As a Christian, how many of you believe in evolution?

[TagliatelliMonster]

I have no problem accepting evolution & the Bible. Even though the fall occurred 6000 year's ago, it was not a fall from a perfect creation. The accounts in Genisis does not say God made thing's perfect (As in immortal) it just says "God saw it was Good" it was good until humans wanted knowledge of good & evil. Even though God put other tree's in the garden to learn from, no, humans wanted only the tree of knowledge of good & evil

Why is it bad to have knowledge of good and evil?

 

[FatalFantasy]

Why is it bad to have knowledge of good and evil?

Because it is the primary force behind our sin nature. Humanity has split between who's good & who's evil, and Satan is that serpent who lives upon that tree tempting us to choose a side

Will you be good?
Will you be evil?
Or will you be neutral?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Because it is the primary force behind our sin nature.

Is it?

I'ld rather say that, if 'sin' means doing bad things, knowing the difference between good and bad is the best tool at our disposal to prevent ourselves from sinning....

Think about it....

You're basically saying that it's better to be a psychopath then an empathic person.
That's what psychopathy is: not knowing or understanding the difference between good and bad... Lacking the ability to make moral judgements through reason and empathy.

Humanity has split between who's good & who's evil

Is it? I disagree that people are evil. Or good, for that matter.
People aren't evil/good - their behaviour can be.

Evil/good is something one does, not something one is.

When Hitler was brushing his teeth, he wasn't doing any evil, for example.
We call him evil, because of his legacy. Because of the wicked stuff that he's done in his life and for which he is known for.

 

[FatalFantasy]

Is it?

I'ld rather say that, if 'sin' means doing bad things, knowing the difference between good and bad is the best tool at our disposal to prevent ourselves from sinning....

Think about it....

You're basically saying that it's better to be a psychopath then an empathic person.
That's what psychopathy is: not knowing or understanding the difference between good and bad... Lacking the ability to make moral judgements through reason and empathy.



Is it? I disagree that people are evil. Or good, for that matter.
People aren't evil/good - their behaviour can be.

Evil/good is something one does, not something one is.

When Hitler was brushing his teeth, he wasn't doing any evil, for example.
We call him evil, because of his legacy. Because of the wicked stuff that he's done in his life and for which he is known for.

"So as a man think's therefore he shall be"

It's your thinking that makes you act a certain way.

Question.

1: Is abortion good?
2: Is abortion evil?
3: Is abortion neither good or evil?
4: Is abortion good & evil?

If we continue to label what we think as good or evil, we will create a society of polar opposites.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

"So as a man think's therefore he shall be"

It's your thinking that makes you act a certain way.

Question.

1: Is abortion good?
2: Is abortion evil?
3: Is abortion neither good or evil?
4: Is abortion good & evil?

If we continue to label what we think as good or evil, we will create a society of polar opposites.

I'm really not going to get tangled up in a web of confusion and derailment by suddenly turning this into an abortion debate.

My point remains unaddressed.

How can you consiously decide to do good and not evil (or even vice versa, for that matter...), if you aren't even aware of what the difference is between both?

How can you make moral judgements about anything, if you don't understand the difference between good and bad?


What is a "good person" if not someone who actively and consciously tries to avoid doing bad, while also actively and consciously tries to do the good thing in whatever situation he/she find him/herself in?

And how do you do that, if you don't know what "good" and "bad" means? If you are unable to distinguish both?

 

[David_AB]

I have no problem accepting evolution & the Bible. Even though the fall occurred 6000 year's ago, it was not a fall from a perfect creation. The accounts in Genisis does not say God made thing's perfect (As in immortal) it just says "God saw it was Good" it was good until humans wanted knowledge of good & evil. Even though God put other tree's in the garden to learn from, no, humans wanted only the tree of knowledge of good & evil

So when did death enter creation?

 

[Speedwell]

So when did death enter creation?

When humans became capable of contemplating their own mortality--either by eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, or by some evolutionary process, depending on your point of view. Before that there was no death, only cessation of life.

 

[Aman777]

So when did death enter creation?

When God brought matter into the physical world apart from Himself, darkness or death entered the creation. Anything apart from God is subject to death.

 

[David_AB]

When humans became capable of contemplating their own mortality--either by eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, or by some evolutionary process, depending on your point of view. Before that there was no death, only cessation of life.

What's the difference between death and cessation of life?
They sound like the same thing but using different words.

 

[Speedwell]

What's the difference between death and cessation of life?
They sound like the same thing but using different words.

In this context, cessation of life is just something that happens, has always happened, to all organic beings. Death, on the other hand, is the awareness of the inevitability of the cessation of life. It requires a level of self-aware intelligence not thought to be possessed by other creatures who do not appear to be aware of the possibility that their lives will inevitably end. Sin has the same origin in self-aware intelligence which gives us the capacity to contemplate the consequences of our acts.

The Garden story gets it right in a figurative way, as pointed out by St. Paul, that the eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the acquiring of self-aware intelligence, brought sin and death into the world.

 

[Aman777]

How can you make moral judgements about anything, if you don't understand the difference between good and bad?

What is a "good person" if not someone who actively and consciously tries to avoid doing bad, while also actively and consciously tries to do the good thing in whatever situation he/she find him/herself in?

And how do you do that, if you don't know what "good" and "bad" means? If you are unable to distinguish both?

Being separated from God is to be separated from good since ONLY God is good or perfect. Mar 10:18

Today, we live in bodies of flesh apart from God and we cannot be perfect even as God is perfect. Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

A good person is one who has been born Spiritually and Eternally in Christ. The only good thing about them is the Holy Spirit inside them. Amen?

 

[FatalFantasy]

So when did death enter creation?

Spiritual death occurred 6000 years ago, however physical death was always in Gods plan.

Ask yourself this question.

If Jesus was sinless, how did he die? If physical death is a result of sin nature, does that mean Jesus was blemished by the sin of Adam & Eve?

 

[Justatruthseeker]

So when did death enter creation?

The moment it was created.....

Why was Adam expelled from the garden? "lest he stretch forth his hand and eat also of the tree of life and live forever" Genesis 3:22

So Adam or life generally was never immortal....... They were simply closer to genetic perfection, mutations had not yet corrupted our genome and so lives were longer....... only the promise of immortality was ever given, if conditions were met....

 

[xianghua]

What exactly are you expecting to see in a transtional? Something with half a wing or half a eye? Because that's not how it works. And why would a photo be more informative than a drawing? Do you think that the drawings are just made up instead of being of the actual fossils themselves?



That's because all science is provisional, not absolute. That's a strength, not a weakness.



The "photos, not drawings" shtick is a hollow objection. The drawings are based on actual fossils and it's not like you or me or any other layperson has enough anatomical knowledge to get more meaningful information from a photo vs. a drawing.

But since you ask...
View attachment 250423
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What do you mean by "the first cell"? I keep seeing that specific verbiage from Creationists and it's very imprecise. Do you mean the first primordial living organism that reproduced and passed on genetic material to offspring?



These sorts of claims are laughable. Scientists are going to be surprised that the observations of evolution they've been making for the last 170 years don't exist and that mutations don't "add information"

Also, what do you meany by "one kind into another"? Could you give us a hypothetical example of what you mean by that?

actually your fossils may be out of place because of this finding:

Oldest Antarctic Whale Found; Shows Fast Evolution

if its true then a fully whale predate most of the suppose "missing links".

 

[the iconoclast]

Let's say that you had lots of individuals in a population, each with different shaped ear canals. Some are straight, others are convoluted. Animals that get damage to the eardrum are less likely to hear warning calls or the approach of a predator. Thus, they are more likely to be killed by a predator. Animals with convoluted ear canals are more likely to survive encounters with predators because they are likely to have intact eardrums and thus are likely to hear the warning calls and the predator.

Tell me, which individuals do you think are most likely to pass their genes on more?

Hey hey kylie

I think im a week away from replying to you. Been very busy, everyone wants me

Thank you for your patience.

Hey hey @TagliatelliMonster my dear. Our conversation will continue shortly

Looks like @46AND2 cannot defend his statement ie a leprechaun/unicorn hybrid.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Being separated from God is to be separated from good since ONLY God is good or perfect. Mar 10:18

Today, we live in bodies of flesh apart from God and we cannot be perfect even as God is perfect. Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

A good person is one who has been born Spiritually and Eternally in Christ. The only good thing about them is the Holy Spirit inside them. Amen?

That didn't answer my question(s), at all.

 

[the iconoclast]

Let's say that you had lots of individuals in a population, each with different shaped ear canals. Some are straight, others are convoluted. Animals that get damage to the eardrum are less likely to hear warning calls or the approach of a predator. Thus, they are more likely to be killed by a predator. Animals with convoluted ear canals are more likely to survive encounters with predators because they are likely to have intact eardrums and thus are likely to hear the warning calls and the predator. Tell me, which individuals do you think are most likely to pass their genes on more?

Hey kylie

This was a good idea my dear! We can keep chatting while i get through our original conversation. I will be completely unshackled soon. Fun!

Anways you can always hold it over me, if i dont reply - wishful thinking. Now you have some collateral

I found this statement rather intriguing.

Lets use this same idea with giraffes. Benefit seems to be the key word here. Remember that word as it will come up somewhere. Easter egg!

Im fun... right?

Let's say that you had lots of proto-giraffes ie D and H - for need of a better term, maybe you can help, what was the ancestor of a giraffe? - in a population, each with different shaped necks.

There are many trees some are tall, others are not. Proto-giraffe H, with slightly shorter necks will not get these leaves. Thus, they are more likely to die from starvation .

Proto-giraffe D with slightly longer necks will. These marvellous animals with slightly longer neck are more likely to survive because they can eat all those nutritious leaves and thus are likely to not too starve so easily.

What you think my dear kylie?

Please excuse my attention to detail. This does not yet suggest anything about random processes v risk analysis. You will now need to explain how 2 similar animals with different ear cannals came through a random process?

Also this opens up some interesting questions.

The giraffe has a long neck, a huge heart - that pumps a certain amount of kpa to the head. It also has special valves in its neck to prevent this pressure from causing damage to the animal, when it bends over. These 3 moving parts appear to be a solution.

How do you explain this when we consider a random process compared to design?

Kylie - "which individuals do you think are most likely to pass their genes on more?"

How about you tell me while and consider the below section into your thinking?

The Gene pool! Homosexuality cannot pass on its genes therefore is no benefit to the gene pool. Does this mean homosexuality is a dead end from an evolutionary POV?

What does that mean when we consider how vital reproduction is to human evolution?

Cheers you diamond

 

[kkamagwi]

Evolution occurs on the microevolutionary level.

 

[the iconoclast]

Evolution occurs on the microevolutionary level.

Hey there my new friend.

Please excuse me. Was this post addressed to me?

 

[NBB]

In this context, cessation of life is just something that happens, has always happened, to all organic beings. Death, on the other hand, is the awareness of the inevitability of the cessation of life. It requires a level of self-aware intelligence not thought to be possessed by other creatures who do not appear to be aware of the possibility that their lives will inevitably end. Sin has the same origin in self-aware intelligence which gives us the capacity to contemplate the consequences of our acts.

The Garden story gets it right in a figurative way, as pointed out by St. Paul, that the eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the acquiring of self-aware intelligence, brought sin and death into the world.

I don't want to sound 'dramatic' but it seems you have a different 'religion', just because you got stuck with evolution. Why God would put a soul and spirit and call it to his liking in a evolved ape that he did not even precisely design, that doesn't make any sense.
And i'm pretty sure we have a soul and spirit. Don't you know that our soul and spirit is meant to go with our bodies along, as something that matchs/works together?