NO MORE PREACHING ON HELL

[cantool]

The Bible is a book of Father God's grace and mercy toward man. That man, though born on this earth with a sinful nature, has the privilege of being redeemed back into God's glory and power. We now live in the last days of Emmanuel! God with us! Or better to say it this way; Christ in us, the hope of glory!
Jesus said, "If I be lifted up, I will draw all men unto me."
If hell, fire and brimstone is preached to unbelievers, you will get converts, but it had nothing to do with Holy Spirit drawing people. A hellfire type of preaching scares the crap out of people and does not present the tender-loving mercy of God, that is always sure. Therefore, to teach and preach on hell and the devil is a false doctrine that is of men, not the Son of God and His desire towards men.
If your own child does bad (against your set codes of conduct) do you hammer at the kid about how screwed up they are while destroying their soul in the process, or do you give right council (and possible punishment) and lovingly restore them anew?
God is a good good Father. Not a theologically practicing idiot. Christ is hidden throughout the Old Covenant and revealed in His glory in the New Covenant.
Satan is never revealed, nor glorified. He is only spoken of as the Adversary, whom now is beneath the feet of our Lord Jesus. Satan has been defeated. I recommend you leave the 'now powerless devil' where he was put, and just listen to the Truth that is the Spirit of Christ Jesus living in you and through you.

 

[BukiRob]

No, I'm really not. I know quite a few other people who feel the same way.

Uhmmm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on when you say that the death penalty is not a severe penalty. Are you sure you know what the word severe means?

Severe: (of something bad or undesirable) very great; intense.

Being sentenced to death and executed are the very discription of intense and undesirable (to the person being executed)

Please do share what you think is a more severe form of punishment that is handed out by men?

 

[CrystalDragon]

It seems that we have devalued to word of God.....thus is why our world is in such a mess. We have turned away from Him and went after the lust of the flesh. Now we are reaping that in a terrible way.

Really? Living conditions in general seem to be improving in many places.

 

[dhh712]

Uhmmm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on when you say that the death penalty is not a severe penalty. Are you sure you know what the word severe means?

Severe: (of something bad or undesirable) very great; intense.

Being sentenced to death and executed are the very discription of intense and undesirable (to the person being executed)

Please do share what you think is a more severe form of punishment that is handed out by men?

Sorry, I was taking severe as in too severe, like it's not justified. Yes, it's definitely a severe form of punishment but is justified by God's word.

 

[dhh712]

Really? Living conditions in general seem to be improving in many places.

Yes, but many people are dead spiritually and their lives depict this (especially those who live rather comfortable lives; they often have no spiritual life).

 

[BukiRob]

Discipline? Yes? Torture for something as simple as not believing what is said? No. If an Earthly father did that they'd be considered vile, abusive, and evil.

That is a totally reasonable view if you only see the human/physical side of the problem.

But, if you realize that that third part of heaven that rebelled and were cast to the earth are those who become human and are given a chance to be redeemed then suddenly the picture does change quite a bit.

When an unbeliever says How can an all loving G-d allow X (whatever innocent has something horrible happen) to happen? How is that fair to that person..... Well, now we know that NONE OF US are innocent. We are guilty of REBELLION. And G-d gave us over to our rebelliousness but in his mercy he created the universe and placed those rebellious creatures here that we might have a means of redemption. Some will take it but MANY will reject it.

 

[BukiRob]

Sorry, I was taking severe as in too severe, like it's not justified. Yes, it's definitely a severe form of punishment but is justified by God's word.

Of course it is

 

[Fishsack]

Its not popular anymore. It doesn't get people in the seats. Look at all the preachers who have the megachurches. People like Joel Osteen. They only preach feel good sermons and their attendance grows. Its becoming more about making people feel good than telling them the truth.

Now, there is an ecumenical movement on the way with the intention of united all the churches that claim to be christian and they would need to put aside doctrinal differences and preach unifying message. Hardcore messages about hell is not going to be accepted. More churches are going in this ecumenical direction softening the word of God to have a message that more people will agree with, sacrificing truth for acceptance.

What is so untrue about God's Love?

 

[BukiRob]

I think a LOT of the Preachers of the World ought to evaluate their own Lives and Churches and what Connections to the outside they do have(I.e: Government)and for what reason do they have those Connections?

Maybe if the Church distanced itself from those Connections and Benefits,they'd have a Stronger Message,which people would actually consider listening to!!! A lot of Churches also have,by certain associations, allowed into their midst individuals who have other agendas,which has NOT gone un-noticed by the discerning and God Himself.Think about the impact a Church not tied to Unrighteous-Money might have(or, am i lacking in Wisdom and Understanding or Discernment?) Surely,if you had a Righteous-Church you'd have Revival Worldwide!

Righteousness is imputed by Messiah... in essence we are saved by the sacrifice of Messiah and our acceptance and belief of that truth imputes righteousness.... Gen 15 Abraham believed G-d and it was counted as RIGHTEOUSNESS.

Perhaps you mean SANCTIFICATION... which is the PROCESS that leads us to walk in HOLINESS. and THAT is sorely lacking in the body.

Evangelism REAL evangelism is accomplished by the BODY and not the preacher. Its LIFESTYLE evangelism. Its when your unsaved coworkers SEE Yeshua in your life. When they see REAL HOLINESS. Its when your coworkers either hate you because you walk upright in holiness (NOT SELF RIGHTEOUS there is a VAST difference) you are a person of unquestioned integrity and you show real love.... OR they KNOW you are different and are drawn to you and start asking what makes you different.....

That is where the power comes from... when the BODY the folks in the pews start to hunger and thirst for holiness.... when they would rather die than compromise to sin.

 

[BukiRob]

Its not popular anymore. It doesn't get people in the seats. Look at all the preachers who have the megachurches. People like Joel Osteen. They only preach feel good sermons and their attendance grows. Its becoming more about making people feel good than telling them the truth.

Now, there is an ecumenical movement on the way with the intention of united all the churches that claim to be christian and they would need to put aside doctrinal differences and preach unifying message. Hardcore messages about hell is not going to be accepted. More churches are going in this ecumenical direction softening the word of God to have a message that more people will agree with, sacrificing truth for acceptance.

This is the beginning of the shaking out....The Father is calling out to his children COME OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE......

I dont know when but there will come a time when MANY will have to leave their churches or compromise until they are asked to compromise on Messiah

 

[BukiRob]

Please everyone Do not preach to anyone on the face of this planet about hell. Focus on the beauty of our Lord, focus on Jesus. Love one another. Focus on the intimacy of his sacrifice. Teach about Love. his LOve was so pure. Teach and pray that people will understand God's love, for this is the most difficult thing. There is no Ultimate act of Love than a friend who laid down his life for his friend, and there is no Ultimate act of love of our God who gave his only son to be crucified by evil doers. Please only preach about Love, Teach people about Love. It is only when people Understand the Love our God, can they truly understand what Hell is.

If I was a non believer and You told me I would go to hell if I ate that donut, "well then sister, I will see you in hell".

But if you told me, God wants you to know that the donut is poisoned and it will make you sick, He loves you so much and he just wants you to be aware, Then I would listen, tearfully, I would even submit and love him back from watching out for me.

Our Loving God is so much more forgiving and absolutely beautiful and Soft and absolutely gracious and patient and so kind that I have no words to discribe him. He brings tears to my eyes. This is the God I worship.

No man every comes to repentance based upon words. One can ONLY come to repentance if the Holy Spirit softens the heart and woo's them to come. It is not the words that convince the heart....... it is the hand of G-d that convinces the heart.

 

[CrystalDragon]

That is a totally reasonable view if you only see the human/physical side of the problem.

But, if you realize that that third part of heaven that rebelled and were cast to the earth are those who become human and are given a chance to be redeemed then suddenly the picture does change quite a bit.

When an unbeliever says How can an all loving G-d allow X (whatever innocent has something horrible happen) to happen? How is that fair to that person..... Well, now we know that NONE OF US are innocent. We are guilty of REBELLION. And G-d gave us over to our rebelliousness but in his mercy he created the universe and placed those rebellious creatures here that we might have a means of redemption. Some will take it but MANY will reject it.

Let me ask you something: would YOU torture someone for all eternity? Or would you consider that immoral and horrific?

And where exactly is this "one third of heaven" thing? I can I only think of it in Revelation, which is heavily symbolic and theorized to either be about the Roman Empire in John's day (likely) or a symbolic representation of the future (in which case the thing with the angels wouldn't have even happened yet)

 

[CrystalDragon]

No man every comes to repentance based upon words. One can ONLY come to repentance if the Holy Spirit softens the heart and woo's them to come. It is not the words that convince the heart....... it is the hand of G-d that convinces the heart.

So someone can only come to repentance if God drives them to? That means if someone goes to hell its because God didn't call them.

 

[guibox]

Here lately I have wondered why I do not hear ANY sermons preached on hell. I grew up Pentecostal and all those years I would hear preaching on hell fire, repent and give your life to Christ. Many times I saw the Holy Spirit convict people during these sermons and they would practically run to the altar. It seems here lately and has been happening for years now that preachers no longer preach on this matter. Why has everything turned into a pretty package, tickle your ears service?? Why have we strayed away from this? The preacher used to pour out his heart to the congregation, pleading the case of Jesus to turn from the wickedness of this world for there is a heaven and there is a hell, choose today who you will serve, repent for the time is drawing near. What happened to this teaching and preaching, it seems it has all but vanished?

Very simple. The reason why is because the God given moral fiber of our being rebels against such a horrific doctrine. Deep down we know that this doctrine as is traditionally taught is morally wrong and logically incomprehensible. Despite some Christian's well intent to 'support the doctrine through scripture', all they are doing is proving that God lacks justice, fairness and loving moral character. The bottom line is that the doctrine of eternal torment is a gross misinterpretation of the Hebrew and Greek words in the Bible, a taking out of context passages that seem to support it, and building a theology on one or two verses while ignoring the vast majority that support the total annihilation of the wicked. The false doctrine of eternal torment has serious moral, theological, philosophical and cosmological problems. It also ignores the scope of salvation history from the fall of sin to the restoration of mankind; sticking out like a street hooker in a convent.

 

[Fishsack]

No man every comes to repentance based upon words. One can ONLY come to repentance if the Holy Spirit softens the heart and woo's them to come. It is not the words that convince the heart....... it is the hand of G-d that convinces the heart.

Of course, My conviction still stands as such, if you want to preach to people. reward them with the good news, for it is easier to reward those who are lost with the good news than to reward them with the bad. we are not the judge of characters, God is. It is he who will discipline those he loves and those who seeks him. we are just soldiers of God. To truly love one must not cast any judgement upon anyone. Let God speak to them in his own way, but remember teach and pray about Love. Therefore my friend.

I love you so much. Be well.

 

[BukiRob]

Let me ask you something: would YOU torture someone for all eternity? Or would you consider that immoral and horrific?

And where exactly is this "one third of heaven" thing? I can I only think of it in Revelation, which is heavily symbolic and theorized to either be about the Roman Empire in John's day (likely) or a symbolic representation of the future (in which case the thing with the angels wouldn't have even happened yet)

I dont believe in ECT (eternal conscious torment) I stated earlier what I believe scripture clearly teaches.

1) both the believer and sinner die and go to the grave where they await the Resurrection.
2) At the sound of the archangel Yeshua riding a white horse will decend with the angles of heaven in all glory and power. The believers will be raised from the dead and they will have glorified bodies that are incorruptible and immortal (as Paul writes we will put on immortality.)
3) after all has been accomplished the unsaved dead will be raised where they will stand before the Lord at the white throne. Those whose names are NOT found in the book of life will be cast into the Lake of Fire. Scripture is clear on this... it is called THE SECOND DEATH. They will die in this all consuming fire until absolutely nothing of them remains. The dead know nothing and so the moment they die their corpses will be burned until only ask remains.

Their punishment is death and the sentence of the punishment is eternal.

You see, scripture tells us that the Lake of Fire exists for the Devil and his angles... Rev 12 tells us that those angels rebelled against G-d and made war and were defeated and CAST TO THE EARTH.....

The Fall of man is the PHYSICAL representative event that occured that reflects the SPIRITUAL reality of the rebellion in Heaven... and mankind in his fallen state are the result of that.

 

[BukiRob]

Of course, My conviction still stands as such, if you want to preach to people. reward them with the good news, for it is easier to reward those who are lost with the good news than to reward them with the bad. we are not the judge of characters, God is. It is he who will discipline those he loves and those who seeks him. we are just soldiers of God. To truly love one must not cast any judgement upon anyone. Let God speak to them in his own way, but remember teach and pray about Love. Therefore my friend.

I love you so much. Be well.

I dont preach Im not a preacher..... I share what I believe the Father has revealed to me and my walk is my testimony.

 

[CrystalDragon]

I dont believe in ECT (eternal conscious torment) I stated earlier what I believe scripture clearly teaches.

1) both the believer and sinner die and go to the grave where they await the Resurrection.
2) At the sound of the archangel Yeshua riding a white horse will decend with the angles of heaven in all glory and power. The believers will be raised from the dead and they will have glorified bodies that are incorruptible and immortal (as Paul writes we will put on immortality.)
3) after all has been accomplished the unsaved dead will be raised where they will stand before the Lord at the white throne. Those whose names are NOT found in the book of life will be cast into the Lake of Fire. Scripture is clear on this... it is called THE SECOND DEATH. They will die in this all consuming fire until absolutely nothing of them remains. The dead know nothing and so the moment they die their corpses will be burned until only ask remains.

Their punishment is death and the sentence of the punishment is eternal.

You see, scripture tells us that the Lake of Fire exists for the Devil and his angles... Rev 12 tells us that those angels rebelled against G-d and made war and were defeated and CAST TO THE EARTH.....

The Fall of man is the PHYSICAL representative event that occured that reflects the SPIRITUAL reality of the rebellion in Heaven... and mankind in his fallen state are the result of that.

But isn't Revelation supposed to be a prediction of the future unless it was a symbolic representation of the Roman Empire)?

 

[BukiRob]

So someone can only come to repentance if God drives them to? That means if someone goes to hell its because God didn't call them.

Hell as you describe it is not scriptural.

There is NO universal salvation.

Again, you hold the view that mankind is here because he is somehow innocent.... our very existence is all about redemption.... G-d gave us over to our rebellion but in his unfathomable mercy created a way for redemption.

 

[Fishsack]

I dont preach Im not a preacher..... I share what I believe the Father has revealed to me and my walk is my testimony.

huge contradiction here dear brethren..... Your testimony has been preached by you, therefore, you are and have preached. which hereby makes you a preacher. Do you not see? be careful friend, the holy spirit is alive.