To whom and why God gave the Sabbaths?

[bugkiller]

We

How do you reconcile that He rested on the 7th day after 6 days of creation? Why would you call it a lie, is God a liar was He tired after 6 days? He ceased from His works after He made man. Why do you not attack the rest of the commandments only, this one. Is it ok to covet now or commit adultery, dishonor your parents? Why does this command not require obedience? What about Isaiah 56? Is that not written to the nations?

It isn't an attack on the Sabbath. We have been trying to show the requirements of the covenants. Since the gentiles were never given the Sabbath, they are never obligated to it. It was not in any covenant made with gentiles. We are not calling the fact God ceased creating after 6 days a lie. You have God returning to creating by your idea of the weekly Sabbath and the requirements of the 4th commandment.

The NC covenant releases even the Israeli (Jew) from the requirements of the law - Rom 7:6.

bugkiller

 

[Ken Rank]

Ken since God is being an example for His creation, why is not no mention of the Sabbath prior to Ex 16? Shy is there no record of God keeping a weekly Sabbath? Sure God does not need rest because He does not get physically tired, but your issue is being an example.

bugkiller

Greetings BK. Just because something is not mentioned, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Keep in mind too, Israel had just spent a couple of hundred years in Egypt and not all that long after Joseph, the Israelites had kind of worn out their welcome. I wonder how much freedom they had to practice. That said, I wrote an article a number of years ago and I showed 15-20 commandments that you would think were from Sinai forward, that appear before Sinai. What happened there is that the do's and don'ts, which I believe we understood, were written and added to them was the ability to prosecute along with the judgments. The reason for this is simple... Israel had become a nation and the Torah, which really means instructions or directions, became the rule of law for that new nation. That is why Torah is translated as law by the way, but I digress.

By the way, you might say, "the Sabbath doesn't appear until Exodus 16" and for argument sake I will just agree to make a point. That is still 3 chapters before the law is given.

 

[Ken Rank]

You sound very sincere and if you feel the need to assemble yourself together with others on Saturday then I certainly have no objection. I personally believe Jesus is my Rest and I do rest in Him daily. I get my information from the Holy Writ found in the New Testament. It is clear that Jesus gave Paul council on the state of Sabbath worship along with the remainder of the covenant given only to Israel. The Sabbath is for Christians a mere shadow, Jesus is reality. Jesus said come to me and I will give you rest. Israel didn't find true rest in the weekly Sabbath. The Sabbath was a yoke around their necks. What has changed?
The most pronounced verses from the Old Testament concerning how to observe Sabbath is the following:
Isaiah 58:13
If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

I don't know about you, but trying to observe those rules in Isaiah became a burden because I couldn't ever come close to embracing them. You may call Sabbath a delight, but deep down you have to know it condemns you every week because you cannot live up to its expectations. The ironic part of it all is Jesus, through the words of Paul and John, tell us we do not have to observe the day given only to Israel and no other nation on Earth.

Same, gather as you are convicted. Just throwing this in and will then let is drop. If Yeshua is your rest, then why are you still decaying, dying, exposed to sin, tempted? Don't get me wrong, we are children of God, but if the wages of sin is death, and we still die, then what he earned the right to do at Calvary has not been applied yet. That us why 2 Cor. 1:22 and 5:5 call the giving of the Holy Spirit a down payment. That indicates God is planning on giving us much more.

Blessings.

 

[Ken Rank]

I don't know about you, but trying to observe those rules in Isaiah became a burden because I couldn't ever come close to embracing them. You may call Sabbath a delight, but deep down you have to know it condemns you every week because you cannot live up to its expectations. The ironic part of it all is Jesus, through the words of Paul and John, tell us we do not have to observe the day given only to Israel and no other nation on Earth.

Not in the least.... Yeshua didn't give his life so that we don't obey God. He is Lord, we live by His rules, not ours. That said, just throwing another thing out to consider....

You probably look at Matthew 5:17 as a verse that states the end of the law. However, that common mainstream interpretation actually forces that verse to contradict itself. It says, "I did not come to do away with the Law I came to fulfill it." If "fulfill it" means it has been done away with, which is how many churches teach the verse, then, "I have not come to do away with the law but rather to fulfill it" is being taught as, "I have not come to do away with but rather do away with."

The word in Greek can be translated as fulfill but not as in bring an end to.... rather, to DO IT THE WAY IT WAS INTENDED. In other words, Yeshua came and walked out God's instructions not only perfectly, but as the model God expects all His people to follow. He is our model, we follow him... but we don't do what he did?

 

[bugkiller]

Greetings BK. Just because something is not mentioned, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Keep in mind too, Israel had just spent a couple of hundred years in Egypt and not all that long after Joseph, the Israelites had kind of worn out their welcome. I wonder how much freedom they had to practice. That said, I wrote an article a number of years ago and I showed 15-20 commandments that you would think were from Sinai forward, that appear before Sinai. What happened there is that the do's and don'ts, which I believe we understood, were written and added to them was the ability to prosecute along with the judgments. The reason for this is simple... Israel had become a nation and the Torah, which really means instructions or directions, became the rule of law for that new nation. That is why Torah is translated as law by the way, but I digress.

By the way, you might say, "the Sabbath doesn't appear until Exodus 16" and for argument sake I will just agree to make a point. That is still 3 chapters before the law is given.

You can not establish something from thin air. Your argument has no Biblical basis in fact.

Yes the Sabbath appears 3 chapters prior to the 10 Cs being issued. This is approximately 30 days, not hundreds of years.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Same, gather as you are convicted. Just throwing this in and will then let is drop. If Yeshua is your rest, then why are you still decaying, dying, exposed to sin, tempted? Don't get me wrong, we are children of God, but if the wages of sin is death, and we still die, then what he earned the right to do at Calvary has not been applied yet. That us why 2 Cor. 1:22 and 5:5 call the giving of the Holy Spirit a down payment. That indicates God is planning on giving us much more.

Blessings.

You appeal to and talk about the flesh. The law does not provide for eternal life.

bugkiller

 

[Ken Rank]

You can not establish something from thin air. Your argument has no Biblical basis in fact.

Yes the Sabbath appears 3 chapters prior to the 10 Cs being issued. This is approximately 30 days, not hundreds of years.

bugkiller

Doesn't matter, it is still before the law was written. And seeing God rested on the Sabbath day, then the "Sabbath day" is established during creation week, not out of thin air. Well, not by me anyway.

 

[Ken Rank]

You appeal to and talk about the flesh. The law does not provide for eternal life.

bugkiller

Never said it did... we are saved by grace, period. But the saved work... faith without works is dead.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Doesn't matter, it is still before the law was written. And seeing God rested on the Sabbath day, then the "Sabbath day" is established during creation week, not out of thin air. Well, not by me anyway.

yes, and right after YHWH CREATED ADAM and HAVAH, for the next interval / season/ until they sinned/

WHO walked in the GARDEN ?

 

[bugkiller]

Not in the least.... Yeshua didn't give his life so that we don't obey God. He is Lord, we live by His rules, not ours. That said, just throwing another thing out to consider....

You probably look at Matthew 5:17 as a verse that states the end of the law. However, that common mainstream interpretation actually forces that verse to contradict itself. It says, "I did not come to do away with the Law I came to fulfill it." If "fulfill it" means it has been done away with, which is how many churches teach the verse, then, "I have not come to do away with the law but rather to fulfill it" is being taught as, "I have not come to do away with but rather do away with."

The word in Greek can be translated as fulfill but not as in bring an end to.... rather, to DO IT THE WAY IT WAS INTENDED. In other words, Yeshua came and walked out God's instructions not only perfectly, but as the model God expects all His people to follow. He is our model, we follow him... but we don't do what he did?

You're a good lawyer without understanding and considering all the Scripture. LK 24:44 settles your argument as does Heb 7:12. I've got loads more you refuse to believe.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Never said it did... we are saved by grace, period. But the saved work... faith without works is dead.

Those works are not works of the law per James 2.

bugkiller

 

[Ken Rank]

You're a good lawyer without understanding and considering all the Scripture. LK 24:44 settles your argument as does Heb 7:12. I've got loads more you refuse to believe.

bugkiller

I see, another who sees his own understanding as the yardstick by which everyone else should be measured. We don't have to agree BK, I was trying to be brotherly. Clearly you're not in any frame of mind for discussion with anyone who might not see things as you do. So, I will "Ignore" you and we won't have to butt heads again. Be blessed!

 

[bugkiller]

yes, and right after YHWH CREATED ADAM and HAVAH, for the next interval / season/ until they sinned/

WHO walked in the GARDEN ?

It wasn't the Messiah.

bugkiller

 

[Ken Rank]

yes, and right after YHWH CREATED ADAM and HAVAH, for the next interval / season/ until they sinned/

WHO walked in the GARDEN ?

I am not sure what you are asking. Adam was with God.

 

[bugkiller]

I see, another who sees his own understanding as the yardstick by which everyone else should be measured. We don't have to agree BK, I was trying to be brotherly. Clearly your not in any frame of mind for discussion with anyone who might not see things as you do. So, I will "Ignore" you and we won't have to butt heads again. Be blessed!

So why the personal stuff? Just because I used your name trying to be a little friendly? The real deal is you can not beat me with the Scripture.

Your reply said nothing about the Scripture I referenced. Why?

bugkiller

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I am not sure what you are asking. Adam was with God.

For not knowing, not bad.
That is the answer. And Havah, of course.

 

[Ken Rank]

So why the personal stuff? Just because I used your name trying to be a little friendly? The real deal is you can not beat me with the Scripture.

bugkiller

That is quite the prideful reply. Take care.

 

[Ken Rank]

For not knowing, not bad.
That is the answer. And Havah, of course.

I didn't say I didn't know, I said I didn't know what you were asking. But we are heading into a topic here that isn't exactly what this thread is about. We'll catch up again I am sure. Blessings.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

That is quite the prideful reply. Take care.

Who are you talking to ?

A little child could answer (the question was pre-kindergarten).

 

[Ken Rank]

Who are you talking to ?

A little child could answer (the question was pre-kindergarten).

Bug Killer... I was trying to be nice, just having a discussion. He takes issues, tells me how I can't beat him with Scripture... kind of prideful I would say.