ROMANS 7 AND ROMANS 8 GOD'S LAW ABOLISHED? OR IS IT SIN? PART 3
Now let's move on looking at both
ROMANS 7 and
ROMANS 8 a little further building on what we have already provided scripure wise and show what is being referred to in
ROMANS 7 and
ROMANS 8 when it talks about the
FLESH or the
CARNAL MIND which is all through those chapters..
THE LAW OF SIN AND DEATH (G4561 sinful human nature; the Flesh or Carnal mind)
ROMANS 7 AND
ROMANS 8
Indeed,
ROMANS 7 is talking about the experience of the UNCONVERTED man and the law of SIN and DEATH (Sinful nature). It concludes in v24-25
Paul is talking about his present life as a Christian. He's not speaking about his life prior to conversion. Paul is using different words translated carnal in 7 and 8. You don't discuss them. G4561 is also translated flesh. So I need you to discuss all the verses and words of those verses with carnal or flesh in them to know what you're talking about. The word flesh is G4561 in Romans except one time it's G29007 referencing sacrificed animals. 14:21
[24], O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
[25], I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. SO THEN WITH THE MIND I MYSELF SERVE THE LAW OF GOD ; but with the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature> the law of sin (not Born again).
Slavation from SIN is found in Jesus Christ (Saviour) ....
Amen! here. Problem is you teach and promote one has to also keep the law for salvation. Do I need to start quoting EGW? You simply can't prove that from the Bible. To do so you have to have both salvation by Jesus and the law in the same verse or sentence. No where is the law mentioned in regard to salvation. Yes you'll quote Mat 19 and MK 10 as proof. But you can't show by either salvation was granted. You can't show that salvation was granted to anyone by keeping the law (famous 10) in the Bible.
SO then with the
MIND I serve the LAW of GOD....
Sound familiar?
HEBREWS 8:10 [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MINDS AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people
links to..
EZEKIEL 36:26-27 [26], A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you a heart of flesh. [27], And I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT WITHIN YOU, AND CAUSE YOU TO WALK IN MY STATUTES AND YOU SHALL KEEP MY JUDGEMENTS AND DO THEM.
No, but you link them. I don't believe Eze 36:26-27 is linked to the New Covenant because it's limited to blood line Jews only. The NT clearly teaches the New Covenant includes the whole world. I believe Eze 36:26-27 is talking about what happens after what we call the second coming. The Jews are still looking for a physical king delivering them from other rulers. It's a primary reason they didn't accept Jesus as Messiah the first time.
Romans 8 continue the same...
ROMANS 8:1-14
[1], There is therefore now no condemnation to them who are in Christ Jesus, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE
FLESH <
G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT <
Ezekiel 36:26-27;
Hebrews 8:10;
Jeremiah 31:31-34;
NEW COVENANT PROMISE>.
True. The law regulates the carnal body of flesh. You seem to claim it regulates the soul providing righteousness. Rom 8:3 says the law isn't effective in this endeavor. Yes the law comes up very short in this aspect. The reason isn't really what at least I'm discussing. You claim it can do that. The Bible says no and proves it.
[2], FOR THE LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS <
Ezekiel 36:26-27;
Hebrews 8:10;
Jeremiah 31:31-34; NEW COVENANT PROMISE> has made me
free from the
law of sin and death <carnal mind or sinful human nature>.
What makes us free from the law of sin and death (the law, famous ten by context)?
[3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>: [4], That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>, but after the Spirit.
You need to read what this quote says and believe it (make it your own). Nothing we do in the flesh creates the righteousness God demands. That can only be had through the substitutional work of Jesus Christ.
[5], For they that are after the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature> do mind the things of the flesh <G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
That's the performance you demand. You follow after the flesh and the carnal law regulating it.
[6], For to be carnally <G4561 same grk word used as FLESH; Carnal mind or sinful human nature> minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Amen! You promote this death by trying to regulate the body with the law. We can discuss this fact in some detail. You won't like it.
[7], Because the carnal mind <G4561 same grk word used as FLESH; Carnal mind or sinful human nature> is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Need I say more?
1 Cor 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas
there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
Heb 9:10
Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed
on them until the time of reformation.
Ordinances are and include the law (famous 10).
[8], So then they that are in the flesh <G4561 same grk word used as CARNAL ; Carnal/FLESH = carnal mind or sinful human nature> cannot please God.
Your claim is indeed we can. Best wishes.
[9], But you are not in the
flesh <G4561 same grk word used as CARNAL ; Carnal/FLESH = carnal mind or sinful human nature> , but in the
Spirit <
Ezekiel 36:26-27;
Hebrews 8:10;
Jeremiah 31:31-34; NEW COVENANT PROMISE>, if so be that the
Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
These have already been covered by me to you. Hebrews 8:10 is a partial quote of Jeremiah 31:31-33, a single sentence proving your intention to be in error.
[10], And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Where does this righteousness come from? Is it the law? Rom 3-4 says no. Specifically 3:21 backed by Rom 4 talking about both those who didn't have the law and those the did and sin greatly.
[11], But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also bring to life your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwells in you.
This verse has nothing to do with raising our physical bodies from the dead. It does deal with having a vibrant physical life because of the results the Spirit has on our soul.
[12], Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh <G4561 same grk word used as CARNAL ; Carnal/FLESH = carnal mind or sinful human nature>, to live after the flesh.
Yes and Amen! We owe nothing to our physical bodies when it comes to our relationship with God.
[13], For if you live after the flesh <G4561 same grk word used as CARNAL ; Carnal/FLESH = carnal mind or sinful human nature>, you shall die: but if you through the Spirit do put to death the deeds of the body, you shall live.
What are the deeds of the body? Don't you use -
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
to prove obligation to the law? Paul calls them works of the flesh (G4561).
[14], For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Here Paul says the sons of God aren't led by the law. You have no NT verse saying the Spirit leads one to the law.
..................
Returning back to your
ROMANS 7:5-9
[5], For when we were in the
flesh <G4561 same grk word used as CARNAL ; Carnal/FLESH = carnal mind or sinful human nature>, the passions of sins, which were by the law <KNOWLEDGE OF SIN>, did work in our members <SIN> to bring forth fruit unto death <
ROMANS 6:23, The WAGES OF SIN is DEATH>.
[6], But now we are
delivered from the law <penalty and condemnation>
, being dead to that in which we were held; <SIN> that we should serve in
newness of spirit, <NEW COVENANT PROMISE OF THE SPIRIT;
Ezekiel 36:26-27; Jeremiar 31:31-33;
Hebrews 8:10-12> and
not in the oldness of the letter (KNOWLEDGE OF SIN).
You're very self contradictory here quoting this verse. See my red emphasis of your post. You clearly promote adherence to the letter (famous 10).
ROMANS 7:6 [6], But now, by
dying to what once bound us <SIN>, we have been released from the law (condemnation and penalty for breaking it through forgiveness> so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.
Please read what you posted. Read only what the verse says. It clearly says "we have been released from the law."
Q. What was it that God's LAW shows in
ROMANS 7 that has
bound us? Let's go back to the verse that is before....
ROMANS 7:5 [5], For when we were in the
FLESH <
G4561 Carnal mind or sinful human nature>, the motions of
SINS, which were by the law,
did work in our members to bring forth fruit to death.
A. It is SIN that has bound us!
<*
NOTE: the key to this verse is
delivered from the law, being dead to that in which we were held. The law revived and I died... Why? Because the LAW gave a KNOWLEDDGE of SIN. It is SIN that God's LAW holds us to. It is SIN that we are delivered from not God's LAW.>
Oh the law revived.
................
CONCLUSION:
ROMANS 7 and
ROMANS 8 are talking about the NEW COVENANT promise of SALVATION from SIN; not salvation in SIN. We are not released from God's LAW (10 Commandments) as it is the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is. We are released from SIN and the PENALTY of SIN and the law of SIN and DEATH (7v5-25; 8v2 6v23) by walking in the Spirit of the NEW COVENANT (8v1) we do not fulfill the lusts of the flesh (SIN). If you have not died to that which holds you captive (SIN) you are not released from the LAW you are UNDER the LAW Guilty before God of SIN.
Will just add part 4 which will add
ROMANS 6...
This conclusion is against Rom 7:6 by your adding things that the verse doesn't say.
Please note I had to break your post here to respond.