Salvation vs : service.

[setst777]

Salvation is God on the Cross, offering His blood as the reconciliation that allows "all who call on the name of Jesus", to be born again.
Once you are born again, you are always born again.

This is your doctrine you keep promoting. But to hold onto your doctrine, you must reject the Scriptures.

• Salvation is by faith in Lord Jesus.
• By faith, we start a new life in Christ Jesus, his Spirit indwelling us as our guide - this is being born again.
• The warnings given all through Scripture, which you continually ignore, is that the believer who is saved, must CONTINUE to remain in the faith or be condemned - no longer born again.

Galatians 6:9 Let us not be weary in doing good, for we will reap in due season, if we do not give up.

1 Timothy 4:16 (WEB)
16 Pay attention to yourself and to your teaching. Continue in these things, for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.

1 Timothy 4:1-2 (WEB) 4 But the Spirit says expressly that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 through the hypocrisy of men who speak lies, branded in their own conscience as with a hot iron

Romans 11:20-22 (WEB)
20 True; by their unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by your faith.
Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God didn’t spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 See then the goodness and severity of God. Toward those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in his goodness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

Hebrews 3:13-15 (WEB)
13 but exhort one another day by day, so long as it is called “today”, lest any one of you be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence firm to the end, 15 while it is said,
“Today if you will hear his voice, do not harden your hearts, as in the rebellion.” [Psalm 95:7-8]

Hebrews 12:25 (WEB) See that you (the Christians for whom the letter was written) do not refuse him who speaks. For if they (those OT Israelites) did not escape when they refused him who warned on the earth, how much more will we (the Christians for whom the letter was written) not escape who turn away from him who warns from heaven

Hebrews 10:35-38 (WEB)
35 Therefore do not throw away your boldness, which has a great reward. 36 For you need endurance so that, having done the will of God, you may receive the promise

Hebrews 4:11 (WEB)
11 Let us therefore give diligence to enter into that Rest, lest anyone fall after the same example of disobedience.

Hebrews 4:1 (WEB)
Let us fear therefore, lest perhaps anyone of you should seem to have come short of a promise of entering into his Rest.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Listen, not everyone is born again, who claims to be so.
And, Its God who died on the Cross, and faith is what He accepts to give you what Jesus said, is "finished".
This is the "gift of Salvation".

Let’s not get off track from the subject here. My whole point is that I said Jesus said only those who endure to the end will be saved. You replied by saying that “enduring is my savior, not Christ”. So then I came back and said that you teach we must believe in order to be saved so my that same logic believing is your savior not Christ. Jesus said we must do both to be saved and your saying we don’t need to endure we only need to believe. Nothing that you said in this post takes away what Jesus said about enduring to the end and remaining in Him.

 

[Ligurian]

Can you do something other then post from hyper religious heretical commentaries? No?

you are pretending I've copied without giving credit to the author?
Are my direct quotes from Jesus "hyper religious heretical" to you?

Are my direct quotes from Jesus "hyper religious heretical" to you?

I never said you didn't "give credit".

Also, quoting verses, isn't the same as proving truth, tho, you would not be able to see it that way, at this time.

Matthew 15:7-9 But in vain they do worship Me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men.

John 8:46-47 And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe Me?

 

[Sidon]

This is your doctrine.

Yes....true.

The doctrine of "justification by faith"......."the preaching of The Cross", "the gift of salvation", "the Gift of Righteousness', and "faith is accepted as Righteousness, and "Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him as righteousness"... "Abraham is the father of our faith">. and that Jesus was was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification."""

Is exactly what i teach.

This is all "Pauline Theology".

 

[Sidon]

Are my direct quotes from Jesus "hyper religious heretical" to you?
?

The devil quotes the bible all day, every Sunday, in pulpits, using "christians'.
Are these heretical?

I wrote two Threads that deal with how to spot them on a forum, these same dark lights.

Many now have, and many will continue to learn how, thanks to those Threads, and about 44 others.

 

[Sidon]

My whole point is that I said Jesus said only those who endure to the end will be saved.

He said that not talking about the Gospel of Grace, or regarding Salvation.
That is Christ speaking prophetically.
God does that a lot in the bible.
You have to learn how to "rightly divide" the word, to see it.

Jesus often spoke to Jews, and what he said was referring to the Millennial reign, that will happen after the Great Trib.
Yet, he's talking to his audience, face to face, who will be dead before the Great Trib starts.

 

[BNR32FAN]

He said that not talking about the Gospel of Grace, or regarding Salvation.
That is Christ speaking prophetically.
God does that a lot in the bible.
You have to learn how to "rightly divide" the word, to see it.

Jesus often spoke to Jews, and what he said was referring to the Millennial reign, that will happen after the Great Trib.
Yet, he's talking to his audience, face to face, who will be dead before the Great Trib starts.

“You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭10:22‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Not in Matthew 10

 

[Ligurian]

Listen, not everyone is born again, who claims to be so.
And, Its God who died on the Cross, and faith is what He accepts to give you what Jesus said, is "finished".
This is the "gift of Salvation".

Finished Work

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which Thou gavest Me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou Me with Thine own self with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was. 6 I have manifested Thy name unto the men which Thou gavest Me out of the world: Thine they were, and Thou gavest them Me; and they have kept Thy word.

teleioo = from teleios; to complete, i.e. (literally) accomplish, or (figuratively) consummate (in character):--consecrate, finish, fulfil, make) perfect.

Finished Scripture

John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished (teleo), that the scripture might be fulfilled (teleioo), saith, I thirst.
29 Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put [it] upon hyssop, and put [it] to His mouth.
30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, He said, It is finished: and He bowed His head, and gave up the ghost. the scripture fulfilled : Exodus 12:21-27

teleo = from telos; to end, i.e. complete, execute, conclude, discharge (a debt):--accomplish, make an end, expire, fill up, finish, go over, pay, perform.

John 13:1 Now before the feast of the passover, when Jesus knew that His hour was come that He should depart out of this world unto the Father, having loved His own which were in the world, He loved them unto the end. 8 Peter saith unto Him, Thou shalt never wash My feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with Me.

Psalms 51:7 Thou shalt sprinkle me with hyssop, and I shall be purified: Thou shalt wash me, and I shall be made whiter than snow.

John 15:2 Every branch in Me that beareth not fruit He taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, He purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in Me.

purgeth = καθαίρει
Cognate: 2508 kathaírō – make clean by purging (removing undesirable elements); hence, "pruned (purged)"; eliminating what is fruitless by purifying (making unmixed). See 2513 (katharos).
Strong's Greek: 2508. καθαίρω (kathairó) -- to cleanse

 

[Ligurian]

“You will be hated by all because of My name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭10:22‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Not in Matthew 10

Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into [any] city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand. 22 And ye shall be hated of all [men] for My name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.KJV

Both at the beginning of their stewardship, and at the end:

Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

hupomeno = hupo and meno; to stay under (behind), i.e. remain; figuratively, to undergo, i.e. bear (trials), have fortitude, persevere:--abide, endure, (take) patient(-ly), suffer, tarry behind.

John 14:2 In My Father's house are many mansions: if [it were] not [so], I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto Myself; that where I am, [there] ye may be also. 4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. 5 Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither Thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.

mone = meno; a staying, i.e. residence (the act or the place):--abode, mansion.
meno = a primary verb; to stay (in a given place, state, relation or expectancy):--abide, continue, dwell, endure, be present, remain, stand, tarry (for), X thine own.

Matthew 28:18-30
Galatians 2:7-9

 

[Ligurian]

BNR32FAN quotes a parable... I don't read the context, so I don't know why.

A grace-gospel-believer tries his best to interpret the parable.

I toss my pearls of wisdom in...

And grace-gospel-believer guy sticks to his guns, adds the oddity of "that's not a parable," and doesn't care who's qualified to understand parables.

Matthew 13:10 And the Disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest Thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
19 When any one heareth the word of the Kingdom, and understandeth [it] not, then cometh the wicked [one], and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; 21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth [it]; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for He is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with Him [are] called, and chosen, and faithful.

Oh I’m sorry I misread that. Yes I completely agree that the enemy can blind people who aren’t willing to hear God’s words.

“And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭4:3-4‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Well then, I guess Paul would consider me blinded by the enemy.

Good thing for me Matthew 24:14 and Galatians 2:7-9 exist.

Perfect assessment of your faith.

Did you forget that you teach Pauline Theology? You're maybe qualified to judge Paul's Christ-crucified gospel. But you're not qualified to judge the works Gospel preached before the cross to Lost Sheep. No wonder people find you so confusing... pick a lane and stay in it, already.

The Discipled-Apostles kept the word of God John 17:6

Matthew 13:10 And the Disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

 

[Ligurian]

And those are not born again.
See, you can't "fall away" from being BORN AGAIN.

If you're teaching Pauline Theology, you should be quoting Paul.

Remember this conversation, when you quoted Romans 4:5 at me?

.
Where does "Paul teach" "born again", Sidon?
Book, Chapter and Verse, please.

Where does "Paul teach" "born again", Sidon?
Book, Chapter and Verse, please.

"To him that worked not but believeth on God who justifieth the UNGODLY, his FAITH is counted for Righteosness".

Romans 4:4-5 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

You and I would get along better if you'd stop robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Because I can kinda see one point you make from those verses there.

Galatians 2:7-9
Romans 4:4-5
Matthew 7:24

 

[Ligurian]

.
Are my direct quotes from Jesus "hyper religious heretical" to you?

The devil quotes the bible all day, every Sunday, in pulpits, using "christians'. Are these heretical?
I wrote two Threads that deal with how to spot them on a forum, these same dark lights.
Many now have, and many will continue to learn how, thanks to those Threads, and about 44 others.

Matthew 15:7-9 But in vain they do worship Me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men.

 

[Sidon]

Did you forget that you teach Pauline Theology? You're maybe qualified to judge Paul's Christ-crucified gospel. But you're not qualified to judge the works Gospel preached before the cross to Lost Sheep.

I can't judge what does not exist.
I can only show you that the Cross is the only Gospel, "in the time of the Gentiles".

The law and commandments were never a gospel.

Abraham was justified by faith, before the nation of Israel existed.

The Great Trib, is going to be a different application of the Gospel, as it will be the same Jesus on the Cross, but it wont be "the gift of Salvation" only.

 

[Sidon]

If you're teaching Pauline Theology, you should be quoting Paul.
Remember this conversation, when you quoted Romans 4:5 at me?
Where does "Paul teach" "born again", Sidon?


Romans 4:4-5 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
You and I would get along better if you'd stop robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Because I can kinda see one point you make from those verses there.

To pretend that you are trying to get along with me, is not wise to pretend.

Also, i quoted a verse where Paul teaches born again.
Try this one from Paul.

""But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."

Notice...>"faith is counted as Righteousness".

This act of "Justification by faith" is why God gives the new Birth to the person.

So, there is another verse, take from the "book".
Need more?

 

[Sidon]

Matthew 15:7-9 But in vain they do worship Me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men.

The result of your verse, is taught by Paul in : Hebrews 13:9.
Its always the core verse i use when i explain that unless your heart is established in Grace as your Theology, the NT will remain closed to you.

 

[Sidon]

Where does "Paul teach" "born again", Sidon?
Book, Chapter and Verse, please.

I know you'll ask me again tomorrow, so, here is the answer for your tomorrow's redundancy ...

Read Romans 3:21-28 carefully.

Then read this carefully.

Titus 3:5-6

This is Paul explaining "born again" to you.

1 ) Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but -

2.).according to GOD's mercy...= He saved us,

How ??

3.) BY the washing of > regeneration<, and renewing of the Holy Ghost..

Notice that the "washing" is not by water, its by "regeneration".
This is the process that causes the dead spirit in a person to become 'One with God", AS = Born again.
JESUS said you "must be born again"....
The end result is the spiritual regeneration. = The Spiritual birth into God's Spirit......"and the renewing of the Holy Ghost".

This is the Holy Spirit actually causing the new birth as the "new creation in Christ", "Son of God".
This is God's Holy Spirit birthing a person's spirit into God's Holy Spirit.
This is what it means to be "made righteous".

See that?
That is Paul explaining "born again" to you.

 

[Ligurian]

I can't judge what does not exist.
I can only show you that the Cross is the only Gospel, "in the time of the Gentiles".

The law and commandments were never a gospel.

Abraham was justified by faith, before the nation of Israel existed.

The Great Trib, is going to be a different application of the Gospel, as it will be the same Jesus on the Cross, but it wont be "the gift of Salvation" only.

People see what they want to see... I get it, I'm convinced...
One could post this at you, 3 years in a row, and you still wouldn't see it.

Mark 1:14-15 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the Kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the Gospel.

Matthew 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand. 18 And Jesus, walking by the sea of Galilee, saw two brethren, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea: for they were fishers. 19 And He saith unto them, Follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men. 20 And they straightway left [their] nets, and followed Him. 21 And going on from thence, He saw other two brethren, James [the son] of Zebedee, and John his brother, in a ship with Zebedee their father, mending their nets; and He called them. 22 And they immediately left the ship and their father, and followed Him. 23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Matthew 9:35 And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people.
Matthew 24:14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
Matthew 26:13 Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this Gospel shall be preached in the whole world, there shall also this, that this woman hath done, be told for a memorial of her.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least Commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.

Synonyms, in the synoptic gospels:
The Gospel of the Kingdom of God
The Gospel of the Kingdom
The Kingdom of Heaven
The Kingdom of God
This Gospel

 

[Sidon]

------

 

[Sidon]

Mark 1:14-15 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom of God,

The Gospel of the KOG is : "Christ in you".
The KOG is a Spiritual Kingdom.
To belong to this Kingdom you "must be born again" into it. Spiritually, as "translated from darkness....TO LIGHT".
So, 3 yrs from now, you probably still wont see it.

"Christ in you" ... this is Salvation.
You are born again, into that, Spiritually.
This occurs when you Trust in Christ, that is based on hearing the "Preaching of the Cross" and "faith comes by hearing",......, and "all that believe"......are born again, into the KOG.

So, its not my job to think for you, or see for you.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Did you forget that you teach Pauline Theology? You're maybe qualified to judge Paul's Christ-crucified gospel. But you're not qualified to judge the works Gospel preached before the cross to Lost Sheep. No wonder people find you so confusing... pick a lane and stay in it, already.

The Discipled-Apostles kept the word of God John 17:6

Matthew 13:10 And the Disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

Sidon is the perfect example of someone who doesn’t have ears to hear.