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As a Christian, how many of you believe in evolution?

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by DecstarG, Jan 12, 2019.

  1. Yes, evolution occurs.

  2. No, evolution does not occur.

  3. I'm not sure.

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    I am curious if any Christians believe that evolution occurs (take careful note of the phrase, "evolution occurs" it means if it has happened or will happen, regardless of whether or not humans evolved from other primates). Please take the time to answer, thanks for any responses.


    (For full disclosure I am atheist)

    ** Convenient definition of evolution for those unsure: Evolution is changes in a life form due to mutations in their genetic code, leading to the success or failure (or neither) of the mutation, leading to the mutated creature having more success mating, therefore passing on the improved gene or no success, leading to the gene not being passed on. Or to put it simply, changes in a life form over time. **
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
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  2. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

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    If we define evolution as changes in life forms over time, yes, I believe in evolution.
     
  3. ml5363

    ml5363 Active Member

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    I do think things can change and modify over time...however I do no believe we evolve from a little amoba creature...

    Things can evolve such as people are taller or shorter these days...or like fish in a cave nearby have evolved and are blind because they are in darkness now...etc
     
  4. morse86

    morse86 Junior Member

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    Any one that objectively examines the evidence and the history, can tell evolution is garbage.
     
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  5. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    I would define evolution as changes in a life form due to mutations in their genetic code, leading to the success or failure (or neither) of the mutation, leading to the mutated creature having more success mating, therefore passing on the improved gene or no success, leading to the gene not being passed on. Or to put it simply, yes, changes in a life form over time.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
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  6. JCFantasy23

    JCFantasy23 In a Kingdom by the Sea. Staff Member Administrator Supporter CF Senior Ambassador Angels Team

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    I do believe evolution occurs and has occurred in different life forms. I'm still not convinced humans came from apes, but animals and other matter clearly have evolved over time, usually to adapt to change so they can survive.
     
  7. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    Oh, I forgot to mention in my previous post, evolution and creation are not mutually exclusive, but only if you are willing to change the ~5000 years ago creation date to a couple billion years. (Just to clarify).
     
  8. Jonaitis

    Jonaitis Pilgrim

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    Yeah, evolution can mean many things, actually.

    I do believe in adaptation, the change that can occur in a species of an animal due to their long residence in a certain environment or climate. This answers the question how all the animals could fit in the Ark, it was before adaptation took place when there may have been just one kind of species of each animal. The same goes for the way different people look different in different regions on earth.

    I don't believe in Human Evolution, that all of life on earth came from an single cell that developed over millions of years, and that we share a common ancestor with all animals, especially with the modern ape.
     
  9. Mark Quayle

    Mark Quayle Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Many christians are revolted by my stand on this. But if God is indeed the one and only Self-existent, Omnipotent, Creator of everything else, he can do whatever he wants and make it look however he wants and take as long as he wants and make it happen within 6000 years, and not be lying. It maybe took 14 billion --what do I know?

    Our own resident Geniuses --Einstein, Hawking and so on-- say time is relative, as also, therefore, is space. If it was expanding rapidly, say, from our point of view now, beginning 14 billion years ago, why would it look any different if from this place we have been the last 6000 years or so, it only took a day?

    We do our computations, and then someone says, but......

    As my dad was known to say, "How old was Adam when God made him"?

    If God is God, he can do anything he wants, and doesn't owe us an explanation. That doesn't mean he doesn't delight in watching us figure things out, and maybe even give a nudge now and then in the right direction, or a hand on the head to make us realize maybe he did do it after all.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
  10. Strathos

    Strathos No one important

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    The question as you have framed it is too vague, and different people will give different responses depending on how they interpret it. I made a poll a while ago that gave more detailed options, but I can't find it now.
     
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  11. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    I clarified the appropriate definition of evolution to use in your answer in another post. Here is the quote:
    To clarify for you, do you think that evolution occurs, or does it not. I don't see how it is too vague. I clarified the OP for any others though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
  12. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I've never heard of evolution, micro or macro, being defined by more success in mating. Please give an example.
     
  13. PloverWing

    PloverWing Episcopalian

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    I assume that by "changes in a life form", you mean changes in a population through successive generations, not changes in a single individual. Yes?
     
  14. DreamerOfTheHeart

    DreamerOfTheHeart I Am What I Am

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    Read 'origin of the species' when I was 13. Read all of Dawkins books, to get their view on matters, a few years ago.

    Ultimately, what you are talking about is the ancient Babylonian create myth: humans were created by the primordial forces of chaos.

    People often treat "science" as if it is inerrant. They believe there is no flaw in the scientific method, nor in the concept of a 'consensus of experts'.

    These beliefs, are demonstrably flawed.

    As for the scientific method, unfortunately, it relies on a concept of objective observation. Objective observation can be... not so objective.

    And it does not have a way of handling subjectivity as influencing results, as as seen on the quantum level, or seen in cognitive behavioral sciences.

    Not even mentioning the fact, that creation its' self might present false evidence to people, because they are unwilling to believe God.

    That is, 'reality' is not what people think it is.

    We are told, in the end, God will send the world a great lie. Because they refuse to believe. What we have these days is one great lie, right here. Though, of course, the world is, and has been, full of many great lies.
     
  15. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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    I know of nobody who believes this.
     
  16. SinoBen

    SinoBen Active Member

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    I wonder if you are conflating theories of evolution with natural selection.

    But using a different albeit standard definition if it can be called that:
    Macro evolution - nah.... highly sceptical about that
    Micro evolution - sure.... the changes are "horizontal" not "vertical" so still just variation of the same species.
     
  17. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    I'm going to respond to four comments, one from @DreamerOfTheHeart another from @PloverWing and one from @Hank77 finally one from @SinoBen.

    I will start with @PloverWing, yes.

    I will then move onto @Hank77, I apologise, I assumed that everyone would get the implied subtext of that, but I now realise I was too general. I meant the whole process of those with non-beneficial mutations dying before they mate and those with beneficial mutations being more likely to mate. Sorry for the confusion.

    Next @SinoBen (and partially @Hank77 because they made the same mistake), macro and micro evolution are NOT seperate theories. They are the same thing just on different timescales, please just say I think evolution exists on a short timescale.

    Finally @DreamerOfTheHeart,
    What? Quantum physics can be predicted accurately with statistics, P(up)=sin(theta)^2 is the formula for predicting the chance of the direction of the spin on a quantum particle being up. Everything is predictable. Even cognitive behaviour is likely predictable because studies show that decisions are likely made in our brain before we know it and then we are given the illusion of deciding to do it.

    In addition to that, your assertion that creation is certain to exist, and as such evolution can not, is complete garbage. Creation and evolution are not mutually exclusive, as I made crystal clear in a previous post. Even if the Earth is 5000 years old and created by a god, than evolution will still occur regardless. I made the question crystal clear, and it appears that you believe that it doesn't occur despite the insurmountable evidence against you. Please reconsider your response and then reply to me.
     
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  18. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    God planned and executes the orbit of each electron in the Cosmos.
    It all looks "natural" to us.
     
  19. DecstarG

    DecstarG We know that we know nothing.

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    So we don't have free will? I do believe that the bible explicitly states that God gave humans free will...

    Galatians 5:13
     
  20. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I don't think your premise is necessarily true. Take Darwin's finches for example, do you think your premise would have been true in this case?


    No they are not separate theories but they are different even though the same mechanisms apply.

    Microevolution is simply a change in gene frequency within a population. Evolution at this scale can be observed over short periods of time — for example, between one generation and the next, the frequency of a gene for pesticide resistance in a population of crop pests increases.
    Macroevolution encompasses the grandest trends and transformations in evolution, such as the origin of mammals and the radiation of flowering plants.
    What is macroevolution?
     
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