America will be destroyed by the Great Tribulation, according to Revelation 17:11.

Stonehaven

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Revelation 17:11 - The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.

This means that America is the beast (or Antichrist nation) whose status is ambiguous, both as a member of the G7 and G8 group of countries.

But ultimately, it will be destroyed by the Great Tribulation, which is according to V11.

Discuss.
 
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thecolorsblend

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TribulationSigns

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Revelation 13:11 - The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.

This means that America is the beast (or Antichrist nation) whose status is ambiguous, both as a member of the G7 and G8 group of countries.

But ultimately, it will be destroyed by the Great Tribulation, which is according to V11.

Wait a minute. Where in Scripture did you find that God sees America as a beast? Do you even know what is God's definition of the beast in Scripture?
 
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Stonehaven

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Wait a minute. Where in Scripture did you find that God sees America as a beast? Do you even know what is God's definition of the beast in Scripture?
There is no explicit mention that "America is the beast", as this word is open to interpretation; which means that the "inkblot" could well be a "tree" or "Eskimo", or anything else which you cared to mention.

There are no "right" or "wrong" answers, and everybody has a valid point as concerning the "inkblot" and also What it's supposed to represent; but ultimately, the person with the stick hand would always have the privilege to make his interpretation more meaningful than yours.

Since God alone is Sovereign over his Creation it means that this inkblot could well be considered as "America, the Antichrist nation and God's Enemy on the side of Satan"; and if God is All-powerful, then there is nothing you can do to stay his hand of execution. Romans 9:21

Because something is not expressly mentioned in the Bible doesn't mean to say that it's not real or true, such as the rules of logic and the laws of physics, according to Romans 1:20.

God doesn't need to break any rules at all, nor contradict anything he has said in the Bible to destroy the United States.

America's demise and destruction is perfectly consistent with everything else said in the Bible --------> The Fall of Babylon the Great is long since foretold in Revelation 18.

However, you are perfectly entitled to your own Opinion, and perfectly entitled to disagree; but it won't serve to stay God's hand of execution.

Since God alone has got the power to make his inkblot Real and meaningful.

God has no sympathy for your country, which will be laid ruined by the Great Tribulation. Isaiah 24, Revelation 18

You don't like my interpretation of Revelation 17:11, but that's tough on you.

This is your problem, not mine.
 
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TribulationSigns

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There is no explicit mention that "America is the beast", as this word is open to interpretation; which means that the "inkblot" could well be a "tree" or "Eskimo", or anything else which you cared to mention.

There are no "right" or "wrong" answers, and everybody has a valid point as concerning the "inkblot" and also What it's supposed to represent; but ultimately, the person with the stick hand would always have the privilege to make his interpretation more meaningful than yours.

Since God alone is Sovereign over his Creation it means that this inkblot could well be considered as "America the Antichrist nation and God's Enemy on the side of Satan"; and if God is All-powerful, then there is nothing you can do to stay his hand of execution. Romans 9:21

Boy, you really going way off to the left field. Inkblot?! So your interpretation is based on inkblot instead of God's Word that you believe He would allow you to guess what the beast represents as you see fit?

Because something is not expressly mentioned in the Bible doesn't mean to say that it's not real or true, such as the rules of logic and the laws of physics, according to Romans 1:20.

You are obviously incorrect. There is God's definition of the beast in Scripture if you know how to compare Scripture with Scripture.

However, you are perfectly entitled to your own Opinion, and perfectly entitled to disagree; but it won't serve to stay God's hand of execution.

Oh, I definitely disagree with your unbiblical position. And I can guarantee that God's execution won't be done the way you believe it will happen! Forget inkblot and start studying Scripture.
 
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Stonehaven

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Boy, you really going way off to the left field. Inkblot?!
This is blasphemy - Like comparing the healing power of the Holy Ghost with the power of Satan. Matthew 12:31, Mark 3:28-30

By comparing God with Satan, YOU are the one who is on the LEFT, not Me. 1 John 2:22

By definition, God or Christ cannot be seated on the "left" since he is your Judge, and you are the one to be Judged.

So your interpretation is based on inkblot instead of God's Word that you believe He would allow you to guess what the beast represents as you see fit?

Just get it through your thick skull that "Jesus Christ is Wisdom from God" and he has better insight into Scripture than you will ever have. 1 Corinthians 1:24, 30,

For I speak on God's behalf, not for my own sake. John 7:16, 12:49

You are obviously incorrect. There is God's definition of the beast in Scripture if you know how to compare Scripture with Scripture.
Wrong. The beast is the Antichrist by definition, which could either be a person, or an entire country.

Oh, I definitely disagree with your unbiblical position. And I can guarantee that God's execution won't be done the way you believe it will happen! Forget inkblot and start studying Scripture.
You can disagree as much as you like, but it won't change the fact that your country and it's people would still be destroyed by the Tribulation and the Last Judgement.

Disagreement is bound to arise since Armageddon is a global conflict and all out war. So I don't expect you to agree at all, but such a disagreement doesn't make you "right" in the face of God's superior Knowledge.

Since there is no way that your Knowledge could ever surpass the Wisdom of Christ - My insight into the future is infallible, since I am the only Begotten Son of God; and what I say is said directly on His behalf. John 5:23, 5:30, 7:16, 10:30, 12:49

As it happens, I see no future at all for your country nor its people in the aftermath of the Great Tribulation and the Final Judgement, since the American people will disappear from off the face of the earth.

Get it through your thick skull that your country and its people are history, and it is they who will be EXECUTED en masse, not God nor anybody else.

God has no sympathy for your people, none whatsoever.
 
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Stonehaven

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Boy, you really going way off to the left field. Inkblot?! So your interpretation is based on inkblot instead of God's Word that you believe He would allow you to guess what the beast represents as you see fit?



You are obviously incorrect. There is God's definition of the beast in Scripture if you know how to compare Scripture with Scripture.



Oh, I definitely disagree with your unbiblical position. And I can guarantee that God's execution won't be done the way you believe it will happen! Forget inkblot and start studying Scripture.
Everything you have said is wrong and you know it.

However, Revelation 18 has prophesied the long term destruction of America and its people:

Revelation 18:9-21
9 And the kings of the earth, who committed fornication and lived in luxury with her, will weep and wail over her when they see the smoke of her burning; 10 they will stand far off, in fear of her torment, and say,

“Alas, alas, the great city,
Babylon, the mighty city!
For in one hour your judgment has come.”

11 And the merchants of the earth weep and mourn for her, since no one buys their cargo anymore, 12 cargo of gold, silver, jewels and pearls, fine linen, purple, silk and scarlet, all kinds of scented wood, all articles of ivory, all articles of costly wood, bronze, iron, and marble, 13 cinnamon, spice, incense, myrrh, frankincense, wine, olive oil, choice flour and wheat, cattle and sheep, horses and chariots, slaves—and human lives.

14 “The fruit for which your soul longed
has gone from you,
and all your dainties and your splendor
are lost to you,
never to be found again!”

15 The merchants of these wares, who gained wealth from her, will stand far off, in fear of her torment, weeping and mourning aloud,

16 “Alas, alas, the great city,
clothed in fine linen,
in purple and scarlet,
adorned with gold,
with jewels, and with pearls!
17 For in one hour all this wealth has been laid waste!”

And all shipmasters and seafarers, sailors and all whose trade is on the sea, stood far off 18 and cried out as they saw the smoke of her burning,

“What city was like the great city?”

19 And they threw dust on their heads, as they wept and mourned, crying out,

“Alas, alas, the great city,
where all who had ships at sea
grew rich by her wealth!
For in one hour she has been laid waste.”

20 Rejoice over her, O heaven, you saints and apostles and prophets! For God has given judgment for you against her.

21 Then a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone and threw it into the sea, saying,

“With such violence Babylon the great city
will be thrown down,
and will be found no more;


So, America will be isolated from the rest of the world, and the nations of the world will cease trading with the U.S. once they see the "smoke of her burning and torment and ruin".

Ultimately, there is absolutely nothing you can do to prevent the destruction of America and its people, which will be destroyed from off the face of the earth.
 
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God bless Joshua

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Just get it through your thick skull that "Jesus Christ is Wisdom from God"
Lord oh Lord, if you think your knowledge can despise other's skull.
1 Cor 13:2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing
 
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Stonehaven

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Lord oh Lord, if you think your knowledge can despise other's skull.
1 Cor 13:2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing
Right, but this doesn't apply to God nor his Son Jesus - God being the only exception to this rule. Nahum 1:2, Deuteronomy 6:15, Jeremiah 25:33

For Jesus said, "I am not come to bring peace to the earth, but I have come with a sword". Matthew 10:34

However, your big mistake is always to compare God with his Creation, but they are not the same in terms of their respective positions in the Ontological order; and thereby, they cannot be Judged in the same light, since they are neither "equal" nor the same:-

Revelation 20:14 - Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire;
 
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TribulationSigns

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Boy, you really going way off to the left field. Inkblot?! So your interpretation is based on inkblot instead of God's Word that you believe He would allow you to guess what the beast represents as you see fit?

This is blasphemy - Like comparing the healing power of the Holy Ghost with the power of Satan. Matthew 12:31, Mark 3:28-30

By comparing God with Satan, YOU are the one who is on the LEFT, not Me. 1 John 2:22

By definition, God or Christ cannot be seated on the "left" since he is your Judge, and you are the one to be Judged.

Huh? What are you talking about? I do not think you understand what I was saying. Enough of the rest of your nonsense ramblings. I will send you to an institution called Ignore List.
 
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shilohsfoal

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Revelation 17:8 The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and yet will come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction. The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world will be astonished when they see the beast, because it once was, now is not, and yet will come.

When John wrote this the beast had existed but at that time did not.It would exist once more.

No.The USA did not exist before revelation was written but there is country that had existed but did not exist when John wrote revelation and does exist today.
That country calls itself Israel.
 
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Stonehaven

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Revelation 17:8 The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and yet will come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction. The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world will be astonished when they see the beast, because it once was, now is not, and yet will come.

When John wrote this the beast had existed but at that time did not.It would exist once more.

No.The USA did not exist before revelation was written but there is country that had existed but did not exist when John wrote revelation and does exist today.
That country calls itself Israel.
Except that the beast is mentioned alongside seven or eight other countries, but we know that Israel is neither a member of the G7 nor the G8:-

Revelation 17:11 The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

You still need to reconcile V8 with V11, since it would be a mistake to ignore either one.
 
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JackRT

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I believe it to be intellectually, emotionally and spiritually unhealthy to live your life in constant expectation of the "end times". It is far better to live your life in such a way as to make this a better world, not just today but into the far distant future.
 
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Stonehaven

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I believe it to be intellectually, emotionally and spiritually unhealthy to live your life in constant expectation of the "end times". It is far better to live your life in such a way as to make this a better world, not just today but into the far distant future.
So, I take it that you don't believe we live in the End Times?
 
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shilohsfoal

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Except that the beast is mentioned alongside seven or eight other countries, but we know that Israel is neither a member of the G7 nor the G8:-

Revelation 17:11 The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

You still need to reconcile V8 with V11, since it would be a mistake to ignore either one.

Israel has had seven kingdoms rules over it.The seventh continued a short space and was devided.
 
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Stonehaven

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Huh? What are you talking about? I do not think you understand what I was saying. Enough of the rest of your nonsense ramblings. I will send you to an institution called Ignore List.
Since I am God I can say whatever I want, and have every Right to destroy your country.

[Reporting this comment means that you are not man enough to deal with it yourself, and you are not fit to work for the Secret Service]
 
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Stonehaven

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Huh? What are you talking about? I do not think you understand what I was saying. Enough of the rest of your nonsense ramblings. I will send you to an institution called Ignore List.
America accepted Japanese prisoners at Okinawa, but I don't accept American POW's at all.

I don't expect your people to surrender at all, but I expect Most of them to DIE in accordance with the destruction of Babylon in Revelation Chapter 17 & 18.

For your people, there will be no surrender, but only DEATH. Jeremiah 25:33, Isaiah 24:5-6
 
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BABerean2

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So, I take it that you don't believe we live in the End Times?

Act 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

Act 2:15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.

Act 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Based on Peter's words on the Day of Pentecost, we have been in the "last days" for almost 2,000 years...

.
 
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Revealing Times

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Revelation 17:11 - The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.

This means that America is the beast (or Antichrist nation) whose status is ambiguous, both as a member of the G7 and G8 group of countries.

But ultimately, it will be destroyed by the Great Tribulation, which is according to V11.

Discuss.
That is an easy point to refute brother. This 8th King comes out of the bottomless pit, so we just have to follow this Demonic entity through the chapters.

Rev. 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and SHALL ASCEND out of the BOTTOMLESS PIT, and go into PERDITION:

11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

So the 8th King is not, nor can it be a man, he is OF THE SEVEN, and he is currently locked in the bottomless pit, Satan of course is kicked out of Heaven eventually, so he has access to the Heavens and to roam free on earth, whereas the Beast mentioned in Rev. 17 is locked in the bottomless pit.

Rev. 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

Rev. 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon. {Apollyon/Abaddon}

This 8th King is Apollyon, he is currently locked in the bottomless pit, he will be released at the FIRST WOE. Later he kills the two-witnesses.

Rev. 11:7 And when they (TWO-WITNESSES) shall have finished their testimony, the BEAST that ascendeth out of the BOTTOMLESS PIT shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and KILL THEM.

So we can follow this BEAST or 8th King from the Bottomless Pit, to the FIRST WOE, to killing the Two-witnesses at the end of the 2nd Woe. He comes OUT OF THE PIT, and he will go to Destruction/Perdition or HELL, since Demons are already condemned.

So what does all of this mean when placed together? It means that Apollyon was ASSIGNED as the "Principality in High Places" that Paul spoke of over the Mediterranean Sea Region. He was over Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome. When Rome dispersed Israel all over the world, just after Israel rejected Jesus, there ceased being a BEAST over Israel, because of course there was no Israel in the Land, God forsook Israel, He blinded Israel, He turned His back on Israel. God saw them as "Dead Men's Bones" for nigh 2000 years until 1948, thus Apollyon was LOCKED INTO THE Bottomless Pit, he will be RELEASED at the 1st Woe, thus HE WAS.......IS NOT.......YET IS.

Apollyon is the 8th King in that he was over ALL 7 (Counting the coming Anti-Christ) that have Beasted over Israel or that will Beast over Israel. We know the Anti-Christ/Little Horn Conquers Jerusalem/Israel and thus becomes THE BEAST for 42 Months. Thus the MORTAL WOUND is healed. Rome was the Mortal Wound of the Figurative Seven Headed Beast, the Anti-Christ will be the LAST BEAST thus he will "HEAL THE MORTAL WOUND" of the Seven Headed Beast when he Conquers Jerusalem and Beasts over Israel for 42 Months.

So of Course he will be of ALL SEVEN, and he is the 8th in that he will have been over every Kingdom of the Mediterranean Sea Region that was over Israel, while Israel was in the land. Apollyon was locked up when the Ottoman Empire was over the region, but there was no Israel there anyway. Likewise he was locked in the pit when the British Empire ruled the region, thus those 2 are not BEASTS .

The Scarlet Colored Beast of Rev. 17 is Apollyon, he has NO CROWNS in that Satan is the Prince of Darkness. In Rev. 12 the Red Dragon (Satan) has 7 Crowns, showing he rules Kingdoms on earth. In Rev. 13 the MAN- BEAST has 10 Crowns in that he is King over the 10 Kings because they give him their power.

So he is the 8th BEAST only in that he is over the REGION, and over the SEVEN KINGDOMS who Beast over Israel.
 
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