Atheistic Darwinist Creationism and It's Just a Sack of Chemicals

[justlookinla]

The FACT remains that this whole "issue" is a non-issue because the so-called video is nothing but a doctored, deceitful LIE and the evidence is HERE in my post that you ran away from (making her comments irrelevant!)

You've also avoided my question as to WHY anti-choicers would ever need to lie/misrepresent their opponents like this IF their cause is actually "on the side of the angels" (true/just)?​

The link to the head of Planned Parenthood admitting guilt is there for all to see, deny it all you wish. Because of the sickening practices of Planned Parenthood, there will also be a congressional investigation. And more videos forthcoming.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/more-vi...nthood-abortion-practices-selling-body-parts/

 

[Willtor]

You want more? We're arranged in a incomprehensibly complex and functional arrangement, producing a wide variety of creations.

Okay, so there's the arrangement of chemicals. I suppose that counts, generally, though the "evolved" part probably covers it. But contextually, you brought this up as something that Darwin opposed. If you recall:

Most Christians believe they're more than an evolved sack of chemicals, contrary to the views of Darwin.

Can you restrict your response to talk about physical things that you believe Christians think comprise us, but that Darwin opposed?

 

[justlookinla]

Okay, so there's the arrangement of chemicals. I suppose that counts, generally, though the "evolved" part probably covers it.

Yes, that counts and the Darwinist evolved part only presents a series of guesses and suppositions of how that happened which drives a worldview that we're nothing special, just a bag of randomly evolved chemicals.

But contextually, you brought this up as something that Darwin opposed. If you recall:

Can you restrict your response to talk about physical things that you believe Christians think comprise us, but that Darwin opposed?

Darwin opposed the view that 'us' are more than random physical creations, but were created by random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless naturalistic mechanisms acting on an alleged single life form of long long ago.

Christians, on the other hand, do not believe that 'us' are creation by random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless naturalistic mechanisms acting on an alleged single life form of long long ago but rather created by God in His image.

Two very different resultant worldviews.

 

[gladiatrix]

The link to the head of Planned Parenthood admitting guilt is there for all to see, deny it all you wish. Because of the sickening practices of Planned Parenthood, there will also be a congressional investigation. And more videos forthcoming.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/more-vi...nthood-abortion-practices-selling-body-parts/

Oh pullleezze, more videos from the same outfit who's already been caught editing/doctoring the one in the CBS newscast...their credibility is worthless. As for Congress "investigating", I'll believe that when I see it, so far all I see is a lot of anti-choicer political posturing from the strident anti-choicers like Martha Roby and Walker (big whoop!)....color me so not impressed.

 

[justlookinla]

Oh pullleezze, more videos from the same outfit who's already been caught editing/doctoring the one in the CBS newscast...their credibility is worthless. As for Congress "investigating", I'll believe that when I see it, so far all I see is a lot of anti-choicer political posturing from the strident anti-choicers like Martha Roby and Walker (big whoop!)....color me so not impressed.

Oh, I don't believe anything will be done to the Planned Parent sickos, but at least the public will be more aware of the evils of the abortion mills.

 

[gladiatrix]

Oh pullleezze, more videos from the same outfit who's already been caught editing/doctoring the one in the CBS newscast...their credibility is worthless. As for Congress "investigating", I'll believe that when I see it, so far all I see is a lot of anti-choicer political posturing from the strident anti-choicers like Martha Roby and Walker (big whoop!)....color me so not impressed.

Oh, I don't believe anything will be done to the Planned Parent sickos, but at least the public will be more aware of the evils of the abortion mills.

Let me get this straight, it's anti-choicers who've been caught LYING, but it's Planned Parenthood that's "evil"? Again,IF your cause is just why lie EVER? This tells all I need to know with regard to the TRUE Evil™ here and it isn't PP.

 

[bhsmte]

Let me get this straight, it's anti-choicers who've been caught LYING, but it's Planned Parenthood that's "evil"? Again,IF your cause is just why lie EVER? This tells all I need to know with regard to the TRUE Evil™ here and it isn't PP.

That's ideology for you. For some, it must be clung to, despite the facts.

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

The example of Christianity is that humanity was created by God.

Please read a dictionary before posting terms you are unfamiliar with. An example of Christianity is not a belief it is an instance to where someone else could point out a person acting according to the tenets of something.

I was born and raised a Jehovah's Witness and knew about God before I knew about me. That is where I learned to eccept all of Gods creations, no matter what their color or abilities were. I learned respct and to act in a dignified manner, because I was supposed to represent Christ in everything I did and everything I said. Why do you think it is said, Whatever comes from your mouth is imprinted on your heart?
I learned to love and that love was something I either had or had not. I learned that you loved because you loved to love and not because Christ toll you to do so. I get so tired of hearing so-called Christians say that , Well, Giod told me to love him or her so I'll do it. You can't force yourself to love. All you can do is tolerate someone because it makes you feel better about yourself.

I also learned that the primary duty of a Christian is to spread the word of God and that was why, after I ran away from home at the age of 16, to get away from the JW's, I was an apologist for Christ. I tried to work in what I've heard from everyone what it was to be a Christian into my life and to speak in behalf of Christian's everywhere. I gave that up when I got tired of hearing what was in the Bible and I finally set down and read the thing from cover to cover. I got lost several times in the old testament, but when I got into the new testament everything clicked.

What impressed me is not just the Philosophy of Christ, but the way he taught and I've not seen but very few people reach out as he did. He even sat with Sinners and publicans to demonstrate something wonderful that i hardly see in the most vocal of Christians. He didn't demonize anyone and even said He who is without sin cast the first stone to show up those who were hypocritical of others.

His main commands were love your God with all your heart, mind and soul and the second was to love your neighbor as yourself. What he gave his decipals to do is spread his word in every corner of the globe and I left that door open when I said I am open to both camps, in my last post I acknowledged my willingness to hear that word.

When I was a practicing Christian and even when I was an apologist I would have picked up on that like a bird dog hearing a chirp and backed off to regroup. As a Christian i was always examining my own actions to evaluate who I was and what I presented myself to the world and having someone say that He would not come to me to speak of Christ would have been like being kicked by a mule.

You didn't pick up on any of that, you just continued on with your single minded ranting about your own issues. That's why I said you were a fine example of Christianity. A more appropriate statement would you are the poster boy the liberal media uses to denigrate actual Christian.

You are filled with hate, my friend and as love pushes out hate, hate pushes out love and if God is love then your hatred has pushed him out of you as well. You are alone here and more than you will ever understand in your present attitude.

 

[AV1611VET]

I was born and raised a Jehovah's Witness and knew about God before I knew about me. That is where I learned to eccept all of Gods creations, no matter what their color or abilities were. I learned respct and to act in a dignified manner, because I was supposed to represent Christ in everything I did and everything I said.

Two questions:

1. What if someone needed a transfusion?
2. Were you ever told to ostracize someone?

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

Two questions:

1. What if someone needed a transfusion?
2. Were you ever told to ostracize someone?

As a Jehovah's witness I was told not to eat blood and there is a passage in the Bible that states that we should not associate with those who had known Christ and rejected him. I think that's in one of the letters, but I am not certain.

It doesn't really matter since I left that faith and was disfellowshiped from them for the last 30 some odd years. I still can't eat in the same room at the same time as my mom and can not be spoken to by any JW, to this day. I don't regret running away from home and leaving that religion behind and never will!

 

[The Cadet]

This is about humanity, not gravity.

Well great. Then stop acting like a scientific explanation of the diversity of life should somehow account for our moral system. It doesn't, because it doesn't try to, because that's not what it's meant to do. The most we can say is that we can use the facts we know from evolution to help derive parts of our moral system - facts like "we are all empathic, emotional, thinking creatures", and "animals are not that dissimilar to us".

It's not the human's fault that they go around killing people, it's the fault of their genes....in a Darwinian world.

The list of biologists who believe in genetic determinism is fairly short.

Cadet, according to Darwinism, is an individual life important?
Why or why not?

According to "darwinism"? I have no idea, because I have never, ever heard someone identify as a "darwinist". According to evolution? Evolution takes no position on the value of an individual life, because it is not a moral system, it is a scientific theory; you might as well be asking, "According to Einsteinism, is an individual life important?" If you are interested in the value of individual life in a system largely predicated on scientific advancement and materialism, check out "Humanism". I reject the god hypothesis, I accept that we are all just sacks of chemicals and electrical systems, but I still feel that each individual life is valuable, and I (and numerous other people) can certainly justify those beliefs. The idea that somehow, an acceptance of evolution leaves one with no justifiable moral guide is completely baseless and downright wrong.

Darwinism is a belief system which yields a worldview.

No, it is a scientific theory which provides an explanatory and predictive model of reality. It does not yield a worldview in any significant way, shape, or form. Materialism might yield a worldview. Scientism might yield a worldview. But acceptance of the theory of evolution? No.

What is the value of humanity in a Darwinist system?

What is the value of humanity in a Planckian system? In a Boylesian system? First define what you mean by "Darwinist".

 

[Alithis]

People have been killing infants and children for millennium. They have left them out to die in the cold of night and have killed them in the womb by striking the mother on purpose. This started long before Darwin was even born and probably before Jesus ever came into the known history of man.

World views are not defined by laws, laws only reflect the values of the society they attempt to control and though Christianity has saturated the culture of America, Darwinism has not.

i did not say they were defined by laws ..i said laws were reshaped by world views to make what was once unacceptable , acceptable . but it is only acceptable in their own eyes . for in truth it remains an evil.

 

[TheBarrd]

Science is nothing more than a tool.
I've said many times...there is nothing science can ever discover that God did not put there...

This battle between faith and science is ridiculous on both sides.

My point was lost in all the rhetoric that followed my post, so let me try again.

Science cannot conclude that life is or is not important...it is not about the individual, but about cold, hard facts. And that is as it should be.

Jesus Christ thinks life is pretty important...He died to give us the opportunity to gain eternal life.
God thinks life is pretty important...He created it. He did not give us a technical manual describing just how He did it...He left that for scientists to try to figure out.
Christianity places a tremendous value on each individual life.

Enter Mr. Charles Darwin.
Now, I'm not the one to say that evolution is or is not a fact.
However, we are much more than just a sack of chemicals, and to us, life is important.
Why?
Anyone who has ever had someone that they love die knows the answer to that.
Even a kid whose beloved pet has died can answer that question.

AHH who-stole-my-name, our Compassionate Observer (cool qualifier, btw) touched on it...

The reason life is important is because only living things can love.

 

[TheBarrd]

As a Jehovah's witness I was told not to eat blood and there is a passage in the Bible that states that we should not associate with those who had known Christ and rejected him. I think that's in one of the letters, but I am not certain.

It doesn't really matter since I left that faith and was disfellowshiped from them for the last 30 some odd years. I still can't eat in the same room at the same time as my mom and can not be spoken to by any JW, to this day. I don't regret running away from home and leaving that religion behind and never will!

I am saddened. You have had a terrible experience.
I'm sure you've heard the Christian arguments against Jehovah's Witnesses. Here at CF they are not considered to be Christians and may not post in Christians only areas.
I say that to show you that there are other ways of seeing God...

 

[JasonClark]

I've said many times...there is nothing science can ever discover that God did not put there..

That sounds wonderful but how would you know that?

 

[TheBarrd]

That sounds wonderful but how would you know that?

It is a basic tenet of my faith that God created everything that exists.
I seriously doubt that science could ever discover anything that doesn't exist...

 

[JasonClark]

That sounds wonderful but how would you know that?

It is a basic tenet of my faith that God created everything that exists.

I see, you believe it but you don't know it.

I seriously doubt that science could ever discover anything that doesn't exist...

What an amazing statement but you're right, science will never ever not ever discover anything that does not exist, do you know why? because it doesn't exist,
that's the reason why science can not find any gods.

 

[The Cadet]

Science cannot conclude that life is or is not important...it is not about the individual, but about cold, hard facts. And that is as it should be.

Technically, you're probably right. However, seeing as our moral capacity is necessarily a function of our knowledge (if we think animals are merely automatons, why would it be wrong to torture or abuse them?), science does have quite a lot to say about morality. Our moral judgments must necessarily be predicated in facts about reality, and science is the only tool we have that's known to offer us consistently valid facts about reality.

 

[JasonClark]

Technically, you're probably right. However, seeing as our moral capacity is necessarily a function of our knowledge (if we think animals are merely automatons, why would it be wrong to torture or abuse them?), science does have quite a lot to say about morality. Our moral judgments must necessarily be predicated in facts about reality, and science is the only tool we have that's known to offer us consistently valid facts about reality.

I wrote about 20 lines but decided the words would get me banned so.......... I don't think she will believe you.

 

[TheBarrd]

I see, y//ou believe it but you don't know it.
What an amazing statement but you're right, science will never ever not ever discover anything that does not exist, do you know why? because it doesn't exist,
that's the reason why science can not find any gods.

Something I've always been curious about...
Why would an atheist, supposedly content with his/her atheism, spend useless hours hanging out on Christian web sites?
Science cannot find God, for the very same reason that science cannot explain what a mind is or how it works. Oh, science can tell us all about the physical aspects of our brains...but things get a bit vague when it comes to explaining intelligence, or why one person can paint beautiful landscapes, while another can't draw a straight line, for instance. Psychiatry admits that it is "not an exact science"...nor can it be.
Science cannot delve into the human mind, because it has no way to deal with what is not physical...
God is a spirit. Science has no way to deal with that.