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LDS Mormonism and Non-Mormons

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Whether the proxy baptism will be accepted or not is not up to the one doing the ordinance. However the gospel is taught to the dead:

(New Testament | 1 Peter 4:6)

6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
Your ordained ministers do no have the authority to baptize the dead. God alone can baptize the dead, because baptism is inseparable from the teaching of Christ, as Christ's own giving of the great commission indicates: “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” (Matthew 28:18-19)

So now you see it. Christ God is not only in Heaven, at the right hand of the Father, but He is also here with us always at the same time, because He is "everywhere present and filling all things with Himself". You also can see that the command to baptize includes the command to teach them to obey Christ's commandments. These things MUST go together. We do not have the ability, regardless of our priestly status, to teach the dead anything. Since therefor, we cannot teach them to obey all that Christ has commanded us, we cannot baptize them either.

God alone can baptize the dead, because He alone has the ability to teach them after they are deceased. Do you want to continue to take matters that God alone can address into your own hands? Oh, arrogance without bounds, when wilt thou cease to corrupt the hearts of evil men?!!!
 
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dzheremi

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I have shown over and over that Paul used baptism for the dead as a resource for teaching about the resurrection. Both the resurrection and baptism for the dead are taught by Paul.:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 15:27 - 29)

27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

Since Mormonism claims to be the restoration of the ancient Christian Church which was somehow taken from the earth (despite Christ's promise that it would not be defeated), it behooves us all to look yet again at what the early Church actually said when it came to these verses, and whether or not they took them to be endorsing the practice of baptizing dead people (either by proxy as Mormons do, or in any other way).

Spoiler alert: the answer is no. That's why no Christian church does so today. It's a practice of heretics of the past, which Christians know better than to follow or continue.

From his 40th homily on 1 Corinthians, St. John Chrysostom (d. 407) observes, regarding the phrase "baptized for the dead" and how some people ran with it:

What then is that which he means? Or will you that I should first mention how they who are infected with the Marcionite heresy pervert this expression? And I know indeed that I shall excite much laughter; nevertheless, even on this account most of all I will mention it that you may the more completely avoid this disease: viz., when any Catechumen departs among them, having concealed the living man under the couch of the dead, they approach the corpse and talk with him, and ask him if he wishes to receive baptism; then when he makes no answer, he that is concealed underneath says in his stead that of course he should wish to be baptized; and so they baptize him instead of the departed, like men jesting upon the stage. So great power has the devil over the souls of careless sinners. Then being called to account, they allege this expression, saying that even the Apostle has said, "They who are baptized for the dead." Do you see their extreme ridiculousness?

+++

And regarding its true meaning, the great saint instructs:

But first I wish to remind you who are initiated of the response , which on that evening they who introduce you to the mysteries bid you make; and then I will also explain the saying of Paul: so this likewise will be clearer to you; we after all the other things adding this which Paul now says. And I desire indeed expressly to utter it, but I dare not on account of the uninitiated; for these add a difficulty to our exposition, compelling us either not to speak clearly or to declare unto them the ineffable mysteries. Nevertheless, as I may be able, I will speak as through a veil.

As thus: after the enunciation of those mystical and fearful words, and the awful rules of the doctrines which have come down from heaven, this also we add at the end when we are about to baptize, bidding them say, I believe in the resurrection of the dead, and upon this faith we are baptized. For after we have confessed this together with the rest, then at last are we let down into the fountain of those sacred streams. This therefore Paul recalling to their minds said, "if there be no resurrection, why are you then baptized for the dead ?" i.e., the dead bodies. For in fact with a view to this are you baptized, the resurrection of your dead body, believing that it no longer remains dead. And thou indeed in the words makest mention of a resurrection of the dead; but the priest, as in a kind of image, signifies to you by very deed the things which you have believed and confessed in words. When without a sign you believe, then he gives you the sign also; when you have done your own part, then also does God fully assure you. How and in what manner? By the water. For the being baptized and immersed and then emerging, is a symbol of the descent into Hades and return thence. Wherefore also Paul calls baptism a burial, saying, "Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death." (Romans 6:4) By this he makes that also which is to come credible, I mean, the resurrection of our bodies. For the blotting out sins is a much greater thing than the raising up of a body. And this Christ declaring, said, "For whether is easier to say, Your sins are forgiven, or to say, Take up your bed, and walk?" (Matthew 9:5) "The former is the more difficult," says He, "but since you disbelieve it as being hidden, and make the easier instead of the more difficult the demonstration of my power, neither will I refuse to afford you this proof." Then says He to the paralytic, "Arise, take up your bed, and go unto your house."

+++

This is the proper understanding, and there is no other in the historical Christian church, nor in those who claim descent from it with any degree of historical backing, and I can say this with a high degree of confidence that does not rely on one man only (St. John Chrysostom just happens to be the only one I know that has been translated to English who contrasts the true teaching with the practices of those who do not interpret it correctly, so his words are closest to our situation when talking to Mormons about how this belief and practice is wrong), in light of the fact that there are Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and Oriental Orthodox posters posting here, and we all -- together with our Protestant friends -- agree that the Mormon practice and justification is absolutely bankrupt and without merit, and contrary to what we actually find when we look for evidence either for or against Mormon claims in the actual preserved writings of the early Christian church.

It's not a part of Christianity, and never has been. It's at best a part of various Gnostic sects which are so incredibly bizarre and off-base that St. John the Golden-Mouthed basically says that they are laughable. Consider that: apparently this understanding that led to baptizing actual dead people was so obviously wrong to the early Church that they would laugh about it. While I would have a hard time laughing at Mormonism's practice (because I don't think it's funny that millions of people are deceived into following Gnosticism under the guise of 'restored' Christianity), I can definitely see why the people who did this stuff were objects of ridicule for early Christians. It is almost like a parody by inversion of what the actual Christian Church does.
 
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mmksparbud

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Whether the proxy baptism will be accepted or not is not up to the one doing the ordinance. However the gospel is taught to the dead:

(New Testament | 1 Peter 4:6)

6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

You do not understand the gospel---you can't, you turned a deaf ear to the Holy Spirit by accepting JS --the gospel was preached to the dead---it means those that are dead in sins! They live in Jesus!!


Eph_2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph_2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Col_2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
1Pe_2:24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
Rev_1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
 
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He is the way

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The Holy Prophet King David said that if he were to go down to Sheol, God would be there. You should have read his Psalm verse that I included with my last post, then you would also know, as God's true prophet, King David knows, that God is indeed everywhere present, and fills all things. Here are the Scriptures again: (Psalms 139:7-12) (Jeremiah 23:23-24)

Try to imagine this: spiritual states of being are referred to in the form of physical "places", but these are only metaphors that point to the nature of the spiritual states. They are not literal places. God does not dwell on a planet somewhere in outer space. God dwells everywhere, and is in all places at all times, filling all things with Himself.

The only thing standing in the way of journeying into the Kingdom of Heaven, by way of the narrow way, is sin. Sin prevents Communion with God, because it is a freewill choice to turn aside from the narrow way in order to commune with sin instead of Communing with God. That is why Christ taught us not to look for the Kingdom of heaven anywhere other than within our own hearts, because within our own hearts is where the Kingdom of Heaven dwells, because the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit come to make their home in our hearts when we "abide in Him", by turning away from sin and drawing near to God in repentance.

But what would you know about any of that? Your God resides not in your heart, but far away on some distant world, somewhere in this universe he created because gods like him grow to have the power to create universes and the like. This is a completely different sort of god than the God of Orthodox Christians, Who is the God of the Bible.
You said: "The only thing standing in the way of journeying into the Kingdom of Heaven, by way of the narrow way, is sin."

And the way to remove the sin and become a new person is through baptism:

(New Testament | Romans 6:3 - 6)

3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.


(New Testament | 1 Peter 3:21 - 22)

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.
 
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He is the way

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Paul used the memorial shrine to the pagan "Unknown god" to talk to pagans about Jesus Christ's Gospel to convince them to believe in Christ. Paul did not, however, say that they ought to worship the pagan unknown God. Talking about something and doing it are two different things.
Who were these pagans?
 
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He is the way

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Your ordained ministers do no have the authority to baptize the dead. God alone can baptize the dead, because baptism is inseparable from the teaching of Christ, as Christ's own giving of the great commission indicates: “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” (Matthew 28:18-19)

So now you see it. Christ God is not only in Heaven, at the right hand of the Father, but He is also here with us always at the same time, because He is "everywhere present and filling all things with Himself". You also can see that the command to baptize includes the command to teach them to obey Christ's commandments. These things MUST go together. We do not have the ability, regardless of our priestly status, to teach the dead anything. Since therefor, we cannot teach them to obey all that Christ has commanded us, we cannot baptize them either.

God alone can baptize the dead, because He alone has the ability to teach them after they are deceased. Do you want to continue to take matters that God alone can address into your own hands? Oh, arrogance without bounds, when wilt thou cease to corrupt the hearts of evil men?!!!
God shares His authority with others. See post #510.
 
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Jamesone5

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Having been a member of The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints for most of my life and having diligently sought God through supplication, I have experienced increased knowledge from many resources.

Try being a Member from birth to age 40, like I have.

Yes, I recognize the tricks you often do such as this "knowing thing' instead of believing---as I used to unwittingly do that myself. I think the term used before is "through eye of faith that you supposedly know"- btw. And, many of my family are still in the Church, although a few like me have denied it.

My genealogy can be traced back to Joseph Smith himself, in sealed marriage to one of my very distant grandmothers. So really, my step, great [X4] grandfather started this deception and I am going to do my part in bringing people out --- to the True Christ.

Only God can break through that foolish pride you have accumulated in being a Member of what is referred to [by only Mormons] as the ONE True Chruch that you think you "know" to be True.

Many Members leave and then become atheist or at least very agnostic. Only God's Grace could have brought me to the True Christ, that is not attached to any particular man-made Religion.

You can heed the warnings of course OR keep at this deception which will only get worse the more you are in it. No one can control your choices you make.
 
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Jamesone5

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You know fine well that baptism for the dead is taught by Paul and is mentioned as a defense for the resurrection. Members of The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints are taught correct principles.

No it is NOT taught by Paul, just a tiny reference to the practice in 1 Corinthians 15:29.

And I would appreciate that you NOT tell me what I supposedly know fine well.
 
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He is the way

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Since Mormonism claims to be the restoration of the ancient Christian Church which was somehow taken from the earth (despite Christ's promise that it would not be defeated), it behooves us all to look yet again at what the early Church actually said when it came to these verses, and whether or not they took them to be endorsing the practice of baptizing dead people (either by proxy as Mormons do, or in any other way).

Spoiler alert: the answer is no. That's why no Christian church does so today. It's a practice of heretics of the past, which Christians know better than to follow or continue.

From his 40th homily on 1 Corinthians, St. John Chrysostom (d. 407) observes, regarding the phrase "baptized for the dead" and how some people ran with it:

What then is that which he means? Or will you that I should first mention how they who are infected with the Marcionite heresy pervert this expression? And I know indeed that I shall excite much laughter; nevertheless, even on this account most of all I will mention it that you may the more completely avoid this disease: viz., when any Catechumen departs among them, having concealed the living man under the couch of the dead, they approach the corpse and talk with him, and ask him if he wishes to receive baptism; then when he makes no answer, he that is concealed underneath says in his stead that of course he should wish to be baptized; and so they baptize him instead of the departed, like men jesting upon the stage. So great power has the devil over the souls of careless sinners. Then being called to account, they allege this expression, saying that even the Apostle has said, "They who are baptized for the dead." Do you see their extreme ridiculousness?

+++

And regarding its true meaning, the great saint instructs:

But first I wish to remind you who are initiated of the response , which on that evening they who introduce you to the mysteries bid you make; and then I will also explain the saying of Paul: so this likewise will be clearer to you; we after all the other things adding this which Paul now says. And I desire indeed expressly to utter it, but I dare not on account of the uninitiated; for these add a difficulty to our exposition, compelling us either not to speak clearly or to declare unto them the ineffable mysteries. Nevertheless, as I may be able, I will speak as through a veil.

As thus: after the enunciation of those mystical and fearful words, and the awful rules of the doctrines which have come down from heaven, this also we add at the end when we are about to baptize, bidding them say, I believe in the resurrection of the dead, and upon this faith we are baptized. For after we have confessed this together with the rest, then at last are we let down into the fountain of those sacred streams. This therefore Paul recalling to their minds said, "if there be no resurrection, why are you then baptized for the dead ?" i.e., the dead bodies. For in fact with a view to this are you baptized, the resurrection of your dead body, believing that it no longer remains dead. And thou indeed in the words makest mention of a resurrection of the dead; but the priest, as in a kind of image, signifies to you by very deed the things which you have believed and confessed in words. When without a sign you believe, then he gives you the sign also; when you have done your own part, then also does God fully assure you. How and in what manner? By the water. For the being baptized and immersed and then emerging, is a symbol of the descent into Hades and return thence. Wherefore also Paul calls baptism a burial, saying, "Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death." (Romans 6:4) By this he makes that also which is to come credible, I mean, the resurrection of our bodies. For the blotting out sins is a much greater thing than the raising up of a body. And this Christ declaring, said, "For whether is easier to say, Your sins are forgiven, or to say, Take up your bed, and walk?" (Matthew 9:5) "The former is the more difficult," says He, "but since you disbelieve it as being hidden, and make the easier instead of the more difficult the demonstration of my power, neither will I refuse to afford you this proof." Then says He to the paralytic, "Arise, take up your bed, and go unto your house."

+++

This is the proper understanding, and there is no other in the historical Christian church, nor in those who claim descent from it with any degree of historical backing, and I can say this with a high degree of confidence that does not rely on one man only (St. John Chrysostom just happens to be the only one I know that has been translated to English who contrasts the true teaching with the practices of those who do not interpret it correctly, so his words are closest to our situation when talking to Mormons about how this belief and practice is wrong), in light of the fact that there are Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and Oriental Orthodox posters posting here, and we all -- together with our Protestant friends -- agree that the Mormon practice and justification is absolutely bankrupt and without merit, and contrary to what we actually find when we look for evidence either for or against Mormon claims in the actual preserved writings of the early Christian church.

It's not a part of Christianity, and never has been. It's at best a part of various Gnostic sects which are so incredibly bizarre and off-base that St. John the Golden-Mouthed basically says that they are laughable. Consider that: apparently this understanding that led to baptizing actual dead people was so obviously wrong to the early Church that they would laugh about it. While I would have a hard time laughing at Mormonism's practice (because I don't think it's funny that millions of people are deceived into following Gnosticism under the guise of 'restored' Christianity), I can definitely see why the people who did this stuff were objects of ridicule for early Christians. It is almost like a parody by inversion of what the actual Christian Church does.
The church has not been defeated, but there was a falling away and the authority had to be restored:

(New Testament | 2 Thessalonians 2:3)

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
 
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He is the way

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You do not understand the gospel---you can't, you turned a deaf ear to the Holy Spirit by accepting JS --the gospel was preached to the dead---it means those that are dead in sins! They live in Jesus!!


Eph_2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph_2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Col_2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
1Pe_2:24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
Rev_1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
I will agree to disagree.
 
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He is the way

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Try being a Member from birth to age 40, like I have.

Yes, I recognize the tricks you often do such as this "knowing thing' instead of believing---as I used to unwittingly do that myself. I think the term used before is "through eye of faith that you supposedly know"- btw. And, many of my family are still in the Church, although a few like me have denied it.

My genealogy can be traced back to Joseph Smith himself, in sealed marriage to one of my very distant grandmothers. So really, my step, great [X4] grandfather started this deception and I am going to do my part in bringing people out --- to the True Christ.

Only God can break through that foolish pride you have accumulated in being a Member of what is referred to [by only Mormons] as the ONE True Chruch that you think you "know" to be True.

Many Members leave and then become atheist or at least very agnostic. Only God's Grace could have brought me to the True Christ, that is not attached to any particular man-made Religion.

You can heed the warnings of course OR keep at this deception which will only get worse the more you are in it. No one can control your choices you make.
No tricks or deception, I do know it is true. Quite a few people have joined The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints after their visit to the spirit world.
 
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He is the way

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No it is NOT taught by Paul, just a tiny reference to the practice in 1 Corinthians 15:29.

And I would appreciate that you NOT tell me what I supposedly know fine well.
You did know because I posted it several times.
 
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Jamesone5

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You did know because I posted it several times.

Uh NO you have not proven anything that I supposedly should know fine well [your words, btw]

Still talking for me I see---- in your insistence. Be careful--- that is bordering on false Judgement.
 
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Jamesone5

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No tricks or deception, I do know it is true. Quite a few people have joined The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints after their visit to the spirit world.

After their visit to the spirit world? Now you are talking about a séance or some sort of witchcraft.
 
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dzheremi

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The church has not been defeated, but there was a falling away and the authority had to be restored:

(New Testament | 2 Thessalonians 2:3)

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

This is yet highly anomalous and obviously self-motivated Mormon reading of something that basically everyone else identifies with the coming of an anti-Christ figure in the last days, as a precursor to the second coming of Christ our God. Hence the Didache (1st century) says "For in the last days false prophets and corrupters shall be multiplied, and the sheep shall be turned into wolves, and love shall be turned into hate; for when lawlessness increases, they shall hate and persecute and betray one another, and then shall appear the world-deceiver as Son of God, and shall do signs and wonders, and the earth shall be delivered into his hands, and he shall do iniquitous things which have never yet come to pass since the beginning." I can't think of any particular figure or figures that came at whatever time Mormons say the 'great apostasy' began or was happening (this is not helped by the fact that you guys apparently can't decide and stick to a historical date for it), so according to one of the earliest Christian writings we have, your interpretation is wrong.

It is also totally wrong according to other early sources we can reference, like Victor of Pettau's Commentary on the Apocalypse of St. John, written c. 260 AD, wherein he writes:

"There was a battle in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon warred, and his angels, and they prevailed not; nor was their place found any more in heaven. And that great dragon was cast forth, that old serpent: he was cast forth into the earth." This is the beginning of Antichrist; yet previously Elias must prophesy, and there must be times of peace. And afterwards, when the three years and six months are completed in the preaching of Elias, he also must be cast down from heaven, where up till that time he had had the power of ascending; and all the apostate angels, as well as Antichrist, must be roused up from hell. Paul the apostle says: "Except there come a falling away first, and the man of sin shall appear, the son of perdition; and the adversary who exalted himself above all which is called God, or which is worshipped." (2 Thessalonians 2:3-4)
Again, we see this is connected to the events of the apocalypse, not the Mormon apostasy and restoration narrative. You can still believe otherwise, of course, but the point is that the early Church -- which your religion claims to be the restoration of, mind you -- disagrees with you.
 
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Jamesone5

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This is yet highly anomalous and obviously self-motivated Mormon reading of something that basically everyone else identifies with the coming of an anti-Christ figure in the last days, as a precursor to the second coming of Christ our God. Hence says "For in the last days false prophets and corrupters shall be multiplied, and the sheep shall be turned into wolves, and love shall be turned into hate; for when lawlessness increases, they shall hate and persecute and betray one another, and then shall appear the world-deceiver as Son of God, and shall do signs and wonders, and the earth shall be delivered into his hands, and he shall do iniquitous things which have never yet come to pass since the beginning." I can't think of any particular figure or figures that came at whatever time Mormons say the 'great apostasy' began or was happening (this is not helped by the fact that you guys apparently can't decide and stick to a historical date for it), so according to one of the earliest Christian writings we have, your interpretation is wrong.

It is also totally wrong according to other early sources we can reference, like Victor of Pettau's Commentary on the Apocalypse of St. John, written c. 260 AD, wherein he writes:

"There was a battle in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon warred, and his angels, and they prevailed not; nor was their place found any more in heaven. And that great dragon was cast forth, that old serpent: he was cast forth into the earth." This is the beginning of Antichrist; yet previously Elias must prophesy, and there must be times of peace. And afterwards, when the three years and six months are completed in the preaching of Elias, he also must be cast down from heaven, where up till that time he had had the power of ascending; and all the apostate angels, as well as Antichrist, must be roused up from hell. Paul the apostle says: "Except there come a falling away first, and the man of sin shall appear, the son of perdition; and the adversary who exalted himself above all which is called God, or which is worshipped." (2 Thessalonians 2:3-4)
Again, we see this is connected to the events of the apocalypse, not the Mormon apostasy and restoration narrative. You can still believe otherwise, of course, but the point is that the early Church -- which your religion claims to be the restoration of, mind you -- disagrees with you.

The the Didache (1st century) that you quote, really parallels the words or signs of the 24th Chapter of Matthew, along with some other prophesies by other Apostles in their Epistles.

So, if nothing else ---it is more support.
 
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He is the way

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Uh NO you have not proven anything that I supposedly should know fine well [your words, btw]

Still talking for me I see---- in your insistence. Be careful--- that is bordering on false Judgement.
You know fine well that I posted the scripture about baptism for the dead, and here it is again:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 15:27 - 29)

27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?
 
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God shares His authority with others. See post #510.
It's not about authority, it is about capability. God alone is capable of teaching people after they have died. We cannot teach dead people, so we can't baptize them because baptism goes hand in hand with teaching. They must go together.

God gives His authority to His Apostles, who transmit their authority to the bishops in the Church. No such Apostolic authority was transmitted through them to any of your priests. So even if it was a matter of authority, your priests have received no such authority from God, because all authority in the Church must come through Christ's Apostles and their successors, the bishops.
 
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You said: "The only thing standing in the way of journeying into the Kingdom of Heaven, by way of the narrow way, is sin."

And the way to remove the sin and become a new person is through baptism:

(New Testament | Romans 6:3 - 6)

3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.


(New Testament | 1 Peter 3:21 - 22)

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.
Yes, but baptism is for those who can receive instruction in Christ's commandments: "Baptize all nations, teaching them all that I have commanded you" is about what Jesus Christ told his Apostles to do. We cannot teach the dead any of Christ's commandments, nor can the dead experience baptism. That is why the Church does not practice baptism for the dead, even if some Christians were practicing it who did not know at the time that it was not in the least beneficial for the dead to have someone baptized in their behalf.


Who were these pagans?
The pagan men of Athens Whom Paul preached to in the Book of Acts 17:3
 
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Jamesone5

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You know fine well that I posted the scripture about baptism for the dead, and here it is again:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 15:27 - 29)

27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

Oh? changed your tune? This was the original post

You know fine well that baptism for the dead is taught by Paul and is mentioned as a defense for the resurrection----He is the way

Now changed to this:

You know fine well that I posted the scripture about baptism for the dead, and here it is again---He is the way

Why would anyone give Mormons any credence on anything? Arrogance, as the Mormon Church teaches, is sometime sadly --- obvious.
 
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