The Warped World of Incel Extremists

[bèlla]

Well, you're not asking to be a matchmaker. Just invite some of your guy friends out to a gathering, and if that gathering happens to have other single women friends, it's up to him to approach. The lady can just provide the opportunity.

I have no interest in doing that. That's not my bend. I'm not a connector.

You stick to couples? Not even single gal pals?

100% couples. I reconnected with an old acquaintance that's single. I'm willing to help him. But we've known each for 13 years. I know what he likes. I made a recent connection with a young lady in her early twenties. She's ready to settle down. I don't mind assisting. She's the type I mentor.

The people I know don't struggle with dating. They haven't met the one. But they're getting traction.

 

[ThisIsMe123]

I have no interest in doing that. That's not my bend. I'm not a connector.



100% couples. I reconnected with an old acquaintance that's single. I'm willing to help him. But we've known each for 13 years. I know what he likes. I made a recent connection with a young lady in her early twenties. She's ready to settle down. I don't mind assisting. She's the type I mentor.

The people I know don't struggle with dating. They haven't met the one. But they're getting traction.

I have to say, it's very odd that you exclusively only spend time with couples. Most singles feel like a third wheel and would have nothing to do with such a situation.

 

[bèlla]

Being online has enabled people to be extremely flaky as they have plenty of choices of men to choose from. Chances are, she's talking to someone else, and she may likely cancelled the date for a better offer, even if the date was on lock".

The Internet didn't change anyone. It exposed who they are. If a person thinks you're a catch it doesn't matter if they're online or not. You stand out among the others.

I've met one person locally. The rest lived elsewhere. The current lives on the east coast. He met women in his vicinity. But they're not bella.

 

[RDKirk]

Yeah, it's like women going to the bathroom together or braiding each other's hair. lol. I recall one guy saying he was going to the bathroom, and another guy chimed in and said he was going too...and the first guy said, "No way man, that's gay...I'm going to the other bathroom" (on the other side of the building) LOL

Not that long ago, men did provide emotional support to one another. Not in the same way as women, but it did happen. Women, if asked, think men didn't do it because we didn't do it the same way they do. But go back a good way, think again about the relationships between David and Jonathan all the way up to Romeo and Mercutio. That was still happening even into the 60s and 70s. Men spent long hours with their best friends, and often got into the most heartfelt discussions. Men could cry with their best friends. Heck, men actually did sometimes go to the restroom together.

And then it changed.

I'm going to give an unpopular opinion here. What changed it was the phenomenon of homosexual men labeling men giving emotional support to other men as a homosexual activity. Homosexual men started saying, "That's gay." That began happening in the 80s.

 

[bèlla]

I have to say, it's very odd that you exclusively only spend time with couples. Most singles feel like a third wheel and would have nothing to do with such a situation.

As opposed to listening to Christians complain about singleness? That wasn't the reason I made the shift. But it's part of it. I don't want to hear that everyday. Nor do I feel like a third wheel. My existence isn't defined by marriage. That's a sliver of God's plan.

I had single unsaved friends. They weren't obsessed with dating. They had vibrant lives. Single or not. Their happiness didn't hinge on a man. I think that's unhealthy.

 

[durangodawood]

....I'm going to give an unpopular opinion here. What changed it was the phenomenon of homosexual men labeling men giving emotional support to other men as a homosexual activity. Homosexual men started saying, "That's gay." That began happening in the 80s.

My strong recollection is it was straight guys who labeled male emotional sharing and bonding as "that's gay". Emotional anything was viewed as effeminate among many younger guys who wanted their emerging masculinity to be validated.

 

[RDKirk]

My strong recollection is it was straight guys who labeled male emotional sharing and bonding as "that's gay". Emotional anything was viewed as effeminate among many younger guys who wanted their emerging masculinity to be validated.

From what decade is your recollection?

There was a time that no guy thought Tonto and the Lone Ranger or Batman and Robin were gay...it was homosexuals in the 80s who began asserting that they were. For that matter, it was homosexuals in the 80s who began asserting that David and Jonathan (as well as Jesus and John) were gay.

Fifty years ago, "that's gay" was associated with particularly flamboyant behavior...not male emotional sharing and bonding. It was never true that homosexuality was always associated with flamboyancy, nor was it true that flamboyancy was always associated with homosexuality (Prince and Davie Bowie being examples of that), male emotional sharing and bonding were not associated with homosexuality fifty years ago.

It's a sad joke today that if young men show non-sexual affection for one another--as males always used to do--they have to append "no homo" to it. It wasn't always that way. Once upon a time in my memory, men could share emotion without saying "no homo" because nobody presumed it.

 

[Jamdoc]

and then I should say.. other times where I actually have made pursuits.. well, those I didn't really have any real feelings for. I wanted to have them.. but hind sight.. I didn't really feel that way about them I just felt like, I should, there was only physical attraction and on paper she seemed "my type", but it was never satisfying and I got bored quickly.
I always get bored and I hate that about myself.

 

[Jamdoc]

You’re unlikely to be friends with someone who mirrors your ideal. You’ll see it as an opportunity. Not a chance to expand your circle.

From personal experience, it can happen.
I even made advances on a girl that I felt was "my type" that I was friends with first and again, on paper, it seemed like I should really like her romantically.
She of course saw through it.
and it could have wrecked the friendship.
But.. there was still value in that friendship (and we have been good friends for 22... 23 years about?), and we still talk regularly.
There've been other times when a friendship went further, for a time, but I have only had one friendship completely crumble due to a romantic relationship.. but that's because she cheated on me, virtually in front of me.. as in.. they were just in another tent and I could hear them. Even her best friend thought what she did to me was awful. But most the time.. even if the fling ended, we still talk as friends.
But when it comes down to it, even if they're "my ideal".. if the time isn't right for a relationship, or she clearly doesn't see me that way..
I'm not going to just throw away being able to know and spend time with someone just because the relationship doesn't go as far as maybe I want it to.
They're a person, not an object, or source of personal fulfillment just for me.

 

[durangodawood]

From what decade is your recollection?

There was a time that no guy thought Tonto and the Lone Ranger or Batman and Robin were gay...it was homosexuals in the 80s who began asserting that they were. For that matter, it was homosexuals in the 80s who began asserting that David and Jonathan (as well as Jesus and John) were gay.

Fifty years ago, "that's gay" was associated with particularly flamboyant behavior...not male emotional sharing and bonding. It was never true that homosexuality was always associated with flamboyancy, nor was it true that flamboyancy was always associated with homosexuality (Prince and Davie Bowie being examples of that), male emotional sharing and bonding were not associated with homosexuality fifty years ago.

It's a sad joke today that if young men show non-sexual affection for one another--as males always used to do--they have to append "no homo" to it. It wasn't always that way. Once upon a time in my memory, men could share emotion without saying "no homo" because nobody presumed it.

I dont recall Tonto and the Lone Ranger nor Batman and Robin doing any significant emotional bonding. So I dont see them as examples of this principle. I think it might be the camp factor that got them attention that Starsky and Hutch or Crockett and Tubbs of Miami Vice or a dozen of other male partners avoided.

Additionally I remember straight masculine icons being particularly stoic, un-emotional, closed-up prior to the emergence of homosexuality in the recognized culture. I'm thinking of all those tough guys who ruled the box office.

My recollection is from 80's SF Bay Area.

 

[Jamdoc]

I think I almost mirror this. Almost scarily uncanny, Jamdoc.

I work with a bunch of women....and, well, a lot of them attractive. "Water water everywhere, but not a drop to drink". At work, you have to watch yourself and not cross boundaries or HR might call you on the carpet. In fact, I once befriended a woman at work, to only have her turn the cold shoulder on me when she put in her 2 week notice. So I wonder if I should even make friends at work, keep real life and work separate, I dunno.

Anyways, got off on a tangent...

There was this new hire, she was married with 18 mos old twins...for whatever reason she came off as rather flirty with me, but with no intent. I kind of thought it was for show. I didn't encourage it.

One day she came to my defense when an irate customer got up in my face...it was near the end of the day, at closing time, and I wanted to get her out the door as opposed to argue....she came to my defense....touched my arm and took over the conversation to do damage control, and I got the feels. (Hadn't been touched by a woman affectionately in a while).

You could probably say I'm affection starved.

Sometimes I'd see a woman complaining about back pain, and one of her female co-workers would actually massage that area of the back. Then I thought, "They didn't think to ask me?" But...maybe it'd be considered weird if a man volunteered to massage the crimp in her back...at work.

I saw another woman offer a woman co-worker a hug when she was feeling down. I thought about chiming in in "I could use a hug, too!" Then realized the double standard that it would be weird if a man did it.

The fact she was married wasn't really relevant, I think she was behaving motheringly, could have been any woman...but my point was it's been a long time since I've been shown affection by a woman and sometimes that's all it takes to really make an impact. But at the same time, teased me in a sense....which can lead to more frustration.

I guess that photo moment is probably the furthest you'll get with a woman I suppose?

No.. there's been "further", but always stopped short of sex, usually for reasons that were just.. bizarrely poorly timed, or just my own conscious convicting me and preventing me.
It took me awhile to figure out that God was holding me to a promise very seriously, even though most promises you make when young are not kept very seriously, but a promise made to God? well...
I tried to break it, He broke me instead and made me pay for it.... and I still didn't actually get to break it.
it's like having guard rails around 1 particular sin, because I made a promise.
I gave up because I got tired of being chastised for it.

 

[bèlla]

I even made advances on a girl that I felt was "my type" that I was friends with first and again, on paper, it seemed like I should really like her romantically.

I'm upfront when getting acquainted with the opposite sex. I tell them I don't date my friends. So there's no confusion.

But.. there was still value in that friendship (and we have been good friends for 22... 23 years about?), and we still talk regularly.

I can't share my heart with someone who desires me carnally. I can't get close to him. There's a matter of respect and walking in the other's moccasins. Would I be okay if the shoe was on the other foot? I want a happy healthy marriage. That doesn't begin at the altar. It starts with me.

I'm not going to just throw away being able to know and spend time with someone just because the relationship doesn't go as far as maybe I want it to.
They're a person, not an object, or source of personal fulfillment just for me.

I like close knit friendships. The kind that include weekends under the same roof and shared vacations. That requires certain components. I don't want to be an option or consideration.

Let your fountain be blessed, and rejoice in the wife of your youth, a lovely deer, a graceful doe. Let her breasts fill you at all times with delight; be intoxicated always in her love.

That's my page. I only have eyes for one person. And him alone.

 

[Jamdoc]

I'd never do that. If he isn't a viable prospect why bother? She's going to turn him down.

actually that has happened.. girl turned me down for prom that I liked, and then started prodding me to ask a girl she worked with at her job, that was in one of my classes, while I was aloof to her she sat behind me every day, laughed at basically anything I said, and came up to say good morning to me at my locker every day.
I would think it's possible for a guy to not be a bad guy in a woman's eyes, just not right for her specifically. But she can be on the lookout for someone that a guy might be a better fit for.
or at least in this case.. know that a friend of hers was interested.
I wasn't particularly interested in this girl but I did give it a chance and took her to prom, and she was happy to have been able to go on the date, even if no relationship really came out of it.

 

[bèlla]

I would think it's possible for a guy to not be a bad guy in a woman's eyes, just not right for her specifically. But she can be on the lookout for someone that a guy might be a better fit for.

I'm not a connector. There are people who delight in doing that. They bring people together. It's a popular business term.

I mentor young, marriage-minded women. They're not incapable of finding suitors. I provide counsel and instruction that improves their person and results. That's part of my calling. The Lord has never told me to help a man romantically. He sends women my way.

 

[RDKirk]

I dont recall Tonto and the Lone Ranger nor Batman and Robin doing any significant emotional bonding. So I dont see them as examples of this principle. I think it might be the camp factor that got them attention that Starsky and Hutch or Crockett and Tubbs of Miami Vice or a dozen of other male partners avoided.

Additionally I remember straight masculine icons being particularly stoic, un-emotional, closed-up prior to the emergence of homosexuality in the recognized culture. I'm thinking of all those tough guys who ruled the box office.

My recollection is from 80's SF Bay Area.

Homosexuality emerged in the recognized culture in the 70s.

Stoicism had never been limited to men...there were a lot of stoic women depicted in the box office as well.

The men look "unemotional, closed-up" only if you expect men to act like women. Men naturally protect their emotions the way women protect their sexuality (women would understand men much better if women would only realize that single fact). Society takes a negative view of an overtly overemotional man the way it takes a negative view of a sexually promiscuous woman.

But the man who expressed his emotions to his closest friends was always there.

 

[Jamdoc]

I'm upfront when getting acquainted with the opposite sex. I tell them I don't date my friends. So there's no confusion.



I can't share my heart with someone who desires me carnally. I can't get close to him. There's a matter of respect and walking in the other's moccasins. Would I be okay if the shoe was on the other foot? I want a happy healthy marriage. That doesn't begin at the altar. It starts with me.

Well by now you pretty much know that I open my heart to everyone.
and as far as carnal desire goes? in that particular friendship, I was friends with her for about a year, grew attracted to her, she didn't really reciprocate though we did go on some dates, and when it was clear that it wasn't going to work, I just told her I wasn't interested in her in that way anymore but still liked hanging out with her and being her friend, and have done so for 20+ years afterward. She's still attractive, but I just don't desire her like that.
Part of the value is.. that I open up myself so freely.. that simultaneously, she (and others) feel they can open up to me, talk to me about anything.

I like close knit friendships. The kind that include weekends under the same roof and shared vacations. That requires certain components. I don't want to be an option or consideration.

Let your fountain be blessed, and rejoice in the wife of your youth, a lovely deer, a graceful doe. Let her breasts fill you at all times with delight; be intoxicated always in her love.

That's my page. I only have eyes for one person. And him alone.

I can't be that strict about it, because I don't have a "one person", without opening to everyone.. I'd be totally isolated... as it is I still feel overwhelmingly isolated.

 

[ThisIsMe123]

I'm not a connector. There are people who delight in doing that. They bring people together. It's a popular business term.

I mentor young, marriage-minded women. They're not incapable of finding suitors. I provide counsel and instruction that improves their person and results. That's part of my calling. The Lord has never told me to help a man romantically. He sends women my way.

You do this professionally?

 

[bèlla]

Part of the value is.. that I open up myself so freely.. that simultaneously, she (and others) feel they can open up to me, talk to me about anything.

I talk to a lot people. But that doesn't mean I want to date or marry them. I like conversation for conversation's sake.

I can't be that strict about it, because I don't have a "one person", without opening to everyone.. I'd be totally isolated... as it is I still feel overwhelmingly isolated.

I'm referencing committed connections that are altar bound.

 

[bèlla]

You do this professionally?

Ministering to women is part of my calling. Mentoring is a gift from the heart. I see something in them and know I can help.

 

[Jamdoc]

I talk to a lot people. But that doesn't mean I want to date or marry them. I like conversation for conversation's sake.

Right I was explaining why we remained friends after an attempt at a more serious relationship failed.
I knew when to quit, and I don't consider her an "option" after that I get that some guys do that, kind of see if maybe she'll change her mind later if you just keep in contact distance...
no I write off romance and would prefer have a friend than just be estranged.