Ask God for Me

[miknik5]

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[Clizby WampusCat]

Indeed. I left the faith reluctantly perhaps even unwillingly. I left my family and friends dismayed. I lost some of those friends. This was not something I chose. It's what I had to do to maintain my integrity.

I did not want to be an atheist. I think theists don't think about what it would be like to not believe and everyone you know does believe and now looks at you as a project or with pity.

 

[miknik5]

It wasn´t a dream, sir...
And these things were not from a god...but they were indeed from a different spirit...

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You continually say that but never will answer specific questions about it. Tell me, what evidence convinces you that the information within a cell is not evidence for the intelligence of God?

Again I don't have to provide evidence against the claim that cells are designed. You making the claim needs to provide evidence that it is designed. And saying it appears designed is not convincing.

 

[miknik5]

I did not want to be an atheist. I think theists don't think about what it would be like to not believe and everyone you know does believe and now looks at you as a project or with pity.

You did believe...but you thought you were wiser and shouldn´t believe..

Don´t you know what the scripture says regarding the WISDOM of GOD?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You were willing at one time to believe that there is a supernatural, spiritual realm and spirits....you even had physical evidence to support this...

I was not willing to believe I was convinced God existed. I realized the evidence I had was insufficient for belief, I became unconvinced. I did not choose to not believe.

Yet, you do not believe that in there is ONE GOD and ONE TRUTH...in the midst of the confusion of this enemy?

Provide evidence that there is an enemy.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You did believe...but you thought you were wiser and shouldn´t believe..

No. I realized that the evidence did not warrant a belief.

Don´t you know what the scripture says regarding the WISDOM of GOD?

Yes, now give me a reason to believe it is true.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

It wasn´t a dream, sir...
And these things were not from a god...but they were indeed from a different spirit...

Can you give me your reasons for believing they were from a spirit?

 

[Oncedeceived]

Yes, I find it unconvincing because intelligence is not the only way for cells to come about. And given that existence of what appear to be serious flaws in life forms, I doubt that a great intelligence is responsible.

I am speaking about the information in cells.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Again I don't have to provide evidence against the claim that cells are designed. You making the claim needs to provide evidence that it is designed. And saying it appears designed is not convincing.

Again, you seem to be missing the point The evidence in the cell is information and the code. So if you find it unconvincing there must be something that has convinced you that something other than intelligence could explain the information (which again is a mind produced element) in the cell.

 

[Oncedeceived]

That is the point. I don't know but if God does exist there should be evidence He could give me that would convince me that he does.

Yes, He could but He won't because you want to make God jump through your self proclaimed hoops and God created you not the other way around.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Again, you seem to be missing the point The evidence in the cell is information and the code. So if you find it unconvincing there must be something that has convinced you that something other than intelligence could explain the information (which again is a mind produced element) in the cell.

No. This is not how it works. I don't need to have an explanation to not believe your explanation.

What is your criteria to determine something is designed over something that was not designed?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Yes, He could but He won't because you want to make God jump through your self proclaimed hoops and God created you not the other way around.

Ok, this is convenient. I guess God's pride won't let him convince me he exists.

 

[miknik5]

Can you give me your reasons for believing they were from a spirit?

Can you refer back to your OWN post, sir...
You KNEW what you knew when it first happened...time went on, and you convinced yourself what your first instict was, might have been incorrect.

A blue head and a daughter describing her friend?

Don´t you recall these events?

And not only that sir, you and your wife prayed for your daughter, and her friend no longer bothered her.

Who do you think you prayed to? Who do you think protected your daughter and yourself because you cried out to HIM?

 

[miknik5]

Stop being angry with GOD.
You are trying to capture a weak and immature faith sir based on your lower carnal feelings and emotions.

 

[Oncedeceived]

No. This is not how it works. I don't need to have an explanation to not believe your explanation.

What is your criteria to determine something is designed over something that was not designed?

We aren't playing by some atheist handbook here. If you are being honest we should be able to assume that those things that are convincing to a Christian don't convince you because you have more sufficient evidence to counter those. So being a person that needs to have sufficient evidence before you believe something must by your very nature believe something that has sufficient evidence in regard to my questions.

When something appears designed as is stated by Scientists the world over, there is a reason they believe it appears designed. If we didn't recognize design, Scientists would not claim it appears to be designed.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Ok, this is convenient. I guess God's pride won't let him convince me he exists.

God will not bend to your will, it goes the other way around. You are too prideful to accept evidence that supports Him, why then would He be beholden to you to MAKE you believe in Him?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Can you refer back to your OWN post, sir...
You KNEW what you knew when it first happened...time went on, and you convinced yourself what your first instict was, might have been incorrect.

A blue head and a daughter describing her friend?

Don´t you recall these events?

Of course, I am not denying that they happened. In both of these events there was only one person that saw something and others in the same room did not. I am not saying these events did not happen only that there is insufficient evidence to believe that they did.

And not only that sir, you and your wife prayed for your daughter, and her friend no longer bothered her.

Who do you think you prayed to? Who do you think protected your daughter and yourself because you cried out to HIM?

This is cherry picking isn't it. I have prayed thousands of time for my wife's chronic condition and the only people that have ever helped were doctors through scientists/engineers etc. If you want to claim that this prayer to God worked is evidence of gods existence then you also must believe the unanswered prayers is evidence against his existence.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

God will not bend to your will, it goes the other way around. You are too prideful to accept evidence that supports Him, why then would He be beholden to you to MAKE you believe in Him?

I know you need to believe this to keep your theology intact but it is not simply the case.

What if I said "You are too prideful to accept the evidence that supports Allah as the true God"?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

We aren't playing by some atheist handbook here. If you are being honest we should be able to assume that those things that are convincing to a Christian don't convince you because you have more sufficient evidence to counter those. So being a person that needs to have sufficient evidence before you believe something must by your very nature believe something that has sufficient evidence in regard to my questions.

No. My answer is I don't know. Please stop accusing me of being dishonest.

When something appears designed as is stated by Scientists the world over, there is a reason they believe it appears designed. If we didn't recognize design, Scientists would not claim it appears to be designed.

So what is the criteria to tell if something is designed or not? If I have a rock, how do I know if it is designed or got here naturally?