Question about the flood

[AV1611VET]

No, he was one.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that a violation of consensus of opinion, scientist?

Adolf Hitler's religious beliefs have been a matter of debate; the wide consensus of historians consider him to have been irreligious and anti-Christian, while a small minority have claimed he was a Christian.

SOURCE

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Also, God cares for the animals.

"Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father." (Matthew 10:29).

Hmm, well that basically says that, directly or indirectly, only God kills sparrows. We know that a lot of sparrows die, else we'd be up to our necks in them, so just how caring does that make God?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that a violation of consensus of opinion, scientist?

You are wrong.

SOURCE

Yes, thank you. The only sources that try to make Hitler out as a non-Christian is the rather untrustworthy "Hitler's Table Talks". He was "anti-Church" but then you tend to be anti-Church to at times, especially when that Church is the Catholic Church. And he had his own strange beliefs. Please note that in the article that you linked atheist groups were outlawed, unless they openly supported the Nazi Party. He did not go that far even with religions. He did not ban churches unless they supported him. If anything that shows that he was more anti-atheist than the was anti-Church.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That is a major non sequitur on your part. And no, it makes no sense at all that one has to believe a myth to understand a myth. If your God is real you should be able to understand him without "faith". In fact "faith" is the worst of all reasons to believe anything. Faith will lead you to Islam or Hinduism just as it will lead you to Christianity. Faith is not a path to the truth. You are also claiming that your God is an unjust God when you do that.

But then logical thought is eliminated by the cognitive dissonance that is involved in preserving a failed belief. We know that there was no flood. And since there are other threads for this we can discuss that elsewhere.

Let's get back to the OP's question. If God is real why didn't he merely recreate the animals after the flood? No one has really offered any answer that could not have been more easily answered with God creating the animals all over again.

When we talk about the faith in God and the Holy Scriptures, the Lord has given a measure of faith to every man (Romans 12:3). It is why you are here most of the time and not a Muslim or Buddah forum trying to convince them that their beliefs are wrong. You come here because deep down you know it is true and you are trying to justify your belief against God and His Word by what you say here. For people rob banks because they have value inside them. You are trying to rob people of the truth because you prefer this world and it's ways and not God.

As for God not re-creating the animals: Well, for one, God does not have to do things your way or the Burger King way. It is actually rather simple. God had stopped from His work of creation on the sixth day of the creation week. This is symbolic of how Jesus would say, "It is finished." on the cross when He paid the price for mankind's sins so as to offer him the free gift of salvation. God starts things and then finishes them. Unlike many people today. They start things and do not finish them. But God is faithful to His promises and always finishes what He promises to us. Fulfilled prophecy is yet one more piece of evidence that leaves people without excuse if they were to be objective about looking at such prophecies.


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[Bible Highlighter]

I feel like I'm under fire here... these forums are a really scary place to ask questions!

But this is probably my fault. My question might not have been clear enough. So I'll give it another try:

What my Question is: God asked Noah to build an ark to save the animals. The animals were his own creation. He could have re-created them after the flood.

Therefore, what was the purpose of saving the animals?
Or, in other words, why go through all the trouble?

What the Question is not:
a) do you believe in God
b) do you believe the Bible
c) do you believe the event of the flood

Thank you for not shooting me on site and for not judging me.
Lets treat one another as brothers.

My comment was to the atheist who said there was no global flood and not you.

Either my eyes are playing tricks on me, or your profile changed. Originally in your profile of each of your posts, it said you were "Non-denominational"; Now it says you are an "atheist." So please do not act like you are under fire or anything. My comment was not directed at you to begin with. But if you are an atheist and you are honestly seeking answers to the truth instead of folding your arms and shaking your head and saying, "No, it didn't happen", do not expect a thumbs up type response. See, when folks deny God, it is a very wrong and serious thing. It is calling God a liar. I don't have patience to deal with people who are out to just mock God and say he is not true. If you are seeking, then that is different. If you are trying to tear down my faith, then expect me to stand up and fight for my faith.

Note: When I say fight for my faith: I am talking about a spiritual battle only using words, love, and prayer, etc. (and not with any physical force). I am talking about conquering my enemies with things that are good, and with love, rather than evil.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Hmm, well that basically says that, directly or indirectly, only God kills sparrows. We know that a lot of sparrows die, else we'd be up to our necks in them, so just how caring does that make God?

You need to have the Holy Spirit to truly understand what His word is saying. So stop trying to understand His Word from a human perspective and repent and ask God to help show you what His Word says (So you can get a bigger picture of things that are going on). You are focusing a laser beam on a particular text and not looking at things from a larger perspective. This is why Job was upset with God. Job wanted God to answer him as to why he was suffering. He did not see it as being fair. Yet, God basically told Job about the wonders of His creation that he could not fathom before. Job was in awe of God's great creation and felt small to the wonder of it all. In other words, God was saying that there is a bigger picture or plan for Job's life that he could not see.

As for birds dying: We have to first see all the good things that have happened through out the animal kingdom first to weigh in the fair treatment of animals or birds. We see many animals (including birds) live very happy lives. It is suggestive that the animal kindom will be resurrected at some point in the future according to Scripture. For the creature eagerly waits the manifestation of the sons of God (i.e. the resurrection of believers).

19 "For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body." (Romans 8:19-23).

So death is not some kind of horrible atheistic nightmare of non-existence for those who are good or innocent. The Bible says there will be a resurrection. Death is not the end for God's Kingdom or people.


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[driewerf]

Hitler wasn't a Christian. In fact, he was a type of the Antichrist.

Hitler was a creationist. From Mein Kampf
http://www.greatwar.nl/books/meinkampf/meinkampf.pdf

p59
And so I believe to-day that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator. In standing guard against the Jew I am defending the handiwork of the Lord.

p182
What we have to fight for is the necessary security for the existence and increase of our race and people, the subsistence of its children and the maintenance of our racial stock unmixed, the freedom and independence of the Fatherland; so that our people may be enabled to fulfil the mission assigned to it by the Creator.

p214
But if for reasons of indolence or cowardice this fight is not fought to a finish we may imagine what conditions will be like 500 years hence. Little of God's image will be left in human nature, except to mock the Creator.

p238
The act which brings about such a development is a sin against the will of the Eternal Creator.

p317
Whoever would dare to raise a profane hand against that highest image of God among His creatures would sin against the bountiful Creator of this marvel and would collaborate in the expulsion from Paradise.

p335
And, further, they ought to be brought to realize that it is their bounden duty to give to the Almighty Creator beings such as He himself made to His own image.

p154
Of course, one doesn't discuss such a question with the Jews, because they are the modern inventors of this cultural perfume. Their very existence is an incarnate denial of the beauty of God's image in His creation.

p458
Whoever destroys His work wages war against God's Creation and God's Will.

 

[AV1611VET]

Hitler was a creationist. From Mein Kampf
http://www.greatwar.nl/books/meinkampf/meinkampf.pdf

Would he have made Chancellor, if he hadn't of walked and talked like a Christian?

 

[driewerf]

Would he have made Chancellor, if he hadn't of walked and talked like a Christian?

This is Europe, not the US.

 

[AV1611VET]

This is Europe,

Yup.

Where the Antichrist will come from.

 

[Subduction Zone]

When we talk about the faith in God and the Holy Scriptures, the Lord has given a measure of faith to every man (Romans 12:3). It is why you are here most of the time and not a Muslim or Buddah forum trying to convince them that their beliefs are wrong. You come here because deep down you know it is true and you are trying to justify your belief against God and His Word by what you say here. For people rob banks because they have value inside them. You are trying to rob people of the truth because you prefer this world and it's ways and not God.

As for God not re-creating the animals: Well, for one, God does not have to do things your way or the Burger King way. It is actually rather simple. God had stopped from His work of creation on the sixth day of the creation week. This is symbolic of how Jesus would say, "It is finished." on the cross when He paid the price for mankind's sins so as to offer him the free gift of salvation. God starts things and then finishes them. Unlike many people today. They start things and do not finish them. But God is faithful to His promises and always finishes what He promises to us. Fulfilled prophecy is yet one more piece of evidence that leaves people without excuse if they were to be objective about looking at such prophecies.


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Mere rationalization. Of course since the flood is a myth your excuses do not really matter.

And you do realize that much of the "fulfilled prophecy" was merely written into the story. When it comes to actual fulfilled prophecies finding reliable examples are all but non-existent. And as you know, if you make enough prophecies and make them vague enough some are guaranteed to be "fulfilled".

Lastly, I do not say that there was no flood with "folded arms". Anyone that has studied it cannot honestly claim that it happened.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Would he have made Chancellor, if he hadn't of walked and talked like a Christian?

Probably not. But of course his hatred of Jews was how Christians typically spoke.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Mere rationalization.

Not at all. It is the truth. You are here and not at Buddah and Muslim forums for a reason.

Of course since the flood is a myth your excuses do not really matter.

You can keep telling yourself that lie, but it is not going to help you on Judgment Day unless you repent and accept Jesus.

#1. Seashells on top of mountains would have eroded away by the weathering of the elements if the Earth was millions of years old. So the seashells on tops of the highest mountains is a result of the global flood.

#2. Underwater ruins or buildings are found deep beneath the ocean floor.

#3. Fossilized trees are found going through each of the layers of rock that atheists say are millions of years each.

#4. Global Flood Legends in many cultures world wide.

#5. Fossil beds or graveyards of animals found all over the world.

#6. Scripture testifies of a global flood and many other evidences back up the Bible in many other areas of Science, Archeology, etc.


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[Subduction Zone]

Not at all. It is the truth. You are here and not at Buddah and Muslim forums for a reason.

Yes, the harm done by Christians in my country is why I am here. Muslims are such a small minority that they cannot do much harm. And I do not know of any Buddhists that actively oppose reality.

You can keep telling yourself that lie, but it is not going to help you on Judgment Day unless you repent and accept Jesus.

Please, if anyone is lying it is you here. But I see from the following list of PRATT's that you are terribly ignorant about this subject. Would you like to treat them properly?

#1. Seashells on top of mountains would have eroded away by the weathering of the elements if the Earth was millions of years old. So the seashells on tops of the highest mountains is a result of the global flood.

#2. Underwater ruins or buildings are found deep beneath the ocean floor.

#3. Fossilized trees are found going through each of the layers of rock that atheists say are millions of years each.

#4. Global Flood Legends in many cultures world wide.

#5. Fossil beds or graveyards of animals found all over the world.

#6. Scripture testifies of a global flood and many other evidences back up the Bible in many other areas of Science, Archeology, etc.


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Nope, just a list of PRATT's for the ignorant. Let's start with your first one. It is bordering idiotic. Yes, there are seashells on top of mountains. But that is not evidence for the flood. You see a flood would predict a thin layer of life. Instead we have entire mountains made of "seashells" actually coral reefs are more common.

Try to think logically for just a little bit. How much life is there right now? Let's say that the Earth had ten times the life that we have right now. Thermodynamically it does not work, but just for kicks we can go with that amount. You would still be hard pressed to have a foot of shells. Instead we see thousands of feet of deposits. You need to study some basic geology. Long slow stead deposition explains the deposits that we see. Creationists simply can't explain it. Geologists can. Plate tectonics explains how mountains were built. Again, creationists can't explain it.

Since you do not understand the nature of evidence you do not understand why you don't have any evidence. People here can help you with that lack.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes, the harm done by Christians in my country is why I am here. Muslims are such a small minority that they cannot do much harm. And I do not know of any Buddhists that actively oppose reality.

So what problem morally do you have with Jesus? Jesus was the most holiest person who has ever walked the face of the planet and He calls people to follow in His footsteps. If Christians today are not meeting your expectations, then chances are they are not following Jesus. So your problem is not with true Christianity but with false Christianity.

If you think Atheism is all lollipops and kittens: You are living in a dream world. Some of the worst men in the world were (and or are) atheists.

http://listverse.com/2010/06/05/10-people-who-give-atheism-a-bad-name/

I mean, murder technically does not exist if humanity all just evolved from a single celled organism. A single celled organism eliminating another is just the process of natural selection in your happy little world. So you can do whatever you want with no strings attached. Nobody has to answer to a Creator God for their actions in your nice little universe. An atheist can drive and get drunk, sleep with many prostitutes, be hateful towards people, and even murder and not have to answer to a Holy God. The Bible has a standard of "absolute morality" that is good for the bettermen of man. The Bible in the atheistic community gets pushed as being evil because they do not know how to properly interpret Scripture; Therefore, as a result, they take things out of context, and they make the Bible says things that it does not really say. The atheist also sees death as this horrible thing, when in reality it is not the end for those who are of God's kingdom.

Please, if anyone is lying it is you here.

Let the Lord stop your mouth in the name Jesus so that you may see. For you speak foolishness.

But I see from the following list of PRATT's that you are terribly ignorant about this subject. Would you like to treat them properly?

You are going to have your slanted view. It is not the evidence that is going to convince you. It is recognizing your own sin before a Holy God that will make you be able to see.

Nope, just a list of PRATT's for the ignorant. Let's start with your first one. It is bordering idiotic. Yes, there are seashells on top of mountains. But that is not evidence for the flood. You see a flood would predict a thin layer of life. Instead we have entire mountains made of "seashells" actually coral reefs are more common.

There is little to no oxygen that far up. It is also really cold up there on top of those mountains. Also, if some of the mountains were heated or covered in magma at one time, then I really can't see how life survived such a thing (unless we are talking about microscopic "water bears").

Try to think logically for just a little bit. How much life is there right now? Let's say that the Earth had ten times the life that we have right now. Thermodynamically it does not work, but just for kicks we can go with that amount. You would still be hard pressed to have a foot of shells. Instead we see thousands of feet of deposits. You need to study some basic geology. Long slow stead deposition explains the deposits that we see. Creationists simply can't explain it. Geologists can. Plate tectonics explains how mountains were built. Again, creationists can't explain it.

Did you know how many seashells existed back then and how much earth was being kicked around? Seriously. You are grasping at straws here.

Since you do not understand the nature of evidence you do not understand why you don't have any evidence. People here can help you with that lack.

I already showed you the evidence. If we were talking about one piece of evidence, that would be one thing, but there is plenty of evidence for those who want to see. You are obviously biased towards atheism, so this makes you unable to see any evidence that the Bible presents. It could be a giant Neon sign falling into your house that says "Believe in Jesus" and you probably still would not believe. Granted, I do hope I am wrong, but I have little hope for those who reject Jesus and the Bible these days. There is just too many evidences that is available to them at the touch of button now. You are without excuse, dear sir.


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[Speedwell]

So what problem morally do you have with Jesus? Jesus was the most holiest person who has ever walked the face of the planet and He calls people to follow in His footsteps. If Christians today are not meeting your expectations, then chances are they are not following Jesus. So your problem is not with true Christianity but with false Christianity.

So you are saying that "Bible-believing" Christianity is false Christianity?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So you are saying that "Bible-believing" Christianity is false Christianity?

Where did I say that?
That is you talking non-sense.


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[Subduction Zone]

So what problem morally do you have with Jesus? Jesus was the most holiest person who has ever walked the face of the planet and He calls people to follow in His footsteps. If Christians today are not meeting your expectations, then chances are they are not following Jesus. So your problem is not with true Christianity but with false Christianity.

I do not have a problem with Jesus. I have a problem with people that abuse the Bible.

If you think Atheism is all lollipops and kittens: You are living in a dream world. Some of the worst men in the world were (and or are) atheists.

http://listverse.com/2010/06/05/10-people-who-give-atheism-a-bad-name/

I never claimed that atheists are perfect, though on average the appear to be more moral than Christians.



You may have believed the falsehoods that you spewed, but they were still falsehoods.

I mean, murder technically does not exist if humanity all just evolved from a single celled organism. A single celled organism eliminating another is just the process of natural selection in your happy little world. So you can do whatever you want with no strings attached. Nobody has to answer to a Creator God for their actions in your nice little universe. An atheist can drive and get drunk, sleep with many prostitutes, be hateful towards people, and even murder and not have to answer to a Holy God. The Bible has a standard of "absolute morality" that is good for the bettermen of man. The Bible in the atheistic community gets pushed as being evil because they do not know how to properly interpret Scripture; Therefore, as a result, they take things out of context, and they make the Bible says things that it does not really say. The atheist also sees death as this horrible thing, when in reality it is not the end for those who are of God's kingdom.

Now you are just demonstrating your own lack of morals. You may not realize it but atheists know that they have to account for their wrong doings. Your religion gives people a "get out of jail free card". All one has to do is to "accept Jesus" and ask forgiveness at the end of a long and wicked life and all would be hunky dory.

Let the Lord stop your mouth in the name Jesus so that you may see. For you speak foolishness.

Please, don't make false claims. And you are merely abusing your belief again. A proper Christian would think twice before saying something so foolish.

You are going to have your slanted view. It is not the evidence that is going to convince you. It is recognizing your own sin before a Holy God that will make you be able to see.

Again, this is a falsehood on your part. A proper Christian would think twice. My view is much less slanted than yours.

There is little to no oxygen that far up. It is also really cold up there on top of those mountains. Also, if some of the mountains were heated or covered in magma at one time, then I really can't see how life survived such a thing (unless we are talking about microscopic "water bears").

ROFLAMAO!! Oh my. You really need to learn before you make such foolish claims. You just demonstrated that you showed up to a gunfight with a rubber band.

Why can't you be honest and admit that you have no clue at all?

Did you know how many seashells existed back then and how much earth was being kicked around? Seriously. You are grasping at straws here.

No, no, please. You are just making me laugh. I know because I have an education in the sciences. You obviously lost what little high school science education that you have. I can help you to learn, but if you are just going to spew nonsense you will remain ignorant for your entire life.

You do know that your superstitions are illegal to teach in schools, don't you? That is because there is no evidence at all for them and mountains of evidence for evolution. For geology, for cosmology.

I already showed you the evidence. If we were talking about one piece of evidence, that would be one thing, but there is plenty of evidence for those who want to see. You are obviously biased towards atheism, so this makes you unable to see any evidence that the Bible presents. It could be a giant Neon sign falling into your house that says "Believe in Jesus" and you probably still would not believe. Granted, I do hope I am wrong, but I have little hope for those who reject Jesus and the Bible these days. There is just too many evidences that is available to them at the touch of button now. You are without excuse, dear sir.


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No, you only demonstrated utter ignorance. You copied PRATT's from a lying site. You do not even know what evidence is.

Since you are hopelessly uneducated in the sciences let's start at the beginning. Do you know what the scientific method is? Here is a simplified flow chart:

Steps of the Scientific Method

Please ask questions. Once you understand this we can begin on the concept of evidence.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Where did I say that?
That is you talking non-sense.


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Right here:

". If Christians today are not meeting your expectations, then chances are they are not following Jesus. So your problem is not with true Christianity but with false Christianity."

 

[Speedwell]

Where did I say that?
That is you talking non-sense.


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You said this: "If Christians today are not meeting your expectations, then chances are they are not following Jesus. So your problem is not with true Christianity but with false Christianity."

The only Christians who are not meeting my expectations today are "Bible-believing" Christians, so according to you they are false Christians.