"Embedded Age" Requires Fake Fossils

[Doveaman]

Some creationists make the claim that God created the Earth with maturity or embedded age during the initial creation of the Earth which is why rocks appear to be millions to billions of years old when measured with radiometric dating. The problem is that this requires God to put fake fossils in the ground.

1. When a T. rex or other large animal dies, it doesn't dig through hundreds of feet of solid basalt rock and make a fossil.

2. Therefore, any lava flows found above a fossil had to occur AFTER the organism died.

Or maybe the dinosaur fell into the lava flow and sank.

Or maybe there was an earthquake and the earth cracked open and swallowed the dinosaur.

 

[RickG]

Or maybe the dinosaur fell into the lava flow and sank.

Or maybe there was an earthquake and the earth cracked open and swallowed the dinosaur.

No on both.

 

[Doveaman]

I do have a problem with those who deliberately misrepresent any information, or make things up to support those beliefs, that is bearing false witness.

Your embedded space expansion claims are all made up. Are you bearing false witness?

Understand that this is not unique to religion or Christianity, as it can apply to secular beliefs as well.

Such as your scientific beliefs.

 

[RickG]

Your embedded space expansion claims are all made up. Are you bearing false witness?

I haven't a clue what you are talking about. Do you have me confuse with someone else?

Such as your scientific beliefs.

I have no scientific beliefs, only scientific learning and experience. And perhaps you could explain why you took my comment about secular equilibrium out of context. That my friend, is bearing false witness.

 

[Doveaman]

As the Christians at Biologos point out an "embedded age" would be a case of God lying, not once but many many times.

If God embedded age into rocks it would only be a case of God lying if it was His intent to mislead. And just because we didn't understand why He did it doesn't mean He would be a deceiver. It would only mean we are simply ignorant as to why He did it. If scientists could communicate with God I'm sure He would have a good explanation for it.

 

[Doveaman]

I haven't a clue what you are talking about. Do you have me confuse with someone else?

Okay maybe your don't believe in space expansion, but your scientific buddies certainly do.

The idea that the space between objects can expand is a made up claim with no empirical verification to back it up. Objects expand away from each other, but the empty space between them has never been observed to expand or empirically verified to expand. Are scientists bearing false witness when they make such claims?

I have no scientific beliefs, only scientific learning and experience. And perhaps you could explain why you took my comment about secular equilibrium out of context. That my friend, is bearing false witness.

I don't think you understand what bearing false witness is.

 

[RickG]

Okay maybe your don't believe in space expansion, but your scientific buddies certainly do.

Yes, the expansion of space is well observed. If you wish to ignore it, so be it.

The idea that the space between objects can expand is a made up claim with no empirical verification to back it up. Objects expand away from each other, but the empty space between them has never been observed to expand or empirically verified to expand. Are scientists bearing false witness when they make such claims?

No, your ignorance of how the expansion of space is observed has you making acquisitions to suit your own preconceived unsupported ideas.

I don't think you understand what bearing false witness is.

You quoted a comment of mine and represented it as something I didn't say. That's false witness.

 

[dad]

You are making a baseless claim that is completely without any supporting evidence. We know there has never been a changed past because we would see it in the physical properties in the atomic structure of all elements and compounds.

That is patently ridiculous. The changes we would see would only be changes if they happened IN this nature. Be honest. If nature itself, the very forces and laws changed, then we would not see what you claim in atoms or anywhere else.

The physical properties of all atomic structures, elements, and compounds are the same regardless of age.

That is truly silly. The properties are no more or less than what they must be under the nature they exist in.

 

[dad]

Yes, the expansion of space is well observed. .

So show us the observations aside from the redshift, which is totally open to interpretation.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Unreasonable according to whose opinion: yours or mine?

By the standards of any thinking person.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Here is the dictionary definition of theory:

“an idea or set of ideas that is intended to explain facts or events


: an idea that is suggested or presented as possibly true but that is not known or proven to be true


: the general principles or ideas that relate to a particular subject”

This means that I did use the term correctly. You are trying to hold me to a specialized use of this term.

That is the dictionary definition. It is also the wrong definition. Since we are having a scientific debate you need to use the scientific definition of theory. Try again. The definition of a scientific theory is much more stringent.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes, there is! I’ll give you a couple of examples: Human DNA, and the fine tuning of the universe. There is no way of evolution to have produced this evidence by mere chance.

Evolution has had a monopoly on education for centuries now and it has failed to convince people that there is no God. Nearly 90 percent of Americans still believe in the existence of an entity responsible for life and the universe.

Again we are talking about scientific evidence and now you have shown that you do not understand what scientific evidence is. And only ignorant creationists try to describe the fact of evolution as "mere chance".

The Fine Tuning argument is basically an argument from ignorance and does not qualify as scientific evidence. Nor does the mere existence of DNA. How And evolution says nothing about the existence or nonexistence of God. It only shows that your beliefs about Adam and Eve are wrong. There was no Adam and Eve. There was no Flood or Noah's Ark. The opinion of ignorant people is all but meaningless.

 

[Subduction Zone]

So show us the observations aside from the redshift, which is totally open to interpretation.

How can redshift be explained besides by the Big Bang theory? And of course there is more evidence. The cosmic background energy is extremely strong evidence of the Big Bang as is the distribution of light elements. Currently there are no other scientific explanations.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Jesus Christ did believe that Adam and Eve were real individuals created by God. I do share his beliefs, and you are questioning my Christianity?

Wrong, there is no real evidence of your claim. Since Jesus used poetic language all of the time, and he never said Adam and Eve are real his references to them is no different than saying that someone is as old as the hills.

And I was pointing out how many of your beliefs seem to be rather blasphemous to say the least.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If God embedded age into rocks it would only be a case of God lying if it was His intent to mislead. And just because we didn't understand why He did it doesn't mean He would be a deceiver. It would only mean we are simply ignorant as to why He did it. If scientists could communicate with God I'm sure He would have a good explanation for it.

Now you are merely rationalizing a deceptive behavior. But it does not really matter. The hundreds of self contradictions, the bad science, the bad geometry, the failed prophecies and the terrible morals shows that the Bible is clearly not a case of God telling us anything. It is a mere work of man. The Earth where its history is written for all to see is a much more reliable source.

 

[AV1611VET]

Since Jesus used poetic language all of the time

So Jesus overturned tables and chairs and sent money and cages full of birds falling to the ground, scattering men, women, and animals in every which direction while quoting Edna St. Vincent Millay?

 

[Subduction Zone]

So Jesus overturned tables and chairs and sent money and cages full of birds falling to the ground, scattering men, women, and animals in every which direction while quoting Edna St. Vincent Millay?

How amazingly dishonest. Try again AV.

 

[AV1611VET]

How amazingly dishonest. Try again AV.

Edgar Allan Poe?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Edgar Allan Poe?

And AV shows that even he knows that Doveman is wrong. Thanks for the support AV.

 

[AV1611VET]

And AV shows that even he knows that Doveman is wrong. Thanks for the support AV.