Purpose of the sabbath

[LoveGodsWord]

It is because there was no Roman Catholic Church before the Council of Nicaea during 325 AD.

All of these Early Church Fathers lived before the time of Constantine. Look it up.

What was their viewpoint of the Sabbath, before the Roman Catholic Church existed?

.

You do not read my posts to you do you. This also is repetition already addressed elsewhere. Your wrong I already posted you a link proving this. Here are some more if it might be helpful (see here; here; here; here; linked). Did you read the link you posted? It has nothing to do with when the Catholic Church started. I do agree however that the Roman Catholic Church did come out of the Roman Empire and that Constantine's civil Sunday law in March 7, 321 AD did a lot to promote it's development.

 

[Carl Emerson]

No one is under the Spirit of the law by breaking God's law

Immediately a contradiction in the first sentence...

And again you change the words of scripture you say you love...

Let me quote the scripture again - please note the word order (and dont reverse it, it is a serious matter to modify scripture to suit your opinions)

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

The Law of the Spirit of Life
(not the Spirit of the Law as you wrongly quoted (reversing the word order...))

The Law of the Spirit of Life has set you free from the Law of Sin and Death.

This is the freedom spoken of - to be free from the Law of Sin and Death and to be under the Law of the Spirit of Life...

This then is not Lawlessness as you claim.

Something to pray about....

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Immediately a contradiction in the first sentence...

And again you change the words of scripture you say you love...

Let me quote the scripture again - please note the word order (and dont reverse it, it is a serious matter to modify scripture to suit your opinions)

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

The Law of the Spirit of Life
(not the Spirit of the Law as you wrongly quoted (reversing the word order...))

The Law of the Spirit of Life has set you free from the Law of Sin and Death.

This is the freedom spoken of - to be free from the Law of Sin and Death and to be under the Law of the Spirit of Life...

This then is not Lawlessness as you claim.

Something to pray about....

There is no contradiction. God gives us the Holy Spirit to help us obey. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. There are only two spirits, the Holy Spirit and the “other spirit” when we are obeying God you are walking with the Holy Spirit. When we sin and break God’s laws, you are walking with the “other spirit”. God says you are either with Him or against Him, there is no Switzerland.

 

[guevaraj]

This is the freedom spoken of - to be free from the Law of Sin and Death and to be under the Law of the Spirit of Life... This then is not Lawlessness as you claim. Something to pray about....

Brother, that is because the Holy Spirit makes you grow slowly, but He will guide you to obey the Sabbath, once the Seventh-day Adventists have the true biblical Sabbath as an angel told our prophetess. James was willing to allow God to grow "Gentiles who are turning to God" slowly as they listen to the law of Moses each Sabbath.

“It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.” (Acts 15:19-21 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Immediately a contradiction in the first sentence...

And again you change the words of scripture you say you love...

Let me quote the scripture again - please note the word order (and dont reverse it, it is a serious matter to modify scripture to suit your opinions)

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

The Law of the Spirit of Life
(not the Spirit of the Law as you wrongly quoted (reversing the word order...))

The Law of the Spirit of Life has set you free from the Law of Sin and Death.

This is the freedom spoken of - to be free from the Law of Sin and Death and to be under the Law of the Spirit of Life...

This then is not Lawlessness as you claim.

Carl there is no contradiction to anything that I have shared with you from the scriptures. All you have done here is ignore my posts to you by micro-quoting one sentence of a whole post of scriptures that show your teachings of lawlessness is not biblical while simply repeating yourself without addressing anything in the posts you are quoting from so I do not think this is worth repeating what I have already posted to you except to provide the link to the full post # 830 linked you choose to ignore and the scripture provided in it that shows why your teaching of lawlessness (without law) is not biblical. So there is no misunderstanding here. When I say lawlessness I simply mean without law as you believe God's 10 commandments have been abolished right? Gods' law is not abolished it is fulfilled in those who believe and follow God's Word. You quote Romans 8:2 which I agree with but ignore Romans 8:4 that says that those who have God's Spirit obey God's law. As posted earlier no one has the Spirit of life if they are breaking God's law that would be the Spirit of death as the wages of sin is death *Romans 6:23. Acts of the Apostles 5:32 says And we are his witnesses of these things; and SO ALSO IS THE HOLY GHOST WHOM GOD HAS GIVEN TO THOSE WHO OBEY HIM. The Spirit of life is not the Spirit of disobedience Carl.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[BABerean2]

Here are some more if it might be helpful (see here; here; here; here; linked). Did you read the link you posted? It has nothing to do with when the Catholic Church started.

Yes. The "tradition" of the Roman Catholic Church claims it started with Christ.

They also claim the Church is built on Peter.

They also claim you can buy your dead relatives out of hell.

The following is from your Wikipedia source, which can be edited by almost anybody.

"
History of the Catholic Church
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Jump to navigationJump to search

Part of a series on the
Catholic Church

St. Peter's Basilica, Vatican City
Overview

• Pope: Francis
• Hierarchy

• timeline)
• Theology
• Liturgy

• Sacraments
• Mary

Organisation
Theologies

• Doctrine

Texts
Rites
Catholic Church portal

• v
• t
• e

The history of the Catholic Church is the formation, events, and transformation of the Catholic Church through time.

The tradition of the Catholic Church claims the Catholic Church began with Jesus Christ and his teachings (c. 4 BC – c. AD 30); the Catholic tradition considers that the Catholic Church is a continuation of the early Christian community established by the Disciples of Jesus.[1][failed verification] The Church considers its bishops to be the successors to Jesus's apostles and the Church's leader, the Bishop of Rome (also known as the Pope), to be the sole successor to Saint Peter[2] who ministered in Rome in the first century AD after his appointment by Jesus as head of the Church.[3][4] "


.

 

[klutedavid]

Brother, that is because the Holy Spirit makes you grow slowly, but He will guide you to obey the Sabbath, once the Seventh-day Adventists have the true biblical Sabbath as an angel told our prophetess. James was willing to allow God to grow "Gentiles who are turning to God" slowly as they listen to the law of Moses each Sabbath.

“It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.” (Acts 15:19-21 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Tell me, if you don't mind. What does Peter mean when he says, 'a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear'.

Acts 15:10
Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yes. The "tradition" of the Roman Catholic Church claims it started with Christ.

They also claim the Church is built on Peter.

They also claim you can buy your dead relatives out of hell.

The following is from your Wikipedia source, which can be edited by almost anybody.

"
History of the Catholic Church
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Jump to navigationJump to search

Part of a series on the
Catholic Church

St. Peter's Basilica, Vatican City
Overview

• Pope: Francis
• Hierarchy

• timeline)
• Theology
• Liturgy

• Sacraments
• Mary

Organisation
Theologies

• Doctrine

Texts
Rites
Catholic Church portal

• v
• t
• e

The history of the Catholic Church is the formation, events, and transformation of the Catholic Church through time.

The tradition of the Catholic Church claims the Catholic Church began with Jesus Christ and his teachings (c. 4 BC – c. AD 30); the Catholic tradition considers that the Catholic Church is a continuation of the early Christian community established by the Disciples of Jesus.[1][failed verification] The Church considers its bishops to be the successors to Jesus's apostles and the Church's leader, the Bishop of Rome (also known as the Pope), to be the sole successor to Saint Peter[2] who ministered in Rome in the first century AD after his appointment by Jesus as head of the Church.[3][4] "


.

All you posted here was something that agrees with what I have already told you. Did you read it?

 

[guevaraj]

Tell me, if you don't mind. What does Peter mean when he says, 'a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear'. Acts 15:10 Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?

Brother, I'd say it is talking about Jewish traditions that supposed are to help keep the people from breaking any of God's laws. It's like when you put a fence around a hole so that no one gets too close to fall. But these other human laws were helpful to some, like the Pharisees who added them, and were an unnecessary burden to others. Some of their human traditions even did the opposite of their function and caused people to disobey God's law instead of helping them keep God's laws.

You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to human traditions.” And he continued, “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and, ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is Corban (that is, devoted to God)— then you no longer let them do anything for their father or mother. Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.” (Mark 7:8-13 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[HARK!]

According to the scriptures God's 4th commandment which is the "seventh day" weekly Sabbath is a memorial of creation *Exodus 20:8 this means it points backwards to the finished work of creation *Genesis 2:1-3 not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17.

It points forward to the day when we will all be one with YHWH in Yahshua. If you believe that has happened already you are mistaken. Yahshua's work isn't finished.

It is not the same as the annual sabbaths in the Feast days that can fall on any day of the week depending on the yearly cycle.

That is definitively evident to me. I honor all of YHWH's appointed times.

Paul obviously understood the difference too; when he drew the distinction in Colossians 2:17.

There was no law, no sin, no plan of salvation given to mankind when God made the "seventh day" Sabbath of creation as a memorial of the finished work of creation.

Of course not. Yahshua is Yah's salvation. Yahshua was in the beginning. Salvation will come before entering into his rest.

Your mixing up the annual sabbaths in the feast days that are shadows of things to come with Gods' 4th commandment which points backwards to the God of creation not forward to things to come.

You are the one who seems to be mixing them up.

Colossians 2:17 draws a distinction.

Time to leave the shadows dear friend Jesus has arrived and God's plan of salvation is revealed and continued by God in the new covenant now not the old.

Again, Yah's plan for salvation was in the beginning. Yahshua's work is not done; and we will see him again, face to face.

Time to move toward the light my fiend. Yahshua is the substance of the shadow. The shadow points to Yahshua. When we turn from Yahshua; we turn to darkness.

Please don't ask me to turn from Yahshua again.

The contract was renewed, not the terms. Yah's Torah is a reflection of his nature. Yah does not change; therefore is Torah doesn't change.

When a tenant violates a lease agreement by allowing his pets to defile the house, he breaks the contract. He is removed from the landlord's house. A new agreement is reached with a new tenant; but the terms remain the same. The landlord will not allow the new tenant to defile his house.

There was no "shadow laws" made when the Sabbath was made for mankind *Mark 2:27; Genesis 2:1-3. Time to leave the shadows dear friend.

Again Yah's plan for salvation was in the beginning. Yah's salvation is Yahshua. Yahshua was in the beginning. Yah's Torah speaks of him. Yahshua is Yah's Torah in the flesh.

When we reject Yah's word; we reject Yahshua. If we don't have Yahshua; we don't have the Father.



(CLV) Jn 8:12
Again, then, Jesus speaks to them, saying, "I am the Light of the world. He who is following Me should under no circumstances be walking in darkness, but will be having the light of life."

(CLV) Jb 24:13
They are among those revolting against the light; They neither recognize its ways Nor dwell in its tracks.

(CLV) Ps 119:105
Your word is a lamp to my feet, And a light to my tracks.

(CLV) Pr 6:23
For instruction is a lamp, and law is a light, And the reproofs of admonition are the way to life,

(CLV) Isa 51:4
Attend to Me, My people, And, My folk, give ear to Me! For a law shall go forth from Me, And My judgment for a light of the peoples.

(CLV) 2Co 6:14
Do not become diversely yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness? Or what communion has light with darkness?

(CLV) 1Jn 1:7
Yet if we should be walking in the light as He is in the light, we are having fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, His Son, is cleansing us from every sin.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Carl there is no contradiction to anything that I have shared with you from the scriptures. All you have done here is ignore my posts to you by micro-quoting one sentence of a whole post of scriptures that show your teachings of lawlessness is not biblical while simply repeating yourself without addressing anything in the posts you are quoting from so I do not think this is worth repeating what I have already posted to you except to provide the link to the full post # 830 linked you choose to ignore and the scripture provided in it that shows why your teaching of lawlessness (without law) is not biblical. So there is no misunderstanding here. When I say lawlessness I simply mean without law as you believe God's 10 commandments have been abolished right? Gods' law is not abolished it is fulfilled in those who believe and follow God's Word. You quote Romans 8:2 which I agree with but ignore Romans 8:4 that says that those who have God's Spirit obey God's law. As posted earlier no one has the Spirit of life if they are breaking God's law that would be the Spirit of death as the wages of sin is death *Romans 6:23. Acts of the Apostles 5:32 says And we are his witnesses of these things; and SO ALSO IS THE HOLY GHOST WHOM GOD HAS GIVEN TO THOSE WHO OBEY HIM. The Spirit of life is not the Spirit of disobedience Carl.

Hope this is helpful.

No it is not helpful at all.

You insist I am teaching Lawlessness which is nuts, I have advocated no such thing.

You have not apologised for misquoting scripture and changing the order of words.

I have never advocated lawlessness and never will.

I advocate being under the Law of the Spirit within, yeilding to the author of the Law - this gift is for all who believe and eclipses the written law which served a good purpose but is no longer necessary.

There is absolutely nothing 'lawless' about that, and I would appreciate you ceasing false accusations.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

No it is not helpful at all.

You insist I am teaching Lawlessness which is nuts, I have advocated no such thing.

You have not apologised for misquoting scripture and changing the order of words.

I have never advocated lawlessness and never will.

I advocate being under the Law of the Spirit within, yeilding to the author of the Law - this gift for all who believe and eclipses the written law which served a good purpose but is no longer necessary.

There is absolutely nothing 'lawless' about that, and I would appreciate you ceasing false accusations.

Carl did you even read the post you are quoting from? What do you think my application of lawlessness is in our discussion? Do you believe Gods' law (10 commandments) is abolished; YES/NO?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

It points forward to the day when we will all be one with YHWH in Yahshua. If you believe that has happened already you are mistaken. Yahshua's work isn't finished. That is definitively evident to me. I honor all of YHWH's appointed times. Paul obviously understood the difference too; when he drew the distinction in Colossians 2:17. Of course not. Yahshua is Yah's salvation. Yahshua was in the beginning. Salvation will come before entering into his rest. You are the one who seems to be mixing them up. Colossians 2:17 draws a distinction. Again, Yah's plan for salvation was in the beginning. Yahshua's work is not done; and we will see him again, face to face. Time to move toward the light my fiend. Yahshua is the substance of the shadow. The shadow points to Yahshua. When we turn from Yahshua; we turn to darkness. Please don't ask me to turn from Yahshua again. The contract was renewed, not the terms. Yah's Torah is a reflection of his nature. Yah does not change; therefore is Torah doesn't change. When a tenant violates a lease agreement by allowing his pets to defile the house, he breaks the contract. He is removed from the landlord's house. A new agreement is reached with a new tenant; but the terms remain the same. The landlord will not allow the new tenant to defile his house. Again Yah's plan for salvation was in the beginning. Yah's salvation is Yahshua. Yahshua was in the beginning. Yah's Torah speaks of him. Yahshua is Yah's Torah in the flesh. When we reject Yah's word; we reject Yahshua. If we don't have Yahshua; we don't have the Father.

I am finding it hard to follow you HARK! Did you want to address the post you are quoting from with scripture now? How can God's "seventh day" Sabbath of the 4th commandment be a "shadow law" when it points backwards as a memorial of creation and not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17? You do know there were no "shadow laws" when the "seventh day" Sabbath of creation was made for all mankind right because there was no sin, no law and no plan of salvation because there was no law and no Moses? Therefore it is impossible for God's 4th commandment to be a "shadow" of anything if you believe the scriptures because there was no sin and no plan of salvation given because there was no sin! According to the scriptures God's 4th commandment which is the "seventh day" weekly Sabbath is a memorial of creation *Exodus 20:8 this means it points backwards to the finished work of creation *Genesis 2:1-3 not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17. It is not the same as the annual sabbaths in the Feast days that can fall on any day of the week depending on the yearly cycle. There was no law, no sin, no plan of salvation given to mankind when God made the "seventh day" Sabbath of creation as a memorial of the finished work of creation. Your mixing up the annual sabbaths in the feast days that are shadows of things to come with Gods' 4th commandment which points backwards to the God of creation not forward to things to come. Time to leave the shadows dear friend Jesus has arrived and God's plan of salvation is revealed and continued by God in the new covenant now not the old. There was no "shadow laws" made when the Sabbath was made for mankind *Mark 2:27; Genesis 2:1-3. This above is what Gods' Word says in regards to Gods' "seventh day" memorial of creation. I see all you have provided in response is your words in disagreement with Gods' Word. Of course you are free to believe as you wish and we will agree to disagree dear friend.

 

[Carl Emerson]

The Written Law has served an important purpose but for the New Covenant believer, is eclipsed by the Law of the Spirit within.
Both remain, because the Spirit uses the Written Law to bring conviction to the unsaved.
The saved under the New Covenant have the indwelling Living Word of the author of the Law.
This is a much more superior line of communication and is specific to individual circumstances in ways the Written Law never was.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The Written Law has served an important purpose but for the New Covenant believer, is eclipsed by the Law of the Spirit within.
Both remain, because the Spirit uses the Written Law to bring conviction to the unsaved.
The saved under the New Covenant have the indwelling Living Word of the author of the Law.
This is a much more superior line of communication and is specific to individual circumstances in ways the Written Law never was.

I agree Gods' people have Gods' Spirit and have never denied this and have posted this to you in the last few posts or more that I have shared with you from the scriptures. So your post here does not answer much of my post that was shared with you Carl. For example; how do you know what sin is and good and evil is if there is now no law? You also avoided answering a direct question to you that would help any misunderstandings between us. Do you believe that God's 10 commandments have been abolished; YES/NO?

 

[HARK!]

Did you want to address the post you are quoting from with scripture now? According to the scriptures God's 4th commandment which is the "seventh day" weekly Sabbath is a memorial of creation *Exodus 20:8 this means it points backwards to the finished work of creation *Genesis 2:1-3 not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17.

I've addressed it time and again. In Colossians 2:17, Paul states that the Sabbath is a shadow of things to come.

I'll take Paul's word over your fallacious presumptions.

You are presenting a false dichotomy.

You see; just because a day is a memorial of a past event; doesn't mean that it doesn't point forward.

For example, Moses was instructed to honor Pesach as a memorial; but it still pointed forward; and even though Yahshua fulfilled it; it still points forward to be fulfilled in us.

All of YHWH's appointments point forward.

If you believe that YHWH doesn't call his people to honor all of his appointments, forever; this contradicts YHWH himself.

We will have to agree to disagree.

 

[HARK!]

The Written Law has served an important purpose but for the New Covenant believer, is eclipsed by the Law of the Spirit within.
Both remain, because the Spirit uses the Written Law to bring conviction to the unsaved.
The saved under the New Covenant have the indwelling Living Word of the author of the Law.
This is a much more superior line of communication and is specific to individual circumstances in ways the Written Law never was.

Yah said that he would write his law on our hearts. If you believe that YHWH will be writing a different law on our hearts, than the ones that were already given; then I would test that spirit. I test the spirits with the word of YHWH.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Yah said that he would write his law on our hearts. If you believe that YHWH will be writing a different law on our hearts, than the ones that were already given; then I would test that spirit. I test the spirits with the word of YHWH.

You are welcome...

We have within the Author of the Law.

He says - this is the way, walk ye in it.

He says - my sheep hear my voice and they follow me.

He also said - as for you, the anointing which you received from Him remains in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you remain in Him.

He also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

These are the words of YHWH...

 

[klutedavid]

Brother, I'd say it is talking about Jewish traditions that supposed are to help keep the people from breaking any of God's laws. It's like when you put a fence around a hole so that no one gets too close to fall. But these other human laws were helpful to some, like the Pharisees who added them, and were an unnecessary burden to others. Some of their human traditions even did the opposite of their function and caused people to disobey God's law instead of helping them keep God's laws.

You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to human traditions.” And he continued, “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and, ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is Corban (that is, devoted to God)— then you no longer let them do anything for their father or mother. Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.” (Mark 7:8-13 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Now that was out of left field. traditions you say?

Here are the relevant verses from that chapter in Acts.

Acts 15
1 Some men came down from Judea and began teaching the brethren,
“Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.”

5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who had believed stood up, saying,
“It is necessary to circumcise them and to direct them to observe the Law of Moses.”

6 The apostles and the elders came together to look into this matter.

The yoke is obviously the law.

How did you get traditions from those verses?

10 Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I've addressed it time and again. In Colossians 2:17, Paul states that the Sabbath is a shadow of things to come.

I'll take Paul's word over your fallacious presumptions.

You are presenting a false dichotomy.

You see; just because a day is a memorial of a past event; doesn't mean that it doesn't point forward.

For example, Moses was instructed to honor Pesach as a memorial; but it still pointed forward; and even though Yahshua fulfilled it; it still points forward to be fulfilled in us.

All of YHWH's appointments point forward.

If you believe that YHWH doesn't call his people to honor all of his appointments, forever; this contradicts YHWH himself.

We will have to agree to disagree.

Actually no you have not addressed any question I have asked of you and you have not provided any scriptures. I asked you how can God's "seventh day" Sabbath of the 4th commandment be a "shadow law" when it points backwards as a memorial of creation and not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17? You do know there were no "shadow laws" when the "seventh day" Sabbath of creation was made for all mankind right because there was no sin, no law and no plan of salvation because there was no law and no Moses? Therefore it is impossible for God's 4th commandment to be a "shadow" of anything if you believe the scriptures because there was no sin and no plan of salvation given because there was no sin! According to the scriptures God's 4th commandment which is the "seventh day" weekly Sabbath is a memorial of creation *Exodus 20:8 this means it points backwards to the finished work of creation *Genesis 2:1-3 not forward to things to come *Colossians 2:17. See post # 834 and elsewhere linked. The above is what Gods' Word says in regards to Gods' "seventh day" memorial of creation. In response all you have provided are your words arguing against Gods' Word. Anyhow you do not have to answer those questions if you do not want to. It is up to you. Perhaps you can pray about it.