The Warped World of Incel Extremists

[ripple the car]

I second Dzheremi getting his own YouTube / Rumble / something else channel.

 

[MehGuy]

I've never understood men who are attracted to so much makeup.

I guess I might count among those men who are attracted to women who wear a lot of makeup. Depends on the makeup routine/skill, but generally I find it gives off a feminine vibe. Exaggerates and helps bring out neotenous features in a way nature alone really cannot. Of course I wouldn't want to be with someone who looks ugly without makeup, but as an enhancer.. yeah I prefer it.

 

[bèlla]

I never really thought about the truly malicious catfishing

I didn't make the connection either. The list was really informative!

almost entirely I've seen it as just being shy or insecurity about their looks

I thought it was a man pretending to be a woman or the reverse. I never considered the others.

I also don't post pictures of other people though to trick people, I mean I'll use profile pictures of very obviously "not me" characters I mean I'm ugly, but I am not Baby Yoda from the Star Wars Mandalorian show (although I really liked that show), but that's not in an effort to deceive.. just I like that character and don't feel like showing my own face.

Swiping pics and identities is too much. I'm not surprised by catfishing. I've known people who experienced serious deceptions.

There was crazy girl in the chat room I used to frequent ages ago with cara-mia. I was friends with her sister. We spoke all the time r/t. When she started coming around our closeness bothered her. I talked to the kids and their dad. And she hated it.

She became me. She mimicked my username, avatars, slogans and pursued the men I spoke to. She'd make comments every now and then. And it was on! You had to do a lot to get in trouble. Her sister would tell her stop and when she didn't she got quiet. She knew how I was. After we finished she'd say, dude I told you to her leave her alone.

She thought I was pushover. Because I was nice and polite and well-spoken. She felt she could intimidate me. But I don't tolerate bullying or harassment. Every time she started I responded. It was in public. Everyone could see it. They banned her for a bit and eventually she got the hint.

There I go again, exposing vulnerabilities when I don't need to...

I'm sorry you've been ridiculed about your appearance. Humans are awful sometimes. ~hugs~

 

[Jamdoc]

I didn't make the connection either. The list was really informative!

Yeah it goes way beyond what I usually associate as catfishing. But it all makes sense.

I thought it was a man pretending to be a woman or the reverse. I never considered the others.

Oh that absolutely happens too. As I said, I played MMO's and there are entire "erotic roleplaying" communities in them and I never understood how that was appealing, knowing that most of the people in them were men behind the keyboard. I've heard it said that MMORPG stands for "Many Men Online Role Playing Girls".. and I mean, I had no problem with a person playing a character of the opposite gender, it's a game and they're playing a character distinct from themselves and so on.. but at the point where they're having a private conversation with another person "roleplaying" okay I get the normal "roleplaying" where people act out characters for fun, but in this case it's 2 guys divulging their fantasies to each other. At that point it's gross.

But personal experience what I've seen is mostly just people posting pictures of what they wish they looked like rather than themselves.

Swiping pics and identities is too much. I'm not surprised by catfishing. I've known people who experienced serious deceptions.

There was crazy girl in the chat room I used to frequent ages ago with cara-mia. I was friends with her sister. We spoke all the time r/t. When she started coming around our closeness bothered her. I talked to the kids and their dad. And she hated it.

She became me. She mimicked my username, avatars, slogans and pursued the men I spoke to. She'd make comments every now and then. And it was on! You had to do a lot to get in trouble. Her sister would tell her stop and when she didn't she got quiet. She knew how I was. After we finished she'd say, dude I told you to her leave her alone.

She thought I was pushover. Because I was nice and polite and well-spoken. She felt she could intimidate me. But I don't tolerate bullying or harassment. Every time she started I responded. It was in public. Everyone could see it. They banned her for a bit and eventually she got the hint.

Now that is utterly crazy! I know that people steal identities but stealing an identity within the same community as the person they're imitating? Wow.. that's just beyond.

Some friends of mine were considering starting up a D&D campaign or something and I had a funny idea of roleplaying Jackie Chan as a monk (well more Jackie Chan characters in old Kung Fu movies, using my turn if I rolled initiative to say "I don't want trouble!") for fun but.. I can't imagine trying to imitate someone while they're basically in the same room. If Jackie Chan was playing the campaign with us I wouldn't consider doing that lol.

I'm sorry you've been ridiculed about your appearance. Humans are awful sometimes. ~hugs~

Thank you, and it's okay, that is this world, it's broken and I am similarly broken. I can't wait for those 2 things to be fixed.

 

[bèlla]

I've heard it said that MMORPG stands for "Many Men Online Role Playing Girls".. and I mean, I had no problem with a person playing a character of the opposite gender, it's a game and they're playing a character distinct from themselves and so on..

I never got into that. I knew someone who loved Second Life. But I couldn't do it. I met enough oddballs in the chat room. That was more than enough.

but at the point where they're having a private conversation with another person "roleplaying" okay I get the normal "roleplaying" where people act out characters for fun, but in this case it's 2 guys divulging their fantasies to each other. At that point it's gross.

I got all my dumbness out when I was younger. I've got some hilarious stories from me and my friends. But we weren't that old. Going through it at 40 is something else.

I knew a girl who met someone online. They hit it off and spoke by phone and exchanged pictures. They arranged a visit. She flew from the states to Australia. The person stood her up at the airport. She was stranded in a country with nowhere to stay. A mutual acquaintance took pity and picked her up and let her stay until her return flight. The man she thought she was talking to was a woman. The imposter did it again years later to someone else. That happened before the term was coined.

Now that is utterly crazy! I know that people steal identities but stealing an identity within the same community as the person they're imitating? Wow.. that's just beyond.

She was really nuts. She was goth girl. I think she did too many drugs. Back then, when I chose a username I'd take 10-20 variations depending on the name. I did the same with the slogans I put on my avatars. To minimize imping (impostering).

You'd have people conversing under multiple names. Some were so crazy they'd hit on you under both of them! But your writing voice is distinct. That's how we'd catch them. Women pretending to be men make the same mistake. Their mannerisms seep out. I'm certain I've spoken to one of them.

I can't imagine trying to imitate someone while they're basically in the same room. If Jackie Chan was playing the campaign with us I wouldn't consider doing that lol.

That's because you're sane!

Thank you, and it's okay, that is this world, it's broken and I am similarly broken. I can't wait for those 2 things to be fixed.

Same here. I remember a comment on an article about bad event. The commenter said, please Lord, blow the trumpet now!

 

[Lain Iwakura]

Let's not forget that in the tradition of the Church that it was the demons who fell in the days of Jared that taught men the ways of war and weaponry and women cosmetics and ornamentation - and that these technologies are not only linked in origin, but in aim. "...so that the world became altered. Impiety increased; fornication multiplied; and they transgressed and corrupted all their ways.”

 

[Jamdoc]

I never got into that. I knew someone who loved Second Life. But I couldn't do it. I met enough oddballs in the chat room. That was more than enough.

The regular roleplaying and playing games I can fully understand. Be in another world, do things you can't do in this world. Have adventure you might not have the resources or well, ability to have in this world, and the roleplaying itself can just be considered acting.
I enjoyed acting characters in plays myself. I have terrible stage fright if I'm just having to speak publicly myself but.. playing a character? that fear goes away.
It's just goofy fun mostly.





I got all my dumbness out when I was younger. I've got some hilarious stories from me and my friends. But we weren't that old. Going through it at 40 is something else.[/quote]

I know someone will quote 1 Corinthians 13 at me about quitting childish things but.. I don't think that there's an age when doing something enjoyable is particularly wrong unless it's actually sin.

I knew a girl who met someone online. They hit it off and spoke by phone and exchanged pictures. They arranged a visit. She flew from the states to Australia. The person stood her up at the airport. She was stranded in a country with nowhere to stay. A mutual acquaintance took pity and picked her up and let her stay until her return flight. The man she thought she was talking to was a woman. The imposter did it again years later to someone else. That happened before the term was coined.

While I haven't had any good luck with distance based relationships (and the few I did start were within a local area so we met up in person shortly after meeting online first so it's not the same as this situation), I have known a few people that have met playing a game online and are happily married.. both of them being the guy lives in the US, the girl came from Australia.
still not something I'd advise others pursue, because situations like the one you described happen probably more often.

She was really nuts. She was goth girl. I think she did too many drugs. Back then, when I chose a username I'd take 10-20 variations depending on the name. I did the same with the slogans I put on my avatars. To minimize imping (impostering).

You'd have people conversing under multiple names. Some were so crazy they'd hit on you under both of them! But your writing voice is distinct. That's how we'd catch them. Women pretending to be men make the same mistake. Their mannerisms seep out. I'm certain I've spoken to one of them.

To some degree, but that can change if they're a foreign language speaker to begin with. I talk in a discord and there's a person from Japan in there. She used the male form of her name and passed herself off as a guy to avoid weird private messages, and everyone accepted "him" and well, when guys talk casually to each other and are kind of "buddy buddy" with each other there can be some behaviors and talk that to women, seem kind of unfriendly. A little bit of teasing, but in good sport, "he" did not take it as being in sport and I thought that was kind of weird but chalked it up to "Japanese dudes must just be really sensitive", I mean there's language barrier, "he" was using translators for English because "his" English isn't very good and sometimes we'd respond to "him" in Japanese but a lot of us can't really speak Japanese either, we know small bits and pieces (and it is fun to be able to practice)

anyway, a conversation about hair got started somehow, and "he" mentioned having long hair to which I called "him" a hippie, being that coming from my Navy days that's what the Marine Gunnery Sergeants and Navy Chief Petty Officers called anyone who's hair had gotten too long to be in regulation (2 inches in length), jokingly of course, funnier was I had a First Class Petty Officer who was shaved smooth bald that called ALL of us with buzz cuts and high and tights "hippies" It's just camaraderie and joking around. Anyway. "he" got fed up with it and then dropped a picture on us... and.. "he" was a she. Then it all clicked into place, the oversensitivity and not knowing how guys joke and punch each other in the arm when being friendly with each other, some weird comments about Japanese workplaces sexual harassment, the fact that she talked about a friend of hers who was female was living with her as a roommate. Yup, she'd been hiding her gender to avoid men being creepy with her but was kind of fed up with being treated as a boy too.

People have reacted positively to it, and while some people observe that people are subconsciously more friendly to her than they were as a guy that's not entirely a bad thing because men and women just interact in different ways.
Female friends don't slug each other in the arm and making joking insults at each other do they?

That's because you're sane!

I don't know if I'd go that far, a lot of people think I'm insane because I think Jesus is coming back soon.

Same here. I remember a comment on an article about bad event. The commenter said, please Lord, blow the trumpet now!

I know it's not spiritual because we're supposed to have some half hour long prayer list for other people but...
lately my prayers are a matter of seconds to a few minutes, because sometimes all I can think of to say is confessing my sins and asking for Jesus to come quickly.
I feel a bit like the publican pounding his chest and saying "Lord have mercy on me, a sinner."
but I can't even think of anything else to talk about.

 

[Lain Iwakura]

I knew a girl who met someone online. They hit it off and spoke by phone and exchanged pictures. They arranged a visit. She flew from the states to Australia. The person stood her up at the airport. She was stranded in a country with nowhere to stay. A mutual acquaintance took pity and picked her up and let her stay until her return flight. The man she thought she was talking to was a woman. The imposter did it again years later to someone else. That happened before the term was coined.

I had this happen with a 400 mile road trip. I did meet that person at another time, by chance, at a Church event. Needless to say, I wasn't pleased to meet her when we did meet.

 

[bèlla]

I had this happen with a 400 mile road trip. I did meet that person at another time, by chance, at a Church event. Needless to say, I wasn't pleased to meet her when we did meet.

That's awful. I'm sorry you went through that. Deception is a huge pet peeve. It bothers me. I value the truth. Hopefully you won't experience that again.

 

[Lain Iwakura]

That's awful. I'm sorry you went through that. Deception is a huge pet peeve. It bothers me. I value the truth. Hopefully you won't experience that again.

Yeah, it was awful, especially because it left me in a dangerous situation the first night (below zero temperatures and nowhere to stay.) But the area was quite beautiful and there was an interesting bookstores, and I decided to just immerse myself in the locality after the first day. I ended up salvaging it to be rather memorable vacation. First time getting stuck in a blizzard - try to keep everything optimistic, lol... Sometimes it's best to find out the character of a person up front.

 

[Pommer]

I was lucky.
I got burnt way back in ye olden days, circa 1998.
Developed a close, intimate online relationship with someone and eventually their lover and friends, (and you could tell that they were all really good friends, because they all misspelled the same words!)
Still, it took a day or two after I went past “huh, maybe there isn’t eight people I’m revealing my soul to, but one seriously twisted person?”, to confront them.

 

[spiritfilledjm]

So I've been mulling things over and looking over "incels" and their logic and whatnot. I wanted to add a couple of things.

One's desire in a mate is what they desire and is not wrong, as long as the desire is not illegal, and as a Christian, is not sinful in nature and fulfills the requirements set forth in the Bible of what God expects of each person in a relationship.

Where it goes wrong in their world is how they approach others.

There are plenty of women out there who want to be a "Trad-wife" who want to be a homemaker, wait on their husband hand and foot, have a million babies. There are also women out there who would love to be submissive, have a more dominant husband, be everything that the stereotypical "incel" desires.

Again, where it all goes wrong is their approach and how they tend to feel they are entitled to these things and how all women should want what they desire.

It is not right, at all for anyone to get hostile when the person they approach with romantic interest rejects their interest.

Ultimatelty, I stand by what I've said previously which is that, yes, many of them need good men who can be good influences. Teach them better social skills and norms and who can be friends to them, include them, pull them out of this painfully shy, introverted rut that they've found themselves in largely, in my opinion, thanks to technology and also bullying.

The ones who are more dangerous and far more down the rabbit hole, as it were, do need professional help and counseling from a doctor.

Things like violence and everything can definitely be prevented. Nobody is too far gone or incurable. The first step is for people to understand that fact instead of going with the narrative of "an "incel" is incapable of being cured and should, instead, be shamed and ridiculed for something that they ultimately have no real control over.

I shudder to think what would have happened to me if I hadn't of had somebody reach out and pull me out of the pit of depression and anger I was in after spending years being bullied. I shudder to think of what I would have done if that person never came into my life.

I also shudder to think what would have happened to all of us if God decided there was no hope for any of us and gave up on us as easily as we give up on others.

 

[Strathos]

I was lucky.
I got burnt way back in ye olden days, circa 1998.
Developed a close, intimate online relationship with someone and eventually their lover and friends, (and you could tell that they were all really good friends, because they all misspelled the same words!)
Still, it took a day or two after I went past “huh, maybe there isn’t eight people I’m revealing my soul to, but one seriously twisted person?”, to confront them.

I was born over 3 decades ago and am still single. Strangely, I have never had any urges to go around murdering people because I can't get laid.

 

[dzheremi]

I second Dzheremi getting his own YouTube / Rumble / something else channel.

Thanks, but I don't think that sort of thing's for me. I don't even know what Rumble is, unless we're talking about this:

And the fact that someone's already put that up on YouTube tells me that my particular knowledge base is already covered on the internet, so...

 

[bèlla]

I shudder to think what would have happened to me if I hadn't of had somebody reach out and pull me out of the pit of depression and anger I was in after spending years being bullied. I shudder to think of what I would have done if that person never came into my life.

Maybe you're that someone for them.

 

[Jamdoc]

So I've been mulling things over and looking over "incels" and their logic and whatnot. I wanted to add a couple of things.

One's desire in a mate is what they desire and is not wrong, as long as the desire is not illegal, and as a Christian, is not sinful in nature and fulfills the requirements set forth in the Bible of what God expects of each person in a relationship.

Where it goes wrong in their world is how they approach others.

There are plenty of women out there who want to be a "Trad-wife" who want to be a homemaker, wait on their husband hand and foot, have a million babies. There are also women out there who would love to be submissive, have a more dominant husband, be everything that the stereotypical "incel" desires.

Again, where it all goes wrong is their approach and how they tend to feel they are entitled to these things and how all women should want what they desire.

It is not right, at all for anyone to get hostile when the person they approach with romantic interest rejects their interest.

Ultimatelty, I stand by what I've said previously which is that, yes, many of them need good men who can be good influences. Teach them better social skills and norms and who can be friends to them, include them, pull them out of this painfully shy, introverted rut that they've found themselves in largely, in my opinion, thanks to technology and also bullying.

The ones who are more dangerous and far more down the rabbit hole, as it were, do need professional help and counseling from a doctor.

Things like violence and everything can definitely be prevented. Nobody is too far gone or incurable. The first step is for people to understand that fact instead of going with the narrative of "an "incel" is incapable of being cured and should, instead, be shamed and ridiculed for something that they ultimately have no real control over.

I shudder to think what would have happened to me if I hadn't of had somebody reach out and pull me out of the pit of depression and anger I was in after spending years being bullied. I shudder to think of what I would have done if that person never came into my life.

I also shudder to think what would have happened to all of us if God decided there was no hope for any of us and gave up on us as easily as we give up on others.

Well obviously finding a partner in life helps most with the struggles that these young men have that they lash out over.
But I think another factor, and what separates a person like me from an incel, is that while a person like me has not had good history with women romantically, I have had good relations with women platonically. having women as friends and valuing those friendships can properly compartmentalize the bad experiences to bad individuals, rather than painting with a broad brush and just ending up hating women in general.
I still love women in general, even though some have hurt me in the past, and I have not had a good romantic involvement and have no partner in life. I can still view women as good people because I have had friends and heart to heart conversations with women that make me still value them as people.

These incels and MGTOW, I don't think they have ever even had good platonic relationships with women, or if they have (at least from the woman's perspective they have tried to be a friend) they have not valued that because it is not what they want, and they see women as just an ends to a means, that unless they're getting sex out of it, it's not what they want so what a woman contributes to their life has no value.

 

[spiritfilledjm]

Well obviously finding a partner in life helps most with the struggles that these young men have that they lash out over.
But I think another factor, and what separates a person like me from an incel, is that while a person like me has not had good history with women romantically, I have had good relations with women platonically. having women as friends and valuing those friendships can properly compartmentalize the bad experiences to bad individuals, rather than painting with a broad brush and just ending up hating women in general.
I still love women in general, even though some have hurt me in the past, and I have not had a good romantic involvement and have no partner in life. I can still view women as good people because I have had friends and heart to heart conversations with women that make me still value them as people.

These incels and MGTOW, I don't think they have ever even had good platonic relationships with women, or if they have (at least from the woman's perspective they have tried to be a friend) they have not valued that because it is not what they want, and they see women as just an ends to a means, that unless they're getting sex out of it, it's not what they want so what a woman contributes to their life has no value.

You seem to be a ridiculously rare guy that can actually develop platonic relationships with women and not develop feelings for them. That's awesome! Most men, and I mean like a ridiculous amount of most men, will develop feelings for the woman at some point and want a romantic relationship. However, either the man will not end up pursuing it, or will end up trying and it will pretty much ruin the friendship. Likewise, the woman will either be aloof to the situation or know that her friend has feelings for her and be fine with it as long as he doesn't pursue it. In worst case scenarios, the woman will know, will enjoy the attention, and string along her "friend" knowing that he will likely never actually make a move. All of these things do also happen vice-versa as well.

 

[bèlla]

You seem to be a ridiculously rare guy that can actually develop platonic relationships with women and not develop feelings for them. That's awesome! Most men, and I mean like a ridiculous amount of most men, will develop feelings for the woman at some point and want a romantic relationship.

I agree. I've experienced it a lot and usually have male acquaintances for that reason. There's no difference in Christian circles if he's single. The topic usually comes up at some point.

 

[ThisIsMe123]

I agree. I've experienced it a lot and usually have male acquaintances for that reason. There's no difference in Christian circles if he's single. The topic usually comes up at some point.

@Jamdoc

Right, and sometimes I'd get women that would throw their friendship on the table to be friends with them. Had some women do this I met on dating sites, I thought, "Well, yeah, I could use some new friendships, esp. these days as I've lost contact with other friends".

Only to have them blow me off or they are just too busy when I'd entertain grabbing a bite or have a movie buddy. Believe it or not, I did have a movie buddy at one time that was a woman. Had fun, too. No real feeling developed because we kind of had a different belief system. Very sweet lady.

She's married now, and part of a handful of female friends I wound up being platonic friends with.

Anyway, going back to some of the women that would attempt their offer of friendship, when I'd call or text them to hang out, sometimes invite them to a group social gathering. I'd get delayed responses, or they say they are busy, or whatever excuse they had.

Basically, I felt I was being blown off the same way a woman I would be interested in blowing me off for a 2nd date. lol

I thought, 'Yeah, she never wanted to be my friend...it was just rhetoric she threw out there to lessen the blow of saying, "sorry, I don't see us being a match"

Of course, if you're someone who is of the mindset of some of the women I met on dating sites, they sights are set on finding a romantic partner...not a movie buddy.

Funny, I'd see it in their profiles sometimes, "If it's not a good match, one can never have too many friends" and I think 'Meh, well, yeah ...you can have too many friends" ...at least in that context. lol

 

[ThisIsMe123]

I agree. I've experienced it a lot and usually have male acquaintances for that reason. There's no difference in Christian circles if he's single. The topic usually comes up at some point.

Bella...you mean life is not like in the Rom Coms where the best male friend was her TRUE soul mate this WHOLE TIME! ;-) lol Where the whole narrative is of the woman that keeps bouncing from to relationship and the male friend she confided in (like Jim and Pam in The Office) wound up being together in the end? ;-)