the result. He was not taking a risk of failure and eternal loss. The I Am is not concerned about losing His existence. Because He knows all things. And He accomplishes all His purposes.

Jesus on this earth, in His human nature, was clearly tempted, and especially in regards to not carrying out His planned sacrifice. At the same time He also said that before Abraham was "I AM".

But she is indicating that part of leaving heaven was not only missing out on heaven, but risk. The Son did not have to decide whether there was risk. Or else God is not God.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

The exact nature of what Jesus knew and didn't know is a bit hard to pin down. I already noted He indicated He did not know the day and hour of the coming of the Son of Man. He grew in wisdom and stature and favor with God and Man. But He could also say He saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

However, look at the statement again:
---
Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss.
---

When Jesus left heaven for us, He knew the result. He was not taking a risk of failure and eternal loss. The I Am is not concerned about losing His existence. Because He knows all things. And He accomplishes all His purposes.

Jesus on this earth, in His human nature, was clearly tempted, and especially in regards to NOT carrying out His planned sacrifice. But she is indicating that part of leaving heaven was not only missing out on heaven, but risk. The Son did not have to decide whether there was risk. Or else God is not God.

ok

 

[tall73]

ok

I realize you acknowledge that God knows all.

And the question you seem to want to ask, but haven't asked quite yet is could Jesus really sin.

And that gets into another hot button question about the human nature of Jesus, etc.

If Jesus forgives sins, and commands the waves, and can say before Abraham was born I Am, then He is not just human. And regarding God James says He tempts no one and cannot be tempted.

But by taking on human nature as well Jesus can be tempted, and was tempted. And so Jesus is Divine and Human.

As to whether Jesus could sin, you can answer.

What is clear is that God knew He would not sin, because He knew everything that would happen, from the time and place of His birth, to what they would say at the crucifixion, to how they would divide His garments, etc.


Mic 5:2 But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are too little to be among the clans of Judah, from you shall come forth for me one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose coming forth is from of old, from ancient days.

Psalm 22:7 All who see me mock me; they make mouths at me; they wag their heads; 8 "He trusts in the LORD; let him deliver him; let him rescue him, for he delights in him!"

Psalm 22:16 For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; they have pierced my hands and feet--17 I can count all my bones-- they stare and gloat over me; 18 they divide my garments among them, and for my clothing they cast lots.

Isaiah 53:5 But He was wounded for our transgressions,He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed. 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; We have turned, every one, to his own way; And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all. 7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted, Yet He opened not His mouth; He was led as a lamb to the slaughter, And as a sheep before its shearers is silent, So He opened not His mouth. 8 He was taken from prison and from judgment, And who will declare His generation? For He was cut off from the land of the living; For the transgressions of My people He was stricken. 9 And they made His grave with the wicked—But with the rich at His death,Because He had done no violence, Nor was any deceit in His mouth. 10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise Him; He has put Him to grief. When You make His soul an offering for sin, He shall see His seed, He shall prolong His days, And the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in His hand.

Acts 13:26 "Brothers, sons of the family of Abraham, and those among you who fear God, to us has been sent the message of this salvation. 27 For those who live in Jerusalem and their rulers, because they did not recognize him nor understand the utterances of the prophets, which are read every Sabbath, fulfilled them by condemning him. 28 And though they found in him no guilt worthy of death, they asked Pilate to have him executed. 29 And when they had carried out all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree and laid him in a tomb. 30 But God raised him from the dead, 31 and for many days he appeared to those who had come up with him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are now his witnesses to the people.32

1Pe 1:10 Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired carefully, 11 inquiring what person or time the Spirit of Christ in them was indicating when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glories.

Luk 24:25 And he said to them, "O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken! 26 Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?" 27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.

 

[tall73]

So that those interested can see how much difference of opinion exists within Adventism, this is a discussion with three Adventists and an ex-Adventist. One of the Adventists is an academy Bible teacher, and at least one of the others is a pastor. However, they are not traditional in their doctrine, and would like to see reform in the church to varying degrees. The four agree on a number of things, and disagree amongst themselves on some others. One of the Adventists agrees with the ex-Adventist when he calls on his fellow Adventist to repent of believing the investigative judgment.

These same Adventists recently interviewed Doug Batchelor, a prominent Adventist preacher, and Ted Wilson, General Conference president.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

So that those interested can see how much difference of opinion exists within Adventism, this is a discussion with three Adventists and an ex-Adventist. One of the Adventists is an academy Bible teacher, and at least one of the others is a pastor. However, they are not traditional in their doctrine, and would like to see reform in the church to varying degrees. The four agree on a number of things, and disagree amongst themselves on some others. One of the Adventists agrees with the ex-Adventist when he calls on his fellow Adventist to repent of believing the investigative judgment.

These same Adventists recently interviewed Doug Batchelor, a prominent Adventist preacher, and Ted Wilson, General Conference president.

More ex-Adventists not moving on from Adventism I am starting to believe this is a thing. I would think one would want to focus on “greener pastures” but it seems the focus is on anti-Adventists instead of focusing on ”spreading the good news”. This seems to be the strongest testimony for Adventists so thanks.

The Adventist church has a set of beliefs found here What do Seventh-day Adventists Believe?

You take any church, you will have varying beliefs to some degree, which is not unique to the SDA church.

 

[tall73]

Folks may want to watch the video to understand the content. The three pastors invited him on, and the gospel was much discussed. And they agreed with him on many points