• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

America is the Best, Most Free, and Most Prosperous Country on Earth: Change My Mind

pitabread

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2017
12,920
13,373
Frozen North
✟344,333.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Has anyone as of yet explained why the U.S. is ranked 17th on the 2018 Human Freedom Index?

For those who think the U.S. has the greatest level of freedom in the world, why isn't it ranked #1?

And for that matter, why are they only ranked 24th in terms of personal freedom (which includes safety & security, religious freedom, freedom of expression, etc).
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,084
3,428
✟980,782.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Have it your way.

But you're engaging in your own type of logical fallacy, if you think that geography is the primary factor in determining the character of a nation. You're falling further behind.
I think it's an inseparable factor not the primary factor.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

expos4ever

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2008
11,236
6,224
Montreal, Quebec
✟298,094.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
[QUOTE="NightHawkeye”]Americans have free speech. American speech cannot be impeded for political expediency as happens regularly in other countries ... despite what denizens of PC want everyone to believe.[/QUOTE]
Dozens of countries have comparable free speech: Canada, Australia, New Zealand, France, UK, Netherlands, Germany.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: pitabread
Upvote 0

FenderTL5

Κύριε, ἐλέησον.
Site Supporter
Jun 13, 2016
5,622
6,578
Nashville TN
✟754,849.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-American-Solidarity
Remember that at the time, "free State" did not refer to the United States, it referred to each of the several States. The purpose of the state militias was to protect the state (Delaware, Virginia, New York, et cetera) from the federal government.

Any state could have written a gun law similar to Switzerland's, and that would have been just fine.
Be that as it may, it was still for the security of the state, not opposition to it as the previous poster had stated.
 
Upvote 0

Paidiske

Clara bonam audax
Site Supporter
Apr 25, 2016
35,675
20,052
45
Albury, Australia
Visit site
✟1,687,145.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Female
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.

I think this idea of "worth fighting for" needs some unpacking, though. If by that, we mean contributing to the good of the nation with all of our talents, intelligence, and so on, then great! By that metric, most countries would be worth fighting for, in the sense of contributing to their good and the welfare of their citizens.

But if, by "worth fighting for" we mean American exceptionalism justifies warfare beyond your borders, profiting from the sale of weapons (whose use results in death, destruction and misery for thousands, if not millions), and so on, then I think that claim needs much more scrutiny.

But...for this earth, for humans, this nation is the 'last best hope' of human effort of this earth. What humans can do. It's that last best hope.

Why? In what way does it offer something different or more for human flourishing than other first-world countries?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: wing2000
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,084
3,428
✟980,782.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Has anyone as of yet explained why the U.S. is ranked 17th on the 2018 Human Freedom Index?

For those who think the U.S. has the greatest level of freedom in the world, why isn't it ranked #1?

And for that matter, why are they only ranked 24th in terms of personal freedom (which includes safety & security, religious freedom, freedom of expression, etc).
I don't think the US wants to be the freest nation in the world.
 
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,084
3,428
✟980,782.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
She would, according to what she reports, take it much further, however, as what it boils down to from her own experiences (and others) is that it's literally a matter of "life and death", etc. That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.
I think there are a lot of nations she could find herself in where she would say the same sentiment.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: pitabread
Upvote 0

brinny

everlovin' shiner of light in dark places
Site Supporter
Mar 23, 2004
249,083
114,186
✟1,373,252.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
brinny said:
She would, according to what she reports, take it much further, however, as what it boils down to from her own experiences (and others) is that it's literally a matter of "life and death", etc. That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.
I think there are a lot of nations she could find herself in where she would say the same sentiment.
What are you basing your post on, Damian?
 
Upvote 0

brinny

everlovin' shiner of light in dark places
Site Supporter
Mar 23, 2004
249,083
114,186
✟1,373,252.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
brinny said:
That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.
I think this idea of "worth fighting for" needs some unpacking, though. If by that, we mean contributing to the good of the nation with all of our talents, intelligence, and so on, then great! By that metric, most countries would be worth fighting for, in the sense of contributing to their good and the welfare of their citizens.

But if, by "worth fighting for" we mean American exceptionalism justifies warfare beyond your borders, profiting from the sale of weapons (whose use results in death, destruction and misery for thousands, if not millions), and so on, then I think that claim needs much more scrutiny.



Why? In what way does it offer something different or more for human flourishing than other first-world countries?
Did you watch the video i referenced in an earlier post, or any of her videos?

She speaks for herself, and explains in great detail why she (and other survivors) love America, fight for America, and believe that America is worth fighting for.
 
Upvote 0

DaisyDay

I Did Nothing Wrong!! ~~Team Deep State
Jan 7, 2003
41,314
19,522
Finger Lakes
✟296,016.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Unitarian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I

Actually prefer to carry on my belt. And the answer is whichever one I want. More to the point, I can carry a handgun too if I want.
The point is, you claimed that pocketknives were not allowed, but they are. If you carry it on your belt, chances are it is not a pocketknife.
 
Upvote 0

renniks

Well-Known Member
Jun 2, 2008
10,682
3,449
✟156,970.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The point is, you claimed that pocketknives were not allowed, but they are. If you carry it on your belt, chances are it is not a pocketknife.
Yes it is, I just find it more comfortable. The point is England's restrictive regulations.
 
Upvote 0

Aryeh Jay

Replaced by a robot, just like Biden.
Site Supporter
Jul 19, 2012
17,628
16,242
MI - Michigan
✟663,786.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Judaism
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I've been there many, many times. From Cozumel to Tijuana.

TJ is just Barrio Logan with donkeys painted as zebras and Cozumel is an exclusive tourist resort island that caters to overweight people from the Mid-West.
 
Upvote 0

Ada Lovelace

Grateful to scientists and all health care workers
Site Supporter
Jun 20, 2014
5,316
9,295
California
✟1,024,756.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
On Twitter this afternoon in the context of discussing the school shooting in Santa Clarita this morning I shared a video from a dance session where I was working on the choreography for a quickly-organized fundraising event held for the victims of a previous mass shooting. One of my friends from Australia asked me which mass shooting in America was that dance for, which was a simple question and yet one so tragically profound. We've had so many it wasn't a matter of it being the shooting where innocent lives were stolen, but asking which one, of which year. I'm a bit of late bloomer because of medicine I took throughout my childhood that slowed my growth so I was a little shorter in the video that I am now, and the friend realized it must have been taken the past, guessing Las Vegas. There was also the Sutherland Springs Church shooting that year where 26 were murdered. In 2018 there were the school shootings at Parkland (17 dead) and Sante Fe (10), the Pittsburgh Synagogue shooting, then Borderline. Then this year......... Americans are slaughtered in their houses of worship, in their schools, at music festivals and food festivals, and yoga studios, and Walmarts, and bars, and their workplaces, in movie theaters.

Last week I flew back home to LA for a memorial service marking the one year anniversary of the shooting at the Borderline Bar and Grill on their College Night. A lot of the Pepperdine and Cal Lutheran students who were there that night are friends from my HS youth group at our church. It was an extraordinarily traumatic time. They experienced a shooting, watched friends die before their eyes. Then while still gripped by shock had to endure devastating and terrifying wildfires that savagely ripped through the community. This year Santa Clarita has had to endure hellacious fires, and then as soon as they ended and they could take their breath, there was a school shooting. And now this weekend there's another fire danger for the area.
 
Upvote 0

Ada Lovelace

Grateful to scientists and all health care workers
Site Supporter
Jun 20, 2014
5,316
9,295
California
✟1,024,756.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
In early February of last year I was running while listening to podcast and had to stop and cry because of a story about a 7-year-old girl in South Carolina who was severely traumatized after a shooting at her school she couldn't live her childhood with joy. She developed a nervous tic of pulling out her eyelashes, she couldn't sleep without being terrorized by nightmares, she had to be homeschooled. That tragedy doesn't even count as a "mass shooting" because it was just one person who died when a 14-year-old drove up to the playground, pulled out a gun, and began randomly shooting. Three were shot. In America a mass shooting is generally defined as when four or more unrelated people are killed. The smallest child in the girl's class, a six-year-old boy who was her friend, died from his wounds. The most attention was given to that shooting because of his love of superheroes and how everyone came to his funeral dressed in a costume to honor him. The girl wrote a letter to Donald and Melania Trump, explaining that she hated guns, it took her best friend from her and it ruined her life. To her surprise, she did receive a response. Her elation wore off a few days later when she realized that he never told her how he planned to keep kids safe at school, as she'd asked him to do. So she wrote him again. "Thoughts and prayers." I listened to this one week before Valentine's Day, 2018. The day of the Parkland shooting.

Please keep kids safe from guns’: How Trump replied to a 7-year-old’s anguished letter

And I mean yes, I know that guns aren't the only way people are murdered in America. A Neo-Nazi stabbed a friend of mine to death at the beginning of last year. A sweet boy crushing it at an Ivy League, whole life ahead of him, taken by a fellow classmate. But guns are the weapon of choice for massacring many people in a mere amount of time.
 
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,084
3,428
✟980,782.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
What are you basing your post on, Damian?
the things she is applauding the US for she could find in other countries as well. it may be perhaps a felt need to defend America because of its wide criticism that she is so vocal about it or the encouraged platform she is given to speak this way. so for example, if she found herself landing in Canada rather than the US she would probably feel just as happy but perhaps not feel the demand to defend the county to others because the international reception of Canada is in a much better place than the US. Canada probably wouldn't give her the same platform either because Canadians are simply not as interested in that sort of attention.

The US, however, definitely has values worth fighting for, it also has a lot of values not worth fighting for and I would rather see a more balanced view with these topics but it rarely happens.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Paidiske
Upvote 0

brinny

everlovin' shiner of light in dark places
Site Supporter
Mar 23, 2004
249,083
114,186
✟1,373,252.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
brinny said:
What are you basing your post on, Damian?
the things she is applauding the US for she could find in other countries as well. it may be perhaps a felt need to defend America because of its wide criticism that she is so vocal about it or the encouraged platform she is given to speak this way. so for example, if she found herself landing in Canada rather than the US she would probably feel just as happy but perhaps not feel the demand to defend the county to others because the international reception of Canada is in a much better place than the US. Canada probably wouldn't give her the same platform either because Canadians are simply not as interested in that sort of attention.

The US, however, definitely has values worth fighting for, it also has a lot of values not worth fighting for and I would rather see a more balanced view with these topics but it rarely happens.
What has your response got to do with any of my posts, including the post that you just quoted from?

She's quite clear in her testimony why she believes in America and says that America is worth fighting for, according to her own testimony in the video info i posted in an earlier post.
I would rather see a more balanced view
What about her testimony is "unbalanced"?
 
Upvote 0

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Site Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,340
9,284
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,223,311.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I think this idea of "worth fighting for" needs some unpacking, though. If by that, we mean contributing to the good of the nation with all of our talents, intelligence, and so on, then great! By that metric, most countries would be worth fighting for, in the sense of contributing to their good and the welfare of their citizens.

But if, by "worth fighting for" we mean American exceptionalism justifies warfare beyond your borders, profiting from the sale of weapons (whose use results in death, destruction and misery for thousands, if not millions), and so on, then I think that claim needs much more scrutiny.



Why? In what way does it offer something different or more for human flourishing than other first-world countries?
Land of immigrants (not just lately, not just moderately, but for centuries), where ethnicities mix together in great numbers. (Not just for recent times, but many generations) The nation where we continue to learn whether or not people of different ways, backgrounds, culture, origins can truly live together, longer term...without a falling apart, disintegrating.

Sometimes it looks shaky, like it might be going down.

But, so far still treading water, well over 2 centuries....

The project still is alive. The experiment.

But its not yet a sure thing, even though we've made it 230 years.

It could still collapse into chaos and bloodshed, and the "center not hold".

Man's hope for peace in this world.

Still could fail, and if that happened, that would suggest the project cannot succeed: brotherhood of man can't last, until Christ returns.

See, it's the "last best hope" Lincoln said. That's a viewpoint.

In the end, if racial harmony fails here, it probably could not succeed anywhere in only human ways, long term.

But we that believe in Christ have a better hope. We have the only ultimate and best hope.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Go Braves

I miss Senator McCain
May 18, 2017
9,646
8,980
Atlanta
✟23,068.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Republican
On Twitter this afternoon in the context of discussing the school shooting in Santa Clarita this morning I shared a video from a dance session where I was working on the choreography for a quickly-organized fundraising event held for the victims of a previous mass shooting. One of my friends from Australia asked me which mass shooting in America was that dance for, which was a simple question and yet one so tragically profound. We've had so many it wasn't a matter of it being the shooting where innocent lives were stolen, but asking which one, of which year. I'm a bit of late bloomer because of medicine I took throughout my childhood that slowed my growth so I was a little shorter in the video that I am now, and the friend realized it must have been taken the past, guessing Las Vegas. There was also the Sutherland Springs Church shooting that year where 26 were murdered. In 2018 there were the school shootings at Parkland (17 dead) and Sante Fe (10), the Pittsburgh Synagogue shooting, then Borderline. Then this year......... Americans are slaughtered in their houses of worship, in their schools, at music festivals and food festivals, and yoga studios, and Walmarts, and bars, and their workplaces, in movie theaters.

Last week I flew back home to LA for a memorial service marking the one year anniversary of the shooting at the Borderline Bar and Grill on their College Night. A lot of the Pepperdine and Cal Lutheran students who were there that night are friends from my HS youth group at our church. It was an extraordinarily traumatic time. They experienced a shooting, watched friends die before their eyes. Then while still gripped by shock had to endure devastating and terrifying wildfires that savagely ripped through the community. This year Santa Clarita has had to endure hellacious fires, and then as soon as they ended and they could take their breath, there was a school shooting. And now this weekend there's another fire danger for the area.

Would love to see that video. If you don't mind sharing it. If you do mind, perfectly understood.

I'll pray for the folks in Cali before hitting the sack tonight. Y'all have been through an awful lot with the wildfires. Anniversary of last year's shootings. Now this school shooting. So much trauma!
 
Upvote 0

Go Braves

I miss Senator McCain
May 18, 2017
9,646
8,980
Atlanta
✟23,068.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Republican
In early February of last year I was running while listening to podcast and had to stop and cry because of a story about a 7-year-old girl in South Carolina who was severely traumatized after a shooting at her school she couldn't live her childhood with joy. She developed a nervous tic of pulling out her eyelashes, she couldn't sleep without being terrorized by nightmares, she had to be homeschooled. That tragedy doesn't even count as a "mass shooting" because it was just one person who died when a 14-year-old drove up to the playground, pulled out a gun, and began randomly shooting. Three were shot. In America a mass shooting is generally defined as when four or more unrelated people are killed. The smallest child in the girl's class, a six-year-old boy who was her friend, died from his wounds. The most attention was given to that shooting because of his love of superheroes and how everyone came to his funeral dressed in a costume to honor him. The girl wrote a letter to Donald and Melania Trump, explaining that she hated guns, it took her best friend from her and it ruined her life. To her surprise, she did receive a response. Her elation wore off a few days later when she realized that he never told her how he planned to keep kids safe at school, as she'd asked him to do. So she wrote him again. "Thoughts and prayers." I listened to this one week before Valentine's Day, 2018. The day of the Parkland shooting.

Please keep kids safe from guns’: How Trump replied to a 7-year-old’s anguished letter

And I mean yes, I know that guns aren't the only way people are murdered in America. A Neo-Nazi stabbed a friend of mine to death at the beginning of last year. A sweet boy crushing it at an Ivy League, whole life ahead of him, taken by a fellow classmate. But guns are the weapon of choice for massacring many people in a mere amount of time.

Holy cow that little girl's story hit me hard. Poor sweet girl. That trauma.
 
Upvote 0