How Many Evenings are in a Day?

[HARK!]

Brother, not always according to your own choice of translation below, where the word is translated "above" and not between.

And it has strong rods for sceptres of rulers, And high is its stature above (bayin) thick branches, And it appears in its height In the multitude of its thin shoots." (Ezekiel 19:11 CLV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

I'm not sure where you found that CLV rendering.

Here is what I have on their program that I downloaded:

(CLV) Ezk 19:11
It had strong mainstems which were fit for scepters of rulers; It soared aloft in its stature on among the leafy trees, And it was made apparent by its loftiness, by the abundance of its branches.

I'd like to see your source, which seems to be misrepresenting the CLV. This looks like fraud to me.

However, the CLV prides itself with translating the same word, the same way, each time.

They jumped the shark on this one.

 

[HARK!]

Please say which books you currently consider scripture, if you wish.

I consider 1Enoch and Jubilees to be scripture. There may be more. Some say that Jasher is another name for Jubilees. There is the lost book of Jasher, which I suspect wasn't lost, but is Jubilees. There is the forgery, which I believe is still accepted by the LDS; and there is the Talmud version, which was named after Jasher; but most people who are familiar with it, understand that it was simply named after the authentic Book of Jasher.

 

[guevaraj]

I'd like to see your source, which seems to be misrepresenting the CLV. This looks like fraud to me.

Brother, here is the source.

studybible.info/CLV/Ezekiel 19:11​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[HARK!]

Brother, here is the source.

studybible.info/CLV/Ezekiel 19:11​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

And it has strong rods for sceptres of rulers, And high is its stature above (bayin) thick branches, And it appears in its height In the multitude of its thin shoots." (Ezekiel 19:11 CLV)

Better to go to the source: https://scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/eze19.pdf

Here is the index for the TaNaK: Online Hebrew Interlinear Bible

 

[guevaraj]

Better to go to the source: https://scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/eze19.pdf
Here is the index for the TaNaK: Online Hebrew Interlinear Bible

Brother, I like this translation! It has given me a new perspective on the meaning of the word translated as exalted "among". Yes, this translation describes the evenings in Jerusalem exalted "among" all other evenings outside of Jerusalem, because the days of the months in God's calendar, fixed in the creation time zone, fall in Jerusalem from evening to evening, when in the creation time zone they fell from morning to morning. Doesn't mean more than one evening per weekday either!

And she had strong rods for the sceptres of them that bare rule, and her stature was exalted among (bayin) the thick branches, and she appeared in her height with the multitude of her branches. (Ezekiel 19:11 CLV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[HARK!]

Acts 24:5 ASV
5 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of insurrections among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes:

I like these too.


(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 9:2
requests from him letters for Damascus to the synagogues, so that, if he should be finding any who are of the way, both men and women, he may be leading them bound to Jerusalem.

Matthew 3 CJB

3 This is the man Yesha`yahu was talking about when he said, "The voice of someone crying out: `In the desert prepare the way of ADONAI! Make straight paths for him!'"

4Q258

He shall guide them with knowledge and instruct them in the mysteries of wonder and truth in the midst of the members of the community, so that they shall behave decently with one another in all that has been revealed to them. That is the time for studying the Torah (lit. clearing the way) in the wilderness.

Dead Sea Scrolls -- Community Rule

4Q434, fr. I
Bless, my soul, the Lord
for all His marvels for ever,
and may His name be blessed.
For He has delivered the soul of the poor,
and has not despised the humble,
and has not forgotten the misery of the deprived.
He has opened His eyes towards the distressed,
and has heard the cry of the fatherless,
and has turned His ears towards their crying.
He has been gracious to the humble by His great kindness,
and has opened their eyes to see His ways,
and [thei]r e[ar]s to hear His teaching.
He has circumcised the foreskin of their heart,
and has delivered them because of His kindness,
and has directed their feet towards the way.

1QS

And when these become members of the Community in Israel
according to all these rules, they shall separate from the habitation of
unjust men and shall go into the wilderness to prepare there the way of
Him; as it is written, Prepare in the wilderness the way of ... , make
straight in the desert a path for our God (Isa. xl, 3). This (path) is the
study of the Law which He commanded by the hand of Moses, that they
may do according to all that has been revealed from age to age, and
as the Prophets have revealed by His Holy Spirit.

They shall depart from none of the counsels of
the Law to walk in all the stubbornness of their hearts, but shall be ruled
by the primitive precepts in which the men of the Community were first
instructed until there shall come the Prophet and the Messiahs of
Aaron and Israel.
These are the precepts in which the Master shall walk in His
commerce with all the living, according to the rule proper to
every season and according to the worth of every man

 

[HARK!]

Brother, I like this translation!

I don't like mistranslations. That's why I study the Hebrew. I prefer the word of YHWH over the words of men.

 

[daq]

I like these too.


(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 9:2
requests from him letters for Damascus to the synagogues, so that, if he should be finding any who are of the way, both men and women, he may be leading them bound to Jerusalem.

Matthew 3 CJB

3 This is the man Yesha`yahu was talking about when he said, "The voice of someone crying out: `In the desert prepare the way of ADONAI! Make straight paths for him!'"

4Q258

He shall guide them with knowledge and instruct them in the mysteries of wonder and truth in the midst of the members of the community, so that they shall behave decently with one another in all that has been revealed to them. That is the time for studying the Torah (lit. clearing the way) in the wilderness.

Dead Sea Scrolls -- Community Rule

4Q434, fr. I
Bless, my soul, the Lord
for all His marvels for ever,
and may His name be blessed.
For He has delivered the soul of the poor,
and has not despised the humble,
and has not forgotten the misery of the deprived.
He has opened His eyes towards the distressed,
and has heard the cry of the fatherless,
and has turned His ears towards their crying.
He has been gracious to the humble by His great kindness,
and has opened their eyes to see His ways,
and [thei]r e[ar]s to hear His teaching.
He has circumcised the foreskin of their heart,
and has delivered them because of His kindness,
and has directed their feet towards the way.

1QS

And when these become members of the Community in Israel
according to all these rules, they shall separate from the habitation of
unjust men and shall go into the wilderness to prepare there the way of
Him; as it is written, Prepare in the wilderness the way of ... , make
straight in the desert a path for our God (Isa. xl, 3). This (path) is the
study of the Law which He commanded by the hand of Moses, that they
may do according to all that has been revealed from age to age, and
as the Prophets have revealed by His Holy Spirit.

They shall depart from none of the counsels of
the Law to walk in all the stubbornness of their hearts, but shall be ruled
by the primitive precepts in which the men of the Community were first
instructed until there shall come the Prophet and the Messiahs of
Aaron and Israel.
These are the precepts in which the Master shall walk in His
commerce with all the living, according to the rule proper to
every season and according to the worth of every man

Amen. In the following link I do not agree with the author's conclusions in the section at the bottom of the page, (not even with the late dating of Apokalypse Yohanne, (66AD is still too late)), but I simply found this in a quick search looking for a decent collection of the Songs of Sabbath Sacrifice and found what I wanted in this page. Surely you have heard of these texts, but for those who may not have, I didn't want to post a PDF file.

The point I wish to make here is that these texts...

Songs of Sabbath Sacrifice: Template for book of Revelation

...contain the same thinking and imagery as what we find in Hebrews 12, (particularly Hebrews 12:22-24, but really the whole chapter), and not a few other places in the apostolic writings.

 

[HARK!]

Amen. In the following link I do not agree with the author's conclusions in the section at the bottom of the page, (not even with the late dating of Apokalypse Yohanne, (66AD is still too late)), but I simply found this in a quick search looking for a decent collection of the Songs of Sabbath Sacrifice and found what I wanted in this page. Surely you have heard of these texts, but for those who may not have, I didn't want to post a PDF file.

The point I wish to make here is that these texts...

Songs of Sabbath Sacrifice: Template for book of Revelation

...contain the same thinking and imagery as what we find in Hebrews 12, (particularly Hebrews 12:22-24, but really the whole chapter), and not a few other places in the apostolic writings.

This part is very poor scholarship.:

"One of the most important of the scroll fragments found at Masada is a copy of the "Songs of the Sabbath Sacrifice," a composition also known from copies found in Qumran Caves 4 and 11. The Masada fragment 1039-200 was discovered in the southeastern corner of Room 1039 in the casemate wall,' a room which also yielded fragments from the books of Psalms and Leviticus and numerous silver and bronze coins struck during the revolt against Rome. Historically, the discovery of this fragment is significant because it suggests the participation of members of the Qumran community, almost certainly to be identified with the Essenes, in the revolt against Rome."

The Zadokites were not Gnostics. The was no Gnostic literature found at Betharaba.

Old rumors die hard.

 

[daq]

This part is very poor scholarship.:

"One of the most important of the scroll fragments found at Masada is a copy of the "Songs of the Sabbath Sacrifice," a composition also known from copies found in Qumran Caves 4 and 11. The Masada fragment 1039-200 was discovered in the southeastern corner of Room 1039 in the casemate wall,' a room which also yielded fragments from the books of Psalms and Leviticus and numerous silver and bronze coins struck during the revolt against Rome. Historically, the discovery of this fragment is significant because it suggests the participation of members of the Qumran community, almost certainly to be identified with the Essenes, in the revolt against Rome."

The Zadokites were not Gnostics. The was no Gnostic literature found at Betharaba.

Old rumors die hard.

I don't care about the scholarship, and tried to explain that, but I guess I could have made that more clear.

However now I am curious: where do you get the idea that the Essenes were Gnostics? or is that not what you are saying? It is the modern (self-proclaimed) Essene movement that is Gnostic. But I suppose everyone has their own opinion of what Gnostic actually means so you would probably need to explain that too. If people really knew what Paul teaches many who really know nothing about Gnosticism would likely call his teachings Gnostic too, and the same goes for the Messiah, it all depends on what a person means by that term because it has now become not much more than a derogatory label used by people who really do not even know what it means in its original context and cultural setting.

For example: the original Gnostics believed in Dualism, they believed that "the O/T God" is real but is evil and created all things physical. Gnostic Dualism had nothing to do with the Essenes of the first century and its origins were probably Alexandria, Egypt. The Essenes were much more likely connected to the Hasidim, (and I don't mean the modern version of the same name now used by Hasidic Jews).

 

[HARK!]

However now I am curious: where do you get the idea that the Essenes were Gnostics?

I'm going to withdraw that statement. That is what I have read; but upon further investigation, I haven't been able to prove that out.

Josephus' account presents no evidence that they were Gnostics IMO.

Josephus on the Essenes

 

[daq]

I'm going to withdraw that statement. That is what I have read; but upon further investigation, I haven't been able to prove that out.

Josephus' account presents no evidence that they were Gnostics IMO.

Josephus on the Essenes

The following link represents the modern Gnostic so-called Essenes, with fake text, supposedly recovered from the Vatican, (some of which is lifted straight out the KJV), and the whole nine yards. They have done a lot of damage to unsuspecting people who fall into the trap, (even those who may not believe what they are pushing but still go away thinking this represents the original Essenes).

The Essene Gospels of Peace Index

 

[daq]

Each season started on the 4th day of the week (Wednesday), every year.[108]

I'll be honoring Pesach on 4/5/22, unless I can find convincing evidence that I should do otherwise.

Happy new year, HARK!

 

[HARK!]

Happy new year, HARK!

Happy new year, Daq.

 

[sparow]

(CLV) Mt 28:1
Now it is the evening of the sabbaths. At the lighting up into one of the sabbaths came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to behold the sepulcher.

(CLV) Jn 20:1
Now, on one of the sabbaths, Miriam Magdalene is coming to the tomb in the morning, there being still darkness, and is observing the stone taken away from the door of the tomb.

(CLV) Jn 20:19
It being, then, the evening of that day, one of the sabbaths, and the doors having been locked where the disciples were gathered together, because of fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and is saying to them, "Peace to you!"

The verses you quote confuse the question. If I remember correctly Thursday was the Passover high day or annual Sabbath and Wednesday was the preparation day when Christ was crucified, then there is Friday preparation for the weekly Sabbath and this way Jesus spends three days and three evenings in the grave; But each day has one evening.


If the day was a thousand years, the the evening would be 500 years and morning would be 500 years; otherwise the day would have 365000 evenings. Was it a trick question?

 

[guevaraj]

If the day was a thousand years, the the evening would be 500 years and morning would be 500 years; otherwise the day would have 365000 evenings. Was it a trick question?

Brother, you are using the wrong words to say what God chose not to say in Genesis first day. "Evening" and "morning" do not mean "night" and "day"! God defined other words to say what you are saying that He chose not to use when He used other words at the end of the first day, because He is saying something different than what you are saying.

Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day” and the darkness “night.” And evening passed and morning came, marking the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NLT)​

God chose not to say "night" and "day" when He said "evening" and "morning", which He uses differently from "night" and "day" in the following passage. God is not saying below what you say above with the word "evening", because He chose to say something else above using other words than "night" and "day". God does not use "evening" below the way you use it above. He is not saying from the "night" of the ninth day of the month to the "night" of the tenth as He defined those words above to mean what He chose not to say using different words that He uses below differently from how you use them above. The way God uses "evening" below helps us understand what He means above. He means above that a "night" ends the first day from "evening to morning", because the days of the week begin with "morning to evening", which God called "day". The same word above as "evening" is translated below as "sundown".

This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:32 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[daq]

Brother, you are using the wrong words to say what God chose not to say in Genesis first day. "Evening" and "morning" do not mean "night" and "day"! God defined other words to say what you are saying that He chose not to use when He used other words at the end of the first day, because He is saying something different than what you are saying.

Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day” and the darkness “night.” And evening passed and morning came, marking the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NLT)​

God chose not to say "night" and "day" when He said "evening" and "morning", which He uses differently from "night" and "day" in the following passage. God is not saying below what you say above with the word "evening", because He chose to say something else above using other words than "night" and "day". God does not use "evening" below the way you use it above. He is not saying from the "night" of the ninth day of the month to the "night" of the tenth as He defined those words above to mean what He chose not to say using different words that He uses below differently from how you use them above. The way God uses "evening" below helps us understand what He means above. He means above that a "night" ends the first day from "evening to morning", because the days of the week begin with "morning to evening", which God called "day". The same word above as "evening" is translated below as "sundown".

This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:32 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

The NLT is giving you an interpretation. Technically, instead of "sundown" if they want to use such language, they should have said "at the going down of the sun", because that is when evening time commences. But that is not sundown as understood in modern terms, no, that is the tzohorim, which is around midday, when the sun begins its downward trek into the west. There is about a six hour time frame wherein the sun is going down and your translation interpretation eliminated the whole time frame without even blinking, lol.

 

[guevaraj]

The NLT is giving you an interpretation. Technically, instead of "sundown" if they want to use such language, they should have said "at the going down of the sun", because that is when evening time commences. But that is not sundown as understood in modern terms, no, that is the tzohorim, which is around midday, when the sun begins its downward trek into the west. There is about a six hour time frame wherein the sun is going down and your translation interpretation eliminated the whole time frame without even blinking, lol.

Brother, "sundown" is the most accurate translation of the original word!

This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:32 NLT)​

What is a translation error is the expression "between the evenings", because that would be a "morning" already said before this expression below, so it would not fit the context and must be translated differently from the more common translation. An acceptable translation would be "from the evening", that is, before the evening.

one in the morning and the other from the evening. (Exodus 29:39 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[daq]

Brother, "sundown" is the most accurate translation of the original word!

This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:32 NLT)​

What is a translation error is the expression "between the evenings", because that would be a "morning" already said before this expression below, so it would not fit the context and must be translated differently from the more common translation. An acceptable translation would be "from the evening", that is, before the evening.

one in the morning and the other from the evening. (Exodus 29:39 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

No, it isn't the most accurate translation: it's an interpretation of the word ערב (ereb), which is most accurately and most often rendered simply as evening by other translators. This is the very same word found in the creations days, an evening and a morning. Should we therefore understand those statements to rather say that there was a sundown and a morning for each of the six days of creation in Genesis 1? Absolutely not, because ereb simply means evening, not sundown.

That translation is actually at war with Elohim because Elohim wants us to understand His Word by (prayerful) study in His Word, so that we all be taught of Elohim, and not of man. We do not come to understand what an evening is by the proclamations of men and their wresting of scripture when they interpret instead of simply translate words for what they mean: we learn what an evening is from the Word of Elohim.

 

[DamianWarS]

No, it isn't the most accurate translation: it's an interpretation of the word ערב (ereb), which is most accurately and most often rendered simply as evening by other translators. This is the very same word found in the creations days, an evening and a morning. Should we therefore understand those statements to rather say that there was a sundown and a morning for each of the six days of creation in Genesis 1? Absolutely not, because ereb simply means evening, not sundown.

That translation is actually at war with Elohim because Elohim wants us to understand His Word by (prayerful) study in His Word, so that we all be taught of Elohim, and not of man. We do not come to understand what an evening is by the proclamations of men and their wresting of scripture when they interpret instead of simply translate words for what they mean: we learn what an evening is from the Word of Elohim.

this is a good focus. overly interpreted translations have value because scripture is more accessible but if you want to study it you need to be willing to get deeper and look at the words presented as they are. This may be a bit of an unknown translation and the guy who writes it (Jeff Benner) doesn't appear to have any accreditation or authority in Hebrew (seems to be somewhat self-taught) so it may be somewhat controversial but he makes an interesting translation called the Mechanical Translation or MT for short. his philosophy is that the same Hebrew word should not be translated into many different English words and as best as it can a single word should be used in all instances to maintain the inherent concrete nature of the language, he also breaks it down word for word and has his own lexicon so is transparent. here are the first verses of Genesis ending at the end of the first day

1 In the summit Elohiym shaped the skies and the land, 2 and the land had existed in confusion and was unfilled, and darkness was upon the face of the deep water and the wind of Elohiym was fluttering upon the face of the waters, 3 and Elohiym said, light will exist, and light existed, 4 and Elohiym saw the light, given that it was functional, and Elohiym made a separation between the light and the darkness, 5 and Elohiym called out to the light, day, and to the darkness he called out, night, and evening existed and morning existed, a day unit,