America is the Best, Most Free, and Most Prosperous Country on Earth: Change My Mind

[Paidiske]

Land of immigrants (not just lately, not just moderately, but for centuries), where ethnicities mix together in great numbers. (Not just for recent times, but many generations) The nation where we continue to learn whether or not people of different ways, backgrounds, culture, origins can truly live together, longer term...without a falling apart, disintegrating.

That's a fair enough point, and I do understand the appeal of a multicultural and pluralist society.

It's just not only America where that's the case, though. It is here in Australia; in Mauritius (where my mother was born) there were no native peoples and everyone there - of Chinese or Indian or African or European heritage - has ancestors who came from somewhere else. And so on.

So it's a good thing, sure; but it's not a uniquely American thing.

 

[brinny]

Land of immigrants (not just lately, not just moderately, but for centuries), where ethnicities mix together in great numbers. (Not just for recent times, but many generations) The nation where we continue to learn whether or not people of different ways, backgrounds, culture, origins can truly live together, longer term...without a falling apart, disintegrating.

Sometimes it looks shaky, like it might be going down.

But, so far still treading water, well over 2 centuries....

The project still is alive. The experiment.

But its not yet a sure thing, even though we've made it 230 years.

It could still collapse into chaos and bloodshed, and the "center not hold".

Man's hope for peace in this world.

Still could fail, and if that happened, that would suggest the project cannot succeed: brotherhood of man can't last, until Christ returns.

See, it's the "last best hope" Lincoln said. That's a viewpoint.

In the end, if racial harmony fails here, it probably could not succeed anywhere in only human ways, long term.

But we that believe in Christ have a better hope. We have the only ultimate and best hope.

Land of immigrants (not just lately, not just moderately, but for centuries), where ethnicities mix together in great numbers. (Not just for recent times, but many generations) The nation where we continue to learn whether or not people of different ways, backgrounds, culture, origins can truly live together, longer term...without a falling apart, disintegrating.

Aynaz Anni Cyrus IS an immigrant (so are many other survivors who were rescued and/or escaped Sharia). She speaks on it in the video mentioned previously.

 

[wing2000]

In early February of last year I was running while listening to podcast and had to stop and cry because of a story about a 7-year-old girl in South Carolina who was severely traumatized after a shooting at her school she couldn't live her childhood with joy. She developed a nervous tic of pulling out her eyelashes, she couldn't sleep without being terrorized by nightmares, she had to be homeschooled. That tragedy doesn't even count as a "mass shooting" because it was just one person who died when a 14-year-old drove up to the playground, pulled out a gun, and began randomly shooting. Three were shot. In America a mass shooting is generally defined as when four or more unrelated people are killed. The smallest child in the girl's class, a six-year-old boy who was her friend, died from his wounds. The most attention was given to that shooting because of his love of superheroes and how everyone came to his funeral dressed in a costume to honor him. The girl wrote a letter to Donald and Melania Trump, explaining that she hated guns, it took her best friend from her and it ruined her life. To her surprise, she did receive a response. Her elation wore off a few days later when she realized that he never told her how he planned to keep kids safe at school, as she'd asked him to do. So she wrote him again. "Thoughts and prayers." I listened to this one week before Valentine's Day, 2018. The day of the Parkland shooting.

Please keep kids safe from guns’: How Trump replied to a 7-year-old’s anguished letter

And I mean yes, I know that guns aren't the only way people are murdered in America. A Neo-Nazi stabbed a friend of mine to death at the beginning of last year. A sweet boy crushing it at an Ivy League, whole life ahead of him, taken by a fellow classmate. But guns are the weapon of choice for massacring many people in a mere amount of time.

An entire generation that has grown up under the threat of being killed in the classroom. In the 1950's, children prepared for nuclear war - that fortunately, never came. Today, they prepare for the next shooter -- which is happening all too often. I expect we'll be dealing with the psychological impact for decades to come.

 

[Halbhh]

That's a fair enough point, and I do understand the appeal of a multicultural and pluralist society.

It's just not only America where that's the case, though. It is here in Australia; in Mauritius (where my mother was born) there were no native peoples and everyone there - of Chinese or Indian or African or European heritage - has ancestors who came from somewhere else. And so on.

So it's a good thing, sure; but it's not a uniquely American thing.

Yes it seems Australia very similar, sorta another tree of the same type. We are at 325 million. In some ways it looks like we are proving it can last, the relative brotherhood, that we are all Americans together, first, above race. We hope. But the last few years make it seem less sure.

 

[DamianWarS]

What has your response got to do with any of my posts, including the post that you just quoted from?

She's quite clear in her testimony why she believes in America and says that America is worth fighting for, according to her own testimony in the video info i posted in an earlier post.

What about her testimony is "unbalanced"?

it's not that her view is unbalanced but when posted in an online thread about America being the best it is being used to support this thread's view, and the thread's view is unbalanced. Create a new thread to discuss her views but when used here, they take on the perspectives of the OP by inheritance.

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

When you put the decision making of what is or is not "hate speech" into the hands of a select few, and then these bombings start and you cannot speak out against the immigration policies because it's the immigrants who are committing them, then what recourse do you have to get the laws changed and stop the invasion from continuing?

Censorship in Sweden - Wikipedia

You're right, freedom isn't free, but freedom does indicate that a citizen is not a slave to their state.

First line of the link.

"Sweden protects freedom of speech and was a pioneer in officially abolishing censorship. A number of restrictions remain such as child pornography, hate speech and libel."

So freedom in your estimation is a right to engage in child porn, hate speech and libel ? Hurrah ?

 

[Robban]

That's the way greedy and un Christian typically think. But taxes also improve streets and the area ,you live in. And service, that help the city or counties run.

I pay 58% in taxes,


what is left is what I decide over.

Either walk on by or stop to help.

 

[brinny]

brinny said: ↑
What has your response got to do with any of my posts, including the post that you just quoted from?

She's quite clear in her testimony why she believes in America and says that America is worth fighting for, according to her own testimony in the video info i posted in an earlier post.

What about her testimony is "unbalanced"?

it's not that her view is unbalanced but when posted in an online thread about America being the best it is being used to support this thread's view, and the thread's view is unbalanced. Create a new thread to discuss her views but when used here, they take on the perspectives of the OP by inheritance.

This post makes no sense.

(For the record, what i posted re: Aynaz Anni Cyrus' own testimony is in perfect sync with the OP of this thread. Discounting and/or dismissing this woman's testimony and/her survival story and why she loves and defends America and why she finds America worth fighting for, highlights the very fact WHY she is doing what she is doing, and why she finds it necessary. Her story/testimony is valid. It counts. She not only speaks for herself, but also for other women who have been, or are still being victimized, and those who were murdered under Sharia Law, and she highlights why she rescues them and brings them to AMERICA. Victims have a right to speak and should not be shushed, discounted, or dismissed. She deserves, at the very least, to be "heard" and "believed" and the fact that she was able to escape, celebrated. She emphasizes these, especially, about America: Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of happiness. i couldn't agree with her more. i join with Aynaz Anni Cyrus and other survivors in saying "God bless America".)

God help us.

Praying.

 

[Halbhh]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus agrees with the OP (and more), and is fighting for America. She is from Iran originally and grew up under Sharia Law there. In the video titled "Sharia for Women: A Female Sharia Survivor Shares Her Story." she gives her own testimony of why she is fighting for America and why it is worth fighting for. (The video is on Youtube, as well as other videos where she speaks of her own experiences.)

Watching now. I find it interesting to hear other views, that are not just the 4 or 8 views I already heard (I read a lot on Iran over the years, especially from about 1979 through about 2005, but many articles since also).

So, instead of being my only close, highly detailed interior view of Iran, this is another highly detailed interior view, to add with the other highly detailed interior views I've gotten before. If you want my impressions after, I'll be happy to tell you how it seems to me.

Thanks for the reference to her!

 

[brinny]

Watching now. I find it interesting to hear other views, that are not just the 4 or 8 views I already heard (I read a lot on Iran over the years, especially from about 1979 through about 2005, but many articles since also).

So, instead of being my only close, highly detailed interior view of Iran, this is another highly detailed interior view, to add with the other highly detailed interior views I've gotten before. If you want my impressions after, I'll be happy to tell you how it seems to me.

Thanks for the reference to her!

i appreciate you saying so. I thought, however, you had already watched it. She now realizes why she survived and escaped Sharia Law. And one of those reasons is to speak out for those unable to speak out for themselves. As she states, many are still under Sharia Law, and will be killed under it, silently, and just "buried" so to speak, with none knowing the horrors that they went through. Her perspective on America NEEDS to be heard. She riskd her very life in speaking out, even here in America. There are death threats against her (and others) as we speak.

 

[Halbhh]

i appreciate you saying so. I thought, however, you had already watched it. She now realizes why she survived and escaped Sharia Law. And one of those reasons is to speak out for those unable to speak out for themselves. As she states, many are still under Sharia Law, and will be killed under it, silently, and just "buried" so to speak, with none knowing the horrors that they went through. Her perspective on America NEEDS to be heard. She riskd her very life in speaking out, even here in America. There are death threats against her (and others) as we speak.

No, I had never seen her before -- she and her talk are totally new to me.

What she is saying (i'm about 1/3rd through) fits what I've learned from other sources.

It's the real deal.

And, this has some new details too.

I'd learned before, in depth at times, of things like the clothing and religious patrols and various repression (against music for example) and forced marriage and several other things I'd read about in detail. Getting more detail of more aspects of a woman's experience and a longer personal testimony is valuable!

While I didn't need any convincing Iran is under a terrible repression, it is still good to be reminded of what that really means in personal terms for people. It's one thing to read about people being beaten brutally down in the streets with clubs for their clothing, and another to hear even worse things.

 

[brinny]

No, I had never seen her before -- she and her talk are totally new to me.

What she is saying (i'm about 1/3rd through) fits what I've learned from other sources.

It's the real deal.

And, this has some new details too.

I'd learned before, in depth at times, of things like the clothing and religious patrols and various repression (against music for example) and forced marriage and several other things I'd read about in detail. Getting more detail of more aspects of a woman's experience and a longer personal testimony is valuable!

While I didn't need any convincing Iran is under a terrible repression, it is still good to be reminded of what that really means in personal terms for people. It's one thing to read about people being beaten brutally down in the streets with clubs for their clothing, and another to hear even worse things.

i agree.

 

[Halbhh]

i agree.

Did you know that today Aynaz Anni Cyrus
could not enter United States?

Trump Will Deny Immigrant Visas to Those Who Can’t Pay for Health Care
Visa applicants will have to prove they have insurance or the financial resources for medical costs.

(pick any news source; every major news outlet has it I think that reports all the main news)

So...Aynaz Anni Cyrus's fellow Iranian victims of rape, tortues, brutalities....cannot get safety here, today.

Did you know this?

 

[98cwitr]

Did you know that today Aynaz Anni Cyrus
COULD NOT ENTER THE United States?


Example:

Trump Will Deny Immigrant Visas to Those Who Can’t Pay for Health Care
Visa applicants will have to prove they have insurance or the financial resources for medical costs.


So...Aynaz Anni Cyrus's fellow Iranian victims of rape, tortues, brutalities....cannot get safety here, today.

Did you know this?

Sweden is inviting.

 

[brinny]

Did you know that today Aynaz Anni Cyrus
could not enter United States?

Trump Will Deny Immigrant Visas to Those Who Can’t Pay for Health Care
Visa applicants will have to prove they have insurance or the financial resources for medical costs.

(pick any news source; every major news outlet has it I think that reports all the main news)

So...Aynaz Anni Cyrus's fellow Iranian victims of rape, tortues, brutalities....cannot get safety here, today.

Did you know this?

Aynaz Anni Cyrus is a citizen of the United States.

 

[Halbhh]

Sweden is inviting.

Oh yeah! You want to go anywhere that is truly safe if you've been raped or threatened, or people you know have been burned to death, or had acid poured on their face, for instance. (minute 31-32 in the Anni Cyrus talk)

You mentioned Sweden, which was very interesting to me.

Hi, my name is Hal. I love Sweden. We had an exchange student from Sweden live with us for a year.

Do you know any Swedes?

I thought I'd get an update on the Sweden refugee situation, since you suggested Sweden, and I'd not read anything on it in the last year.

Make sense?

Instead, Sweden now has a situation where some young Afghans have been given protection while others only have precarious, temporary permits. Many have no legal status at all or have left Sweden for other E.U. countries because they feared deportation. Some have been deported to Afghanistan.
...
Then, a combination of Swedish and European measures to reduce the number of incoming asylum seekers kicked in. The E.U. struck a controversial refugee deal with Turkey, and Sweden temporarily refused to let anyone without identity documents cross the Swedish border from Denmark. Sweden also changed its asylum laws, introducing temporary (instead of permanent) residence permits, excluding large groups from the right to be joined by family members and canceling certain types of protection on humanitarian grounds.

Last year, Sweden recorded its lowest asylum seeker intake since 2005. ...
Lessons from Sweden: How Not to Solve an Asylum Crisis

 

[Halbhh]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus is a citizen of the United States.

Did you not listen to the whole video?

 

[brinny]

brinny said: ↑
Aynaz Anni Cyrus is a citizen of the United States.

Did you not listen to the whole video?

Yes.

In the video she speaks on how and when she became a citizen of the United States.

 

[Halbhh]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus is a citizen of the United States.

If you didn't notice in the video --

today Aynaz Anni Cyrus
could not enter United States, as a refugee, as she was.

Why?

Because as a refugee without wealth, she would not have been able to meet this new restriction:

Trump Will Deny Immigrant Visas to Those Who Can’t Pay for Health Care
Visa applicants will have to prove they have insurance or the financial resources for medical costs.

(pick any news source; every major news outlet has it I think that reports all the main news)

So...Aynaz Anni Cyrus's fellow Iranian victims of rape, tortues, brutalities....cannot get safety here, today, except for the small number that are wealthy.

Did you know this?

How does it seem to you? Is that ok with you?

It's not ok with me.

 

[ananda]

As I was told this was a debatable topic, I figured I'd post here to let the debate ensue.

Definitions:

Best: most productive of good : offering or producing the greatest advantage, utility, or satisfaction

Free: enjoying personal freedom : not subject to the control or domination of another

Prosperous: marked by success or economic well-being

IMO absolutely, it is the best ... towards one goal: proliferation of monetary profit ("prosperity"), based on the "freedom" of opportunity to fleece others (consumers) by addicting them to unnecessary things (various forms of delusions, attachments & aversions).