Can we fall from grace ?

[Light hearted]

Jesus speaks of iniquity here In the NT Being a slave to sin or a habitual sinner! Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work in iniquity. ]Matthew‬ ]7‬:]21-23‬ KJV)

lori milne, I quoted the above post, yet I removed the Old Testament part. I did this for two reasons.

(1) Jesus had not bore the penalty yet for mankind to be reconciled back to God yet,

(2) I want to focus on the New Testament part of your post, something stands out that I see could be tripping you up.

Although you posted Mat 7, I want to bring forth Mat 25:31, basically the same but has deeper content.

First verse.
Jesus Will Judge the World
31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory and all his angels are with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 The people of every nation will be gathered in front of him. He will separate them as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right but the goats on his left.

When we read the Bible it can be difficult to determine where we stand in relation to whom he is talking about. Unique thing about Mat:25 is, he is speaking to the saved and un-saved. Basically the sheep (saved) and the goats (un-saved).

Which category do you belong in, the sheep or the goats? I'm not trying to sound sarcastic, just try to get you on stable ground as you read through Mat 25:31 - Mat 25:46.

What I'm saying is, it is easy to get snared into scripture that is a warning to those who have not accepted Christ, we the saved can be drawn into feeling defeated and Christians and begin to look at ourselves instead of who we are in Christ. Next thing we know we are turning to the law to save ourselves.

Back to Mat 25, I really like verse 40, the sheep didn't take credit for the fruit they produced and Jesus said 40 “The king will answer them, ‘I can guarantee this truth: Whatever you did for "one" of my brothers or sisters, no matter how unimportant they seemed, you did for me.’

He said for "ONE", wow, those humbled sheep, and Jesus thanked them.

Now the goats, trying to sell their works.44 “They, too, will ask, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or as a stranger or in need of clothes or sick or in prison and didn’t help you?’

Those poor goats, it's not that they didn't do something for ONE, it's that they may have done a thousand good deeds yet missed ONE.

What it gets down to, God never knew them, they didn't have the Grace offered, they went at it by themselves and failed to gain God's approval.

For the many sin posts I've seen, I want to post a Grace post from Hebrews.

10:15 The Holy Spirit tells us the same thing: 16 “This is the promise that I will make to them after those days, says the Lord: ‘I will put my teachings in their hearts and write them in their minds.’”

17 Then he adds, “I will no longer hold their sins and their disobedience against them.”

18 When sins are forgiven, there is no longer any need to sacrifice for sins.

Remember, know your standing with God as you read scripture.

If any of this sounds harsh I apologize, I mean it all with total respect.

 

[hmw]

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, ([bless and do not curse]Hebrews‬ [bless and do not curse]10‬:[bless and do not curse]26‬ KJV)

Hi lori,

To answer your question about Heb 10:26, firstly lets define sin. Many just think sin is bad behavior. But God gives definitions in scripture and its these that we should use.

Below are some examples of God's definitions of sin:

1: Unrighteousness, 1John 5:17. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5.

2: Unbelief in Jesus, John 16:9. This is the sin the world is convicted of. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as we believe on Jesus.

3: Transgression of the law, 1John 3:4. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as we're not under the law (Rom 8:2. Rom 10:4, Gal 3:25, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9). Remember that whatever the law says it says to those under it, Rom 3:19.

Thus we see in Rom 8:33
Who shall lay ANY THING (this includes sin) to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

1Pet 4:1
Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

1John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

This is not saying that Christians are perfect in behavior. Instead it's describing our position in Christ, as believers. Our life is hid with Christ in God (col 3:3), and in him there is no sin, 1John 3:5. It's Christ's righteousness, holiness, sinlessness that covers us.

Now to explain Heb 10:26.

Remember that as believers in Christ its his sinlessness that covers us. So how does one make themselves a (willful) sinner again (that is being outside of Christ's covering)?
Gal 2:18
For if I build again the things which I destroyed (righteousness by works of the law), I make myself a transgressor./SINNER

This is how one makes themselves a willful sinner. They turn back to the law for righteousness by works. And it's this that Heb 10:26 refers to.

If, after having the knowledge of the truth in Christ, a Christian rejects God's grace by turning back to the law for righteousness, then for such there is no more repentance. They are like a dog returning to it's vomit.

Heb 6:4-6 confirms Heb 10:26-29.

Heb 6:4-6
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Those that fall away are those who sin willfully by rejecting God's grace when turning back to the law for righteousness. When such turn back to the law then whatever the law says it says to them (Rom 3:19) as they are under it's jurisdiction. And they will be found guilty of all the law because the law must be kept perfectly (James 2:10).

So we see that Heb 10:26 is not talking about so called "habitual" sin. Instead Heb 10:26 refers to legalists who preach righteousness by works of the law. We cannot even mix works of the law, with grace (Rom 11:6) as that is to be lukewarm and God will spew such out of His mouth.

Heb 10:26 is a warning that Christians should not turn back to the law like the foolish Galatians did (Gal 3). For any Christian who truly had the knowledge of the truth in Christ (Heb 6:4-6) to turn back to works of the law or even mixing works of the law, with grace, such willfully make themselves a sinner as they will be back under the jurisdiction of the law and thus be found guilty of all the law (James 2:10).

Hope this helps to explain Heb 10:26.

Also, having just read Light hearted's post I see that Heb 10:26 refers to goats (legalists) as the willful sinners.

 

[Noblemen]

Sin is defined in Scripture as a nature more commonly known as a sin nature, Eph. 2:3. Our first birthing we received Adam's sin or sin nature in our second birthing we received God's nature or the "in Christ" nature.

 

[lori milne]

We will always have had and will always continue to have a choice to sin, be partakers in iniquity, er or turn we can walk out of his hand in fact it says it's worse for the brethren/ saved after obtaining the knowledge / understanding to fall back into sin or go back to his vomit like a dog, I see all the passages you guys continue to post but it doesn't deny the post that clearly tell me NOT to sin especially in the NT Jesus speaks of iniquity Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew‬ 7:22-23‬ KJV) Definition of iniquity = Iniquity is sin at its worst. Iniquity is premeditated, continuing, and escalating. When we flirt with sin, we fall for the lie that we can control it. But like a cute baby monkey can grow to be a wild, out-of-control primate, sin that seems small and harmless at first can take control before we know it. When we give ourselves over to a sinful lifestyle, we are committing iniquity. Sin has become our god rather than the Lord! Everything you speak of has been given to you all by pastors or commentary NO WAY did any of you figure this on your own from the bible because it's not in the bible! But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not. 2 Peter‬ 2:1-3‬ KJV) The church use to teach it correctly " anyone remember fire and brimstone, bible thumper hell and damnation "?? Well if you do that's ware it came from!! Keep sinning and thinking that way but I warn u READ THE BIBLE search for the wisdom and understanding He continuously tells us about.

The snake lied to eve remember it wasn't GOD that lied. And remember satins original lie it's the theme of al his work.. If it sounds like his/satins lie then be warned. DO YOU REMEMBER HIS LIE? And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Genesis‬ 3‬:4-5‬ KJV)
He said plainly we can sin and we will not die / have eternal life GOD said we will die if we-sin.

 

[MWood]

We will always have had and will always continue to have a choice to sin, be partakers in iniquity, er or turn we can walk out of his hand in fact it says it's worse for the brethren/ saved after obtaining the knowledge / understanding to fall back into sin or go back to his vomit like a dog, I see all the passages you guys continue to post but it doesn't deny the post that clearly tell me NOT to sin especially in the NT Jesus speaks of iniquity Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew‬ 7:22-23‬ KJV) Definition of iniquity = Iniquity is sin at its worst. Iniquity is premeditated, continuing, and escalating. When we flirt with sin, we fall for the lie that we can control it. But like a cute baby monkey can grow to be a wild, out-of-control primate, sin that seems small and harmless at first can take control before we know it. When we give ourselves over to a sinful lifestyle, we are committing iniquity. Sin has become our god rather than the Lord! Everything you speak of has been given to you all by pastors or commentary NO WAY did any of you figure this on your own from the bible because it's not in the bible! But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not. 2 Peter‬ 2:1-3‬ KJV) The church use to teach it correctly " anyone remember fire and brimstone, bible thumper hell and damnation "?? Well if you do that's ware it came from!! Keep sinning and thinking that way but I warn u READ THE BIBLE search for the wisdom and understanding He continuously tells us about.

The snake lied to eve remember it wasn't GOD that lied. And remember satins original lie it's the theme of al his work.. If it sounds like his/satins lie then be warned. DO YOU REMEMBER HIS LIE? And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Genesis‬ 3‬:4-5‬ KJV)
He said plainly we can sin and we will not die / have eternal life GOD said we will die if we-sin.

Surely you remember that Jesus died on the Cross? When He shed His blood, it was for the forgiving of the sins of the whole world. From Adam to the last sin at the end of time. ALL the sins of the world have been forgiven.

 

[lori milne]

Of course I do know Jesus died on the cross for our sins but that does not give us the right to sin or practice iniquity or fall into habitual sinning leaning on Grace to continue to sin is more/ worse then being a sinner . Jesus said forgive them father for they do not know what they do! After obtaining the knowledge it is worse because you new better! kinda like the age of accountability.

This isn't anything new im saying btw it's actually in the bible

 

[FanthatSpark]

The One, (borrowed from an earlier post)

Read this thread as a whole. A lot of good help on grace. Amen vessels! This post is dedicated to the vessel as an individual under sanctification (justification assumed). Each vessels individualism is of itself different. However, Heb. 13:8 never changes = God/the One/trinity/love unfathomable/New testament/Grace.Now comes the mind/us/individuals
with pride for translation of truth. Lori seems to come to an understanding/truth her mind is struggling to wrap around in Rom 12:2. The first 11 chapters paints a picture of grace chapter 12 starts application. The flaw in sanctification and training in the bible has been touched upon in this thread. Sanctification involves us, Lori. Each and every one of us from Adam to today were of John 8:44 . Thus a truth we read in the bible we seek answers from ? People correct? No trust in Matt 22:37 and the book of truth. This thread holds a lie in it for two types of answers given to the OP. One says yes, one says no. Jesus individualized the church in this verse Matt 16;18 . The question lays inside of you Lori yet we balk at truth for we are not of it by...nature, John 8:44 . So, faith in statements in the bible such as "It is done", "Sin no more", comes to self/individual to be translated in one of two ways. Carnal translation and/or Spirit translation. That truth soothes this vessel for the mind may not be ready today in a mystery of scripture because self is in the way in this present season for 1 Cor: 13:4-7 has not fully enveloped this vessel from receiving it (basking in that as God/1 John 4:8) to applying it to self and ultimately another. Source = God. In us, source = love/God in us which produces love to do good deeds for loves/Gods sake only. So God loved us first in grace/justifications gift, to be sanctified in NT (with love at the forefront of perception while reading) to transform the mind to think in ??? Love. Applying love back to God is no "want" to commit sin . Yet, our want is just that...Ours alone, and in pride thought turns to deed in choice = obedience. In a nutshell Non obedience is "will"- full sin in snatching will from God and applying "our" will . Our will encompasses sin.

Perception in love/NT and falling from grace has been thoroughly talked of here in. Deeds become our reputation and can be seen in selfs eye as "I do" these things. This thread covers a lot of ... I ,me, my, mine that looses sight that all good things are from God and the deed never came from humanity. Quenching the Spirit is another terminology. Another is Law, in claiming of "I"... Did this, wrote that, spoke upon this, I have a good idea,I gave this and that and my last dollar too... <-- Fallen from grace/love 1 Cor 13:4-7/God/NT. Good will is His will yet we all get caught up in the little things as accepting thanks for Gods good deed. However Lori, there is but one teacher it seems for you in this season, God. It seems upon looking at responses, a solid training has already been established in the Word. It may be time for sequester for a season and pray and test the spirits for truth & love. Then, one comes back to oneness of the source, the one...God.

 

[lori milne]

To: thepromisfrograce:

What it means is we can never live an Entire life with out sinning hence we have spot I. Suso we can't go to heaven Jesus died for the cleansing of those sins so you are new and have a chance to start a fresh! But you have to trust in him like when he asked his desiple to walk on the water, he wasn't teaching them a cool trick it was a note: to trusting and believing you can turn from sin and he will give you the strength to THATS his promise to kit give us more in Temptation the we can handle! He I fact made the law even harder to obey by saying he who lust in his heart / eyes has committed adultery! Not just the act. Sin no more repent from Your sin ESPECIALLY willful sin sin you choose to do! How can you expect to be forgiven for something you don't feel bad for GOD forbid!

 

[lori milne]

Fanthespark

I didn't get any of what you said :/
You are to over my head no pun intended
Just couldn't understand.
Verbiage is deferent maybe?

 

[lori milne]

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. ([bless and do not curse]Matthew&#8236; [bless and do not curse]7&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]13-20&#8236; KJV)

 

[thepromiseofgrace]

To: thepromisfrograce:

What it means is we can never live an Entire life with out sinning hence we have spot I. Suso we can't go to heaven Jesus died for the cleansing of those sins so you are new and have a chance to start a fresh! But you have to trust in him like when he asked his desiple to walk on the water, he wasn't teaching them a cool trick it was a note: to trusting and believing you can turn from sin and he will give you the strength to THATS his promise to kit give us more in Temptation the we can handle! He I fact made the law even harder to obey by saying he who lust in his heart / eyes has committed adultery! Not just the act. Sin no more repent from Your sin ESPECIALLY willful sin sin you choose to do! How can you expect to be forgiven for something you don't feel bad for GOD forbid!

by faith through Grace.

Praise God.

 

[lori milne]

Grace is a word only Paul ever used Jesus only said the word 4 times read the bible it was used 150 times in the NT and 126 of those times were from Paul, look at the OT it's used 60 times! The law is there to keep u from sin so you can have grace is what Paul preached! Your being mislead

 

[lori milne]

Search for truth is to actually search, not base your life around 1 Person or 1 book or even your preacher to actually read and learn for your self which no one does any more , every one is into short cuts the easy road??!

I pray for an awakening in Jesus name!
Amen

 

[hmw]

Of course I do know Jesus died on the cross for our sins but that does not give us the right to sin or practice iniquity or fall into habitual sinning leaning on Grace to continue to sin is more/ worse then being a sinner . Jesus said forgive them father for they do not know what they do! After obtaining the knowledge it is worse because you new better! kinda like the age of accountability.

This isn't anything new im saying btw it's actually in the bible

Actually "habitual" sin is not in the Bible.

I've often asked those who follow this doctrine of "habitual" sin if they can provide scripture detailing what amount of sinning determines "habitual". Interestingly nobody has ever been able to answer this.

The term "habitual" is a very ambiguous term, but God is not ambiguous about salvation. Therefore we see the argument for "habitual" sin is an error doctrine.

It seems that you follow this "habitual" sin doctrine. Can you explain what is "habitual"?
Is it 7x70 offences?

And does the length of ones life get taken into consideration in determining habitual. Or are you saying that those with death bed salvation are more blessed than those who live for decades in that they did not have to dodge the habitual sin bullet and simply were saved by grace in just believing on Jesus.

BTW your quote below is missing the rest of the verse that puts a different context to it.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew&#8236; 7:22-23&#8236; KJV)

Here is the whole scripture.
Matt 7: 21-23
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

And what is God's will?
John 6:40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

So with this in mind, who are the workers of iniquity?
It's those who preach the law as they are under the jurisdiction of the law (Rom 3:19) and will be found guilty of all the law (James 2:10) thus being workers of iniquity.

Remember that whatever the law says it says to those under it, Rom 3:19.

Christians, however, are NOT under the law (Rom 8:2, Rom 10:4, Gal 3:25, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9).

Thus we see in Rom 8:33
Who shall lay ANY THING (this includes sin) to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

For Christians our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5. Thus we cannot be charged with sin/unrighteousness. Christians obey God's will to believe on Jesus, John 6:40.

But legalists disobey God's will. They reject grace and preach works of the law instead. And the law is not of faith. Gal 3:12. By being under the law legalists thus make themselves a sinner, (Gal 2:18) as they reject God's grace.

We must not mix works of the law, with grace, Rom 11:6. To do so is to be lukewarm.

Lori, I suspect you have been misled by a legalistic doctrine.
Are you suggesting that Christians are unrighteous unless they keep the law?

 

[thepromiseofgrace]

Grace is a word only Paul ever used Jesus only said the word 4 times read the bible it was used 150 times in the NT and 126 of those times were from Paul, look at the OT it's used 60 times! The law is there to keep u from sin so you can have grace is what Paul preached! Your being mislead

on the contrary, Law says do not sin but does not help you to not sin.
so law demands from you.

grace says I forgive you for your sin as i paid for it all ready.
Grace enables you to stay close to god.

 

[Neogaia777]

Yes, you are saved in the moment you turn to him regardless of your sins, but the Lord will begin a work in you from that point onward, especially/and the more you turn to him, to change your perception of sin from something desirable, to something distasteful and undesirable to you, like weaning a baby by souring the milk, the milk being sin.

He (the Lord) will also begin to open your eyes and not only change your perception of sin from something desirable, to something undesirable, but he will also open your eyes to the fact of the misery that sin causes in your life and how it (sin) is preventing you from living a desirable, fully satisfied, content and peaceful, The good life that he intended for you...

This is the process known as "sanctification"

But if you backslide, God understands, and you DO NOT "fall from grace", "IF", in that case, (if you backslide), you admit that your sin IS sin, and feel sorry or regret over it, and NOT try an excuse it, and be of a repentant attitude (heart) and "turn" to him, and as/the more you "turn" to him, especially if you immediately do it when being tempted, this "should" (if your "yielding" your heart, soul, mind, and spirit to him and you are not "resisting" him), this should greatly help you with your sin, and put you back on course toward the goal and process of sanctification, and pretty soon, the more you turn to him, your appetite or desire to sin should wane and change and even go away completely (eventually, it's a process)...

God Bless!

 

[lori milne]

Habitual sin is iniquity

 

[lori milne]

Actually "habitual" sin is not in the Bible. I've often asked those who follow this doctrine of "habitual" sin if they can provide scripture detailing what amount of sinning determines "habitual". Interestingly nobody has ever been able to answer this. The term "habitual" is a very ambiguous term, but God is not ambiguous about salvation. Therefore we see the argument for "habitual" sin is an error doctrine. It seems that you follow this "habitual" sin doctrine. Can you explain what is "habitual"? Is it 7x70 offences? And does the length of ones life get taken into consideration in determining habitual. Or are you saying that those with death bed salvation are more blessed than those who live for decades in that they did not have to dodge the habitual sin bullet and simply were saved by grace in just believing on Jesus. BTW your quote below is missing the rest of the verse that puts a different context to it. Here is the whole scripture. Matt 7: 21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. And what is God's will? John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. So with this in mind, who are the workers of iniquity? It's those who preach the law as they are under the jurisdiction of the law (Rom 3:19) and will be found guilty of all the law (James 2:10) thus being workers of iniquity. Remember that whatever the law says it says to those under it, Rom 3:19. Christians, however, are NOT under the law (Rom 8:2, Rom 10:4, Gal 3:25, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9). Thus we see in Rom 8:33 Who shall lay ANY THING (this includes sin) to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. For Christians our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5. Thus we cannot be charged with sin/unrighteousness. Christians obey God's will to believe on Jesus, John 6:40. But legalists disobey God's will. They reject grace and preach works of the law instead. And the law is not of faith. Gal 3:12. By being under the law legalists thus make themselves a sinner, (Gal 2:18) as they reject God's grace. We must not mix works of the law, with grace, Rom 11:6. To do so is to be lukewarm. Lori, I suspect you have been misled by a legalistic doctrine. Are you suggesting that Christians are unrighteous unless they keep the law?

Your basing that all off your usurpation


&ldquo;This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,&rdquo; then he adds, &ldquo;I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.&rdquo; Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful. And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near. For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. ([bless and do not curse]Hebrews&#8236; [bless and do not curse]10&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]16-18, 22-27&#8236; ESV)

Btw I skipped a few versus not to hide them but they are erelavent to my point
In one hand Paul says all sins are covered
And In the same chapter like a verse below he says there is no sacrifice for willful sinning/ which is the same as iniquity or habitual sinning. Like natural instinctual sinning is comment until you grow more in faith but choose to sin is to not repent from sin but from God.
The lawns there to keep us from sinning it's like a handrail that yes we must obey

 

[lori milne]

I used the esv which I never do just wanted it to be clear

 

[FanthatSpark]

Fanthespark

I didn't get any of what you said :/
You are to over my head no pun intended
Just couldn't understand.
Verbiage is deferent maybe?

Fanthespark


Verbiage and change of perception,

That's O.k. Assumptions were added to the post . Source speech is all it is. Grace stems from love. Love is God. Falling from grace is loosing love/trust of God inside the individuals head or mind = faith. In source speech faith, grace, hope and love are terms used by humanity for descriptions sake yet all these terms can be interchangeable from the source, God and or Spirit. Falling from grace is done by "us alone" for what faith looks like in a human is love of God first then self (that can cause confusion too but self must be sanctified first in perfecting love), then another . Grace is God loving us first (in part), faith is reciprocation of that love/grace in (another term stemming from God but manifests in us through love) belief of hope. That looks like joy for joys sake which requires faith. Jesus's burden is light. Light is joy the easiest yoke.

Love is the manifestation from humanities point of view. In previous post
1 Cor 13: 4-7 and 1 John 4:8 were used in, source, and may cause confusion. 1 John states God is love. God is soo much more ,but, in manifestation in us , the term love is all we got for verbiage. We as humanity show spurts of God in 1 Cor 13:4-7 (that is taken out of context to apply to self or another. Another verbiage is a mystery revealed to the individual in Spirit). Source speech is change of perception to view every thing around us in Spirit/(His gift in justification or baptism)Love(what it looks like from a humans point of view then understanding in the measure what love looks like from Gods point of veiw)/God( a Godly love 1-Cor 13:4-7). We can not do 1- Cor on a constant basis for if we replace the term charity/love with God in its place that IS true source speech and fulfills scripture in 1 john 4:18. Imagine a world that followed 1Cor 13:4-7 in totality. Heaven right? Love has many aspects in thought, deed , our understanding of it and Gods understanding of it.

Lets try another tact. OT = Avoidance of hell by self to follow law out of FEAR of place upon death or pride in knowledge of what sin looks like. Outside in.

NT = Love, where no fear exists in the... mind, which will manifest to actions in its season. 1 John 4:18. Inside of us to manifest to others. Inside out. If we think in the realm of love then it manifests to others .

When an individual looks to the OT and tries to apply it in sincere ignorance that faith is lost to a degree, because now we know of a sin, and we think this is good, a degree of faith is lost to knowledge unwittingly. If an individual sanctifies in NT only and perfects love then Matt 22:37-39 is fulfillment of all law to God, others and self. No need to have knowledge of law. Inside out. It is written Jesus says he adds to the law and in carnal translation it is what it says and it sounds like, its harder. However, in Spirit the law can be thrown to the wayside (which makes it easier in actuality)because we have faith in God, love, grace, hope, self to treat each other in love. To train the mind to think like 1 Cor 13:4-7 is perfection . OT provides confusion to the professor of Jesus. All will be judged, however, the justified will be judged and rewarded or not but the gift never tarnishes thus Heb 13:8. Falling from grace stems from many sources such as knowledge that cuts faith from the picture. With knowledge now comes judgment of self and others. The true religion is to visit all in their afflictions yet not be stained, James 1:27. Carnal translation of that verse makes one think of children and widows. Lets change perception to Spirit/Source/God. Widows and orphans are the unjustified from the baptism which further translates in Spiritual conceptual thinking that an 80 year old man or woman can be an orphan to the baptism. Is it not written call no one but God, father?

All that above to say knowledge can not hold Miracle, Spirit, Grace, Godly love , yet a broadening of perception through love from the source is to open the mind and accept the unexplainable in faith of the Fathers grace = Trust.
Trust turns into obedience for the heavy reciprocator (or love of God first in all things even our suffering). That brings Rom:12-3 in the measure and or our individual faith in God.

Love is source. All other aspects produce negativity in doubt and the Spirit resides not there. It is understood that this post looks off topic but it really is not because we all here in seek the source but a change of perception is required. It is in all hopes one wraps the mind around 1 Cor 4-7 as stand alone verses to apply to every thing = Change of perception in love for loves sake. Does this not encompass Matt 16:18 where the gates of hell can not prevail. If one encompasses this one does not come to judge a sin, we are not equipped, for biasness arises in the mind of the flesh. However, coming to a friend or a stranger in love not to judge and not to condemn but in understanding that every one has a plank in the eye especially self, one can be compassionate in the affliction and help the sufferer come to the truth of the Word.

A tidbit in closing. If a piece of knowledge causes doubt should one continue in knowledge for knowledges sake? Or joy for joys sake and leave knowledge behind and live life under love/spirit/God What Does the Bible Say About Joy Of The Hope Inside?