Subduction Zone
Regular Member
Is it? That would be hard to prove. I am not saying that the universe has to exist, but we do not know if it is possible for it not to exist.Because its possible for the universe not to exist.
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Is it? That would be hard to prove. I am not saying that the universe has to exist, but we do not know if it is possible for it not to exist.Because its possible for the universe not to exist.
P.S.
BUT THEY BETTER HURRY UP!
I don't agree. For one thing, too many scientists believe in God themselves. I think you have fallen victim to creationist propaganda: that if you don't agree with an Evangelical Protestant literal interpretation of Genesis you must be an atheist.Oh, but I see a concerted effort to prove there is no God,,,rather than an honest effort to come to some conclusion...(although this is happening anyway).
I just brought up Newton because science ASSUMED there was a God .... What about Galileo....he was imprisoned for discovering that the earth was not the center of the universe (or what was known of it at that time)....however, he did believe in God.
I think that today, science does mean to prove there is no God. That does not leave the science community with an open mind.
It depends how one defines 'nothing'. It may be impossible for 'nothing' to exist in our universe. There is a lot that we do not know. If you read the book "A Universe From Nothing" you can see how the universe arising from no mass and no volume does not violate the laws of physics. Or if you wish there is a synopsised one hour video of it that you can watch on YouTube.I reread it.
Right...NOT EVERYTHING REQUIRES A CAUSE...
The first cause cannot possibly have a cause or it woudn't be the first cause...
As to options...what would another option be?
1. Something coming from nothing.
2. A deity.
3......?
That is a misrepresentation of his position. As a Christian you should know better. He does not look like the desperate one here. Misrepresenting what others claim is not a wise debating technique.LOL
I could agree with that...
but it works both ways!
Look at Lawrence Krauss....
He's decided that nothing is something!
How desperate does one have to be?
Oh, but I see a concerted effort to prove there is no God,,,rather than an honest effort to come to some conclusion...(although this is happening anyway).
I just brought up Newton because science ASSUMED there was a God .... What about Galileo....he was imprisoned for discovering that the earth was not the center of the universe (or what was known of it at that time)....however, he did believe in God.
I think that today, science does mean to prove there is no God. That does not leave the science community with an open mind.
Hey OldWiseGuy,
I love the story of Adam and Eve and am most willing to learn anything new about it. There is so much to glean from the story.
But, this just isn't the place....
I'm confused to tell you the truth....
Was the snake an angel that became a snake?
Do we not know what it was?
I DO understand that the snake represented evil in those times...
I took the red pill.Are you familiar with Last Thursdayism? How do you know god did not create everything last Thursday with all memories embedded? How does one measure god's involvement?
If you have to account for the supernatural in everything, you cannot learn anything. Literally every observation could be illusion.
This is possible...however, what I'm hearing is concerning an ID...not God as how a fundamentalist might think of Him. Just an intelligent design.I don't agree. For one thing, too many scientists believe in God themselves. I think you have fallen victim to creationist propaganda: that if you don't agree with an Evangelical Protestant literal interpretation of Genesis you must be an atheist.
No SZ,,,,I was not talking about how nothing may be impossible to exist in our universe. All we see exists in our universe.It depends how one defines 'nothing'. It may be impossible for 'nothing' to exist in our universe. There is a lot that we do not know. If you read the book "A Universe From Nothing" you can see how the universe arising from no mass and no volume does not violate the laws of physics. Or if you wish there is a synopsised one hour video of it that you can watch on YouTube.
Oh...I didn't know I was debating!That is a misrepresentation of his position. As a Christian you should know better. He does not look like the desperate one here. Misrepresenting what others claim is not a wise debating technique.
Krauss's point that if one defines "nothing" as no matter and no space that a universe from nothing is not impossible. "Nothing" may be an impossible state.
God cannot be DISPROVED.If anyone practicing science assumed that there was a God they were just as wrong as those that assume that there is no God. And I do not see anyone trying to disprove God. At the most they only show that there is no need for a God. That is not the same as disproving God.
I took the red pill.
BUT,,, who can know for sure?
Maybe we're just one big video game and some kid is having a lot of fun?
God's involvement cannot be measured.
If He didn't do all this...I think we're in some kind of trouble.
When YOU say measured....If god's involvement cannot be measured, does it therefore not make sense to exclude any such value when considering an observation?
When YOU say measured....
you must mean SCIENTIFICALLY.
If not, I apologize.
God's involvement can be measured FOR ME because I believe in a spiritual being that created everything...His name is God...the God of the bible.
So my observation is that HE created everything...
but MY observation has no value to YOU....
so I try to keep MY God out of these discussions since they should be scientific discussions.
I mean, I'm not here to discuss my Christianity.
Is this wrong in your opinion?
The point is that "nothing" in and out of our universe may be a nonexistent state. It is physically impossible in our universe, even a perfect vacuum has countless virtual particles in it.No SZ,,,,I was not talking about how nothing may be impossible to exist in our universe. All we see exists in our universe.
I was talking about BEFORE the universe came to be....
we CANNOT KNOW what nothing is....
Is it a white space..that would be something...
We just cannot know what NOTHING is.
God cannot be DISPROVED.
He can only be proved.
But I agree with your statement:
If anyone practicing science assumed that there was a God they were just as wrong as those that assume that there is no God.
And you said you do not see ANYONE trying to disprove God...
Krauss is one....
Really, you cannot say ANYONE, because it would not be true...there is ALWAYS someone.
I know.The point is that "nothing" in and out of our universe may be a nonexistent state. It is physically impossible in our universe, even a perfect vacuum has countless virtual particles in it.