Third Temple Scam in modern Jerusalem?

[nolidad]

I don't see an actual contrast in any of this post. This statement, "but the gospel has nothing to do with the New Covenant as written in the Scriptures" remains an unsubstantiated opinion.

Well if you believe I am wrong it should be easy for you and BAB to answer this question then. Show from the words of the New Covenant how the gospel today has fulfilled the provisions of the covenant?

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

I don't know of any other definition other than BABerean2's use of "now" (what's being labeled as "forcing it to mean something it does not")....so maybe that begs more explanation. What does "now" mean to you?
***Questions like this seem to come up often in discussions with futurists. "This" becomes "that" is another common futurist definition.

with all due respect, that is a load of horse manure!

Jesus is mediating the new covenant! where your problem lies is you seem to have forgotten what a mediator does. He is working with two sides to settles something! That means it is not completely settled yet!

What does now mean to me? the same as it does to most- "at this moment" so what does mediator mean to you? If it varies from this standard definition (same definition in greek for "mesites")

Defend why you disagree with it.





me·di·a·tor
/ˈmēdēˌādər/
Learn to pronounce

noun

1. a person who attempts to make people involved in a conflict come to an agreement; a go-between.

See I know that NOW Jesus is mediating the New covenant. Not with His Father but with people!
First in every age to the Jew and then to the gentiles!

As Paul said in romans 11 the Covenant belongs to Israel, we believers who are gentiles have become partakers of teh benefits of that covenant through faith in Jesus-partakers-not taker overs!

 

[nolidad]

Acts 2:5
Now there were dwelling(b) in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.
Peter said (in part - for the sake of space);

Acts 2:14-17
"Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and listen carefully to my words. 15These men are not drunk, as you suppose. It is only the third hour of the day!d 16No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:17‘In the last days, God says,

I will pour out My Spirit on all people.

And none of this is part and parcel of the new covenant!

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

If it is, above is the covenant,simply show us all here! It is just things god said would happen in the last days, and then you need to understand how Peter is interprewting this prophecy.

Betcha didn't know that Jews and the Apostles and Jesus used 4 ways of describing prophecy.

Acts 2
22Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. 23He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. 24But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.25David says about Him:

‘I sawf the Lord always before me;

because He is at my right hand, I will not be shaken.26Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices;

my body also will dwell in hope,27because You will not abandon my soul to Hades,

nor will You let Your Holy One see decay.28You have made known to me the paths of life;

You will fill me with joy in Your presence.’g
29Brothers, I can tell you with confidence that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that He would place one of his descendants on his throne.h 31Foreseeing this, David spoke about the resurrection of the Christ, that He was not abandoned to Hades, nor did His body see decay. 32God has raised this Jesus to life, to which we are all witnesses.33Exalted, then, to the right hand of God, He has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. 34For David did not ascend into heaven, but he himself says:

‘The Lord said to my Lord,

“Sit at My right hand35until I make Your enemies

a footstool for Your feet.” ’i

What is this lengthy quote trying to prove? God fulfilling the new covenant as he said He would? Not hardly!

36Therefore let all Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ!”

37When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”38Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39This promise belongs to you and your children and to all who are far off—to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”40With many other words he testified, and he urged them, “Be saved from this corrupt generation.” 41Those who embraced his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to the believers that day.j

And like I told BAB, Peter was not addressing the whole house of Israel and Judah vis-a-vis the New Covenant. He simply was making a declaration that all of Israel needed to know. No one with a lick of sense would believe Peter was addressing all Jews here in person!

 

[mkgal1]

And yes Jesus is mediating a better covenant!

I asked what covenant it is.

 

[mkgal1]

No you are not understanding my position.

I'd asked:

"ISTM - going by this post - you, personally, don't recognize anything related to the New Covenant going on in Acts 2....am I understanding your position?"​

.....and now you're responding with what I quoted. So....does that mean that you do recognize something related to the New Covenant going on in Acts 2?

 

[mkgal1]

when is the "after those days"?

The text I'm reading says:

Jeremiah 31
31 Behold, the days are coming...declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

"Hebrews 8 BSB" Hebrews 8 BSB​

 

[mkgal1]

Jesus is mediating the new covenant! where your problem lies is you seem to have forgotten what a mediator does. He is working with two sides to settles something! That means it is not completely settled yet!

Do you mean....now, He is mediating the New Covenant?

Mediator of a covenant isn't the same as a mediator in court. I appreciate the explanations in these videos:

"Video: The Covenants | BibleProject™" Video: The Covenants | BibleProject™​

In covenant language, the mediator is more of a translator between God and humanity. Noah was a mediator....Abraham was a mediator.....Moses was a mediator....King David was a mediator.....and finally, the only mediator that truly was able to fully and accurately translate between God and humanity....Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant.

Quoting the Bible Project:
In total, there are four Old Testament covenants—one with Noah, one with Abraham, one with the Israelites, and one with King David. All these covenants serve the purpose of creating a new partnership into which God can eventually invite all humankind. Unfortunately, Israel eventually breaks these covenants with God.

Nevertheless, throughout the Old Testament, prophets talked about a day when God would once again create a new covenant, one that would completely restore all the broken covenants that came before it. This new covenant was fulfilled by God's Son, Jesus Christ. - Covenants in the Bible | BibleProject™​

What does now mean to me? the same as it does to most- "at this moment" so what does mediator mean to you?

I answered your question about mediators above.

Earlier you implied that BABerean2 was using the word "now" to mean something it doesn't mean. But he was using the word "now" properly (and as you're now defining it to mean). So.....you now must agree this is fulfilled:

Hebrews 8:6
But now Jesus, our High Priest, has been given a ministry that is far superior to the old priesthood, for He is the one who mediates for us a far better covenant with God, based on better promises.​

 

[Oseas]

The text I'm reading says:

Jeremiah 31
31 Behold, the days are coming...declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
"Hebrews 8 BSB" Hebrews 8 BSB​

That prophecy of Jeremiah fulfilled LITERALLY around two thousand years ago in the Person of JESUS. But as is written-John 1:v.11-13:
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. (In fact they preferred Barabbas instead JESUS)
12 But as many as received Him (Jewish or Gentile), to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will o flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
​

 

[mkgal1]

And none of this is part and parcel of the new covenant!

I'd quoted Acts 2. None of it is of the New Covenant?

What's your interpretation of Jesus's words here. Where did this promise of the Father originate?

Luke 24:49
"And behold, I am sending the promise of My Father upon you. But remain in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.”​

 

[mkgal1]

No one with a lick of sense would believe Peter was addressing all Jews here in person!

So are we to believe that there's going to be a future gathering of all the generations of Jews together at one time?

 

[nolidad]

I asked what covenant it is.

C'mon how many times do I need to answer this silly question? NEW, Neuvo!

 

[nolidad]

I'd asked:

"ISTM - going by this post - you, personally, don't recognize anything related to the New Covenant going on in Acts 2....am I understanding your position?"​

.....and now you're responding with what I quoted. So....does that mean that you do recognize something related to the New Covenant going on in Acts 2?

Other than the invitation for jews to enter into the body- no!

If you think there is then here is the covenant again, just show me:

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

why do you keep dodging this simple request???????????????

 

[nolidad]

The text I'm reading says:

Jeremiah 31
31 Behold, the days are coming...declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

Actually you are citing a partial text, but I think you already know that.

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Verse 33 "after those days" defines "behold the days come" so when did the "after those days" happen for Israel in you scenario that says the new covenant is fulfilled.

I know you can answer if you try.

 

[nolidad]

Mediator of a covenant isn't the same as a mediator in court. I appreciate the explanations in these videos:

show a historical and factual difference.

 

[nolidad]

"Video: The Covenants | BibleProject™" Video: The Covenants | BibleProject™
In covenant language, the mediator is more of a translator between God and humanity. Noah was a mediator....Abraham was a mediator.....Moses was a mediator....King David was a mediator.....and finally, the only mediator that truly was able to fully and accurately translate between God and humanity....Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant.

prove it! Paul was not a moron and he knew the difference between tranlsator and mediator. He chose the word used in classic greek for one negotiating between two parties. Sorry but teh cutesy film says nothing.

 

[nolidad]

So are we to believe that there's going to be a future gathering of all the generations of Jews together at one time?

I have answered this for you several times already. I will not answer it anymore so you can seemingly ignore my answer if it suits you!

 

[nolidad]

I answered your question about mediators above.

Earlier you said that BABerean2 was using the word "now" to mean something it doesn't mean. But he was using the word "now" properly (and as you're now defining it to mean). So.....you now must agree this is fulfilled:

Hebrews 8:6
But now Jesus, our High Priest, has been given a ministry that is far superior to the old priesthood, for He is the one who mediates for us a far better covenant with God, based on better promises.

Well you misquote me when I write to you , so why am I not surprised you would pull my words out of tehre context in my discussion with BAB!

I wanted Him to show me the now of when the new covenant was fulfilled as inpired by god.

He hasn't responded, do you want a crack at it!

Here is Hebrews 8:

ut now Jesus, our High Priest, has been given a ministry that is far superior to the old priesthood, for He is the one who mediates for us a far better covenant with God, based on better promises

So now show me when the "NOW' was he fulfilled the new covenant defined by God:

ut now Jesus, our High Priest, has been given a ministry that is far superior to the old priesthood, for He is the one who mediates for us a far better covenant with God, based on better promises.

You and BAB should enter a twister contest. You would win. the way you twist and turn from answering teh questions and counter points I make to you is really breathtaking!

 

[mkgal1]

I asked what covenant it is.

C'mon how many times do I need to answer this silly question? NEW, Neuvo!

Because I still don't understand how you can believe that and also say the New Covenant isn't fulfilled nor does the Gospel have anything to do with the New Covenant. You've agreed this is the New Covenant the author was writing about:

Hebrews 8
The New Covenant
(Jeremiah 31:26–40)​

6Now, however, Jesus has received a much more excellent ministry, just as the covenant He mediates is better and is founded on better promises. 7For if that first covenant had been without fault, no place would have been sought for a second.​

 

[mkgal1]

I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

The forgiveness of ALL sin occurred on the Cross. There's only 1 covenant that promises that....and it's the New Covenant. There's only 1 time this will happen and that was 30 AD.

Peter explained this to those in covenant with God that were under the Mosaic covenant (the biblical ancient Israelites)....and their response was recorded for us in Acts 2. Here's an excerpt:

Acts 2
36Therefore let all Israel know with certainty that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ!”
37When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”38Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39This promise belongs to you and your children and to all who are far off—to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”40With many other words he testified, and he urged them, “Be saved from this corrupt generation.” 41Those who embraced his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to the believers that day.j
​

why do you keep dodging this simple request???????????????

I had answered it earlier (but I'm not digging for that post now).

 

[BABerean2]

Only until the event of Matthew 12 when the nation of Israel through its leaders committed the unpardonable sin!

REad all four gospels and you will see that after this event. Jesus no more sent out the disciples to declare the kingdom is at hand, nor did He announce the kingdom was at hand, nor did Jesus do miracles anymore openly and without the precondition of faith in Him!

He hid the kingdom from Israel and taught th emystery form to the disciples to prepare them to launch the church at Pentecost!

Was the Gospel taken to the Jews on the Day of Pentecost?


.

 

[BABerean2]

Well as I do not hold to a dual covenant theology- this statement of yours again is still worthless.

REally? I just checked my trash can and my bibles aren't there!

But instead of bearing false witness against a brother by your repeated false accusations and implications . For a change answer this that I have asked you multiple times:

Former Dispensationalist Jerry Johnson addresses your words above:

.