want to talk about OSAS?

[Bible Highlighter]

For purposes of having a discussion, we sometime need facts, reasoning, and evidence, not just "what I believe is...."

Granted, we do not even need to look at history, but all we have to do is look at our own Bibles.
Take for example John 10:28 that is commonly quoted by OSAS proponents. They fail to take into consideration the context that the kind of sheep that cannot be snatched out of his hand are the sheep that FOLLOW Jesus (as mentioned in verse 27). This means that we have to meet the conditon of following Jesus. We can be a believer but if we are not following Jesus, then we can be snatched out of His hand because the context of our Lord's words is only referring to sheep that hear His voice and follow Him and not lazy and or disobedient sheep. So it's not walk in the park.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

no you are presenting a caricature.

How so? Can you explain the difference of what you really believe vs. what I have said?
I doubt it. Usually phrases like these get thrown around a lot and yet there is no actual substance to them.

 

[Albion]

Here is a historical examination of Eternal Security.

That fellow really does seem to be confused when it comes to this subject.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

no you are presenting a caricature. like I said earlier if you want to leave calvin out I'm in otherwise I have no interest.

I have already posted verses to you before that did not refer to Calvin and you still have yet to address those verses. So no. You never really were in, unless you want to go back and deal with the verses I put forth to you before.

 

[Albion]

They fail to take into consideration the context that the kind of sheep that cannot be snatched out of his hand are the sheep that FOLLOW Jesus. This means that we have to meet the conditon of following Jesus.

Of course. I don't know anyone who argues that those who do not want Christ or believe in him are nevertheless guaranteed of salvation. Well, not unless we include Unitarian Universalists.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That fellow really does seem to be confused when it comes to this subject.

He is closer to the truth on this because the Bible actually warns against Eternal Security or sin and still be saved type belief. It started in the garden. Satan tried to tempt Eve that she would not die if she disobeyed God's command, and he succeeded.

 

[Jesus is YHWH]

I have already posted verses to you before that did not refer to Calvin and you still have yet to address those verses. So no. You never really were in, unless you want to go back and deal with the verses I put forth to you before.

And I gave you a myriad of them where Eternal Life is Never lost, no scripture states that once a person has eternal life it can be lost, removed or taken away.

Nothing you have posted so far has proven me wrong.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Of course. I don't know anyone who argues that those who do not want Christ or believe in him are nevertheless guaranteed of salvation. Well, not unless we include Unitarian Universalists.

So who then is saved? How can you tell?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

And I gave you a myriad of them where Eternal Life is Never lost, no scripture states that once a person has eternal life it can be lost, removed or taken away.

hope this helps !!!

I gave you the context and you did not address a single verse of the context I put forth to you (that refutes your wrong understanding on eternal life in the Bible). You did not bring forth any verse to help explain the verses I put forth to you, and neither did you offer any word for word commentary on those verses I provided. You just gave a broad brush stroke response of disagreement.

 

[Albion]

He is closer to the truth on this because the Bible actually warns against Eternal Security or sin and still be saved type belief. It started in the garden. Satan tried to tempt Eve that she would not die if she disobeyed God's command, and he succeeded.

So you are convinced that both Adam and Eve wound up in Hell?

 

[Albion]

So who then is saved? How can you tell?

You or I being able to "tell" is irrelevant to the issue. We can make a good guess if the person behaves like a heathen even while claiming to be a believer, but even that is a guess since we do not know the future.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So you are convinced that both Adam and Eve wound up in Hell?

Not at all, but I believed they died that very day as God said. Seeing they did not have immortality yet because they were prevented in eating of the tree of life that would have made them immortal, they died spiritually that day. They would have had to reconcile with God and seek forgiveness with Him in order to obtain grace and favor with Him. Yes, God also provided a sacrifice for them, as well.

 

[Albion]

Not at all, but I believed they died that very day as God said.

They didn't die that very day, but went on to work, have children, and live--just as Genesis records.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You or I being able to "tell" is irrelevant to the issue. We can make a good guess if the person behaves like a heathen even while claiming to be a believer, but even that is a guess since we do not know the future.

John sounded like he was sure that the brethren he wrote to had an assurance of their salvation.

“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.” (1 John 5:13).

In fact, he says this:

“And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.” (1 John 2:3).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

They didn't die that very day, but went on to work, have children, and live--just as Genesis records.

I did not say they physically died that day. That was my point. I said they died spiritually that day, and they needed to be reconciled with God afterwards in order to have spiritual life again.

 

[Jesus is YHWH]

I gave you the context and you did not address a single verse of the context I put forth to you (that refutes your wrong understanding on eternal life in the Bible). You did not bring forth any verse to help explain the verses I put forth to you, and neither did you offer any word for word commentary on those verses I provided. You just gave a broad brush stroke response of disagreement.

nothing you posted about Eternal Life refuted my position and proved it could be lost, to the contrary my position still stands, its eternal, never ends.

 

[Albion]

John sounded like he was sure that the brethren he wrote to had an assurance of their salvation.

I wouldn't say that, but it does look as though he believes in Eternal Security!

“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.” (1 John 5:13).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

nothing you posted about Eternal Life refuted my position and proved it could be lost, to the contrary my position still stands, its eternal, never ends.

Again, your just not getting it. Your post of disagreement is not proof of anything unless you can substantiate your claims with Scripture and by explaining the verses I put forth to you. It seems your not getting it, so it's best you simply move on. Just hitting the disagree button does not prove your right.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I wouldn't say that, but it does look as though he believes in Eternal Security!

Why would you say that? What is your word for word commentary on 1 John 5:13 and 1 John 2:3? How do you understand these verses?

As for the apostle John believing in Eternal Security? That's a joke. 1 John 3:15 says that everyone who hates his brother is like a murderer, and no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. So are you saying that no born again believer can accidentally at any point hate his brother? To hate one's brother can be done in several ways.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God essentially said that Adam would die in the day he would eat of the wrong tree.
But Adam did not die physically that day and neither did he lose any form of immortality, either.
For Adam had to eat of the tree of life in order to be immortal.
So Adam died spiritually the day he disobeyed God.
The devil was trying to sell Eve on the lie that she could disobey God's command and not die.
This same lie is being pushed today.
This is proof that Eternal Security is false.

 

[Albion]

As for the apostle John believing in Eternal Security? That's a joke. 1 John 3:15 says that everyone who hates his brother is like a murderer, and no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.

What does that have to do with Eternal Security of the believer?