Once a Catholic, Always a Catholic?

[Reconciliation and Truth]

As for the white collar, you have your history the wrong way around. The white clerical collar was invented by Presbyterians, and only later taken up by Catholics (who up until that point had favoured a cassock worn without white collar, as the Orthodox still do). Catholics complaining about Protestants wearing something Protestants invented is a bit much!

Catholics actually wore a white collar. Protestants invented long sleeve shirts with collars that could be easily removed. Until Vatican II, anything worn or done had to originate from tradition. If you are celebrating an eastern Catholic liturgy, at least in the US, a cassock without a collar may be appropriate.

 

[Reconciliation and Truth]

If you're not Catholic, the Church regards you as among our separated brethren.

A sheep is still a sheep even if lost from the flock.

But then, a lot of the objections in this thread have come from non-Catholics, who, in theory, shouldn't care what the Church teaches.

Divorced people have all kinds of opinions about their spouses about whom they should not be concerned.

Anyway. But for Catholics who leave the Church, it's a bigger deal since the Catholic Church has the fullness of truth regarding the faith. If one is already a member of the Catholic Church, there's nothing to be gained truth-wise from visiting Protestant ecclesial communities. There is no reason to abandon the faith. So if a Catholic were to leave the Church, I suppose "prodigal" would be one way of describing them.

That's not really true - as people can be hurt by the Church or any faith tradition. Faith psychology is complicated.

 

[Reconciliation and Truth]

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[ChicanaRose]

That just puts people into religious mindsets and even spiritual bondage falsely causing them to feel they Must remain under the dominion of this or that organisation .

I think you are referring to Galatians 5:1-6.

 

[ChicanaRose]

The process of defection (writing a letter to Bishop to exit the church) is no longer available as of 2010, if I understand it correctly. This makes it near-impossible for someone wanting to leave quietly to have a sense of closure. Because if you read the grounds for excommunication, including automatic excommunication, these are either acts that no Christian would ever want to do (such as throwing away a consecrated host); or makes it impossible for you to not "make a scene" (such as publishing books against the Catholic faith). The RCC allows annulment of marriage if it feels that a couple was not mature enough to understand what they were getting themselves into. Then why not the same with entering the church? What if a person was not spiritually-mature enough to understand what she was getting herself into and later regrets the decision?

 

[Concord1968]

The process of defection (writing a letter to Bishop to exit the church) is no longer available as of 2010, if I understand it correctly. This makes it near-impossible for someone wanting to leave quietly to have a sense of closure. Because if you read the grounds for excommunication, including automatic excommunication, these are either acts that no Christian would ever want to do (such as throwing away a consecrated host); or makes it impossible for you to not "make a scene" (such as publishing books against the Catholic faith). The RCC allows annulment of marriage if it feels that a couple was not mature enough to understand what they were getting themselves into. Then why not the same with entering the church? What if a person was not spiritually-mature enough to understand what she was getting herself into and later regrets the decision?

I wouldn't let it trouble you. I left quietly, and I have closure. What are they going to do, after all? Send the ecclesial police after me? I'm gone. I'm NOT Catholic anymore. They can believe what they wish, but their belief has no bearing on my life or yours.

Don't let your heart be troubled!

 

[ChicanaRose]

Divorced people have all kinds of opinions about their spouses about whom they should not be concerned.

This is an insightful analogy. And just as divorced people need closure, some leaving Catholics just need closure; a clean cut from the past. Just as one cannot remarry until his divorce is finalized, it may feel strange to some Catholics, to convert to another denomination without being able to formally leave the RCC. At least it feels strange to me.

 

[ChicanaRose]

I wouldn't let it trouble you. I left quietly, and I have closure. What are they going to do, after all? Send the ecclesial police after me? I'm gone. I'm NOT Catholic anymore. They can believe what they wish, but their belief has no bearing on my life or yours.

Don't let your heart be troubled!

I had a feeling you came from RCC, since you proudly post "New Convert to Lutheranism" under your avatar (LOL). That's great that you can have closure, as I've desired a more tangible form of closure. I think it's just part of my personality.

 

[thecolorsblend]

The RCC allows annulment of marriage if it feels that a couple was not mature enough to understand what they were getting themselves into. Then why not the same with entering the church?

Possibly because marriage is not understood to have a sacramental character which leaves an indelible mark on the soul.

The sacrament of Baptism and the sacrament of Holy Orders, on the other hand, do leave a mark on the soul.

 

[ChicanaRose]

Possibly because marriage is not understood to have a sacramental character which leaves an indelible mark on the soul.

The sacrament of Baptism and the sacrament of Holy Orders, on the other hand, do leave a mark on the soul.

Do you mean, the sacrament of matrimony, being one of the seven sacraments, do not leave an indelible mark on the soul? So only Baptism and Holy Orders do. Thank you for the information.

 

[MDC]

I had a feeling you came from RCC, since you proudly post "New Convert to Lutheranism" under your avatar (LOL). That's great that you can have closure, as I've desired a more tangible form of closure. I think it's just part of my personality.

The peace you have from being in Christ should be closure for you. I’m of the belief, like many of the reformers, that the teachings of the RCC is anti Christ. So it’s pure joy and gratefulness for me being delivered from such an organization. But you seem to have regrets about leaving and is why there’s no closure. Just my opinion

 

[ChicanaRose]

The peace you have from being in Christ should be closure for you. I’m of the belief, like many of the reformers, that the teachings of the RCC is anti Christ. So it’s pure joy and gratefulness for me being delivered from such an organization. But you seem to have regrets about leaving and is why there’s no closure. Just my opinion

I have no regrets about leaving. Instead, I have regrets about joining and that's why I want closure by "undoing" the joining. But closure it seems, would have to come spiritually rather than on paper.

 

[JacksBratt]

I have no regrets about leaving. Instead, I have regrets about joining and that's why I want closure by "undoing" the joining. But closure it seems, would have to come spiritually rather than on paper.

I have always thought it odd that you are basically born into Catholic or Protestant household and "become" that sect.... very odd. It's just a belief system. You are born to parents that have a belief in a certain set of theological ideals... It has no bearing on what you want to believe. There is no walls. There is no fences. There is just a different belief... period...

 

[Alithis]

I think you are referring to Galatians 5:1-6.

In part ..yup.

 

[Julian of Norwich]

I think the best closure for me was to be able to recognize what good things I had learned while I was a practicing Catholic. Whatever the RCC wants to believe about my leaving and joining another church is their belief, not mine. I'm glad I was able to learn what He wanted me to learn while there and I hope to be able to have the humility to learn important things about Him in my present church.

 

[Major1]

Hmm, I'm Protestant... well... my family took me to a Protestant based church and I was raised with traditional Protestant worship practices... I am a "child of God"....

And, I've never heard the verse "come out of her" before..

Can you give me chapter and verse and tell me what they are using this to indicate?

Revelation 18:4.

The word for the end time religious system in place AFTER the Rapture is Babylon. It is treacherous in beauty and charm of but is a theological and political prostitute.

The system, represented by the whole image, is attractive. As in Paul's analogy of the body in I Corinthians 12, the head guides and directs the other parts of the body. In effect, this means that Babylon, the head of gold, has impressed its system, its ideas, its style, its qualities on all of civilization. Though the system is not acceptable to God, it nevertheless has stamped its mark on the whole world.

Everyone has participated in it. American culture is an Israelite adaptation of the head of gold. All other nations have absorbed its qualities, putting their own particular twists on them. The same basic system pervades the world—and as it is practiced, it is anti-Christ.

The only thing keeping it from completely over coming the world of today is the Holy Spirit in the hearts of believers. Once the Rapture happens, HE, the Holy Spirit will be removed and then the ANT_CHRIST will be revealed and all hell will break out.

Because of its attractiveness, its magnetism, and because all are defenseless before conversion, it has impressed itself upon God's people. Babylon is the world Christians must separate themselves from.

 

[Major1]

That can be dangerous, don't you think? Labeling someone as "racist" which is very condescending and a huge slam to their character... when they are not "racist". They are prejudiced to the actions of a certain religious group.

Now, for me, I work with Muslims... nice people. We get along just fine and I have absolutely no concern about what God or god you want to worship or how you worship...

I could care less what religion you are or how your particular sect of a certain religion believe.

BUT... start killing people or insulting people or hurting them in any way... for any reason or under the name of your god or religion... is wrong .........no matter what your excuse..

So, in the end, people are wary of people of the Muslim religion simply due to the track record of people doing things based on their view of that religion.
It is not racism... it is a learned fear. A learned and cultivated instinctive protective reaction.

A small number of deranged people use a certain religion as a springboard and justification of terrible acts.... It's wrong... But the fact that people are cautious is a natural and protective reaction.

We should not be insulted because of this.


If someone was to go out and kill a bunch of random people... and claim that Jesus told them to... the whole of the Christian religious followers would be strong, loud and vocal that this is totally against Christ's way..

I would like to see more of that from the leaders of Muslims... I think, that they too are afraid of being in danger of doing so, however.

Sorry for being off topic.

I hear you. I know what you are saying and I am assuming that you are living and working in America.
That would allow you to say that you had not seen or been involved in any racist or predigest actions.

However, have you ever been to a Muslim controlled country??? Say Pakistan or Saudi Arabia??

An example is that when in Pakistan, doing work on children who have been damaged by exploding mines and such, for free, eye surgeons and doctors are told specifically not to ever say the words.....
"JESUS CHRIST'. Doing so can mean DEATH to them.

 

[JacksBratt]

I hear you. I know what you are saying and I am assuming that you are living and working in America.
That would allow you to say that you had not seen or been involved in any racist or predigest actions.

However, have you ever been to a Muslim controlled country??? Say Pakistan or Saudi Arabia??

An example is that when in Pakistan, doing work on children who have been damaged by exploding mines and such, for free, eye surgeons and doctors are told specifically not to ever say the words.....
"JESUS CHRIST'. Doing so can mean DEATH to them.

That's still not "racism". It's religious persecution.... big difference.

 

[Shimokita]

I've heard that if you were baptized in a Catholic church, you will always technically be considered a Catholic even if you go to another denomination. Is this true?

Yes.

What about adult converts who were baptized in a Protestant church but was later received into the Catholic church? Since they were not baptized in the Catholic church, will they be no longer considered a Catholic if they revert to their Protestant faith?

No.

 

[Shimokita]

I think it's disrespectful to people who wish to step away from their Church.

Why do you think it is disrespectful?