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Wherein I catch a professional YEC in a lie

DogmaHunter

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Amusing but sad. You still think pictures are evidence.

The picture shows how we obtained brussel sprouts, broccoli, kale, cabbage, cauliflower,......

And we obtained them in the exact way your quote I was responding to says doesn't happen.
They all come from a wild plant species. We created them by using the processes of evolution and selection. They evolved.
 
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omega2xx

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The picture shows how we obtained brussel sprouts, broccoli, kale, cabbage, cauliflower,......

Do you really not understand that evidence includes HOW it can happen?

And we obtained them in the exact way your quote I was responding to says doesn't happen.

No you didn't. You have pictures and say "SEE." That is meaningless.

They all come from a wild plant species. We created them by using the processes of evolution and selection. They evolved.

How did you do that? Do you use a magic wand that can overcome the laws of genetics?
 
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pitabread

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How did you do that? Do you use a magic wand that can overcome the laws of genetics?

It's true. Upon initiation, every farmer is issued a magical wand which allows them to transform naturally occurring flora into viable crops for human consumption.

You've now uncovered the secret behind human agriculture. Use that knowledge wisely.
 
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DogmaHunter

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Do you really not understand that evidence includes HOW it can happen?

I need to explain cultivation and agriculture to you?
See, farmers breed generations of plants and then choose which plants to create the next generation with. This is a selection process. It's called artificial selection (as opposed to natural selection, where the selection pressure is based on survival in the wild and reproductive success). The farmer uses a self-defined selection pressure to steer the evolution of the specimens in a certain direction.

To obtain kale for example, they selected for the larger leaves.

So, how do you explain that through generations of farming, we obtained all these very different vegetables from a single mother plant population?

Especially in contrast with your intial comment, that the plants in your garden "remained the same"? Well, this wild mustard plant surely changed quite a bit, hasn't it?

No you didn't.

Yes we did.

Just like we changed this:
upload_2018-3-31_20-50-24.png


into this:

upload_2018-3-31_20-51-41.png




You have pictures and say "SEE." That is meaningless.

It's about what the picture depicts.
But go ahead... keep on playing dumb.
You're just exposing the very weak position you find yourself in.

How did you do that?

By selecting for and/or against specific traits when selecting breeding pairs.

Do you use a magic wand that can overcome the laws of genetics?

Why would they need to be overcome?
Au contraire... it's exactly genetics that makes this process possible.
 
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HitchSlap

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Do you really not understand that evidence includes HOW it can happen?



No you didn't. You have pictures and say "SEE." That is meaningless.



How did you do that? Do you use a magic wand that can overcome the laws of genetics?
Did you know the banana was created by god to fit perfectly in the palm of your hand?
 
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tas8831

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speciation does not result in a new species.

You saw it here first, folks!

Speciation does not produce a new species!

And home construction does not make a new home!

Baking does not result in baked goods!

Dropping something does not result in something being dropped!

Amazing creation SCIENCE!!!!
 
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tas8831

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Amusing. You can't even understand such a simple, obvious proof. That is worse than amusing, it ispathetic.


I'm sorry - how was you telling me to plant corn 'proof' of anything?
 
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tas8831

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Do you use a magic wand that can overcome the laws of genetics?

You have been asked several times, by several people, in several threads, what these "laws of genetics" are.


Please lay them out for us all. I taught Genetics (undergrad) for the 5th time last year, so I can handle your in-depth scientific discourse.

To paraphrase a famous fake doctor, thrill us with your acumen.
 
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Speedwell

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I'm sorry - how was you telling me to plant corn 'proof' of anything?
If you plant corn every year, and each time buy the same genetically engineered hybrid, rather than using the seeds from the previous years crop, it proves that there is no such thing as heritable variation and so evolution cannot occur.
 
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tas8831

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If you plant corn every year, and each time buy the same genetically engineered hybrid, rather than using the seeds from the previous years crop, it proves that there is no such thing as heritable variation and so evolution cannot occur.
Ah, I stand corrected...
 
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tas8831

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Medical doctor Elizabeth Mitchell writes, in an essay on the 'Answers in Genesis' site in a caption of a Tiktaalik artistic rendition (note the bolding and/or italics I added for emphasis in both quotes):


In fact, the evolutionary imagination accords this fish’s hind-parts so much power, they believe it was ready for “pelvic-propelled locomotion”1 across the terrestrial world and up the evolutionary tree.​

The 1 links to this article:

N. Shubin et al., “Pelvic girdle and fin of Tiktaalik roseae,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (13 January 2014)


wherein one finds this passage - the only passage in which one finds the word "propelled":


Tiktaalik reveals that features contributing to the trend toward pelvic-propelled locomotion in the tetrapodomorph stem began emerging in finned taxa before being enhanced in more derived digited forms. Indeed, this trend has deep roots or parallel trajectories: diverse lungfish, both fossil
and extant, have pectoral and pelvic girdles that are subequal in size (17).​



Why do professional creationists lie like this? Is it because they have brainwashed their target audiences into bowing to their perceived authority so it doesn't matter?

Or are most of them just incompetent and don't know any better?

This is not, sadly, a rarity. YEC Dr.David Menton had written commentary on the pelvic bones of Tiktaalik, declaring them insufficient for land-based locomotion. Problem - at the time he wrote the article, the pelvic bones had not yet been discovered.

YEC Dr. Jeff Tomkins wrote an essay declaring that humans and chimps are really only about 70% similar, and thus could not have a shared ancestry. It was soon discovered that he had done 2 things - that he had used a version of BLASTn with known problems, and that he had constrained the program to return only sequence matches of prescribed lengths that were 100% matches - so if the program found a sequence in human that matched chimp in 9 out of 10 bases, it would come back as 0% identical, virtually guaranteeing that what he found would have a lower % identity than other analyses. When confronted with these problems, Tomkins doubled down and called his critics names (this played out on Reddit, not sure I want to link to it).

There are many other examples - but one has to wonder why, if they are so sure that they are correct, why do they engage in these acts of dishonesty?

And if they are acts of incompetence, why should their followers trust them?
Still curious as to why professional creationists are so likely to engage in these shallow and easily debunked/disproven claims.

Also curious as to why so many creationists will go through embarrassing mental gymnastics to try to defend these people when they get caught.
 
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Eight Foot Manchild

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Still curious as to why professional creationists are so likely to engage in these shallow and easily debunked/disproven claims.

Also curious as to why so many creationists will go through embarrassing mental gymnastics to try to defend these people when they get caught.

You can say anything when you're not burdened by reality.
 
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AV1611VET

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Amazing creation SCIENCE!!!!
Anawesyagottadu is take the word "creation" off the term and:

1. The Titanic wasn't unsinkable.

2. Thalidomide wasn't a prenatal wonder drug.

3. The Challenger wasn't GO for throttle-up.

4. The Deepwater Horizon wasn't safe for drilling.

5. Pluto wasn't our 9th planet.

6. L'Aquila wasn't safe to go back to.

7. The FIU footbridge wasn't destined to save lives.

Amazing misleading SCIENCE!!!!
 
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AV1611VET

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Also curious as to why so many creationists will go through embarrassing mental gymnastics to try to defend these people when they get caught.
I'll say this much: I wish they would stop doing that.
 
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Warden_of_the_Storm

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Anawesyagottadu is take the word "creation" off the term and:

1. The Titanic wasn't unsinkable.

2. Thalidomide wasn't a prenatal wonder drug.

3. The Challenger wasn't GO for throttle-up.

4. The Deepwater Horizon wasn't safe for drilling.

5. Pluto wasn't our 9th planet.

6. L'Aquila wasn't safe to go back to.

7. The FIU footbridge wasn't destined to save lives.

Amazing misleading SCIENCE!!!!

And you are once again using tragic events to boost up your own self. Sad. Just... so, so sad.
 
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Jimmy D

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And you are once again using tragic events to boost up your own self. Sad. Just... so, so sad.

Sums it up really, I was going to rise to the bait but's what the point? Trolls gonna troll.

Best to remember George Carlin's advice.
 
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Bungle_Bear

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Anawesyagottadu is take the word "creation" off the term and:

1. The Titanic wasn't unsinkable.

2. Thalidomide wasn't a prenatal wonder drug.

3. The Challenger wasn't GO for throttle-up.

4. The Deepwater Horizon wasn't safe for drilling.

5. Pluto wasn't our 9th planet.

6. L'Aquila wasn't safe to go back to.

7. The FIU footbridge wasn't destined to save lives.

Amazing misleading SCIENCE!!!!
Funny how you still can't distinguish between SCIENCE and journalism, management and pre-SCIENCE architecture. And better yet that you ignore the failings of the bible.

Point 5 - Pluto was out 9th planet. Please remind us all how many planets are identified in the bible? What number is Pluto?
 
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AV1611VET

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Point 5 - Pluto was out 9th planet. Please remind us all how many planets are identified in the bible? What number is Pluto?
What's your point?
 
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