The Seventh Day is the SABBATH of the Lord thy God Exodus 20:10

[bugkiller]

Did that

Well you quoted him and said something without answering his question.

bugkiller

 

[1stcenturylady]

So I ask yet again, why even bother with the law?

bugkiller

It was holy
It was a schoolmaster
It pointed out sin

But the apostle John said, a Christian does NOT commit sin, and Paul said we are dead to sin. So you're right. If we walk in the Spirit, we won't be committing sin, so are not under the law, except belief in Jesus, and love.

 

[bugkiller]

The "IT" in section 19 refers to what that section calls "the moral law of God" and "the TEN Commandments" Point number 6 in section 19 says that "IT" (The Ten Commandments, the MORAL Law of God" is not a "covenant of works". So that obedience to God's Law is not a claim to earn our salvation via works.

Both sides again - agree on that point. In fact pretty much all of section 19 is agreed by both the pro-Bible Sabbath side of the debate - and the Sunday scholars. As I have stated numerous times.

The odd notion that "if you keep the commandment to not take God's name in vain well that is compatible with grace but if you keep God's Bible Sabbath commandment also then that is incompatible with grace" -- is not at all a view that I agree with.

Exactly how does that support your claim requiring worship on the sabbath?

bugkiller

 

[1stcenturylady]

Exactly how does that support your claim requiring worship on the sabbath?

bugkiller

Actually, buggy brother, we keep the Sabbath everyday! We have rested from our works to get into heaven, and trust Jesus, our Sabbath rest everyday! And He has given us His own Spirit, the Spirit of Christ to make us not sin. And as sin is lawlessness, and we don't sin willfully when we walk in the Spirit, we are continuously cleansed by His blood. So we should be in agreement. Bob R keeps the Sabbath one day a week, and we keep it seven.

 

[BobRyan]

Exactly how does that support your claim requiring worship on the sabbath?

bugkiller

So then you have or have not actually read section 19 of the document you are talking about? It will help explain that question you ask.

 

[BobRyan]

It was holy
It was a schoolmaster
It pointed out sin
.

And it is "established by our faith" Romans 3:31 instead of abolished by it.

 

[BobRyan]

So should we stone people to death for working [e.g. gathering sticks] on god's holy day. Numbers 15:32

We should not stone them for taking God's name in vain, or for not honoring their parents...so we also should not stone them for breaking the Sabbath. Because as the Baptist Confession of Faith points out and the Westminster Confession of Faith points out - the civil laws under the OT theocracy ended when that theocracy ended.

So I ask yet again, why even bother with the law?

bugkiller

The Law of God "written on heart and mind" under the NEW Covenant Jer 31:31-33, Hebrews 8:5-10

But as we noted in Romans 8:4-10 the lost "Do not submit to the Law of God - neither indeed CAN they"

 

[1stcenturylady]

And it is "established by our faith" Romans 3:31 instead of abolished by it.

We establish the moral laws of God by walking in the Spirit and not coming anywhere close to breaking any.

 

[BobRyan]

We establish the moral laws of God by walking in the Spirit and not coming anywhere close to breaking any.

Obedience is the fruit of a changed life - the "Law of God written on the heart and mind" - the NEW Covenant.

 

[1stcenturylady]

The Law of God "written on heart and mind" under the NEW Covenant Jer 31:31-33, Hebrews 8:5-10

But as we noted in Romans 8:4-10 the lost "Do not submit to the Law of God - neither indeed CAN they"

Don't you realize that the way the Sabbath commandment was written, it couldn't be written on our hearts? But, spiritually every Christian keeps it everyday?

 

[bugkiller]

Actually, buggy brother, we keep the Sabbath everyday! We have rested from our works to get into heaven, and trust Jesus, our Sabbath rest everyday! And He has given us His own Spirit, the Spirit of Christ to make us not sin. And as sin is lawlessness, and we don't sin willfully when we walk in the Spirit, we are continuously cleansed by His blood. So we should be in agreement. Bob R keeps the Sabbath one day a week, and we keep it seven.

Well said. I agree.

bugkiller

 

[BobRyan]

Hello Bob.

So the law in Jeremiah includes the ten commandments, so what else does the law written on the heart include?

As even the Baptist Confession of Faith and the Westminster Confessions of Faith point out - all the moral law of God. All that defines what sin is... "Sin IS transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4.

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

Exegesis matters.

Context matters.

Bible details matter.

As I am sure you will agree.

Why are you arguing about it? Is your point that, the christian is supposed to keep the sabbath simply because they don't murder?

That was not an argument - David asked a question I answered it.

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

In this case that "Bible detail" is that the TEN Commandments - remain - as included in the moral law of God.

 

[BobRyan]

Don't you realize that the way the Sabbath commandment was written, it couldn't be written on our hearts?

Interesting speculation on your part. You have free will you can certainly have that opinion.

 

[BobRyan]

Can you show us where this means 10 Cs? I JN 3:23 essentially restates JN 15:10.No where in the works of John do we find him advocating keeping the law.I will ask you again a bit differently though - what matters more the blood of Jesus or keeping the law?

bugkiller

Eph 6:2 the FIFTH commandment is the "FIRST commandment" in that still-valid-for all mankind unit of TEN "with a promise".

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

 

[1stcenturylady]

Interesting speculation on your part. You have free will you can certainly have that opinion.

Unless you've read it, how do we know. How does our conscience instinctively know to not do any work from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday. Impossible. It is not a moral law that is known in the heart. It has to be memorized outwardly.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Eph 6:2 the FIFTH commandment is the "FIRST commandment" in that still-valid-for all mankind unit of TEN "with a promise".

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

Unfortunately, half the people you list are not people I would listen to. I've found too many mistakes in their theology.

Ephesians 6:2 is not about the Sabbath. It is about honoring our mother and father. And that is covered in our New Covenant under loving your neighbor as yourself.

 

[bugkiller]

Eph 6:2 the FIFTH commandment is the "FIRST commandment" in that still-valid-for all mankind unit of TEN "with a promise".

Sorry but Jesus did not issue nor bring that commandment according to Jn 1:17.

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

So why are you trying to debate it?

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Unless you've read it, how do we know. How does our conscience instinctively know to not do any work from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday. Impossible. It is not a moral law that is known in the heart. It has to be memorized outwardly.

He intends for us to understand that we are not Christians as yuo know his organization teaches.

bugkiller

 

[BobRyan]

Can you show us where this means 10 Cs? I JN 3:23 essentially restates JN 15:10.No where in the works of John do we find him advocating keeping the law.I will ask you again a bit differently though - what matters more the blood of Jesus or keeping the law?
bugkiller

Eph 6:2 the FIFTH commandment is the "FIRST commandment" in that still-valid-for all mankind unit of TEN "with a promise".

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"

Sorry but Jesus did not issue nor bring that commandment according to Jn 1:17.So why are you trying to debate it?

bugkiller

Sorry but Jesus said the words recorded in Mark 7:6-13 which does indeed include that commandment. (As we have all seen a few dozen times by now);

6 He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
7 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men —the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.”

9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do.”

 

[1stcenturylady]

Sorry but Jesus did not issue nor bring that commandment according to Jn 1:17.So why are you trying to debate it?

bugkiller

Eph 6:2 the FIFTH commandment is the "FIRST commandment" in that still-valid-for all mankind unit of TEN "with a promise".

When a Bible detail is so incredibly obvious that both sides of the Saturday-vs-Sunday debate admit to it... well there is no sense in "debating the obvious"



Sorry but Jesus said the words recorded in Mark 7:6-13 which does indeed include that commandment. (As we have all seen a few dozen times by now);

6 He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
7 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men —the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.”

9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do.”

You do know Jesus was explaining the law to those still under the law don't you? He hadn't died yet...thus His will and testament wasn't in force.