Do the scriptures reveal there will be two different raptures for the saints?

[Deep Truth]

When you study the details of the rapture in Thessalonians and compare it to the rapture in Corinthians, it appears these scriptures are describing two distinct rapture events for the saints. And if this is true, then what do these two different raptures represent?

In the Bible, similar words and phrases are often used to connect one scripture with another in order to reveal a hidden meaning or prophecy. In other words, scripture interprets scripture; for example, the Word in John 1:1 is revealed in John 1:14. So with this in mind, let us carefully examine the rapture in Thessalonians and Corinthians to see if there are any word connected scriptures or stories that will give us deeper insight and understanding for the rapture of the saints.

The rapture in Thessalonians​

1 Th 4:15-17 For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep (died).​

• For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout (Mat 25:6, Psa 47:5),​
• with the voice of the archangel (Michael?, Jude 1:9),​
• and with the sound of the trumpet of God,​

And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive (in Christ by yielding to the Spirit, Rom 8:12-14), who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.​

The rapture shout from the Lord in 1 Thessalonians 4:16, is mentioned again when the 10 virgins heard a shout, 'Here is the bridegroom! Come out to meet him.' Which is a parable for the wise saints who have their lamps burning as a faithful witness for Christ that will be raptured to the heavenly wedding banquet by a shout from the Lord, before the tribulation begins (Mat 5:14-16, Zep 2:3, 1Th 5:2-4, Rev 3:10).

• Mat 25:5-6, 10 As the bridegroom was delayed, they all became drowsy and slept. (6) But at midnight there was a shout, 'Here is the bridegroom! Come out to meet him.'......(10) And while they (the foolish virgins) were going to buy (more oil for their lamps), the bridegroom came, and those (wise virgins) who were ready (with their lamps burning) went in with him to the marriage feast, and the door was shut.

The pre-tribulation rapture of the faithful saints is foreshadowed by Noah, a preacher of righteousness who entered the ark 7 days before the flood of God's judgment destroyed ungodly mankind. Which is prophetic for the obedient saints who will be raptured 7 years before God's final judgment of rebellious mankind takes place at the end of the tribulation, Gen 7:1-4, Heb 11:7, Mat 24:45-47, 2 Pet 2:5.

• Rev 3:10 Because you have kept my word about patient endurance, I will keep you from the hour of trial (the tribulation) that is coming on the whole world, to try those who dwell on the earth.
• Isaiah 26:20-21 Go, my people, enter your rooms and shut the doors behind you; hide yourselves for a little while until his wrath has passed by. (21) See, the Lord is coming out of his dwelling to punish the people of the earth for their sins.

However, the foolish saints whose lamps for Jesus are going out will be left behind in tribulation's darkness, where they will repent and refill their vessels with the Holy Spirit's oil so their lamps can burn again with the light of Christ for all to see (Psa 141:5a), so they may be ready when Jesus returns from the wedding feast for his left-behind tribulation saints, Luke 12:35-38, Mat 24:48-51, 25:1-13, Rev 16:15.

• Psalms 141:5a Let (Jesus) a righteous man strike me--it is a kindness; let him rebuke me (for my sin)--it is (the Spirit's) oil for my head (so my face may shine again with the light and love of Christ, see Psa 104:14-15); let my head not refuse it.

Jesus returns from the wedding feast to rapture his left-behind tribulation saints​

Luke 12:35-36, 39 "Stay dressed for action and keep your lamps burning (as a faithful witness for Christ), (36) and be like men who are waiting for their master to return from the wedding feast (in heaven), so that they may open the door to him at once when he comes and knocks......(38) If he comes in the second watch, or in the third (watch of the tribulation), and finds them awake, blessed are those servants! (39) But know this, that if the master of the house had known (in the past) at what hour the thief was coming (to rapture his wise saints in the first watch), he would not have left his house (and heart) to be broken into (by his sinful desires, Luke 21:34-36, Pro 25:26).​

​

Rev 16:15 "Behold, I am coming like a thief (to rapture my left-behind tribulation saints)! Blessed is the one who stays awake (by following my will), keeping his garments (of righteousness) on, that he may not go about naked (in his sinful flesh, Gal 5:16-17, Rev 3:17) and be seen exposed!"​

​

The shout from God that's followed by the sound of the trumpet when the princes of the peoples are gathered in Psalms 47:1-9, is a second example for the rapture of the faithful saints who will sing praises to God for their heavenly redemption.

Psalms 47:1-9, A Psalm of the Sons of Korah. Clap your hands, all peoples! Shout to God with loud songs of joy! (2) For the LORD, the Most High, is to be feared, a great king over all the earth. (3) He subdued peoples under us, and nations under our feet. (4) He chose our inheritance for us, the pride (excellency) of Jacob whom he loves. Selah.​

• (5) God has gone up with a shout (Mat 25:6, 1 Th 4:16), ​
• the LORD with the sound of a trumpet.​

(6) Sing praises to God, sing praises! Sing praises to our King, sing praises! (7) For God is the King of all the earth; sing praises with a psalm! (8) God reigns over the nations; God sits on his holy throne. (9) The princes of the peoples gather (when they are raptured to heaven) as the people of the God of Abraham. For (the righteous who walk by faith are) the shields of the earth (who) belong to God; he is highly exalted! (Psa 5:12, Eph 6:16)​

The faithful disciple John who was caught up in the spirit to heaven by a loud voice like a trumpet before he witnessed the events of the tribulation (Rev 1:9-10, 4:1-2), is the third example for the obedient saints who will be raptured by a shout from the Lord and the sound of the trumpet, before the tribulation begins.

The rapture of the saints in Corinthians​

However, the sound of the last trumpet which is the only detail that's mentioned regarding the rapture of the saints in Corinthians, which is similar and connected to the loud trumpet call when the elect (saints) are gathered after the tribulation of those days in Matthew 24:29-31, reveals the rapture in Corinthians represents the foolish saints that have hidden their light and will be left behind in the tribulation (Mat 5:14-16), who will not all sleep (die), but shall all be changed at the sound of the last trumpet.

• 1 Cor 15:51-52 Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep (die in the tribulation), but we shall all be changed, (52) in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead (tribulation saints) will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.​
• Mat 24:29-31 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken (30) Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (31) And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect (tribulation saints) from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. (these scriptures are repeated in Rev 6:9-17, 7:13-17)

The Thessalonians who were growing in faith and increasing in their love for one another that were considered worthy of the kingdom of God for which they were suffering, represent the wise saints who have their lamps burning for Christ and are not in darkness for the day of the Lord to surprise them like a thief (1Th 5:4, 2Th 1:3-5), when Jesus will rapture his faithful saints with a shout, the voice of the archangel, and the sound of the trumpet of God.

While the carnal Corinthians who were divided and tolerated sin in the church (1Cor 1:10-13, 5:1-5), are a type for the lukewarm saints who will miss the rapture and be disciplined by the Lord in the tribulation (Rev 3:1-3, 3:15-19), when they are handed over to Satan for the destruction of the sinful flesh, so the righteous spirit of God within these repentant saints may be saved in the day of the Lord, at the sound of the last trumpet.

• 1 Cor 5:1-5 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. (2) And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you. (3) For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. (4) When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, (5) you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord (the tribulation).

The rapture of the left-behind worldly tribulation saints is represented by righteous Lot who was persecuted by the wicked men of Sodom, that was told to flee from the city's coming destruction but hesitated to leave, when the two angelic men seized Lot's family by the hand and led them out since the Lord was merciful to him, just before God's wrath destroyed the sinful people of Sodom, Gen 19:1-29, Luke 17:28-33.

The two rapture harvests of the saints​

• The first-fruits of the spring barley harvest that are waved in the air (Lev 23:10-11),
• followed by the summer harvest of wheat that's cut down by the sickle (Rev 14:14-16),
• represents the faithful barley saints who will be caught up in the air to the heavenly wedding feast by a shout from the Lord (2Th 2:13, 1Th 4:16),
• while the foolish wheat saints will be left-behind to be persecuted (cut down) and purified in the summer heat of the tribulation (Mat 24:36-42, Rev 6:9-11, 20:4),
• where they will be waiting to be raptured when Jesus returns at the sound of the last trumpet, Luke 12:35-36, 1Cor 15:51-52, Rev 16:15.

The wise and foolish saints and their two separate rapture events are revealed in the following scriptures: Amos 7:1,
Barley first-fruit saints: 2Th 2:13, Rev 3:4, 10, Barley rapture - Rev 1:9-10, 4:1-2.
Summer wheat saints: Rev 3:1-3, 14-19, 6:9-11, 7:13-17, 14:14-16, Wheat rapture - Rev 16:15.

• Amos 7:1 This is what the Sovereign LORD showed me:
• He was preparing swarms of locusts (for demonic judgment in the tribulation, Rev 9:2-11)
• after the king’s share (of the faithful first-fruit saints, 2Th 2:13-17, James 1:1) had been harvested (by a shout from the Lord, Mat 25:6, 1Th 4:16, Rev 1:10, 4:1),
• and just as the latter crops (of summer wheat saints) were beginning to sprout (when God will separate the righteous from the wicked in the tribulation, Mat 13:36-43, Rev 14:14-20).

Summer is symbolic for the fiery heat of God's judgment in the tribulation
Rev 7:13-17, 16:8-9, Isa 4:2-4, 31:4-9, Zec 13:8-9​

• Dan 2:34-35 As you looked, a stone was cut out by no human hand, and it struck the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces. (35) Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold, all together were broken in pieces, and became like the chaff of the summer (tribulation) threshing floors; and the wind carried them away, so that not a trace of them could be found. But (Jesus) the stone that struck the image became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.
• Micah 7:1-2 Woe is me! For I have become as when the summer fruit (of tribulation saints) has been gathered (raptured), as when the grapes have been gleaned: there is no cluster to eat, no first-ripe fig that my soul desires. (2) The godly has perished (vanished) from the land, and there is no one upright among mankind; they all lie in wait for blood, and each hunts the other with a net.
• Amos 8:1-3 This is what the Lord GOD showed me: behold, a basket of summer fruit. (2) And he said, "Amos, what do you see?" And I said, "A basket of summer (tribulation) fruit." Then the LORD said to me, "The end has come upon my people Israel; I will never again pass by them.
• Jer 8:20 "The harvest (of saints) is past, the summer (of tribulation) is ended, and we are not saved."
• Mat 24:32 "From the fig tree (Israel, Hos 9:10), learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts out its leaves (when Israel becomes a nation in 1948), you know that (the) summer (heat of God's tribulation judgment) is near.
• Psalms 32:4-7 For day and night your hand was heavy upon me; my strength was dried up as by the (tribulation) heat of summer. Selah. (5) I acknowledged my sin to you, and I did not cover my iniquity; I said, "I will confess my transgressions to the LORD," and you forgave the iniquity of my sin. Selah.

My Rapture Dream is a Wake Up Call !!!

Rapture Dream! I was Left Behind!

• Acts 2:17-18 "'And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams; (18) even on my male servants and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit, and they shall prophesy.
• Amos 3:6-7 Is a trumpet blown in a city, and the people are not afraid? Does disaster come to a city, unless the LORD has done it? (7) "For the Lord GOD does nothing without revealing his secret to his servants the prophets.
• Eph 5:15-18 Look carefully then how you walk, not as unwise but as wise, (16) making the best use of the time, because the days are evil. (17) Therefore do not be foolish (saints), but understand what the will of the Lord is. (18) And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,

In the following articles I discuss the mystery of the rapture of the saints.
Will you be raptured in the first watch of the night?
Who are the sons of the kingdom cast into outer darkness?

Why will the first be last, and the last first?
Why are many called to the wedding banquet but few are chosen?

Will you be raptured to the feast of Abraham or left behind in Sodom?

In these articles I examine the scriptures that seem to be pointing to the years of 2031 to 2038 for the tribulation.
Part 1, Are the years of the tribulation hidden in scripture?
Part 2, 2 days, 7th hour, 38
Part 3, 2-38

The Ominous Sign of Four Blood Moons in 2032 and 2033

 

[RandyPNW]

When you study the details of the rapture in Thessalonians and compare it to the rapture in Corinthians, it appears these scriptures are describing two distinct rapture events for the saints. And if this is true, then what do these two different raptures represent?

The basis of the Rapture is the 2nd Coming, of the Coming of the Son of Man, which originates in Dan 7. Having a common origin in Scriptures, I seriously doubt there is any substantial evidence for "different Raptures."

The Son of Man comes down from heaven to establish God's Kingdom on the earth, in the face of Antichrist's opposition, who is called in Dan 7 the "Little Horn." Revelation goes to great lengths to describe this, as if to let all of Christianity know, throughout history, that Antichrists will somewhat prevail until the Kingdom of Christ is actually established. The Gospel will succeed, but opposition will temporarily succeed, as well.

When the Son of Man comes, it will be to bring victory to his suffering saints, gathering them into his Kingdom. Paul sees Christ coming back from heaven, just as he left for heaven. And as Christ ascended into heaven to obtain his glorious new body, so he will call up his saints to give them glorious new bodies, as well, so that they may join him in establishing his Kingdom and in regathering his people into their various nations.

In the Olivet Discourse Jesus speaks primarily of Israel's regathering, because at that time he was still speaking under the era of Law, where Israel was primarily viewed as God's exclusive people. But not long after the Cross, a great outreach began to convert many pagan nations to Christianity. And so, this great regathering, to take place at Christ's Coming, will regather not just Israel but many fallen nations who have fallen away from Christianity, just as Israel did.

In the Bible, similar words and phrases are often used to connect one scripture with another in order to reveal a hidden meaning or prophecy (John 1:1, John 1:14).

I see no "hidden meanings" in these passages?

The Rapture, or calling up of the saints at Christ's Coming, in 1 Thes 4 is the same as the Coming of the Son of Man in Dan 7 and in the Olivet Discourse. So is 1 Cor 15. Both passages focus on Christ's Coming and on the victory of the saints at that time, with particular emphasis on their resurrection and glorification.

1 Thes 4.16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

1 Cor 15.22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power.... 51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.

All of these passages are saying the same things, based on Dan 7, that the Son of Man is Coming from heaven to deliver his saints, to raise them from the dead and to give them immortality and eternal life with God. This will constitute the establishment of God's Kingdom on earth forever. There is nothing secretive about this, and nothing divergent between one passage and another, in my opinion.

 

[One God and Father of All]

The rapture includes both the living and the dead who are in Christ. It is therefore not to save them from the Anti-Christ. A dead person cannot be harmed by anyone anymore. All those in the past who will be raised to immortal life will be included in the rapture.
The rapture is for the purpose of bringing those with him to execute God’s judgments.

When God’s judgments are being executed on earth by Jesus and his raptured saints there will be what is called “the first resurrection” . This “first” resurrection comes some time after the rapture. There is no rapture for the living at the “first” resurrection. It is only a resurrection of dead ones who died during the tribulation and persecution of Anti-Christ and the beast of the sea of nations.

After the “first resurrection” of this time, all the faithful who have died in Christ will be ready to rule with Christ when his kingdom is established and the nations have been judged and ready to submit to Christs rule.

The ones in Christ who survive during this time are not raptured but remain mortal.

the immortal ones will operate in the kingdom in a way similar to how God’s angels operate now.
The mortal ones will operate in a way that God had originally intended His kingdom on earth to operate. And therefore the restoration.

 

[Clare73]

The rapture includes both the living and the dead who are in Christ. It is therefore not to save them from the Anti-Christ. A dead person cannot be harmed by anyone anymore. All those in the past who will be raised to immortal life will be included in the rapture.
The rapture is for the purpose of bringing those with him to execute God’s judgments.

When God’s judgments are being executed on earth by Jesus and his raptured saints there will be what is called “the first resurrection” . This “first” resurrection comes some time after the rapture. There is no rapture for the living at the “first” resurrection. It is only a resurrection of dead ones who died during the tribulation and persecution of Anti-Christ and the beast of the sea of nations.

After the “first resurrection” of this time, all the faithful who have died in Christ will be ready to rule with Christ when his kingdom is established and the nations have been judged and ready to submit to Christs rule.

The ones in Christ who survive during this time are not raptured but remain mortal.

the immortal ones will operate in the kingdom in a way similar to how God’s angels operate now.
The mortal ones will operate in a way that God had originally intended His kingdom on earth to operate. And therefore the restoration.

Apostolic teaching presents only one tribulation of the saints; i.e., the church age, and only one rapture of the saints i.e, at the resurrection.

 

[One God and Father of All]

Apostolic teaching presents only one tribulation of the saints; i.e., the church age, and only one rapture of the saints i.e, at the resurrection.

The tribulation of the saints is a tribulation of living mortals. It is not a tribulation for dead ones or for immortals. The rapture is a translation of the living to immortality and a resurrection of the dead to immortality. There is only one rapture. However, there is more than one resurrection. There is a resurrection at the rapture, a resurrection after the tribulation and a resurrection of those judged in contempt of Christ. They will experience a second death in the lake of fire.

 

[Clare73]

The tribulation of the saints is a tribulation of living mortals. It is not a tribulation for dead ones or for immortals. The rapture is a translation of the living to immortality and a resurrection of the dead to immortality.

No, according to NT apostolic teaching authoritative to the church, the rapture is the catching up (harpazo) of all the saints at the one and only resurrection at the end of time (that of the sheep and the goats),
to go up (out) to meet the Lord and accompany him back to earth (as they went out and accompanied him back into the city on Palm Sunday; i.e., parousia) for the final judgment.

There is only one rapture. However, there is more than one resurrection. There is a resurrection at the rapture, a resurrection after the tribulation and a resurrection of those judged in contempt of Christ. They will experience a second death in the lake of fire.

 

[One God and Father of All]

No, according to NT apostolic teaching authoritative to the church, the rapture is the catching up (harpazo) of all the saints at the one and only resurrection at the end of time (that of the sheep and the goats),
to go up (out) to meet the Lord and accompany him back to earth (as they went out and accompanied him back into the city on Palm Sunday; i.e., parousia) for the final judgment.

To say there is a first resurrection implies at least one another to follow. And so there is.

 

[One God and Father of All]

Rev 20:6Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

It‘s said that in the first resurrection the second death has no power. Which implies that in another resurrection the second death would have power.

Therefore, the first resurrection is of those who are to be made immortal and reign with Christ and the second resurrection is of those who will die a second death.

 

[Clare73]

To say there is a first resurrection implies at least one another to follow. And so there is.

The 1,000 years of Rev 20 is symbolic prophecy.
I see it as referring to the church age, where the first resurrection is the new birth from spiritual death to eternal life.

Do not treat interpretation of symbolic prophecy (as in bodily resurrection) as NT apostolic teaching authoritative to the church.

 

[RandyPNW]

The rapture includes both the living and the dead who are in Christ. It is therefore not to save them from the Anti-Christ. A dead person cannot be harmed by anyone anymore. All those in the past who will be raised to immortal life will be included in the rapture.
The rapture is for the purpose of bringing those with him to execute God’s judgments.

When God’s judgments are being executed on earth by Jesus and his raptured saints there will be what is called “the first resurrection” . This “first” resurrection comes some time after the rapture. There is no rapture for the living at the “first” resurrection. It is only a resurrection of dead ones who died during the tribulation and persecution of Anti-Christ and the beast of the sea of nations.

After the “first resurrection” of this time, all the faithful who have died in Christ will be ready to rule with Christ when his kingdom is established and the nations have been judged and ready to submit to Christs rule.

The ones in Christ who survive during this time are not raptured but remain mortal.

the immortal ones will operate in the kingdom in a way similar to how God’s angels operate now.
The mortal ones will operate in a way that God had originally intended His kingdom on earth to operate. And therefore the restoration.

We have some similarities in our views, and some differences. I tend to agree with you that the saints come back with Jesus to judge the earth. And then I think they'll exercise their dominion from heaven, like the angels do, until after the final judgment. We seem agreed on this.

I do think, however, that when Christ comes back it will be in part to save the saints from the abuses of Antichrist. That seems to be the message in 2 Thes 1-2. Obviously, those who have died in Christ are being saved from death, and not from the Antichrist. They're dead!

I do not separate the 1st Resurrection and the Rapture. To me they are the same thing. Christ comes back to save not just those beheaded by the Beast but also to save from death all those who have died in faith, and to deliver those still alive and being persecuted by the Beast.

Thanks for your thoughts. There is significant agreement between us.

 

[One God and Father of All]

We have some similarities in our views, and some differences. I tend to agree with you that the saints come back with Jesus to judge the earth. And then I think they'll exercise their dominion from heaven, like the angels do, until after the final judgment. We seem agreed on this.

I do think, however, that when Christ comes back it will be in part to save the saints from the abuses of Antichrist. That seems to be the message in 2 Thes 1-2. Obviously, those who have died in Christ are being saved from death, and not from the Antichrist. They're dead!

I do not separate the 1st Resurrection and the Rapture. To me they are the same thing. Christ comes back to save not just those beheaded by the Beast but also to save from death all those who have died in faith, and to deliver those still alive and being persecuted by the Beast.

Thanks for your thoughts. There is significant agreement between us.

My view, as a futurist, means my understanding of the book of Revelation is that it all takes place in the future. The events described all happen at the coming of Christ with his raptured saints. it’s the beginning of the end.
That’s why I separate the rapture from the first resurrection described in the book.
If the saints are to come with Christ they would have to be raptured so that they may come with him. it is those, whom I believe, are described as the 4 living creatures and 24 elders around the throne. They are Kings and priest. They are there when the Lamb takes the scroll containing the judgments to be executed.

The question then becomes: “How is it that all the saints can be raptured and resurrected and come with Christ if the book speaks of a first resurrection?”

My answer is that Christs coming is a two-fold event. At his coming he will rapture the saints. And at some point later he will come with them to execute the judgment’s written. By the time he comes with them, there will have been a developmenot of believers who go through the tribulation. And it is those who have died during that time who are the first resurrection. They also will reign with Christ when his kingdom gets established.

I think it’s important to notice that the first resurrection spoken of in Revelation speaks nothing of those believers who are still alive as is spoken of during the rapture

 

[One God and Father of All]

Rev 20:6Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

The word “first” as an adjective implies that there are others.

For example, if I say my first car was a Pontiac it implies I had other cars after that. “first” is an adjective.
”first” can also be used as a noun. If I said my Pontiac had a ”first” gear, then “first” is a noun.

Since “first” in the Greek is an adjective it implies others did follow

 

[Douggg]

1 rapture/resurrection event.

Referred to in...

Matthew 24:40-51

Luke 21:34-36

1Thessalonains4:15-18

1Thessalonians5:9-11

1Corinthians15:51-52

 

[Douggg]

For example, if I say my first car was a Pontiac it implies I had other cars after that. “first” is an adjective.
”first” can also be used as a noun. If I said my Pontiac had a ”first” gear, then “first” is a noun.

In that sentence, gear is a predicate nominative - i.e. a noun. "first" is an adjective. If you had wrote it as first-gear, hyphenated, then, yes ,"first-gear" would be a noun.

If you wrote... "My Pontiac had a dream." "dream" is a noun. The sentence itself, though, is an irrational statement.

If you wrote.... "When it comes to cars, my 1970 Pontiac was my first." In that sentence, first is a predicate adjective.

If you wrote.... "First is a word." "First" is a noun, the subject of the sentence. All words can actually be made a noun in a sentence of that sorts. For example, "Was is a word." Normally, "was" is a past tense verb.

 

[One God and Father of All]

In that sentence, gear is a predicate nominative - i.e. a noun. "first" is an adjective. If you had wrote it as first-gear, hyphenated, then, yes ,"first-gear" would be a noun.

If you wrote... "My Pontiac had a dream." "dream" is a noun. The sentence itself, though, is an irrational statement.

If you wrote.... "When it comes to cars, my 1970 Pontiac was my first." In that sentence, first is a predicate adjective.

If you wrote.... "First is a word." "First" is a noun, the subject of the sentence. All words can actually be made a noun in a sentence of that sorts. For example, "Was is a word." Normally, "was" is a past tense verb.

Yes, thank you. “first” in ”first gear” depends on “gear” in order to be a noun. Like you said it could be hyphenated as “first-gear”. But does not “first-gear” imply at least a second gear or another gear?

 

[One God and Father of All]

If I had part in the “first-resurrection” it implies that there is at least a seocd-resurrection. It would make no sense to say “first resurrection“ if there was none to follow. If there is to be only one resurrection, then I would say that they are to partake in the one or only resurrection and not the first resurrection. Or I might say that they are to partake in the resurrection without including the word “first”.

 

[One God and Father of All]

Therefore, to say “first resurrection “ means that there is a resurrection to follow the first. Which means that those who claim there is only one resurrection is false teaching.

 

[Douggg]

But does not “first-gear” imply at least a second gear or another gear?

Yes. More than one gear.

 

[One God and Father of All]

Yes. More than one gear.

I definitely agree. Happy are those who take part in the first resurrection because a second death has no power over them.
So what has power over those in the second resurrection? A second death, of course.

 

[RandyPNW]

My view, as a futurist, means my understanding of the book of Revelation is that it all takes place in the future. The events described all happen at the coming of Christ with his raptured saints. it’s the beginning of the end.
That’s why I separate the rapture from the first resurrection described in the book.
If the saints are to come with Christ they would have to be raptured so that they may come with him. it is those, whom I believe, are described as the 4 living creatures and 24 elders around the throne. They are Kings and priest. They are there when the Lamb takes the scroll containing the judgments to be executed.

The question then becomes: “How is it that all the saints can be raptured and resurrected and come with Christ if the book speaks of a first resurrection?”

My answer is that Christs coming is a two-fold event. At his coming he will rapture the saints. And at some point later he will come with them to execute the judgment’s written. By the time he comes with them, there will have been a developmenot of believers who go through the tribulation. And it is those who have died during that time who are the first resurrection. They also will reign with Christ when his kingdom gets established.

I think it’s important to notice that the first resurrection spoken of in Revelation speaks nothing of those believers who are still alive as is spoken of during the rapture

It's true that in the only place where "1st resurrection" is mentioned, nothing is said about believers who are still alive--at least not directly. But how can you say that those "given authority to judge" do not include those who had still been alive and granted immortality?

Rev 20.4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge.

This passage, in particular, focuses rightly on the deliverance of those who had been killed by the Beast. It is not ignoring those who survived, but rather, lauding those who had endured until death.

I also am a Futurist, but not of the Dispensationalist kind. I do not embrace the argument that in order for the glorified Church to return with Christ they must 1st have been "Raptured" 7 years earlier. This is how I often hear it described.

In my view, the Rapture of the Church, along with our glorification, is instantaneous. Therefore, we can immediately appear in heaven with Christ in the clouds as he begins his descent. This takes no time at all for God.

Rather than try to understand the mechanics of how God brings us from A to B, and then from B to A, why not just accept what Scripture teaches, that Christ is coming back to deliver the Church from the Beast and from Death?

As I've said many times now, all of this eschatology comes directly from Dan 7, where the Son of Man is portrayed as coming down from heaven, to establish God's Kingdom on the earth. There is no systematic break down in the process--it is just declared as something that will happen at some point in the future, all at once.

But you're welcome to form your own opinion. I will not respect you any less, since much of what you say is Bible.