Are you squeamish about the word "catholic"?

[thecolorsblend]

I believe the second church was the Smyrnaen

Are you changing the subject on purpose? Or is it purely accidental?

Again, do you plan to keep pasting your nonsense man-made traditions in every thread on this site? The answer to that question could be "yes" or it could be "no". Please choose one or the other.

 

[Philip_B]

My assumptions? Just talk to any catholic and they will tell you they are the real church.

Actually the becomes circumlocutious as you are very unclear what you mean when you say 'just talk to any catholic'. Any member of the latin rite church (in communion with the Bishop of Rome) who sees that as the limitation of the Church has failed to appreciate the considerations of Vatican II, or to acknowledge the Apostles or Nicene Creed - and to that extent they cease to be catholic. Any Christian not a member of the latin rite church who adheres to either or both of these creeds must have an understanding of the term catholic as I presume that they are not taking as an article of faith that there is another church down the road that we have nothing to do with.

 

[W2L]

Actually the becomes circumlocutious as you are very unclear what you mean when you say 'just talk to any catholic'. Any member of the latin rite church (in communion with the Bishop of Rome) who sees that as the limitation of the Church has failed to appreciate the considerations of Vatican II, or to acknowledge the Apostles or Nicene Creed - and to that extent they cease to be catholic. Any Christian not a member of the latin rite church who adheres to either or both of these creeds must have an understanding of the term catholic as I presume that they are not taking as an article of faith that there is another church down the road that we have nothing to do with.

I dont understand.

 

[High Fidelity]

The word? No.

The Catholic faith? Turns my stomach.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I dont understand.

He's saying that since Vatican II, their beliefs about others, especially Jews, has changed.

Forgive me...

 

[W2L]

He's saying that since Vatican II, their beliefs about others, especially Jews, has changed.

Forgive me...

Are we talking about Catholics changing their beliefs?

 

[S.O.J.I.A.]

I'm catholic, just not the Roman variety.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Are we talking about Catholics changing their beliefs?

Im afraid so.

Forgive me...

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Actually the becomes circumlocutious as you are very unclear what you mean when you say 'just talk to any catholic'. Any member of the latin rite church (in communion with the Bishop of Rome) who sees that as the limitation of the Church has failed to appreciate the considerations of Vatican II, or to acknowledge the Apostles or Nicene Creed - and to that extent they cease to be catholic. Any Christian not a member of the latin rite church who adheres to either or both of these creeds must have an understanding of the term catholic as I presume that they are not taking as an article of faith that there is another church down the road that we have nothing to do with.

I dont understand.

He's saying that since Vatican II, their beliefs about others, especially Jews, has changed.

Forgive me...

I have never read much about it myself. Very interesting!

Why Is Vatican II So Important?

When Pope John XXIII announced the creation of the Second Vatican Council (also known as Vatican II) in January 1959, it shocked the world. There hadn't been an ecumenical council — an assembly of Roman Catholic religious leaders meant to settle doctrinal issues — in nearly 100 years.

"Many people maintained that with the definition of papal infallibility in 1870, councils were no longer needed. So it was a big surprise," Georgetown University professor Rev. John W. O'Malley says.............

Today, the council is credited with essentially shaping the modern Catholic Church. But some Catholics still look fondly on the old days, and others are concerned about the interpretation of the council's legacy. Pope Benedict, for one, is careful to emphasize that Vatican II was not a condemnation of the pre-council church.

"He wants to see Vatican II as a council of reform but a council that's in continuity with the Catholic past that came before it," Huff says.

Fifty years since the council, O'Malley says that most young Catholics know little about this revolutionary period. But he hopes the anniversary will change that.

"It's passing from experience and memory into history. You have to pass on the word to the next generation," he says.................

Pope Paul VI hands Orthodox Metropolitan Meliton of Heliopolis a decree during the December 1965 session of the Roman Catholic Ecumenical Council in Vatican City.
The decree cancels excommunications that led to the break between the Roman and Orthodox churches nine centuries before.

 

[W2L]

I dont get religion. My faith is simple, and thats how i believe its supposed to be. I believe that if everyone gave up their theology and started over, then we would have true unity. Of course this wont happen because people believe their churches are infallible.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Uniate Churches

Them's fighting words!

But frankly, Uniate is downright RUDE. It's almost as bad as the N word. A lot of that comes from the Orthodox Church, who put us down, and fought with us, and shed our blood, instead of reaching to us in Christian unity.

And I realize that some of the Popes and Latin bishops have made it difficult for the Orthodox, too. Some Popes have treated our bishops just as bad as the Orthodox bishops. Thankfully, that silliness is past.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I dont get religion. My faith is simple, and thats how i believe its supposed to be. I believe that if everyone gave up their theology and started over, then we would have true unity. Of course this wont happen because people believe their churches are infallible.

There is a deposit of Christian Truth under all this stuff. Things we need to believe and things we should be doing.

One thing all catholics have in common. We all believe in the grace distributed through Gods hand in the sacraments. They are vastly important to Holy Traditional Christian teaching. That is to say, Christ taught proper worship "in form of the last supper and the hours of prayer" to the senior Apostles.

And here we stand not knowing why the Psalms are included in our bibles.

Forgive me...

 

[Monk Brendan]

(the Roman Catholic Church excommunicated Elizabeth I in 1570 in response to the Act of Supremacy 1559).

And Queen Elizabeth I had hundreds, maybe thousands of Catholics put to death, as well.

Pot, meet kettle.

 

[W2L]

There is a deposit of Christian Truth under all this stuff. Things we need to believe and things we should be doing.

Forgive me...

Yes but division is carnal. So says Paul anyway.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

I dont get religion. My faith is simple, and thats how i believe its supposed to be. I believe that if everyone gave up their theology and started over, then we would have true unity. Of course this wont happen because people believe their churches are infallible.

Yes but division is carnal. So says Paul anyway.

That was a pet peeve of his.

I can just see Paul coming down here to GT with a rod to spank us with [1 Corin 4:21]

1 Cor 3:
For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal?

1 Corin 1:
10 I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree together, so that there may be no divisions among you,
and that you may be united in mind and conviction.
12 What I mean is this: Individuals among you are saying, “I follow Paul,” “I follow Apollos,” “I follow Cephas,”a or “I follow Christ.”

13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized into my name. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with eloquent words of wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

1 Corin 4:
18 Some of you have become arrogant, as if I were not coming to you. 19 But I will come to you shortly, if the Lord is willing,
and then I will find out not only what these arrogant people are saying, but what power they have. 20 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of talk but of power. 21 Which do you prefer? Shall I come to you with a rod, or in love and with a gentle spirit?

......................................

 

[Monk Brendan]

If you want to differentiate, there's Eastern Rite and Latin Rite, and 22 other rites.

The word to use is Tradition. I am of the Byzantine Tradition. Several of the other churches use the Byzantine Tradition. The Western Tradition includes the Latin Rite, as well as the Sarum Rite. There are a few other Rites in the Western Tradition, but they all firmly under the Pope.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

... but they all firmly under the Pope.

I think there was a misspelling? Y where the P is perhaps...K where the P is again... in other words they should be under the yoke of Jesus not the Pope

 

[W2L]

That was a pet peeve of his.

I can just see Paul coming down here to GT with a rod to spank us with [1 Corin 4:21]

1 Corin 1:
10 I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree together, so that there may be no divisions among you,
and that you may be united in mind and conviction.
12 What I mean is this: Individuals among you are saying, “I follow Paul,” “I follow Apollos,” “I follow Cephas,”a or “I follow Christ.”

13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized into my name. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with eloquent words of wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

1 Corin 4:
18 Some of you have become arrogant, as if I were not coming to you. 19 But I will come to you shortly, if the Lord is willing,
and then I will find out not only what these arrogant people are saying, but what power they have. 20 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of talk but of power. 21 Which do you prefer? Shall I come to you with a rod, or in love and with a gentle spirit?

......................................

Paul would lay down the law in GT.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Yes but division is carnal. So says Paul anyway.

Division for no good reason is... over a calendar for instance.

However the councils that were gathered to make these definitions did not do so without good reason.

The common thing about all the early councils, (say the one that defined our book collection and the definition of the trinity) gathered because the very beliefs about the faith were in danger of being changed. Fighting off heresy, they would say. Was a direct order from the Apostles.

Forgive me...

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Paul would lay down the law in GT.

His rabinical law or the Holy Spirit law? Better to ask Peter.