A Corporeal Return? Says Who?

Residential Bob

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Jesus tells Caiaphas that he is coming in power in the clouds of heaven (Mt 26:64). Yes, clouds of heaven; not a stratus cloud, a cumulus cloud, or a fog hovering over a lake. Clouds of heaven.

Jesus also says that he will come “as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west.” (Mt 24:27) He comes as light from all directions. Also as the sound of the trumpet of God. (1 Thes 4:16). To repeat, a trumpet of God, not marching band brass.

The Bible does not describe a flesh-and-blood return of Christ.

When we consider all the ways that the Parousia is prophesied, we see that he comes everywhere. Lightning lights up the sky all around. The nature of his coming may elude us until we grasp it in the context of scripture. The way that Jesus comes—on clouds of heaven, as a call from God, as lightning—cannot be manifested in flesh and blood. A man cannot come in these ways. Christ’s advent is rather a return in power and spirit that the Scriptures corroborate. How much more glorious and momentous an advent that would be than to come in the body of a man.

Think about that for a moment, about limitations imposed on flesh and blood, even Christ’s. When in the flesh, Jesus performed miracles and amazed the crowds around him, and even some who heard by word of mouth. His miracles impacted locally. If he were to be a man again, what would change? What would his impact be globally and for all time? Would he really effect a worldwide utopia? Of course not. Even a return in power and spirit would not effect such an “idyllic” world. John the Divine says the wicked still live on the earth despite the presence of the kingdom. God’s kingdom does not vanquish evil from the world. It confronts evil and challenges it, but wickedness still persists outside the gates.

So where does the idea of a corporeal return come from? The church fathers? Dispensationalists? Who knows?

Certainly not from the Scriptures.
 

SeventyOne

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Zechariah 14:3-4
Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations as when he fights on a day of battle. On that day his feet shall stand on the Mount of Olives that lies before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall be split in two from east to west by a very wide valley, so that one half of the Mount shall move northward, and the other half southward.
 
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FireDragon76

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1) The Nicene Creed does not specify how Christ will return again, only that he will, to judge the living and the dead.

2) Jesus Christ is still a man, and will be a man forever. He did not renounce being a man after his ascension. If he were not a man, he could not be a priest and an intercessor for us.
 
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tampasteve

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If he does not return in flesh and blood and fulfill the remaining prophesies that were not fulfilled the first time around then he is and was not the messiah.
 
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FireDragon76

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Zechariah 14:3-4
Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations as when he fights on a day of battle. On that day his feet shall stand on the Mount of Olives that lies before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall be split in two from east to west by a very wide valley, so that one half of the Mount shall move northward, and the other half southward.

That could be interpreted non-literally, as an anthropomorphism. Neither Jews nor Christians believe feet pertain to a divine nature, per se.
 
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New Birth

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Acts 1:11 Which also said, ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
 
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Residential Bob

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If he does not return in flesh and blood and fulfill the remaining prophesies that were not fulfilled the first time around then he is and was not the messiah.
What "remaining prophesies" say he returns in flesh and blood?
 
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Residential Bob

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That could be interpreted non-literally, as an anthropomorphism. Neither Jews nor Christians believe feet pertain to a divine nature, per se.
Of course that's not literal. To assign physical limitations to the Lord, like feet, is to reduce him to a size that fits neatly into a futurist box.

Zechariah affirms Haggai's prophesies associated with the rebuilding of the Temple at Jerusalem after the exile. Zechariah found impetus to his prophetic activity in the revolts that broke out in the vassal states of the Persian empire. Any allusion of his to the Messianic Age do not hint that the messiah is merely a man.
 
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Residential Bob

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Acts 1:11 Which also said, ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Exactly. A cloud of heaven took him out of their sight.
 
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You do understand the concept of 3 heavens, right?
Yes first is the sky, second is what we would call space, third is where the throne of God is. The Apostles were looking up into and watching Jesus be taken up into the clouds of the First heaven. They were not looking up into the third heaven.
 
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Residential Bob

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says the definition of the word οὐρανόν (ouranon) used in Acts 1:11 and bible translators
Oh, yea, you mean the sky.

But back to the verse you cited:

"Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."​

The two angels challenge the apostles for looking up. Jesus was not taken up to the sky; he was exalted (epairō).

A cloud took him out of their sight.
 
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Residential Bob

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Yes first is the sky, second is what we would call space, third is where the throne of God is. The Apostles were looking up into and watching Jesus be taken up into the clouds of the First heaven. They were not looking up into the third heaven.
Not so. The apostles did not see Jesus floating up anywhere.

A cloud had taken him out of their sight.
 
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New Birth

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Oh, yea, you mean the sky.

But back to the verse you cited:

"Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."​

The two angels challenge the apostles for looking up. Jesus was not taken up to the sky; he was exalted (epairō).

A cloud took him out of their sight.
Jesus was not taken up to the sky? Where was this cloud located?
 
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Not so. The apostles did not see Jesus floating up anywhere.

A cloud had taken him out of their sight.
Are you serious? Read the verses its self explanatory. Acts 1:9-11
 
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Residential Bob

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Jesus was not taken up to the sky? Where was this cloud located?
Does it matter? It took him out of their sight. The two angels asked them why they would look up.

I will not read into it anything else, such as that he was taken up into the first heaven.
 
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Residential Bob

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Are you serious? Read the verses its self explanatory. Acts 1:9-11
When you say that Jesus was taken up into the first heaven, that is not self-explanatory. That is you. The Bible does not say that he was taken up into the first heaven.
 
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