Eschatological and Millennial Theories and their problems.

[BABerean2]

You don't have a doctorate in geology either !

So, you think that people outside of any buildings ----let say farmers in an open field without any thing that risk to fall on them can be killed because the ground is shaking badly ? Seriously !

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/4j5oTgfvHtY/maxresdefault.jpg

Dr. Riberra,

I don't have a doctorate, but I used to teach the subject of geology. My students used math and geometry to calculate the epicenter of an earthquake. They knew the difference between a P-wave and an S-wave.

The following shows what happened during 1964 in Alaska.

Have you ever heard of the ground cracking open and swallowing people, boats, and water?

Have you ever heard of the ground changing from a solid to a liquid?

Have you ever heard of a Tsunami?

Better get out your geology textbook for this one...

.

 

[Douggg]

If you read Revelation chronologically you will run into difficulties.

But the order in terms of time can be determined from Revelation.

 

[BABerean2]

But the order in terms of time can be determined from Revelation.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

.

 

[Riberra]

and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Why bother to destroy those who destroy the Earth if as you claim Jesus will destroy the Earth at His coming ?

 

[Riberra]

Dr. Riberra,

I don't have a doctorate, but I used to teach the subject of geology. My students used math and geometry to calculate the epicenter of an earthquake. They knew the difference between a P-wave and an S-wave.

The following shows what happened during 1964 in Alaska.

Have you ever heard of the ground cracking open and swallowing people, boats, and water?

Are you saying that nobody LIVING IN ALASKA have survived the 1964 earthquake in Alaska ?

Have you ever heard of the ground changing from a solid to a liquid?

That depend upon the type of soil and if there is an underground aquifer with enough water to create the process of liquefaction.

Have you ever heard of a Tsunami?

Sure

Better get out your geology textbook for this one…

Discovery channel give very good geological explanation about earthquakes...

 

[BABerean2]

Why bother to destroy those who destroy the Earth if as you claim Jesus will destroy the Earth at His coming ?

Who is the judge at the bodily resurrection and judgment of all the dead in the passage below?

Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

The timing of the event is found in the verse below.
Your Bible says the same thing.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

...........................................

Nobody in Alaska went through an earthquake that destroyed every mountain in Alaska, much less the whole planet...

.

 

[Riberra]

Who is the judge at the bodily resurrection and judgment of all the dead in the passage below?

Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

That is talking about the Great White Throne Judgment who will happen 1,000 YEARS AFTER THE RESURRECTIOn REWARD FOR THE SAINTS MARTYRS MENTIONED IN REVELATION 20:4-6

Remember that PETER tell us that the Day of The LORD WILL LAST 1,000 years.

 

[Riberra]

Nobody in Alaska went through an earthquake that destroyed every mountain in Alaska, much less the whole planet…

Have you read what follow Revelation 16:18 the planet is not destroyed in chunks of rocks floating in space ...the text says that the CITIES OF THE NATIONS FELL.

 

[BABerean2]

That is talking about the Great White Throne Judgment who will happen 1,000 YEARS AFTER THE RESURRECTIOn REWARD FOR THE SAINTS MARTYRS MENTIONED IN REVELATION 20:4-6

Remember that PETER tell us that the Day of The LORD WILL LAST 1,000 years.

And that is why the timing of the event is right after the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, when He judges both the living and the dead. (2 Timothy 4:1) (Matthew 25:31-46) (2 Thessalonians 1:7-10)

.

 

[Douggg]

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

.

When in Revelation 20, does it say the dead are judged?

 

[BABerean2]

When in Revelation 20, does it say the dead are judged?

When the fire comes...

2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
2Th 1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

And when is the time of the judgment of the dead found in Revelation chapter 11?

.

 

[Riberra]

And that is why the timing of the event is right after the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible,

Wrong ...The 7 Trumpets mentioned in Revelation announce 7 Plagues and are part of the Tribulation [Revelation 8 ...Revelation 9 ]..and later Satan and his angels will be cast out of Heaven during the 7Th Trumpet plague, which will include the 42 months Reign of the Beast...who will precede the Coming of Jesus.

The LAST TRUMPET IN THE BIBLE will sound AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS and is mentioned in Matthew 24:29-31

As you can see Scriptures prove you wrong again...

 

[BABerean2]

The LAST TRUMPET IN THE BIBLE will sound AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE and is mentioned in Matthew 24:29-31

You have the above right.

If that is not the 7th trumpet found in Revelation 11:15-18, show us the 8th trumpet...

.

 

[Riberra]

You have the above right.

If that is not the 7th trumpet found in Revelation 11:15-18, show us the 8th trumpet...

Very easily ....
-7 Trumpets plagues during the Tribulation of those Days ....

-And finally THE TRUMP OF GOD/VOICE OF GOD SOUNDING THE GATHERING OF THE ELECT AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS Mentioned in Matthew 24:29-31

Do the count.

 

[BABerean2]

Very easily ....
-7 Trumpets plagues during the Tribulation of those Days ....

-And finally THE TRUMP OF GOD/VOICE OF GOD SOUNDING THE GATHERING OF THE ELECT AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS Mentioned in Matthew 24:29-31

Do the count.

I have done the count.

There is no 8th trumpet in the Book of Revelation.


Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Eph_5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.


The "mystery" of God is finished at the sounding of the 7th trump.

.

 

[TribulationSigns]

I have done the count.

There is no 8th trumpet in the Book of Revelation.


Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Eph_5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.


The "mystery" of God is finished at the sounding of the 7th trump.

.

Yes, The mystery of God is the building of Christ's church as a representation of God's kingdom on Earth. The building of the church will be finished when the seventh trumpet sounds which is OUR "last trump." Consider what Paul wrote:

Romans 11:25-27 KJV
[25] For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
[26] And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
[27] For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.​

What covenant? The covenant that Christ has confirmed at the Cross (Daniel 9:27) to take away the sins of His people, Israel. And THIS is the mystery of the purpose of the Church where the fullness of the Gentiles be coming in, even so, ALL COVENANT ISRAEL shall be saved. Done for! All Elects that God has secured, starting with Adam to the Last Elect. Then comes the end when the Seventh Trumpet shall sound. That will be the Second Coming, as well as the rapture for those who are "alive and remain" at the last trump.

 

[Douggg]

When the fire comes...

2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
2Th 1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

And when is the time of the judgment of the dead found in Revelation chapter 11?

.

BaB2, it's a problem when you know what it says in the text,but don't want to face it.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[Douggg]

ALL COVENANT ISRAEL shall be saved.

It's a problem when you make up your own terms - not in the bible - changing the content of what Paul said.

 

[BABerean2]

BaB2, it's a problem when you know what it says in the text,but don't want to face it.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

That is a remarkable statement from someone who is willing to ignore "the time of the judgment of the dead" in Revelation 11:18, and the judgment of the living in Matthew 25:31-46, and Christ returning in "flaming fire" in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, and Christ judging both the living and the dead at His return in 2 Timothy 4:1.

Either the 1,000 years in Revelation 20 is symbolic of the Church Age, or all of the scripture above is wrong. That is the choice.

Maybe you think the two witnesses in Revelation 11 are two men made of wood and metal, since the text says they are the olive trees and candlesticks.

Which choice do you prefer?

.

 

[BABerean2]

It's a problem when you make up your own terms - not in the bible - changing the content of what Paul said.

2Co 3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away,
2Co 3:8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?



Can you show us a covenant referred to by Paul with the modern State of Israel, whose government is now made up of those who reject Christ?

1Jn 2:21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
1Jn 2:22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son.
1Jn 2:23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
1Jn 2:24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father.
1Jn 2:25 And this is the promise that He has promised us—eternal life.
1Jn 2:26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to deceive you.
1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.
1Jn 2:28 And now, little children, abide in Him, that when He appears, we may have confidence and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.
1Jn 2:29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him.

.