What if racism is an evolutionary response?

[pitabread]

I'm addressing their problems as a homogenous group, which I believe is the point. I don't like the "whack-a-mole" approach.

I don't know what you mean by "whack a mole" approach. The whole point in combating racism is to see people as individuals rather than simply a homogenous group based on skin color or ethnic background.

That you reinforce that you are seeing and judging people in such ways is part of the problem.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It comes down to intent. Today we, myself included tend to decide on our own what another person intended. The only way to know if what he said was racist would be to know what was in his mind. Everyone is on edge lately and throwing out words like racist, liberal etc. so much that they've lost meaning. The one thing I do know about true racists are they are just looking for someone to blame for their own perceived failures. Even then most of them don't really hate the other race they just want to make hurtful comments towards them and try to bring them down a notch. Lack of personal responsibility.

When I was a kid I would rather get the spanking than the lecture.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

It comes down to intent. Today we, myself included tend to decide on our own what another person intended. The only way to know if what he said was racist would be to know what was in his mind. Everyone is on edge lately and throwing out words like racist, liberal etc. so much that they've lost meaning. The one thing I do know about true racists are they are just looking for someone to blame for their own perceived failures. Even then most of them don't really hate the other race they just want to make hurtful comments towards them and try to bring them down a notch. Lack of personal responsibility.

Again, there is such a thing as positive racism, where you (not the personal you) view a certain group as being so lacking in certain things, so beneath you, that they always require your help or aid, which ends up leading to negative stereotypes about those groups which then leads to racism.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Best. Movie. Ever.

"The African Queen". Great movie.

 

[Arc F1]

When I was a kid a would rather get the spanking than the lecture.

I got lots of both.

 

[Arc F1]

Again, there is such a thing as positive racism, where you (not the personal you) view a certain group as being so lacking in certain things, so beneath you, that they always require your help or aid, which ends up leading to negative stereotypes about those groups which then leads to racism.

I don't know anything about positive racism. If someone wants to help all white people and I am better for their help then I see that as the positive.

I do take issue with government helping one specific group instead of the individuals. Is that an example of positive racism?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

I don't know anything about positive racism. If someone wants to help all white people and I am better for their help then I see that as the positive.

I do take issue with government helping one specific group instead of the individuals. Is that an example of positive racism?

Well, yeah, essentially. The view is also sometimes referred to as 'benevolent prejudice' if you want another term, or 'positive discrimination'.
Granted, governments will always go for the "help the many, regardless of the few" mindset because it's easier, so that one can really just be called laziness.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Except that that isn't always the case. If you say that the whole needs help because of the words of a minority in that group, then that is stereotyping.

At some point one must make generalizations, or you are overwhelmed by the details.

 

[Zaymer]

I still fail to see how this is a logical conclusion. Survival of the fittest does not entail wiping out everyone/everything else.

Insofar as cooperation goes, just using the human species as an example, we tend to be at our best (survival-wise) when we do cooperate.

Using the WW2 example, it's not like when Hitler decided to wipe out/conquer everyone else that he was successful. Everyone else decided to cooperate and said "no, we don't think so". And thus was the end of Hitler's plans for domination.

Yes, Germans under Hitler (who was influenced by the Kaiser Wilhelm Institute's views on evolution and eugenics) vyed to try conquer more resources and eliminate competition; the West allied with the Soviets to eliminate/wipe out their common enemy, the Germans, but afterward their alliance broke down into animosity, each seeking the upper-hand over the other.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It's not. Children who aren't taught to fear or dislike or look down upon other races will happily befriend and play with and love and embrace other children of any ethnicity. It's entirely taught, whether by outside influences or experiences one endures.

Sadly those kids lose the agreement that allowed them to walk together as children when they become adults.

 

[QvQ]

What is the basis of morality?

I was raised a stone cold atheist. Morality was social norms, which in my social circle, was whatever felt good or we could get away with. Or a soapy mix of imitation Christian compassion and Buddhist karma "be nice to" selected group of "poor unfortunates."
When I became a Christian, I realized that Morals define the relationship with God. To do right, to have dignity in the eyes of God. I realized I was naked and God clothed me in righteousness. Not to say I don't fall short of the Glory but at least I can see the Glory.
Merry Christmas

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

At some point one must make generalizations, or you are overwhelmed by the details.

And that's called stereotyping and leads to racism.
Do you understand this?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Yes, Germans under Hitler (who was influenced by the Kaiser Wilhelm Institute's views on evolution and eugenics) vyed to try conquer more resources and eliminate competition; the West allied with the Soviets to eliminate/wipe out their common enemy, the Germans, but afterward their alliance broke down into animosity, each seeking the upper-hand over the other.

And that's called politics, not evolution, and was brought about by the racist idea that the German Aryans (as Hitler viewed them) were superior to the other peoples of Europe and the world.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I don't know what you mean by "whack a mole" approach. The whole point in combating racism is to see people as individuals rather than simply a homogenous group based on skin color or ethnic background.

That you reinforce that you are seeing and judging people in such ways is part of the problem.

I'm taking the long view, that a rising tide lifts all boats. If you improve the black economy everyone is helped and most problems go away. "Money answereth everything." Trying to put out brush fires here and there is counterproductive.

 

[Zaymer]

And that's called politics, not evolution, and was brought about by the racist idea that the German Aryans (as Hitler viewed them) were superior to the other peoples of Europe and the world.

Politics is an abstracted conflict over resources, power, and ultimately survival.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

And that's called stereotyping and leads to racism.
Do you understand this?

Most cultural stereotyping is done from within, not from without (like "wash day").

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Politics is an abstracted conflict over resources, power, and ultimately survival.

But it's not a facet of evolutionary biology. It's an abstraction of the group, yes, but only because the human mind evolves to say that we need politics.

 

[pitabread]

Trying to put out brush fires here and there is counterproductive.

That wasn't what I was suggesting though.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Most stereotyping is done from within, not from without.

I like how you said 'baloney' first. And no, it is both a mix of without and within. We are all guilty of it, but any stereotyping of a racial group from without will always lead to racism.

 

[Arc F1]

Well, yeah, essentially. The view is also sometimes referred to as 'benevolent prejudice' if you want another term, or 'positive discrimination'.
Granted, governments will always go for the "help the many, regardless of the few" mindset because it's easier, so that one can really just be called laziness.

I think a lot of what we are seeing now is coming from the lack of employment. Automation and offshore manufacturing is taking a toll on our country. People need someone to blame and racial tension will probably only get worse. The unemployment numbers don't tell the real story. So many are completely out of the work force.