The point is, of course, that you wouldn't know it from the discussions on this forum.
The point is, that you are still missing, is as per the OP, that discussions on this forum don't make people want to be a Christian. What Christianity "really" is is irrelevant to the point @hedrick was making.Well just because Christianity is about a relationship with Christ it doesn't mean Christians can't have opinions or thoughts about politics or ethical dilemmas or abortion or whatever.
The point is, that you are still missing, is as per the OP, that discussions on this forum don't make people want to be a Christian. What Christianity "really" is is irrelevant to the point @hedrick was making.
I came to CF with a desire to be christian. I called myself Christian. But spending time here on CF, I cannot abide the intolerance, misogyny, homophobia, and at times outright hatred expressed here. I also cannot abide the total rejection of science in favour of beliefs that are at odds to scientific reasoning.
As you can see I have since stepped away from Christianity, but I still enjoy the philosophical discussions.
Then you came to CF with the wrong purpose. If you step away from Christianity because Christians think homosexuality is sinful or evolution from a common ancestor is incorrect then you are not searching for a relationship with Christ. A relationship with Jesus is about recognizing that you are lost without him and need him for salvation.
For the non-Christians: When you're browsing this site, and you see discussions on salvation or Church history or any theological topic, do these discussions make Christianity seem appealing, or do these arguments turn you away?
I've discussed this topic with Christians on this site, but I want to turn it over to the non-Christians: Are we doing a good job of discussing the Christian faith?
Then you came to CF with the wrong purpose
It's recognizing you are a sinner and nothing you do will get you a relationship with the Almighty God. It's only by faith in Christ that makes you right with God.
If we can't look at our own life and say I need Christ then it's hopeless for us.
The majority of the discussions make me so grateful I renounced Christianity half a century ago. There are some posts that are exceptions and some specific members for whom I have the utmost respect.For the non-Christians: When you're browsing this site, and you see discussions on salvation or Church history or any theological topic, do these discussions make Christianity seem appealing, or do these arguments turn you away?
I've discussed this topic with Christians on this site, but I want to turn it over to the non-Christians: Are we doing a good job of discussing the Christian faith?
I find it interesting that people believe so fervently stories which appear to me to be blatant nonsense. I’d love to understand why some believe in god/ Jesus etc but some don’t. My own opinion is that the majority of Christians will have been raised in a Christian environment, or suffered some form of trauma which they hoped Christianity might help heal. I’ve seen nothing on here which would move me towards religion in any way.For the non-Christians: When you're browsing this site, and you see discussions on salvation or Church history or any theological topic, do these discussions make Christianity seem appealing, or do these arguments turn you away?
I've discussed this topic with Christians on this site, but I want to turn it over to the non-Christians: Are we doing a good job of discussing the Christian faith?
If you consider that it also happens - not too rarely - that there are people who proclaim that the have a relationship with Jesus, are lost without him, needed salvation and found it with Jesus... and then get told that they don't do any of that because they support homosexual marriage or are pro-choice or don't hate immigrants... you might come to reconsider this simplistic approach of "It's all about a relationship!"Then you came to CF with the wrong purpose. If you step away from Christianity because Christians think homosexuality is sinful or evolution from a common ancestor is incorrect then you are not searching for a relationship with Christ. A relationship with Jesus is about recognizing that you are lost without him and need him for salvation. It's recognizing you are a sinner and nothing you do will get you a relationship with the Almighty God. It's only by faith in Christ that makes you right with God. Your not made right with God by believing homosexuality is a so or by believing abortion is wrong or being a conservative or liberal. If we can't look at our own life and say I need Christ then it's hopeless for us.
CF is not the whole Christian Church. I would hate to see someone turned away from Christianity because of CF.I came here to look at more specifics and it would seem that to be christian, it warrants a package deal I must accept that includes notions around who is good and who is bad : Gays bad (Heck you are not even allowed to express support for gays on this site such is the mood by Christians towards them). You have to reject science, must believe that if a friend has sex with her boyfriend shes bad, accept demons are true, accept that as a woman I must not lead either my family or in any capacity for that matter...and the list goes on. So you saying that only Jesus matters, is not generally accepted as being true amongst Christians - being christian is a whole package deal.
I came to CF with a desire to be christian. I called myself Christian. But spending time here on CF, I cannot abide the intolerance, misogyny, homophobia, and at times outright hatred expressed here. I also cannot abide the total rejection of science in favour of beliefs that are at odds to scientific reasoning.
As you can see I have since stepped away from Christianity, but I still enjoy the philosophical discussions.
If you consider that it also happens - not too rarely - that there are people who proclaim that the have a relationship with Jesus, are lost without him, needed salvation and found it with Jesus... and then get told that they don't do any of that because they support homosexual marriage or are pro-choice or don't hate immigrants... you might come to reconsider this simplistic approach of "It's all about a relationship!"
One of the major problems I have with Christianity is that none of those people who claim to have a relationship with Jesus are able to show that they have a real relationship with a real Jesus.
For me it's the other way around. The discussions I have here are a consequence of me wanting to live Christianity. That involves gaining a deeper understanding through theological discussion.
I'm not a non-Christian, but if I was a non-Christian and CF was my primary or only introduction to it, I'd likely run as far away from the religion as possible. Too many posts/threads here give the false impression that following Christ is about holding harsh, narrow, anti-intellectual views.
No. Christianity has been unappealing to me since day one of Ms. Heflin's Sunday school class, and this website has not changed that.
But that's ok. I'm not here to look for reasons to become a Christian. I'm here because,
1. I don't want to live in an echo chamber. Almost everyone I know and interact with regularly is either atheist, irreligious, or very liberal in their religion. The internet is the most convenient resource for exposure to opposing viewpoints. I consume conservative religious radio, podcasts and youtube videos, and talk to street preachers, for the same reason.
2. It's interesting.
3. I consider the public scrutiny of ideas and the reasoning behind them to be a civic duty.
4. On rare occasions, I like to peruse the 'Christians Only' sections and see what believers say about atheists when they know we can't respond.
In that order.
Speaking as an atheist, no, they don't. Generally speaking, Christians just just aren't good enough at arguing their case. Most of them hardly understand any of the tenents of their own religion. The folks on Christian Forums are sometimes better, or sometimes more unbalanced, but even so, as a general matter, atheists know the Christian religion better, and can argue it better.
The problem is that Christianity just doesn't make sense. This isn't necessarily a disadvantage in a religion; there are parts of the Christian religion that Christians are proud of not understanding. God works in mysterious ways, and all that. the problem is with apologists who convince themselves and others that they actually can win all of their arguments and show atheists the error of their ways, and of course they can't.
If I may offer some advice, Christians showing humility, kindness and helpfulness would be way more convincing, and likely to recruit converts, than fans of Josh McDowell and Lee Strobel.
None of the excerpts you posted were apologetics topics. From reading what they said, it looks as if @Ignatius the Kiwi , @bekkilyn and @Eight Foot Manchild were all simply answering the question in a straightforward manner, as was I.according to the statement of purpose for this forum, apologetics are not allowed here. So that means that athiests who ask apologetical questions cannot receive an answer that is allowed per the forum rules.
"No General Apologetics Topics
Apologetics is a branch of theology that concerns itself with defending or proving the truths of the Christian faith and doctrines. Discussion and debate on subjects related to general apologetics are not allowed in the Discussion and Debate category forums. Christians who would like to discuss apologetics may do so in the Christian Apologetics forum."
oh the rule goes further than that, it does not want apologetics discussion here.None of the excerpts you posted were apologetics topics. From reading what they said, it looks as if @Ignatius the Kiwi , @bekkilyn and @Eight Foot Manchild were all simply answering the question in a straightforward manner, as was I.
You say that we are not allowed to ask apologetical questions, and I'm sure we all respect that. I can't see a question mark, or any kind of implied question, in anything any of us said.
I don't see that anyone has begun an apologetics discussion as yet. But if you feel an irresistible need to have one, feel free to start a thread in General Apologetics (I believe Christians are allowed to initiate threads there as well?) Otherwise, perhaps you could go to Christians Apologetics, and ask the people there what they think of Christianity.oh the rule goes further than that, it does not want apologetics discussion here.
and the responses from athiests here demands it.