GOD'S DIETARY LAWS AND BAT SOUP STEW - COVID 19

[Leaf473]

The issue with keeping only some of the laws, in the case of the OP the dietary laws, is that there's no reasonable and complete way to deal with the whole law.

Some people say, Keep the Ten Commandments, dietary laws, and tithing, but don't keep animal sacrifices. That's a good start, but it's not complete. There are many laws left over.

Since the scriptures don't give us a clear way to divide up the law, I believe the entire law was fulfilled by Jesus, including the dietary laws. Fulfilled in the sense that we don't need to keep it. (There are, of course, other guidelines on behavior.)

You shall teach these laws diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise up.
Deuteronomy 6

 

[Leaf473]

You're right it's not what I'm saying.

Happy New Year! Take care.

And thank you for the kind words

 

[Doug Brents]

There is no place in the entire bible that says we no longer need to keep the seventh day Sabbath commandment. I noticed you didn't quote it because it’s not there.

Actually, there is. As I have already cited:
Col 2: - “And when you were dead in your wrongdoings and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our wrongdoings, 14 having canceled the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

16 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”

Verse 16 gives examples of the decrees that were against us that were taken away and nailed to the cross: food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath. These all come from different parts (as some people see them) of the Old Covenant. Each being referenced means each part of the Old Covenant was included in the hostile decrees against us that was nailed to the cross (canceled, completed, and fulfilled).

All of these things (food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath) are shadows of the things to come (in Heaven), and the substance (the real thing) is Christ. In Christ none of these OT commands have any power, significance, or authority.

The Sabbath is not a standalone commandment according to God, He wrote the Ten Commandments in a unit of Ten found in Exodus 20. Deuteronomy 4:13, Exodus 34:28, The Sabbath is the only commandments that God said "remember" so we should not forget it and its the only commandment that uses the word "holy" and "blessed" It's also the only commandment that has to do with our time which is why people probably reject it so much. God said keeping the Sabbath is a sign between Him and His people. Ezekiel 20:20, Ezekiel 20:12 There is One God and God has one people Hebrews 8:10 which is through faith Gal 3:26-29. I can only speak for myself, but I want to be one of God's people.

Correct, the sabbath is not a stand alone commandment. It is part of the whole of the OT that was canceled by Christ at the cross.

Ezekiel is still part of the OT which was done away with (as commandments) at the cross. Yes, there is one people of God, and it is neither Jew nor Gentile, it is neither male nor female, it is neither slave nor free: it is all people who believe that Jesus is the Christ and obey Him.

Here I would suggest prayerfully reading this because it will provide context if allowed to this misused verse.

Its very clear this passage is referring to the blood sacrifices for the forgiveness of sins which pointed to Jesus as He became our Sacrificial Lamb for the forgiveness of sins and sanctification when we turn from sin (breaking God's law 1 John 3:4, Romans 7:7) and turn to Christ and walk in obedience to Him. John 14:15

Hebrews 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect. 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.

The sacrificial system was not a stand alone part of the OT. It was integrated into every command: if you break this command, make this sacrifice, etc. The Law (of Moses), which was the codification of the Old Covenant, was all removed by Christ at the Cross.

Look familiar? Colossians 2:17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. Christ became our Passover Sacrificial Lamb for the forgiveness of sins. 1 Corinthians 5:7 It has nothing to do with the weekly Sabbath which is one of God's eternal commandments written by God's own finger, spoke by God's own voice which God placed together and no man can separate as it resides in God's heavenly kingdom Revelation 11:19.

Yes, Jesus became the ONE sacrifice that paid the debt for all our sins forever. But you miss that He incorporated the sabbath (in verse 16) into the things that are a shadow of what is to come.

If you back up to Colossians 2:14 it makes this passage abundantly clear it is not referring to one of God's commandments.

Colossians 2:14
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

So we know this from Colossians 2:14:
1. They are handwritten
2. They are ordinances
3. They are contrary.

Does this fit the Sabbath commandment in any way? Absolutely not.
1. The Sabbath was finger-written by God Exodus 31:1
2. The Sabbath is a commandment of God. Exodus 34:28
3. God said the Sabbath is holy and blessed Exodus 20:8-11

What Colossians 2:14 is referring to:

1. They are ordinances that have to do with annuals feast days and sacrifices (annual sabbath(s))

Exodus 12:43 And the Lord said to Moses and Aaron, “This is the ordinance of the Passover:
Ezekiel 43:18 And He said to me, “Son of man, thus says the Lord God: ‘These are the ordinances for the altar on the day when it is made, for sacrificing burnt offerings on it, and for sprinkling blood on it.

2. They were handwritten
2 Chronicles 33:8 Neither will I any more remove the foot of Israel from out of the land which I have appointed for your fathers; so that they will take heed to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses.
Deuteronomy 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished,

3. They were contrary
Deuteronomy 31:26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;

You are separating into pieces a much larger whole. The covenant with Moses, of which the 10 Commandments and the rest of the Law, and the sacrificial system were a part, is just a renewal of the covenant made with Abraham, renewed with Issac, and renewed with Jacob. This same covenant was then renewed and expanded, and put into national law form through Moses. Same covenant, just made more detailed and given specific sacrifices for the breaking of each law. The whole covenant, all the way back to Abraham, was fulfilled and completed in Christ, and Christ made a New Covenant with His people (those who believe that He is the Christ and obey Him).

If one were to look at these scriptures in their Truth we would know clearly it is not referring to one of Gods Ten Commandments. We are sanctified by God's Truth through His Word John17:17 and all of God's commandments are Truth Psalms 119:151 God blessed and sanctified the Sabbath and it the holy day of our Lord thy God by God's own words. Exodus 20:10, Isaiah 58:13.

I didn’t say this one command was nullified I said the whole of the OT was fulfilled. All of the other of the 10 Commandments was renewed in the New Covenant, but the observation of the sabbath was not.

Please show me where it says the Sabbath is now "today" Lets quote the scripture, you will plainly see it doesn't say that. Not sure if you are actually reading the scriptures, you keep quoting.

Hebrews 4: 7 again He designates a certain day, saying in David, “Today,” after such a long time, as it has been said:
“Today, if you will hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

This is a reference to David in Psalms 95, nothing about making the Sabbath "today".

Heb 4:4-10 - “For He has said somewhere concerning the seventh day: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;5 and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” 6 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it [some will enter into God’s rest, others will not], and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience [the unbelieving Jews] , 7 He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before,

“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

8 For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that [a day other than the sabbath]. 9 Consequently, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God [and that rest is Christ]. 10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”

Read the passages in context. You keep focusing on parts and not seeing the whole.

Pslams 95:7 Today, if you will hear His voice:
8 “Do not harden your hearts, as in the rebellion,

We should not wait another day to obey God. There is no scripture in the entire bible that says we no longer have to obey God's commandments. Instead, there is warning after warning for those who keep doing so. Today if you hear His voice, do not harden your heart.

Again, I am not saying anything about failing to obey the commands of God. I am just saying that we are no longer subject to those commands of God that He Himself has said are no longer binding on us today.

Wheres the scripture that says that. You keep quoting you and not the Text.

I just quoted and explained the passage that says just that.

It talks about what day man esteems above another day, not which day God esteems over other days.

It also says that God accepts the man who does, and the man who doesn’t, equally as long as each is doing it with his heart focused on God.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Actually, there is. As I have already cited:
Col 2: - “And when you were dead in your wrongdoings and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our wrongdoings, 14 having canceled the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

16 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”

Verse 16 gives examples of the decrees that were against us that were taken away and nailed to the cross: food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath. These all come from different parts (as some people see them) of the Old Covenant. Each being referenced means each part of the Old Covenant was included in the hostile decrees against us that was nailed to the cross (canceled, completed, and fulfilled).

All of these things (food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath) are shadows of the things to come (in Heaven), and the substance (the real thing) is Christ. In Christ none of these OT commands have any power, significance, or authority.

Thanks for your response- I'm not sure if you read my detailed response to this argument you made previously, but I will leave the reference here again to it. GOD'S DIETARY LAWS AND BAT SOUP STEW - COVID 19

There are more than one Sabbath in the scripture- one is the weekly Sabbath of God's Ten Commandments that is part of God's moral law and eternal. Revelation 11:19, Exodus 20, Isaiah 66:23, Matthew 5:19 and is what points out sin Romans 7:7 the other is the yearly sabbath(s) ordinances (annual sacrificial feast days) which was given because of sin and we no longer sacrifice animals for the forgiveness of sin because Christ became our Sacrificial Lamb for the forgiveness of sin- sin again is defined as breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 and points right to the Ten Commandments to define sin Romans 7:7. What ended was the ordinances, not commandments and I provided the detailed proof in the link posted. Plus the Sabbath is eternal which we see Isaiah 66:23 Revelation 11:19 and did not end at the cross.

Correct, the sabbath is not a stand alone commandment. It is part of the whole of the OT that was canceled by Christ at the cross.

There is no scripture that say the whole OT was cancelled out by Christ including any of God's moral commandments that Jesus taught from often. The last book in the OT warns us not to forget the law and prophets, Malachi 4:4-5

The NT also warns us of this as well

Hebrews 10:28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

All of the scripture is God's Word 2 Timothy 3:16

The sacrificial system was not a stand alone part of the OT. It was integrated into every command: if you break this command, make this sacrifice, etc. The Law (of Moses), which was the codification of the Old Covenant, was all removed by Christ at the Cross.

Please show how the sacrificial law was integrated into the Ten Commandments.

The Ten Commandments​

20 And God spoke all these words, saying:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of [a]bondage.
3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor [b]serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting[c] the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

I didn’t say this one command was nullified I said the whole of the OT was fulfilled. All of the other of the 10 Commandments was renewed in the New Covenant, but the observation of the sabbath was not.

Jesus observed the Sabbath His entire life as well as the apostles. Luke 4:16, Acts 13:42, Acts 13:44, Acts 18:4, John 15:10. Jesus commissioned his disciples to teach everything He observed and Jesus most certainly observed the Sabbath and all of His Father’s commandments as our example to follow And said was made for man. Mark 2:27 The Sabbath is mentioned over 50 times in the NT and is still called the Sabbath which means there was no change to this commandment. Jesus spoke of the Sabbath long after He ascended back to heaven as it would be kept Matthew 24:20 and we see the Sabbath continuing as the Lords chosen day of worship for all eternity. Isaiah 66:23

Heb 4:4-10 - “For He has said somewhere concerning the seventh day: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;5 and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” 6 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it [some will enter into God’s rest, others will not], and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience [the unbelieving Jews] , 7 He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before,

Hebrews 4:4 is referring to God who spoke of the seventh day in this way at Mt Sinai when God spoke and wrote His commandments. Exodus 20:8-11 God resting on the seventh day from all His works is a reference to creation week. Genesis 2:1-3 Some do not enter His rest (this is not the Sabbath rest and verse 10 makes this distinction clear) the reason some do not enter into His rest was due to disobedience. This is a reference to those who it was first preached and Ezekiel tells us what they disobeyed, which is really what this whole passage is about if reading in its proper context.

Ezekiel 20:13 Yet the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness; they did not walk in My statutes; they despised My judgments, ‘which, if a man does, he shall live by them’; and they greatly defiled My Sabbaths. Then I said I would pour out My fury on them in the wilderness, to consume them.

“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

8 For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that [a day other than the sabbath].

Not sure if you noticed this but the Text does not say (a day other than the Sabbath) - these appear your words. Previously you made the claim that this verse says today is the Sabbath- I see you changed your stance on that since that is clearly not written, but it doesn't say a day other than the sabbath, we need to be careful we are not trying to insert our will in God's Word.

9 Consequently, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God [and that rest is Christ].

The seventh day is the Sabbath according to God Exodus 20:10. There is no scripture that says Christ is the Sabbath, this appear to be your words again and not the Text.

Rest here is sabbatismos which literally translates into keeping of the Sabbath. So this verse says there remains a keeping of the Sabbath for the people of God. Hebrews 4:9

σαββατισμὸς (sabbatismos)
Noun - Nominative Masculine Singular
Strong's 4520: A keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”

Yes and God's rest is the seventh day as shown in this very passage Hebrews 4:4 and to enter His rest we must also cease from our works (on the Sabbath) as God did from His as the text shows.

There is also one more verse that was left out...

Hebrews 4:11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience.

The example of disobedience was profaning God's holy Sabbath day. Ezekiel 20:13 This whole passage is about keeping the Sabbath to enter into Christ rests and we should be careful of not entering His rest due to hardening our heart in rebellion and following the same example of disobedience of the Israelites who profaned the Sabbath and why the Sabbath rest remains for God's people.

Again, I am not saying anything about failing to obey the commands of God. I am just saying that we are no longer subject to those commands of God that He Himself has said are no longer binding on us today.

God said something a little different Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33, Hebrews 10:16 and Jesus and the apostles 1 John 5:3, 1 John 2:3-6, Revelation 12:17, John 14:15, Revelation 14:12 John 15:10, Revelation 22:14-15, 1 Cor 7:19, James 2:10-12 to quote just a few.

To be honest, I am not sure it makes sense to continue this discussion so I will probably bow out. Too many of ones own words that are not in scripture and our words are not the same as God’s Word, which makes it hard to reason under these conditions. I do wish you well in seeking God’s Word.

 

[JSRG]

This phrase from Mark 7:19 contains a critical key, παντα τα βρωματα, (which was mentioned in the post you quoted). He is therefore only speaking of broma, (and herein bromata is of course plural), which concerns only foods that are declared to be edible food in the Torah. Broma and brosis concern these things and these are the two primary words also used by Paul in his letters when discussing foods and diet. People do not generally realize this unless they study the original languages, (for obviously this does not come through in English translations), but this does indeed change everything. The unclean creatures forbidden in the Torah almost never even enter into the discussions in N/T texts concerning food.

You assert that broma/bromata refer only to food edible according to the Torah, but do not offer any proof at all for this. Looking into it, it appears that the term simply means food. Not a special subset of food as you claim, but food. If your assertion is that it means something different in the New Testament than it does everywhere else, it seems it is incumbent on you to prove it, rather than asserting it with no evidence.

Here is what the LSJ Greek Lexicon says for βρῶμα (broma):
"A.that which is eaten, food, meat, Hp. VM6, Th.4.26, al.: metaph., Ar.Fr.333: freq. in pl., Hp.VM3, Antiph.246, Pl.Criti.115b, etc.; opp. ὄψα, Sosip.1.30.
II. cavity in a tooth, Hp.Epid.4.25, Dse.1.105, Archig. ap. Gal.12.859.
2. moth-eating, in pl., LXX Ep.Je.12.
III. pl., filth, ordure, prob. in Ev.Marc.7.19; cf. βρῶμος (B)."

No statement whatsoever that this refers specifically to clean foods. Interestingly, it suggests that the Mark 7:19 could have the meaning of filth or ordure, which goes even further against your statement of it being clean food. Even if we ignore that last note (it does say probably), we are still left with a word that simply means food, as the other meanings listed clearly do not apply.

You claim this is something that is uncovered in study of the original languages but the Greek lexicons I have consulted give no indication of this claim of yours; they simply say it means food with no qualification. So what is your rationale that broma refers only to food edible according to the Torah?

 

[daq]

You assert that broma/bromata refer only to food edible according to the Torah, but do not offer any proof at all for this. Looking into it, it appears that the term simply means food. Not a special subset of food as you claim, but food. If your assertion is that it means something different in the New Testament than it does everywhere else, it seems it is incumbent on you to prove it, rather than asserting it with no evidence.

Here is what the LSJ Greek Lexicon says for βρῶμα (broma):
"A.that which is eaten, food, meat, Hp. VM6, Th.4.26, al.: metaph., Ar.Fr.333: freq. in pl., Hp.VM3, Antiph.246, Pl.Criti.115b, etc.; opp. ὄψα, Sosip.1.30.
II. cavity in a tooth, Hp.Epid.4.25, Dse.1.105, Archig. ap. Gal.12.859.
2. moth-eating, in pl., LXX Ep.Je.12.
III. pl., filth, ordure, prob. in Ev.Marc.7.19; cf. βρῶμος (B)."

No statement whatsoever that this refers specifically to clean foods. Interestingly, it suggests that the Mark 7:19 could have the meaning of filth or ordure, which goes even further against your statement of it being clean food. Even if we ignore that last note (it does say probably), we are still left with a word that simply means food, as the other meanings listed clearly do not apply.

You claim this is something that is uncovered in study of the original languages but the Greek lexicons I have consulted give no indication of this claim of yours; they simply say it means food with no qualification. So what is your rationale that broma refers only to food edible according to the Torah?

Start here in your studies:

Genesis 6:21 KJV
21 And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather it to thee; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them.

Genesis 6:21 LXX Brenton Translation
21 (6:22) And thou shalt take to thyself of all kinds of food which ye eat, and thou shalt gather them to thyself, and it shall be for thee and them to eat.

Genesis 6:21 OG LXX
21 συ δε λημψη σεαυτω απο παντων των βρωματων α εδεσθε και συναξεις προς σεαυτον και εσται σοι και εκεινοις φαγειν

This is a direct referral back to Genesis 1:29, (where you will find brosis in the LXX, another word mentioned previously), and Gen 1:29 concerns the only food Noah would have eaten when this commandment was given in the passage above, and of course, the food for the animals in the above is also given in Gen 1:30. Lexicons compiled by meat lovers focusing on the Greek Classics are not going to help you: you'll need to study and learn the truth from the scripture.

 

[Doug Brents]

There are more than one Sabbath in the scripture- one is the weekly Sabbath and one of God's Ten Commandments that is God's moral law and eternal. Revelation 11:19, Exodus 20, Isaiah 66:23, Matthew 5:19 and is what points out sin Romans 7:7 the other the yearly sabbath(s) ordinances (annual sacrificial feast days) which was given because of sin and we no longer sacrifice animals for the forgiveness of sin because Christ became our Sacrificial Lamb for the forgiveness of sin- sin again is defined as breaking God's law 1 John 3:4 and points right to the Ten Commandments to define sin Romans 7:7

There is no distinction in Col 2 between any feast day sabbath and the weekly 7th day sabbath; it just says, “Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day”.

The festival sabbaths were an extension of the weekly sabbath. They were just additional days that were treated as a 7th day. They were not a separate class of sabbath. These sabbaths were also part of God’s moral law laid down as part of the Law delivered on Mt. Sinai. The violation was f these days was exactly the same as the violation of any other sabbath.

There is no scripture that say the whole OT was cancelled out by Christ including any of God's moral commandments that Jesus taught on. How many times are the commandments of God taught in the NT? How often did Jesus teach on the OT? The last book in the OT warns us not to forget the law and prophets, Malachi 4:4-5

Indeed there are passages that say this. Heb 8:13, “When He said, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is about to disappear.”
The Old Covenant was made obsolete by the New (the Covenant in His blood), and the Old was ready to pass away (completely and entirely, not just pieces of it).

Jesus taught on the OT because it was a school master to bring us to Christ Himself. Gal 3:24-29, “Therefore the Law has become our guardian to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26 For you are all sons and daughters of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.”

The entirety of the Old Covenant was the guardian/school master and we who are in Christ are no longer subject to that guardian.

Please show how the sacrificial system was integrated into the Ten Commandments. These again appear to be your words and not the Text.

The Ten Commandments​

20 And God spoke all these words, saying:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of [a]bondage.
3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor [b]serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting[c] the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

These were just the first 10 of the 613 laws of the Old Covenant. They are a summation of the more specific laws that had penalties and sacrifices connected with them. For example, there is no punishment mentioned when the 10 Commandments are first given, but in Exo 21:17 a punishment is given. And for some of the violations of commandments sacrifices were ordered as a way of pushing off the guilt so as not to fall under punishment. All of this is incorporated in the whole of the Old Covenant.

Jesus observed the Sabbath His entire life as well as the apostles, so again these are your words and not what is in the actual Text.

Indeed Jesus did observe the sabbath, BECAUSE HE WAS UNDER THE OLD COVENANT HIS ENTIRE LIFE!!! But the OC was removed as our school master when He died. And so WE are no longer subject to it.

Luke 4:16, Acts 13:42, Acts 13:44, Acts 18:4, John 15:10 to name just a few. The Sabbath is mentioned over 50 times in the NT and the fact it is still called the Sabbath, means there was no change to God's Commandment. Jesus spoke of the Sabbath long after He ascended back to heaven as it would be kept Matthew 24:20 and we see the Sabbath continuing as the Lords chosen day of worship for all eternity. Isaiah 66:23

Yes, sabbath is used repeatedly all through the NT. Jesus kept it because He was subject to it His whole life. The Apostles went to the Synagogue on sabbath because that was when people met there. That was where the people were, and the opportunity to talk about Christ was best.

But Matt 24:20 was about 70AD when the Romans sacked Jerusalem. And Isaiah 66:23 uses sabbath like we would use “weekend”. It is not talking about keeping sabbath in Heaven.

Hebrews 4:4 is referring to God who spoke of the seventh day in this way at Mt Sinai when God spoke and wrote His commandments. Exodus 20:8-11 God resting on the seventh day from all His works is a reference to creation week. Genesis 2:1-3 Some do not enter His rest (this is not the Sabbath rest and verse 10 makes this distinction clear) the reason some do not enter into His rest was due to disobedience. This is a reference to those who it was first preached and Ezekiel tells us what they disobeyed, which is really what this whole passage is about if reading in its proper context.

Have you never seen a passage from the OT applied to a NT event and the meaning of it changed to fit the real rather than the shadow? Do you not know that Hos 11:1 was originally speaking about the nation coming out in the Exodus, but Matthew changed it to fit Jesus (thus calling Jesus “Israel”) and completely changing the reference of Hosea.

God, through the Hebrew writer, is doing that here. This is not talking about the ancient Israelites defiling sabbath. It is about those who refused to accept Jesus as Messiah.

Not sure if you noticed this but the Text does not say (a day other than the Sabbath) you are adding to the Word of God which we are warned not to do Proverbs 30:5-6 and we cannot add or subtract to God's commandments Deut 4:2. Previously you made the claim that this verse says today is the Sabbath- I see you changed your stance on that since that is clearly not written, but it doesn't says a day other than the sabbath, we need to be careful we are not trying to insert our will in God's Word.

I am not adding anything to the Scripture. I didn’t say that today was the sabbath. I said whatever day you are reading those words is the fulfillment of “today”. NOW is the time, TODAY is the day, to accept Jesus as Messiah and obey Him so you may enter into His rest.

No, you again are adding your words that is not in the Text. The seventh day is the Sabbath according to God Exodus 20:10. There is no scripture that says Christ is the Sabbath.

Sorry, but is says so right there in Heb 4:9-10 - “Consequently, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. For the one who has entered His [Jesus’] rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”
Whoever enters into Jesus’ rest enters into the sabbath rest.

Yes and God's rest is the seventh day as shown in this very passage Hebrews 4:4 and to enter His rest we must ALSO cease from our works (on the Sabbath) as God did from His as the text clearly states.

There is also one more verse that was left out...

Hebrews 4:11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience.

Another admonition to be in Christ. Since He is our sabbath rest, and denying His is now what keeps us from that rest.

 

[Soyeong]

Actually, there is. As I have already cited:
Col 2: - “And when you were dead in your wrongdoings and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our wrongdoings, 14 having canceled the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

16 Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”

Verse 16 gives examples of the decrees that were against us that were taken away and nailed to the cross: food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath. These all come from different parts (as some people see them) of the Old Covenant. Each being referenced means each part of the Old Covenant was included in the hostile decrees against us that was nailed to the cross (canceled, completed, and fulfilled).

All of these things (food and drink, festivals, and the sabbath) are shadows of the things to come (in Heaven), and the substance (the real thing) is Christ. In Christ none of these OT commands have any power, significance, or authority.

In Colossians 2:14, it is not speaking about any laws being nailed to the cross, but rather there is a significant difference between these two statements:

1.) You shall not commit murder.

2.) This person has been found guilty of murder.

The first is an example of a law that is for our own good while the second is an example of a handwritten ordinance that was against someone that was nailed to their cross in order to announce why they were being executed. In Matthew 27:37, it says that they put the charge that was against Jesus over his head, so what was nailed to people's crosses was not the laws themselves, but the charge that was against them. This serves as a perfect analogy for the list of our violations of God's law being nailed to Christ's cross and with him dying in our place to pay the penalty for our sins, but has nothing to do with ending any of God's laws, especially because they are all eternal (Psalms 119:160). The Greek word "dogma" means "edict, ordinance, or decree" and is never used by the Bible to refer to God's law.

If we look at Colossians 2:16 by itself, then it is ambiguous in regard to two possible situations:

1.) The Colossians were not keeping God's feasts, they were being judged by Jews because they were not keeping them, and Paul was encouraging not to let any man judge them for not keeping them.

2.) The Colossians were keeping God's feasts, they were being judged by pagans because they were keeping them, and Paul was encouraging them not to let anyone judge them for keeping them.

If we look at the context of what Paul described of the views of the people who were judging them, then it becomes clear that the 2nd situation is the case in that they were being judged by pagans, such as saying in Colossians 2:20-23 that they were promoting human precepts and traditions, self-made religion, asceticism, and severity of the body. We must obey God rather than man, so we should be careful not to mistake what was only said against obeying the teaching of men as being against obeying the commands of God, especially when the point that Paul was making was that we shouldn’t let anyone prevent us from obeying the commands of God.

God's holy days are important foreshadows of what is to come and as followers of God we should live in a way that testifies about the truth of what is to come by continuing to keep them rather than a way that denies the truth of what is to come. In 1 Corinthians 5:6-8, Paul spoke in regard to how Passover foreshadowed Christ by drawing the connection of him being our Passover Lamb, however, instead of concluding that we no longer need to bother with Passover, he concluded that we should therefore continue to keep it.

Correct, the sabbath is not a stand alone commandment. It is part of the whole of the OT that was canceled by Christ at the cross.

Ezekiel is still part of the OT which was done away with (as commandments) at the cross. Yes, there is one people of God, and it is neither Jew nor Gentile, it is neither male nor female, it is neither slave nor free: it is all people who believe that Jesus is the Christ and obey Him.

In Matthew 4:17-23, Christ began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, and the Law of Moses was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel message. Furthermore, Jesus set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Law of Moses, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 3:4), so the way to believe that Jesus is the Christ and obey him is not by arguing that he went to the cross in order to nail to the cross everything he spent his ministry teaching by word and by example. In Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to end any laws, but in order to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what Jesus taught during his ministry and in what he accomplished through the cross, while saying that there were any laws nailed to the cross undermines his ministry and what he accomplished on the cross. The freedom that we have in Christ is the freedom from sin, not the freedom to do what God has revealed through His law to be sin.

The sacrificial system was not a stand alone part of the OT. It was integrated into every command: if you break this command, make this sacrifice, etc. The Law (of Moses), which was the codification of the Old Covenant, was all removed by Christ at the Cross.

Yes, Jesus became the ONE sacrifice that paid the debt for all our sins forever. But you miss that He incorporated the sabbath (in verse 16) into the things that are a shadow of what is to come.

You are separating into pieces a much larger whole. The covenant with Moses, of which the 10 Commandments and the rest of the Law, and the sacrificial system were a part, is just a renewal of the covenant made with Abraham, renewed with Issac, and renewed with Jacob. This same covenant was then renewed and expanded, and put into national law form through Moses. Same covenant, just made more detailed and given specific sacrifices for the breaking of each law. The whole covenant, all the way back to Abraham, was fulfilled and completed in Christ, and Christ made a New Covenant with His people (those who believe that He is the Christ and obey Him).

I didn’t say this one command was nullified I said the whole of the OT was fulfilled. All of the other of the 10 Commandments was renewed in the New Covenant, but the observation of the sabbath was not.

Heb 4:4-10 - “For He has said somewhere concerning the seventh day: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;5 and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” 6 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it [some will enter into God’s rest, others will not], and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience [the unbelieving Jews] , 7 He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before,

“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

8 For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that [a day other than the sabbath]. 9 Consequently, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God [and that rest is Christ]. 10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”

Read the passages in context. You keep focusing on parts and not seeing the whole.

Again, I am not saying anything about failing to obey the commands of God. I am just saying that we are no longer subject to those commands of God that He Himself has said are no longer binding on us today.

I just quoted and explained the passage that says just that.

It also says that God accepts the man who does, and the man who doesn’t, equally as long as each is doing it with his heart focused on God.

In Hebrews 3:18-19, they did not enter into God's rest because of their unbelief/disobedience, and in Ezekiel 20:13, it specifically mentions that they greatly profaned God's Sabbaths. In Hebrews 4:9-11, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, we should rest from our works in accordance with God example, and we should strive to enter into God's rest so that no one may fall away by the same sort or disobedience, so nothing in this passage should be used to try to justify the same sort of disobedience.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Another admonition to be in Christ. Since He is our sabbath rest, and denying His is now what keeps us from that rest.

Without adding your commentary, can you please post the scripture that says Jesus is our Sabbath please? I noticed you posted "your words" again and not the scripture. Our opinions, ideas, thoughts and desires are not equal to the Word of God.

If you could post the scripture that is as straightforward to what God personally wrote below, that would be great and without adding anything extra.

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God

 

[SabbathBlessings]

In Colossians 2:14, it is not speaking about any laws being nailed to the cross, but rather there is a significant difference between these two statements:

1.) You shall not commit murder.

2.) This person has been found guilty of murder.

The first is an example of a law that is for our own good while the second is an example of a handwritten ordinance that was against someone that was nailed to their cross in order to announce why they were being executed. In Matthew 27:37, it says that they put the charge that was against Jesus over his head, so what was nailed to people's crosses was not the laws themselves, but the charge that was against them. This serves as a perfect analogy for the list of our violations of God's law being nailed to Christ's cross and with him dying in our place to pay the penalty for our sins, but has nothing to do with ending any of God's laws, especially because they are all eternal (Psalms 119:160). The Greek word "dogma" means "edict, ordinance, or decree" and is never used by the Bible to refer to God's law.

If we look at Colossians 2:16 by itself, then it is ambiguous in regard to two possible situations:

1.) The Colossians were not keeping God's feasts, they were being judged by Jews because they were not keeping them, and Paul was encouraging not to let any man judge them for not keeping them.

2.) The Colossians were keeping God's feasts, they were being judged by pagans because they were keeping them, and Paul was encouraging them not to let anyone judge them for keeping them.

If we look at the context of what Paul described of the views of the people who were judging them, then it becomes clear that the 2nd situation is the case in that they were being judged by pagans, such as saying in Colossians 2:20-23 that they were promoting human precepts and traditions, self-made religion, asceticism, and severity of the body. We must obey God rather than man, so we should be careful not to mistake what was only said against obeying the teaching of men as being against obeying the commands of God, especially when the point that Paul was making was that we shouldn’t let anyone prevent us from obeying the commands of God.

God's holy days are important foreshadows of what is to come and as followers of God we should live in a way that testifies about the truth of what is to come by continuing to keep them rather than a way that denies the truth of what is to come. In 1 Corinthians 5:6-8, Paul spoke in regard to how Passover foreshadowed Christ by drawing the connection of him being our Passover Lamb, however, instead of concluding that we no longer need to bother with Passover, he concluded that we should therefore continue to keep it.



In Matthew 4:17-23, Christ began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, and the Law of Moses was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel message. Furthermore, Jesus set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Law of Moses, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 3:4), so the way to believe that Jesus is the Christ and obey him is not by arguing that he went to the cross in order to nail to the cross everything he spent his ministry teaching by word and by example. In Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to end any laws, but in order to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what Jesus taught during his ministry and in what he accomplished through the cross, while saying that there were any laws nailed to the cross undermines his ministry and what he accomplished on the cross. The freedom that we have in Christ is the freedom from sin, not the freedom to do what God has revealed through His law to be sin.




In Hebrews 3:18-19, they did not enter into God's rest because of their unbelief/disobedience, and in Ezekiel 20:13, it specifically mentions that they greatly profaned God's Sabbaths. In Hebrews 4:9-11, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, we should rest from our works in accordance with God example, and we should strive to enter into God's rest so that no one may fall away by the same sort or disobedience, so nothing in this passage should be used to try to justify the same sort of disobedience.

Hey!

I haven't seen you around for a while- welcome back and Happy New Year!

 

[JSRG]

Start here in your studies:

Genesis 6:21 KJV
21 And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather it to thee; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them.

Genesis 6:21 LXX Brenton Translation
21 (6:22) And thou shalt take to thyself of all kinds of food which ye eat, and thou shalt gather them to thyself, and it shall be for thee and them to eat.

Genesis 6:21 OG LXX
21 συ δε λημψη σεαυτω απο παντων των βρωματων α εδεσθε και συναξεις προς σεαυτον και εσται σοι και εκεινοις φαγειν

This is a direct referral back to Genesis 1:29, (where you will find brosis in the LXX, another word mentioned previously), and Gen 1:29 concerns the only food Noah would have eaten when this commandment was given in the passage above, and of course, the food for the animals in the above is also given in Gen 1:30.

This is not evidence that the word "food" was used only to refer to clean food, as was your contention. What you're basically doing is asserting that the word meant a particular thing, and then arguing based on that assumption for your assumption.

Indeed, you cite brosis here. But that term is used in Genesis 3:6 in the LXX to refer to the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge--which they were told explicitly not to eat from.

Further evidence against this is Leviticus 11:34, which in the LXX uses broma with the additional specifier of being eaten (that is, food you eat), which would be unnecessary if it was understood that the term was limited to food they were allowed to eat.

And the interpretation you offer also simply makes the statement of Mark 7:19 completely redundant, as it's claiming that Jesus declared food that was clean to be clean.

 

[Soyeong]

Hey!

I haven't seen you around for a while- welcome back and Happy New Year!

Merry New Year!

 

[daq]

This is not evidence that the word "food" was used only to refer to clean food, as was your contention. What you're basically doing is asserting that the word meant a particular thing, and then arguing based on that assumption for your assumption.

Indeed, you cite brosis here. But that term is used in Genesis 3:6 in the LXX to refer to the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge--which they were told explicitly not to eat from.

Further evidence against this is Leviticus 11:34, which in the LXX uses broma with the additional specifier of being eaten (that is, food you eat), which would be unnecessary if it was understood that the term was limited to food they were allowed to eat.

And the interpretation you offer also simply makes the statement of Mark 7:19 completely redundant, as it's claiming that Jesus declared food that was clean to be clean.

Okay, so we disagree on the understanding of the contexts and what they say in the passages I quoted. Your response strongly implies to me that you have already studied them out, and thus, no further need for us to discuss this: for in my understanding only what Elohim calls food to be eaten is actually food to be eaten.

In your understanding of the Mark passage you believe the Master somehow cleansed all foods so that you may now eat whatsoever you wish. As others have already presented very good arguments against what you prefer to believe, I don't see much reason to repeat those arguments, except to say that the Mark passage and its Matthew companion passage are not speaking about what you and those who agree with you claim. It's about washing your hands before eating. You would do well to look up a video or two concerning the Pharisaic handwashing custom or ceremony, which was, and still is, quite elaborate and lengthy. Moreover your understanding of the Mark passage creates a contradiction in the scripture because the abominations listed in the Torah, regarding unclean foods, do indeed defile the eater according to the Torah. You and yours are essentially saying that the Master overthrows the Word of the Father so that you can now eat whatsoever you wish.

 

[Doug Brents]

Without adding your commentary, can you please post the scripture that says Jesus is our Sabbath please? I noticed you posted "your words" again and not the scripture. Our opinions, ideas, thoughts and desires are not equal to the Word of God.

If you could post the scripture that is as straightforward to what God personally wrote below, that would be great and without adding anything extra.

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God

These are not my words, I borrowed them, but they say what, and cite the Scriptures that, I would have. He is just more eloquent than I am.

The key to understanding how Jesus is our Sabbath rest is the Hebrew word sabat, which means "to rest or stop or cease from work." The origin of the Sabbath goes back to Creation. After creating the heavens and the earth in six days, God "rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made" (Genesis 2:2). This doesn’t mean that God was tired and needed a rest. We know that God is omnipotent, literally "all-powerful." He has all the power in the universe, He never tires, and His most arduous expenditure of energy does not diminish His power one bit. So, what does it mean that God rested on the seventh day? Simply that He stopped what He was doing. He ceased from His labors. This is important in understanding the establishment of the Sabbath day and the role of Christ as our Sabbath rest.

God used the example of His resting on the seventh day of Creation to establish the principle of the Sabbath day rest for His people. In Exodus 20:8-11and Deuteronomy 5:12-15, God gave the Israelites the fourth of His Ten Commandments. They were to "remember" the Sabbath day and "keep it holy." One day out of every seven, they were to rest from their labors and give the same day of rest to their servants and animals. This was not just a physical rest, but a cessation of laboring. Whatever work they were engaged in was to stop for a full day each week. (Please read our other articles on the Sabbath day, Saturday vs. Sunday and Sabbath keeping to explore this issue further.) The Sabbath day was established so the people would rest from their labors, only to begin again after a one-day rest.

The various elements of the Sabbath symbolized the coming of the Messiah, who would provide a permanent rest for His people. Once again the example of resting from our labors comes into play. With the establishment of the Old Testament Law, the Jews were constantly "laboring" to make themselves acceptable to God. Their labors included trying to obey a myriad of do’s and don’ts of the ceremonial law, the Temple law, the civil law, etc. Of course they couldn’t possibly keep all those laws, so God provided an array of sin offerings and sacrifices so they could come to Him for forgiveness and restore fellowship with Him, but only temporarily. Just as they began their physical labors after a one-day rest, so, too, did they have to continue to offer sacrifices. Hebrews 10:1 tells us that the law "can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship." But these sacrifices were offered in anticipation of the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who "after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right of God" (Hebrews 10:12). Just as He rested after performing the ultimate sacrifice, He sat down and rested—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever. Because of what He did, we no longer have to "labor" in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in God and in what He has provided.

Another element of the Sabbath day rest which God instituted as a foreshadowing of our complete rest in Christ is that He blessed it, sanctified it, and made it holy. Here again we see the symbol of Christ as our Sabbath rest—the holy, perfect Son of God who sanctifies and makes holy all who believe in Him. God sanctified Christ, just as He sanctified the Sabbath day, and sent Him into the world (John 10:36) to be our sacrifice for sin. In Him we find complete rest from the labors of our self-effort, because He alone is holy and righteous. "God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God" (2 Corinthians 5:21). We can now cease from our spiritual labors and rest in Him, not just one day a week, but always.

Jesus can be our Sabbath rest in part because He is "Lord of the Sabbath" (Matthew 12:8). As God incarnate, He decides the true meaning of the Sabbath because He created it, and He is our Sabbath rest in the flesh. When the Pharisees criticized Him for healing on the Sabbath, Jesus reminded them that even they, sinful as they were, would not hesitate to pull a sheep out of a pit on the Sabbath. Because He came to seek and save His sheep who would hear His voice (John 10:3,27) and enter into the Sabbath rest He provided by paying for their sins, He could break the Sabbath rules. He told the Pharisees that people are more important than sheep and the salvation He provided was more important than rules. By saying, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath" (Mark 2:27), Jesus was restating the principle that the Sabbath rest was instituted to relieve man of his labors, just as He came to relieve us of our attempting to achieve salvation by our works. We no longer rest for only one day, but forever cease our laboring to attain God’s favor. Jesus is our rest from works now, just as He is the door to heaven, where we will rest in Him forever.

Hebrews 4 is the definitive passage regarding Jesus as our Sabbath rest. The writer to the Hebrews exhorts his readers to “enter in” to the Sabbath rest provided by Christ. After three chapters of telling them that Jesus is superior to the angels and that He is our Apostle and High Priest, he pleads with them to not harden their hearts against Him, as their fathers hardened their hearts against the Lord in the wilderness. Because of their unbelief, God denied that generation access to the holy land, saying, “They shall not enter into My rest” (Hebrews 3:11). In the same way, the writer to the Hebrews begs his readers not to make the same mistake by rejecting God’s Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ. “There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience” (Hebrews 4:9–11).

There is no other Sabbath rest besides Jesus. He alone satisfies the requirements of the Law, and He alone provides the sacrifice that atones for sin. He is God’s plan for us to cease from the labor of our own works. We dare not reject this one-and-only Way of salvation (John 14:6). God’s reaction to those who choose to reject His plan is seen in Numbers 15. A man was found gathering sticks on the Sabbath day, in spite of God’s plain commandment to cease from all labor on the Sabbath. This transgression was a known and willful sin, done with unblushing boldness in broad daylight, in open defiance of the divine authority. “Then the LORD said to Moses, ‘The man must die. The whole assembly must stone him outside the camp’” (verse 35). So it will be to all who reject God’s provision for our Sabbath rest in Christ. “How shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation?” (Hebrews 2:3).

 

[SabbathBlessings]

These are not my words, I borrowed them, but they say what, and cite the Scriptures that, I would have. He is just more eloquent than I am.

The key to understanding how Jesus is our Sabbath rest is the Hebrew word sabat, which means "to rest or stop or cease from work." The origin of the Sabbath goes back to Creation. After creating the heavens and the earth in six days, God "rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made" (Genesis 2:2). This doesn’t mean that God was tired and needed a rest. We know that God is omnipotent, literally "all-powerful." He has all the power in the universe, He never tires, and His most arduous expenditure of energy does not diminish His power one bit. So, what does it mean that God rested on the seventh day? Simply that He stopped what He was doing. He ceased from His labors. This is important in understanding the establishment of the Sabbath day and the role of Christ as our Sabbath rest.

God used the example of His resting on the seventh day of Creation to establish the principle of the Sabbath day rest for His people. In Exodus 20:8-11and Deuteronomy 5:12-15, God gave the Israelites the fourth of His Ten Commandments. They were to "remember" the Sabbath day and "keep it holy." One day out of every seven, they were to rest from their labors and give the same day of rest to their servants and animals. This was not just a physical rest, but a cessation of laboring. Whatever work they were engaged in was to stop for a full day each week. (Please read our other articles on the Sabbath day, Saturday vs. Sunday and Sabbath keeping to explore this issue further.) The Sabbath day was established so the people would rest from their labors, only to begin again after a one-day rest.

The various elements of the Sabbath symbolized the coming of the Messiah, who would provide a permanent rest for His people. Once again the example of resting from our labors comes into play. With the establishment of the Old Testament Law, the Jews were constantly "laboring" to make themselves acceptable to God. Their labors included trying to obey a myriad of do’s and don’ts of the ceremonial law, the Temple law, the civil law, etc. Of course they couldn’t possibly keep all those laws, so God provided an array of sin offerings and sacrifices so they could come to Him for forgiveness and restore fellowship with Him, but only temporarily. Just as they began their physical labors after a one-day rest, so, too, did they have to continue to offer sacrifices. Hebrews 10:1 tells us that the law "can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship." But these sacrifices were offered in anticipation of the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who "after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right of God" (Hebrews 10:12). Just as He rested after performing the ultimate sacrifice, He sat down and rested—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever. Because of what He did, we no longer have to "labor" in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in God and in what He has provided.

Another element of the Sabbath day rest which God instituted as a foreshadowing of our complete rest in Christ is that He blessed it, sanctified it, and made it holy. Here again we see the symbol of Christ as our Sabbath rest—the holy, perfect Son of God who sanctifies and makes holy all who believe in Him. God sanctified Christ, just as He sanctified the Sabbath day, and sent Him into the world (John 10:36) to be our sacrifice for sin. In Him we find complete rest from the labors of our self-effort, because He alone is holy and righteous. "God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God" (2 Corinthians 5:21). We can now cease from our spiritual labors and rest in Him, not just one day a week, but always.

Jesus can be our Sabbath rest in part because He is "Lord of the Sabbath" (Matthew 12:8). As God incarnate, He decides the true meaning of the Sabbath because He created it, and He is our Sabbath rest in the flesh. When the Pharisees criticized Him for healing on the Sabbath, Jesus reminded them that even they, sinful as they were, would not hesitate to pull a sheep out of a pit on the Sabbath. Because He came to seek and save His sheep who would hear His voice (John 10:3,27) and enter into the Sabbath rest He provided by paying for their sins, He could break the Sabbath rules. He told the Pharisees that people are more important than sheep and the salvation He provided was more important than rules. By saying, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath" (Mark 2:27), Jesus was restating the principle that the Sabbath rest was instituted to relieve man of his labors, just as He came to relieve us of our attempting to achieve salvation by our works. We no longer rest for only one day, but forever cease our laboring to attain God’s favor. Jesus is our rest from works now, just as He is the door to heaven, where we will rest in Him forever.

Hebrews 4 is the definitive passage regarding Jesus as our Sabbath rest. The writer to the Hebrews exhorts his readers to “enter in” to the Sabbath rest provided by Christ. After three chapters of telling them that Jesus is superior to the angels and that He is our Apostle and High Priest, he pleads with them to not harden their hearts against Him, as their fathers hardened their hearts against the Lord in the wilderness. Because of their unbelief, God denied that generation access to the holy land, saying, “They shall not enter into My rest” (Hebrews 3:11). In the same way, the writer to the Hebrews begs his readers not to make the same mistake by rejecting God’s Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ. “There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience” (Hebrews 4:9–11).

There is no other Sabbath rest besides Jesus. He alone satisfies the requirements of the Law, and He alone provides the sacrifice that atones for sin. He is God’s plan for us to cease from the labor of our own works. We dare not reject this one-and-only Way of salvation (John 14:6). God’s reaction to those who choose to reject His plan is seen in Numbers 15. A man was found gathering sticks on the Sabbath day, in spite of God’s plain commandment to cease from all labor on the Sabbath. This transgression was a known and willful sin, done with unblushing boldness in broad daylight, in open defiance of the divine authority. “Then the LORD said to Moses, ‘The man must die. The whole assembly must stone him outside the camp’” (verse 35). So it will be to all who reject God’s provision for our Sabbath rest in Christ. “How shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation?” (Hebrews 2:3).

I take it you can’t answer the question. If it was there is would be easy to provide- much like the definition God gave by His own Words that the seventh day is the Sabbath Exodus 20:10. I could provide commentary that disputes the commentary you presented, but I am asking you to deal with the scriptures and to find the verse that says Jesus is our Sabbath. If it was in God’s Word- it should be easy to find.

 

[Doug Brents]

I take it you can’t answer the question. If it was there is would be easy to provide- much like the definition God gave by His own Words that the seventh day is the Sabbath Exodus 20:10. I could provide commentary that disputes the commentary you presented, but I am asking you to deal with the scriptures and to find the verse that says Jesus is our Sabbath. If it was in God’s Word- it should be easy to find.

You continue to focus on Exodus and the definition there. That is a great definition, and a good example of an OT command. But we are no longer subject to the OT at all, as I have already shown but you refuse to see.

The commentary I posed above details the passages that show Jesus as our sabbath rest. He is the end of our “work” to save ourselves, to keep the commandments, and to obey the Law. He is the Holy One, He is greater than the sabbath, and He made the sabbath for man, not man for the sabbath. We who are “IN CHRIST” have rest for our soul, and peace with God. That is what the 7th day sabbath was all about. But now we have that in Christ, even more than some weekly task (or lack of task) of keeping the sabbath.

I know you don’t like that answer, but that is the answer that Scripture gives. It is not all in one place, like the definition of the OT sabbath, but it is there in Scripture all the same.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You continue to focus on Exodus and the definition there. That is a great definition, and a good example of an OT command. But we are no longer subject to the OT at all, as I have already shown but you refuse to see.

The commentary I posed above details the passages that show Jesus as our sabbath rest. He is the end of our “work” to save ourselves, to keep the commandments, and to obey the Law. He is the Holy One, He is greater than the sabbath, and He made the sabbath for man, not man for the sabbath. We who are “IN CHRIST” have rest for our soul, and peace with God. That is what the 7th day sabbath was all about. But now we have that in Christ, even more than some weekly task (or lack of task) of keeping the sabbath.

I know you don’t like that answer, but that is the answer that Scripture gives. It is not all in one place, like the definition of the OT sabbath, but it is there in Scripture all the same.

Is God not the God of eternity, yesterday today and tomorrow? Not sure why you think God of the OT is a different God of the New Testament and somehow His Words are no longer valid. Jesus disagrees.

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ”

According to God’s Word, the Sabbath is about keeping the day holy. Exodus 20:8 which God said is the seventh day. Exodus 20:10. The purpose of the Sabbath is the day to honor God doing His ways, not ours Isaiah 58:13 And the Lord delights when we keep His Sabbath and blesses us Isaiah 58:14 . He blesses us by His spiritual rest, when we cease from our works (God told us to do this on the seventh day Exodus 20:8-11) just like He did as our example on the seventh day. Genesis 2:1-3, Hebrews 4:4. Hebrews 4:10. The Sabbath is also a commandment of God that God said we cannot add or subtract from- Deut 4:2 and we need to be careful of doing so Proverbs 30:5-6 There is no scripture that says Jesus is our Sabbath and kept it so we don’t have to. God did not give Himself the commandments- He gave man His commandments. I see a lot of opinions in your post, but our opinions are not the same as the Text.

Anyway, since you can’t provide a simple verse that backs up your statement that Jesus is our Sabbath, I think its safe to say, we both know it’s not there.

Take care.

 

[Soyeong]

The key to understanding how Jesus is our Sabbath rest is the Hebrew word sabat, which means "to rest or stop or cease from work."

Agreed, the word used for "rest" refers to ceasing from creative activity.

God used the example of His resting on the seventh day of Creation to establish the principle of the Sabbath day rest for His people. In Exodus 20:8-11and Deuteronomy 5:12-15, God gave the Israelites the fourth of His Ten Commandments. They were to "remember" the Sabbath day and "keep it holy." One day out of every seven, they were to rest from their labors and give the same day of rest to their servants and animals. This was not just a physical rest, but a cessation of laboring. Whatever work they were engaged in was to stop for a full day each week. (Please read our other articles on the Sabbath day, Saturday vs. Sunday and Sabbath keeping to explore this issue further.) The Sabbath day was established so the people would rest from their labors, only to begin again after a one-day rest.

God did not command the Israelites to rest one day our of seven, but to rest on the 7th day. Resting on the 7th day is in remembrance of when God rested after Creation and the Israelites received a double portion of manna for the 7th day, so they knew on which day God rested, and the Israelites were all to rest on the same day.

The various elements of the Sabbath symbolized the coming of the Messiah, who would provide a permanent rest for His people. Once again the example of resting from our labors comes into play. With the establishment of the Old Testament Law, the Jews were constantly "laboring" to make themselves acceptable to God. Their labors included trying to obey a myriad of do’s and don’ts of the ceremonial law, the Temple law, the civil law, etc. Of course they couldn’t possibly keep all those laws, so God provided an array of sin offerings and sacrifices so they could come to Him for forgiveness and restore fellowship with Him, but only temporarily. Just as they began their physical labors after a one-day rest, so, too, did they have to continue to offer sacrifices. Hebrews 10:1 tells us that the law "can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship." But these sacrifices were offered in anticipation of the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who "after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right of God" (Hebrews 10:12). Just as He rested after performing the ultimate sacrifice, He sat down and rested—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever. Because of what He did, we no longer have to "labor" in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in God and in what He has provided.

Resting on the the Sabbath testifies about the Messiah and we should live in a way that testifies about him. The Sabbath does not involve resting from our obedience to God, but from our creative work. In Jeremiah 6:16-19, God's law is described as the good way where we will find rest for our souls, not as the way to labor for God to earn our salvation. In Deuteronomy 30:11-14, God's word says that His law is not too difficult to keep, so it is false that we can't possibly keep all of them. In Psalms 119:160, all of God's righteous laws are eternal, so they were not given temporarily. Again, we should live in a way that testifies about the ultimate sacrifices by obeying God's laws for how to do that rather than a way that denies it. God's law was not given as a means of earning our justification as a wage even through perfect obedience (Romans 4:4-5), which is why there are many verses that speak against that misunderstanding of the goal of the law, so that was never something that we needed to rest from. Furthermore, the fact that we don't earn our justification by obeying God does not mean that we aren't still obligated to obey God.

Another element of the Sabbath day rest which God instituted as a foreshadowing of our complete rest in Christ is that He blessed it, sanctified it, and made it holy. Here again we see the symbol of Christ as our Sabbath rest—the holy, perfect Son of God who sanctifies and makes holy all who believe in Him. God sanctified Christ, just as He sanctified the Sabbath day, and sent Him into the world (John 10:36) to be our sacrifice for sin. In Him we find complete rest from the labors of our self-effort, because He alone is holy and righteous. "God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God" (2 Corinthians 5:21). We can now cease from our spiritual labors and rest in Him, not just one day a week, but always.

Again, in 1 Corinthians 5:6-8, Paul spoke in regard to how Passover foreshadowed Christ, however, instead of concluding that we no longer need to bother with Passover, he concludes that we should therefore keep. So the fact that the Sabbath foreshadows Christ is a reason why we should continue to keep the 7th day holy. In 1 Peter 1:16, we are told to have a holy conduct for God is holy, which is a quote from Leviticus where God was giving instructions for how to have a holy conduct as he is holy, which includes keeping God's Sabbaths holy (Leviticus 19:2-3), so by keeping those laws we are acting in accordance with and testifying about God's eternal holiness. It is contradictory for someone to want to be made holy by believing in Christ while wanting nothing to do with following God's instructions for how to have a holy conduct as He is holy. The only way that we should no longer follow God's instructions for how to have a holy conduct as He is holy would be if God were no longer eternally holy.

God is trustworthy, therefore His law is also trustworthy (Psalms 19:7), so to rely on God's law for salvation is the way to rely on God for salvation, while for you to speak against relying on God's law is to speak against relying on God. Obedience to any set of instructions is about relying on the one who gave them to correctly guide us, so thinking that our obedience to God's law is about our self-effort is not giving credit where it is due. Christ expressed the righteousness of God through His obedience to God's law, so that is also the way that we live when we have become the righteousness of God.

Jesus can be our Sabbath rest in part because He is "Lord of the Sabbath" (Matthew 12:8). As God incarnate, He decides the true meaning of the Sabbath because He created it, and He is our Sabbath rest in the flesh. When the Pharisees criticized Him for healing on the Sabbath, Jesus reminded them that even they, sinful as they were, would not hesitate to pull a sheep out of a pit on the Sabbath. Because He came to seek and save His sheep who would hear His voice (John 10:3,27) and enter into the Sabbath rest He provided by paying for their sins, He could break the Sabbath rules. He told the Pharisees that people are more important than sheep and the salvation He provided was more important than rules. By saying, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath" (Mark 2:27), Jesus was restating the principle that the Sabbath rest was instituted to relieve man of his labors, just as He came to relieve us of our attempting to achieve salvation by our works. We no longer rest for only one day, but forever cease our laboring to attain God’s favor. Jesus is our rest from works now, just as He is the door to heaven, where we will rest in Him forever.

If you think that Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, then you should live in a way that testifies about that truth by keeping the 7th day holy rather than a way that denies it. While God commanded His people to rest on the 7th day, He also commanded priests to make offering on the 7th day (Numbers 28:9-10), however it was not the case that they were forced to sin by transgressing one of the two commands no matter what they chose to do, but that the lesser command was never intended to be understood as preventing the greater command from being obeyed. This is why Jesus said that priests who did their duties on the Sabbath were held innocents, why David and his men were innocent, and why he defended his disciples as being innocent (Matthew 12:5-7), so there has never been anything wrong with getting a sheep out of a pit on the Sabbath, but that doesn't mean that a priest who did creative work on the Sabbath would still be held innocent. In Galatians 4:4, Jesus was born under the law, so he was obligated to obey it, and he was sinless, so he never broke it, which includes never breaking the Sabbath. Again, if you think that Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, then he could not do away with the Sabbath without doing away with himself. The Sabbath is a gift from God that was given for our own good in order to bless us and was not given for our detriment, so it was never intended to prevent someone from being healed. Jesus came to set us free from sin, not to set us free to be able to sin. Nowhere does the Bible state that Jesus is our Sabbath now instead of keeping the 7th day holy.

Hebrews 4 is the definitive passage regarding Jesus as our Sabbath rest. The writer to the Hebrews exhorts his readers to “enter in” to the Sabbath rest provided by Christ. After three chapters of telling them that Jesus is superior to the angels and that He is our Apostle and High Priest, he pleads with them to not harden their hearts against Him, as their fathers hardened their hearts against the Lord in the wilderness. Because of their unbelief, God denied that generation access to the holy land, saying, “They shall not enter into My rest” (Hebrews 3:11). In the same way, the writer to the Hebrews begs his readers not to make the same mistake by rejecting God’s Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ. “There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience” (Hebrews 4:9–11).

Again, in Hebrews 4:11, we should strive to enter into God's rest so that no one may fall away by the same sort of disobedience, so you should not try to use that to justify the same sort of disobedience.

There is no other Sabbath rest besides Jesus. He alone satisfies the requirements of the Law, and He alone provides the sacrifice that atones for sin. He is God’s plan for us to cease from the labor of our own works. We dare not reject this one-and-only Way of salvation (John 14:6). God’s reaction to those who choose to reject His plan is seen in Numbers 15. A man was found gathering sticks on the Sabbath day, in spite of God’s plain commandment to cease from all labor on the Sabbath. This transgression was a known and willful sin, done with unblushing boldness in broad daylight, in open defiance of the divine authority. “Then the LORD said to Moses, ‘The man must die. The whole assembly must stone him outside the camp’” (verse 35). So it will be to all who reject God’s provision for our Sabbath rest in Christ. “How shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation?” (Hebrews 2:3).

In Hebrews 1:3, the Son is the exact expression of God's nature, or in other words, he is the living embodiment of the nature of God expressed through setting a sinless example of how to walk obedience to God's law, so he is the personification of righteousness, justice, holiness, etc., and there is no righteousness, justice, or holiness apart from the nature of who he is. However, that doesn't mean that we shouldn't do what is righteous, just, and holy, but just the opposite, we should seek to be like Christ and to testify about who he is by parting in his nature through following his example. God's law is the way (Psalms 119:1-3), the truth (Psalms 119:142), and the life (Deuteronomy 32:47), and the way to know the Father (Exodus 33:13), and Jesus is the living embodiment of the way, the truth, and the life, and the way to know the Father (John 14:6-7), so it is contradictory to believe in one while rejecting the other. Our salvation is from sin (Matthew 1:21) and sin is the transgression of God's law (1 John 3:4), so living in obedience to God's law is intrinsically part of the concept of Jesus saving us from not living in obedience to it, while refusing to repent and live in obedience to it in accordance with the Gospel is the way to neglect so great a salvation.

 

[Leaf473]

Okay, so we disagree on the understanding of the contexts and what they say in the passages I quoted. Your response strongly implies to me that you have already studied them out, and thus, no further need for us to discuss this: for in my understanding only what Elohim calls food to be eaten is actually food to be eaten.

In your understanding of the Mark passage you believe the Master somehow cleansed all foods so that you may now eat whatsoever you wish. As others have already presented very good arguments against what you prefer to believe, I don't see much reason to repeat those arguments, except to say that the Mark passage and its Matthew companion passage are not speaking about what you and those who agree with you claim. It's about washing your hands before eating. You would do well to look up a video or two concerning the Pharisaic handwashing custom or ceremony, which was, and still is, quite elaborate and lengthy. Moreover your understanding of the Mark passage creates a contradiction in the scripture because the abominations listed in the Torah, regarding unclean foods, do indeed defile the eater according to the Torah. You and yours are essentially saying that the Master overthrows the Word of the Father so that you can now eat whatsoever you wish.

Commenting on this idea:

You and yours are essentially saying that the Master overthrows the Word of the Father so that you can now eat whatsoever you wish.

Not overthrew the word, but fulfilled the law.

The reasoning presented as to why the laws about unclean foods are fulfilled is given here imo:

...whatever goes into the person from the outside can’t defile him, because it doesn’t go into his heart, but into his stomach, then into the sewer.

Peace be with you all.

 

[Doug Brents]

Is God not the God of eternity, yesterday today and tomorrow? Not sure how you think God of the OT is a different God of the New Testament and somehow His Words are no longer valid.

God is the same, but His commands and how He relates to man have changed over time.

He does not change: His character, His nature, His power; but His mind does change, He has changed the way He deals with man, He has repented of a decision He made. And He said, not I, that He would make a NEW Covenant with man, and that New Covenant would replace the Old because the Old was but a shadow of the real, and the real is Christ.

According to God’s Word, the Sabbath is about keeping the day holy. Exodus 20:8 which God said is the seventh day. Exodus 20:10. The purpose of the Sabbath is the day to honor God doing His ways, not ours Isaiah 58:13 And the Lord delights when we keep His Sabbath. Isaiah 58:14 I see a lot of opinions in your post, but our opinions are not the same as the Text.

Yes, the sabbath in the OT was the 7th day. No one is disputing that. But in the NT the sabbath is Christ. He takes away our work, and He gives us peace. And all of that is from the text, not my opinion or speculation. It is directly from God’s word.

Anyway, since you can’t provide a simple verse that backs up your statement that Jesus is our Sabbath, I think its safe to say, we both know it’s not there.

Take care.

Just because you refuse to see what is in the text does not mean it is not there. Your focus is so tight on keeping (at least some of) the OC Law that you, like the Pharisees, cannot see that the OC is obsolete. It is no longer valid for Christians today. I pray that your vision would be restored and you would see what God wrote for us to understand.