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Where is a 7 year period mentioned in the book of Revelation?The only way that text in Luke would be relevant is if the OP topic was about marriage, and widowhood.
But the topic of the OP is about being "caught up" from 1 Thes.4:17. Therefore regardless of the marriage lasting 7 years, it's still erroneous to mention it AND claim that it's the only place in the new testament that speaks of a 7 year event.
Both of you are conveniently ignoring the new testament book of Revelation which is an extensive detail of the 70th week of Daniel.. a week being seven days, the original text indicating a week of years which amounts to 7 years. A prophetic topic.
No one said that it was a prophetic topic. He said it was the only place where a 7 year time period is mentioned in the New Testament, which is true.While the marriage, widowhood text is not a prophetic topic. So it's apparent that neither of you can actually read your Bibles in an exegetic manner in order to gain some relevant understanding.
He already came once long ago, so you're talking about a second coming and a third coming. Which is completely unbiblical. There is no basis whatsoever to see 1 Thess 4:13-17 as a separate event from Matthew 24:29-25:46 and Revelation 19:11-21. What you don't understand is that Paul was not done talking about the second coming at the end of 1 Thess 4. He talked about what will happen to believers at the second coming in 1 Thess 4:13-18 and what will happen to unbelievers at the second coming in 1 Thess 5.It is mine in that it is not yours of the Amil theology. However it is not mine as if to say that it isn't in the Bible. The pertinent Bible text(s) clearly reveal that aside from the birth of Jesus there are two comings.. that of 1 Thes.2:1, 4:17 (a first coming), and that of Rev.19:11-13, 16 (a second coming). Therefore has developed the theological term "Second Coming" of Christ which the disciples asked Jesus. "When shall be the sign of Your coming, and the end of the age?" (Mat.24:3).
No, I have never believed in a pretrib rapture. It never made any sense to me at all at any time.Since you give the scripture text below I am curious if you are like sovereigngrace says he is.. formerly of the pretrib rapture belief because below you post it, but then again since it is not of the second coming, but of the first.. I would have to conclude that you have never been formerly pretrib in your theology.
I have no idea what you're trying to say here. You are very unclear. I posted the passage to show that it speaks of "the coming of the Lord". There is only one future "coming of the Lord", so I didn't think I needed to explain that.I do wander then why you post it since you don't include any comments to indicate how you interpret the text.
Could it be that in spite of not believing it you still attempt to teach to a pretrib rapture student what is already known of, and more than you know of it..?
Here is how I interpret the passage you're referencing.
1 Thess 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
First of all, I see a lot of similarities in what is described there compared to what is described here:
Mark 13:24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, 25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken. 26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
I color coded each passage to show where I see the similarities. Both passages mention the coming of Christ from heaven. Both passages also mention a gathering of believers from heaven and a gathering of believers from earth. I believe the gathering of believers from "the uttermost part of heaven" are the souls of the dead in Christ which Jesus brings with Him as mentioned in 1 Thess 4:14.
Paul wrote about that here as well:
1 Thess 3:13 3 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.
The gathering of believers "from the uttermost part of the earth" is those who are alive and remain who are then caught up together with the bodily raised dead in Christ to meet the Lord in the air.
Thank you. I take that as a compliment.Really. The same text was already featured in one of sovereigngrace's posts to me. You two are like peas in a pod.
You just shared above that you see a first future coming of the Lord (1 Thess 4:13-17) and a second future coming of the Lord (Rev 19). His first coming happened long ago, obviously, so your 2 future comings of the Lord would be a second and third coming of the Lord, overall.Nope. As I've indicated to sovereigngrace on three occasions in three different posts.. I don't see any scripture to support the third coming that apparently someone else has at one time shared during a prior discussion with you or s.g.
You think that believers will be escorted by airplane to Christ? How can you expect to be taken seriously with an interpretation like that?The scripture text that you provide below is a reference to the second coming.
The similar text in Revelation can be found in Rev.6:12-13.
The event is in Rev.19:11-16.
That is regarding a means of angelic assisted translation as was done with Philip Acts.8:39.. or by conventional transportation of the elect which at His Coming are located in different nations all over the world. The text can refer to a use of airplanes.. as was historically done to transport the discovered descendants of Israel who had lived in Africa to Israel to live.
Where are you seeing that the gathering of the elect mentioned in Matthew 24:31 is a slow process? It does not say that. You bring a lot of assumptions and speculation into this that isn't warranted.For the Jews they have been for some years making the call for Jews living in other nations to return to Israel or at least come to Israel to make an Aliya. It was also done on the day of Pentecost as recorded in Acts 2:5-11.
There are those who mistakenly suppose that verse 31 is referring to a rapture but it clearly isn't for the word rapture with it's correct surrounding text implies a quick removal from the confines of the earth and to heaven. But, such an idea is not possible to conclude when reading it correctly.
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