Where would you move if you had a virtual job as an Orthodox man? Russia, Romania, etc.?

[SingularityOne]

America. I would just recommend you to go to a big city to find Orthodox people though.

Which cities come to mind?

 

[E.C.]

I will admit my bias here, but Washington DC comes to mind. DC itself has five parishes; four cathedrals and one mission. The surrounding DC metropolitan area has an additional twenty. Some have more young adults then others, but this weekend there's an attempt for a young adult gala which is meant to bring ALL the Orthodox young adults together for a party (my friends who are organizing it described it as the fun part of a wedding reception without the wedding). I'll be the first to admit that yes, some parishes are less welcoming then others, however, myself and my fellow Orthodox millennials are at least actively trying to be more pan-Orthodox in these here parts. The various Greek parishes will typically have a Greek night from time to time to try and get the young adults together, but those are more catered to the Greeks. I still have fun anyway even without knowing Greek dancing and unlike other parts of the country they're surprised that I'm Orthodox without any sort of so-called "ethnic" background.

New York has a lot of parishes, but it gets super tribal super quickly to the point that the ROCOR parishes in Brooklyn refuse to venerate St Raphael of Brooklyn because "he wasn't Russian". But hey, let's forget the fact that Sts Raphael and Tikhon are all over the Antiochian's St Nicholas Cathedral.

Seattle/Western Washington were awful with Orthodox my age which is a large part of why I left and joined the Navy in 2012.


The overall point is to try and make an effort. Yes, God will provide a spouse when the time comes, but He isn't going to deliver her via Amazon nor dropping her onto your lap from the sky. Get out of your comfort zone. Visit other parishes. Be social. Talk to people. Have realistic expectations. Eventually you'll hit a point where people will actually offer to set you up with someone; sometimes in a neighboring state.

 

[ArmyMatt]

But hey, let's forget the fact that Sts Raphael and Tikhon are all over the Antiochian's St Nicholas Cathedral.

or that St Raphael was sent by the Russians….

 

[ValeriyK2022]

I've been doing a bit of reading on the subject and here's what surprised me.

The majority, thinking about where it is better for an Orthodox Christian to live, looks for comfort and the presence of churches. But for some reason, the main goal is being forgotten - the salvation of the soul.

You can live comfortably next to an Orthodox church and go to hell. Read Orthodox Patericons and Fathers. For 2000 years even bishops went to hell, and monks, and not only lay people.

That is, from the point of view of comfort, it is understandable. Now regarding the presence of an Orthodox church. The presence of a temple and a priest does not mean that you will be able to get closer to God guaranteed. My life turned out in such a way that I changed my place of residence several times and every time there was an Orthodox church nearby. There was a liturgy, there were sacraments of confession and communion and others. That is, the necessary minimum was. But it was not possible to find a spiritual leader everywhere. As Archimandrite Joachim Parr says, only a Christian who has been there can lead to Emmaus. Only one who knows how to pray well can teach prayers. Spiritual life can only be taught by someone who has gone through it in practice. Telling you to read a book may not be enough to get you where you need to go. When you drive a car, says the elder Paisius of Athos, you can have a map. But sometimes it's better to ask the locals. Because somewhere the road can be dug up, repair work can be carried out or something else. Or you can get lost, spend energy and money and not reach where you were going. It is the same in spiritual life. We read a saint of the 11th or 19th century, but some circumstances have changed decisively. Something suits us, and something does not.

Nothing can replace the living words of Christians, which have experienced in spiritual life.

I watched a film about Archimandrite Efrem of Arizona. It says that many Orthodox in the USA moved to live with him and his students. Houses were sold in one town and bought in another. These are people who have not forgotten the ultimate goal: to get closer to God and the Kingdom of Heaven. And they settled where people who already have practical experience in this live. If I had a choice, I would probably do the same.

 

[Dorothea]

As far as Orthodox Churches, unfortunately the ones that seem most comforting and spiritually alive are not where we are. My oldest son has been struggling with this at our small Greek Orthodox Church. The problem is it's pretty much dead when it comes to activities to be involved in and also lacking a mission mind. So, we kind of feel not nourished here, which is sad because it was our home parish the last time we lived in the Colorado Springs area from 2007-2013. The two churches that have those things I mentioned were in PA (Lancaster area) and in LA (Louisiana - Shreveport area). Too bad they're so far away and I love this state and have a job to keep.

 

[ValeriyK2022]

As far as Orthodox Churches, unfortunately the ones that seem most comforting and spiritually alive are not where we are. My oldest son has been struggling with this at our small Greek Orthodox Church. The problem is it's pretty much dead when it comes to activities to be involved in and also lacking a mission mind. So, we kind of feel not nourished here, which is sad because it was our home parish the last time we lived in the Colorado Springs area from 2007-2013. The two churches that have those things I mentioned were in PA (Lancaster area) and in LA (Louisiana - Shreveport area). Too bad they're so far away and I love this state and have a job to keep.

It seems to me that this is a global trend now. Going to church and serving church services is not yet Christianity. Why do I think so? Because Christ will say: Matthew 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the Kingdom of Heaven..."

For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

"37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’"

Archimandrite Joachim Parr told the story. A rich man called his lawyer and said that he wanted to donate money to the temple. And the lawyer must fulfill this assignment. But a lawyer should donate money only to the temple where he will be as received as Christ and the apostles received people. He can donate to any temple, regardless of religious affiliation. The main thing is for the priest to accept the needy people as Christ and the apostles accepted them. A lawyer comes to one temple and says: I have a problem, can I talk to the priest? They answer him: you can make an appointment for the next week or the week after. He went to the second temple, the third. Priests were busy everywhere. So he went around dozens of temples until he met a priest who, without asking who he was, agreed to help him and invited him to listen to his problems. It was an Orthodox church to which a rich man donated such a sum of money that it was enough to cover the roof and build a building near the church. There are still such priests, but now they are perhaps 1 in 100 and are becoming fewer and fewer.

Now there may be a situation when there is a functioning church, but there are no Christians.

 

[Dorothea]

It seems to me that this is a global trend now. Going to church and serving church services is not yet Christianity. Why do I think so? Because Christ will say: Matthew 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the Kingdom of Heaven..."

For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

"37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’"

Archimandrite Joachim Parr told the story. A rich man called his lawyer and said that he wanted to donate money to the temple. And the lawyer must fulfill this assignment. But a lawyer should donate money only to the temple where he will be as received as Christ and the apostles received people. He can donate to any temple, regardless of religious affiliation. The main thing is for the priest to accept the needy people as Christ and the apostles accepted them. A lawyer comes to one temple and says: I have a problem, can I talk to the priest? They answer him: you can make an appointment for the next week or the week after. He went to the second temple, the third. Priests were busy everywhere. So he went around dozens of temples until he met a priest who, without asking who he was, agreed to help him and invited him to listen to his problems. It was an Orthodox church to which a rich man donated such a sum of money that it was enough to cover the roof and build a building near the church. There are still such priests, but now they are perhaps 1 in 100 and are becoming fewer and fewer.

Now there may be a situation when there is a functioning church, but there are no Christians.

I get what you're saying. But our church doesn't have much of any regular outreach or ministries for the poor or any other worthwhile ministry. We don't really have one, and there is only one church school teacher for the younger kids. There are none for upper elementary school through high school. It's really sad. Unfortunately, our priest doesn't even do catechism classes for new people coming to our church. He did adult ed years ago back when we lived near the Springs in 2007-2013. He doesn't seem interested in doing them, even though we have tons of new people coming to our church. They have nothing to participate in with regard to catechism or bible studies or anything in which they can learn about their faith. I mean, I love my priest. I just think he doesn't have the mission or evangelical mindset to engage well.


For instance, when my family and I moved to the Springs in 2007, I'd been praying for over a year that God would help give me the courage and ability to do something useful in the church. Eventually, at one of our general assembly meetings, I raised my hand to help the one school teacher at that time. Again, it was just for the young kids and some mid elementary kids. The teacher ended up having to be out for over 6 weeks because of a knee surgery, and I ended up taking over. This isn't about me in any way. Like boasting over this. I was only able to do this because God helped me through my prayers. I was very introverted and shy and didn't want to do anything wrong or mess up. But He gave me the courage to step up at that time and get truly involved. So, I ended up doing the church school for mid elementary aged kids and some lower elementary school aged kids, and two other women helped in doing kindergarten/pre-K and middle school/teens. It took off for those few years.

I started an outreach program by doing a bottles for babies campaign for the local pregnancy crisis center each fall, was ambassador of my church to participate in their Walk for Life each spring (we got to do one walk before the next summer when we moved). Also, I got the kids involved in signing up to help at a local soup kitchen. Also, I did women's knitting and book clubs. We also collected pop tabs for the Ronald McDonald House (for which my son and in extension my family were guests at a few times during my younger son's serious medical condition), and for Christmas, I did a collection of toys for children at the local children's hospital.


After that, the parish decided to use a small portion of the money they made at the yearly Greek Festival toward two charities.

When we returned in 2019 before covid, there was one of my friends/fellow parishioner that was trying to keep up the pop tabs. I don't recall if she kept up the soup kitchens. This Lent, one of my friends at the church took up the bottles for babies campaign again, but it was really just giving money to the organization.


My fellow parishioners were so happy that I'd started all of these things. They came alive and loved being involved. They just needed someone or a catalyst to get involved.


So it's back to just about nothing. I tried to get a women's bible study started in fall 2019 when I got back to this state, and we met a few weeks, but then covid happened, and the church was closed to parishioners (which I always believed was gravely wrong). Anyway, I guess I'm just rambling on. Please forgive me.

 

[Lukaris]

it was until the people of NEPA invented the Old Forge pizza, which is a pizza made with American cheese….and the Orthodox up there all love it….

Missed this over the weeks. All I can say that all skepticism over white, old forge pizza will disappear if you have it baked right. It is truly an amazing situation like a tasty kake ( Philadelphia brand supermarket cakes) becomes like a piece of wedding cake.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Missed this over the weeks. All I can say that all skepticism over white, old forge pizza will disappear if you have it baked right. It is truly an amazing situation like a tasty kake ( Philadelphia brand supermarket cakes) becomes like a piece of wedding cake.

and some people also defend ketchup on a steak…

but I will say I did hear it’s good if made correctly, it’s just that it was still bad even when made by those who said they made it correctly.

 

[ValeriyK2022]

I get what you're saying. But our church doesn't have much of any regular outreach or ministries for the poor or any other worthwhile ministry. We don't really have one, and there is only one church school teacher for the younger kids. There are none for upper elementary school through high school. It's really sad. Unfortunately, our priest doesn't even do catechism classes for new people coming to our church. He did adult ed years ago back when we lived near the Springs in 2007-2013. He doesn't seem interested in doing them, even though we have tons of new people coming to our church. They have nothing to participate in with regard to catechism or bible studies or anything in which they can learn about their faith. I mean, I love my priest. I just think he doesn't have the mission or evangelical mindset to engage well.

Unfortunately, this is happening in many places now. People come, take communion. They go for years and no one checks whether they understand the content of the main dogmas, whether they know the commandments, whether they know the canons (that is, how the Orthodox faith differs from others). Most people do not know church services and do not understand the meaning of what is read and sung.

It would be normal to check each new person's knowledge of the Orthodox faith: does he understand the dogmas correctly, does he know the commandments and canons. There are people who can practice yoga, read books on the occult or go to psychics (magicians, sorcerers) and for years go to the temple and to partake of the Body and Blood of Christ of their condemnation. Nobody cares about it.

 

[Lukaris]

I believe an effort should be made to increase the relevance of the Didache for the average layperson. The Didache should not be rewritten but a study guide given to focus on matters in proper context. Much of the Didache is taken from the Sermon on the Mount so that is obviously priority. A couple of aspects are now obscure ( like wandering prophets) but there is still modern relevance in lessons that can be learned.

Didache - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Didache. The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles (translation Roberts-Donaldson).

Didache. The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles (translation Roberts-Donaldson). On Early Christian Writings.

www.earlychristianwritings.com

 

[Dorothea]

Unfortunately, this is happening in many places now. People come, take communion. They go for years and no one checks whether they understand the content of the main dogmas, whether they know the commandments, whether they know the canons (that is, how the Orthodox faith differs from others). Most people do not know church services and do not understand the meaning of what is read and sung.

It would be normal to check each new person's knowledge of the Orthodox faith: does he understand the dogmas correctly, does he know the commandments and canons. There are people who can practice yoga, read books on the occult or go to psychics (magicians, sorcerers) and for years go to the temple and to partake of the Body and Blood of Christ of their condemnation. Nobody cares about it.

How sad. Lord, have mercy.

 

[truefiction1]

I'd stay right where I am, to work with Orthodox faithful from within my own parish community, and all of the surrounding parish communities in the Syracuse/Auburn, NY area on collaboratively/cooperatively building a center for us (all Orthodox faithful from around the area) to better minister to the various needs of our children and youth within the Church (and their families) and all of the adults who, thusly called, would be ministering to them. Also, to use our center to help equip the Orthodox faithful who are thusly called, to provide rehabilitation to men and women who are afflicted with drug or alcohol addiction in the Orthodox manner that has been developed by certain Orthodox Christians in other places and to develop the physical facilities (buildings and grounds) for this ministry to take place in. Also, to use our center to help equip the Orthodox faithful who are thusly called, to provide hospitality and care to the homeless and poor, many with mental illnesses, and to develop the facilities (buildings and grounds) for this ministry to be provided in.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I'd stay right where I am, to work with Orthodox faithful from within my own parish community, and all of the surrounding parish communities in the Syracuse/Auburn, NY area on collaboratively/cooperatively building a center for us (all Orthodox faithful from around the area) to better minister to the various needs of our children and youth within the Church (and their families) and all of the adults who, thusly called, would be ministering to them. Also, to use our center to help equip the Orthodox faithful who are thusly called, to provide rehabilitation to men and women who are afflicted with drug or alcohol addiction in the Orthodox manner that has been developed by certain Orthodox Christians in other places and to develop the physical facilities (buildings and grounds) for this ministry to take place in. Also, to use our center to help equip the Orthodox faithful who are thusly called, to provide hospitality and care to the homeless and poor, many with mental illnesses, and to develop the facilities (buildings and grounds) for this ministry to be provided in.

yep, bloom where you’re planted

 

[ValeriyK2022]

yep, bloom where you’re planted

Archimandrite Ephrem of Arizona could afford to flourish where he found himself (in the USA), having already achieved perfection. Anthony of Kiev-Pechersk also studied monasticism on Mount Athos in the 11th century, and then returned to Kyiv.

But if a person has not yet learned true Christianity, then it is better to live next to those who already know how to live in a Christian way, until he reaches such a level when he can do without outside help.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Archimandrite Ephrem of Arizona could afford to flourish where he found himself (in the USA), having already achieved perfection. Anthony of Kiev-Pechersk also studied monasticism on Mount Athos in the 11th century, and then returned to Kyiv.

But if a person has not yet learned true Christianity, then it is better to live next to those who already know how to live in a Christian way, until he reaches such a level when he can do without outside help.

sure, but that’s because God called them to new ministry in new areas.

 

[ValeriyK2022]

sure, but that’s because God called them to new ministry in new areas.

Yes, God called them to a new ministry when they had already reached perfection.

But if Anthony of Kiev-Pechersk had started learning Christianity at home in the 11th century, and Ephrem of Arizona had taken his first steps from 18 years old and continiued before old age in Arizona, then they would not have become what they have become.

It is very important for beginners to go through school among those who have achieved perfection. And a perfect Christian can already be saved everywhere.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Yes, God called them to a new ministry when they had already reached perfection.

But if Anthony of Kiev-Pechersk had started learning Christianity at home in the 11th century, and Ephrem of Arizona had taken his first steps from 18 years old and continiued before old age in Arizona, then they would not have become what they have become.

It is very important for beginners to go through school among those who have achieved perfection. And a perfect Christian can already be saved everywhere.

no disputes from me

 

[ValeriyK2022]

no disputes from me

In addition to Anthony of Kiev-Pechersk, another great ascetic - Paisius Velichkovsky - also underwent spiritual training on Mount Athos. He was born and lived in the 18th century in Poltava (Ukraine). Poltava region then belonged to the Russian Empire. Looking for spiritual guidance in the Russian Empire and not finding it, he went to Mount Athos. There he reached spiritual maturity and acquired disciples, with whom he returned to Moldavia, which was then under the Turkey protectorate.

At the end of his life, the territory where his monastery was located in Moldavia was annexed to the Russian Empire. His students transferred the spiritual experience of Mount Athos to Optina deserts (Russia) and Glynska deserts (now Sumy region of Ukraine).

If he had not gone to Mount Athos, he might not have become what he became. And Optina and Glynska Pustiny (monasteries) would not have received such spiritual mentors from his students and the students of his students, who made these monasteries famous in the 19th and 20th centuries.

From approximately 1960 to 1980, the Pskovo-Pechersk Monastery housed a very famous prayer book and miracle worker - Abbot Savva. But he got to this monastery when he reached perfection under the tutelage of a monk who, even before the revolution of 1917, underwent spiritual training on Mount Athos.

The same can be said about Reverend Kuksha of Odessa, who became a famous prayer leader and miracle worker in Pochaev (Volyn region of Ukraine) and Odessa. He died in 1964. Even before the First World War, as a young man, he studied to become a monk on Mount Athos for 17 years.

And these are just some examples.

 

[ArmyMatt]

interesting stuff, thanks!