Biden's Proposals Aim to Give Sturdier Support to the Middle Class

[disciple Clint]

What evidence do have to support such claims?

How about any basic Econ 101 course, look into it and you will find that tax and spend has never been used to provide a healthy economy. Where do you think the money is going to come from to fund all the free programs, Just a clue the Fed does not put more money in circulation by cranking up the printing press.

 

[TLK Valentine]

How about any basic Econ 101 course, look into it and you will find that tax and spend has never been used to provide a healthy economy. Where do you think the money is going to come from to fund all the free programs, Just a clue the Fed does not put more money in circulation by cranking up the printing press.

How about cracking down on tax cheats and making them pay what they owe?

 

[disciple Clint]

How about cracking down on tax cheats and making them pay what they owe?

Yes that should keep the middle class in line, classic Obama technique use the IRS to intimidate people and go after those you disagree with. It is certainly not going to change anything for the wealthy who hire professionals to find all the loopholes in the tax code so that they pay as little as possible. If we truly want to level the playing field there have been many proposals over the years to go to a graduated flat tax, that would be fair to all. 19 Facts On IRS Targeting President Obama Can't Blame On Republicans

 

[TLK Valentine]

Yes that should keep the middle class in line, classic Obama technique use the IRS to intimidate people and go after those you disagree with.

You don't disagree with tax cheats?

It is certainly not going to change anything for the wealthy who hire professionals to find all the loopholes in the tax code so that they pay as little as possible.

Unless the government hires professionals to close the loopholes -- or would that be too Socialist?

If we truly want to level the playing field there have been many proposals over the years to go to a graduated flat tax, that would be fair to all.

...and how much more revenue would the US take in (ballpark figure) if we did that?

 

[Vylo]

How about any basic Econ 101 course, look into it and you will find that tax and spend has never been used to provide a healthy economy. Where do you think the money is going to come from to fund all the free programs, Just a clue the Fed does not put more money in circulation by cranking up the printing press.

Except you know, the time period where we had the highest amount of prosperity was a heavy tax and spend period. The economic turnout allowed us to recoup the not only the money spent, but the cost of a world war.

 

[disciple Clint]

You don't disagree with tax cheats?



Unless the government hires professionals to close the loopholes -- or would that be too Socialist?



...and how much more revenue would the US take in (ballpark figure) if we did that?

Have you considered that elected officials do not want to solve the problem of tax loopholes? It serves them in their personal finance and those people who take advantage of the tax laws are the same ones who give heavily to political campaigns. There is no benefit to them to cut off their funding.

 

[Larniavc]

How about any basic Econ 101 course, look into it and you will find that tax and spend has never been used to provide a healthy economy. Where do you think the money is going to come from to fund all the free programs, Just a clue the Fed does not put more money in circulation by cranking up the printing press.

So unable to provide evidence. How unexpected.

“Critics believe that the trickle-down policy has done damage to the U.S. economy more times than it has helped. It has met with disastrous results when applied at the federal and state level.”

Does Trickle-Down Economics Work?

That took about two minutes to find.

 

[disciple Clint]

So unable to provide evidence. How unexpected.

“Critics believe that the trickle-down policy has done damage to the U.S. economy more times than it has helped. It has met with disastrous results when applied at the federal and state level.”

Does Trickle-Down Economics Work?

That took about two minutes to find.

https://www.hoover.org/sites/defaul...nt_bidens_economic_agenda_hassett_updated.pdf
An Analysis of Vice President Biden’s Economic Agenda:
The new regulations would affect resource usage by regulated industries while new taxes would distort the markets for capital and labor. We estimate that the full Biden agenda will reduce long-run real GDP per capita by more than 8 percent as a result of reducing full-time equivalent employment (FTEs) per person by 3 percent, the capital stock per person by 15 percent and total factor productivity by 2 percent. Relative to the CBO’s 2030 projections for these variables (Congressional Budget Office 2020), this suggests there will be 4.9 million fewer employed individuals, $2.6 trillion less GDP, and $1.5 trillion less consumption in that year alone. Median household income in 2030 would be $6,500 less.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Have you considered that elected officials do not want to solve the problem of tax loopholes? It serves them in their personal finance and those people who take advantage of the tax laws are the same ones who give heavily to political campaigns. There is no benefit to them to cut off their funding.

This is true -- unless we write laws that, among other things, limit the monies that can be used to bribe "contribute" to those campaigns. Then the elected officials lose their incentive to keep the loopholes.

Instead of supporting corruption, we fight against it -- just a thought.

 

[Oneiric1975]

The presidency is part of the government.

Oh, OK. I think I get your point.

Yes there are times when the government gets a "bad apple" in a position of authority who mishandles things (sometimes disastrously). But overall the government can do good. As I said the government has provided us with massive improvements to live. Nearly 50% of breakthrough drugs you and I both rely on every day came from NIH (government) funded research, our dept of agriculture has a nearly 200 year track record of research which has revolutionized the world's ability to feed itself and the list can go on and on and on.

Further I think it is also a matter of what WE want. If we want our government to do better that's up to us. We are an amazing country and together we can do so much. We've done it before. We can do it again.

 

[Hammster]

Fair enough -- I assume that a person who loses everything he has in the world (or believes they are about to) and/or prefers not to end up living on the streets is more likely to turn to crime than one who has not.

Maybe. But your assumption is that this will be so widespread, we should put some program in place just in case.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Maybe. But your assumption is that this will be so widespread, we should put some program in place just in case.

If Louis XVI had put some program in place, he might have ended his reign with his head still attached. If the Romonovs had put some program in place, their dynasty might not have ended with bullets and bayonets.

We've seen in this country what (presumably) otherwise law-abiding people will do at their state capitals when they can't get a haircut or the Cheesecake Factory closes down for a few weeks -- care to see what real desperation will lead to? I don't.

 

[Oneiric1975]

If Louis XVI had put some program in place, he might have ended his reign with his head still attached. If the Romonovs had put some program in place, their dynasty might not have ended with bullets and bayonets.

Arguably the 1905 peasants uprising in Russia didn't turn into a full-scale Russian Revolution because the Romanovs listened to the people and established the Duma. It wasn't enough, obviously, and 12 short years later very bad things happened.

Obviously America isn't at that ridiculous level yet but history tells us what happens when people are desperate.

 

[renniks]

Biden's Proposals Aim to Give Sturdier Support to the Middle Class

By bankrupting the country?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Arguably the 1905 peasants uprising in Russia didn't turn into a full-scale Russian Revolution because the Romanovs listened to the people and established the Duma. It wasn't enough, obviously, and 12 short years later very bad things happened.

Considering that the Duma eventually turned on him, I'd have to agree.

Obviously America isn't at that ridiculous level yet but history tells us what happens when people are desperate.

America has programs in place. Let's axe them and see what happens... not.

 

[Larniavc]

https://www.hoover.org/sites/defaul...nt_bidens_economic_agenda_hassett_updated.pdf
An Analysis of Vice President Biden’s Economic Agenda:
The new regulations would affect resource usage by regulated industries while new taxes would distort the markets for capital and labor. We estimate that the full Biden agenda will reduce long-run real GDP per capita by more than 8 percent as a result of reducing full-time equivalent employment (FTEs) per person by 3 percent, the capital stock per person by 15 percent and total factor productivity by 2 percent. Relative to the CBO’s 2030 projections for these variables (Congressional Budget Office 2020), this suggests there will be 4.9 million fewer employed individuals, $2.6 trillion less GDP, and $1.5 trillion less consumption in that year alone. Median household income in 2030 would be $6,500 less.

That’s pure speculation about 2030. Not factual information based on what actually happened in the real world.

Is that what you think evidence is?

smh

 

[Hammster]

If Louis XVI had put some program in place, he might have ended his reign with his head still attached. If the Romonovs had put some program in place, their dynasty might not have ended with bullets and bayonets.

We've seen in this country what (presumably) otherwise law-abiding people will do at their state capitals when they can't get a haircut or the Cheesecake Factory closes down for a few weeks -- care to see what real desperation will lead to? I don't.

How much more unemployment would we have needed to make anecdotal stories the norm? It was pretty high last year.

 

[TLK Valentine]

How much more unemployment would we have needed to make anecdotal stories the norm? It was pretty high last year.

Hard to say; it's like asking how many school shootings did it take before "thoughts and prayers" became the political pro forma?

You never know how quickly something's going to become the new normal.

 

[Oneiric1975]

Hard to say; it's like asking how many school shootings did it take before "thoughts and prayers" became the political pro forma?

You never know how quickly something's going to become the new normal.

...and as in "thotz-n-prayerz", America finds a way to deal with its problems!

 

[BigDaddy4]

Not one word in there talks about you living up to a particular standard. As for protecting the middle class, that IS the government's job, for sure. God-ordained, in fact.

Reference for God-ordained government protection of the middle class?