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Bible Prophecy unfolding

keras

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Controversy surrounds the Prime Minister of Israel’s forthcoming appearance on Capitol Hill. Invited by Republican House Speaker John Boehner to address Congress about the threat of Iran’s nuclear ambitions, Benjamin Netanyahu welcomed this opportunity to share his country’s existential concern as the Iranian regime comes ever closer to achieving the capability of fulfilling its avowed goal of the total annihilation of Israel. But the White House has made known its displeasure. A growing number of Democratic lawmakers said they would boycott his talk. Vice President Joe Biden, who as president of the Senate would normally oversee Netanyahu’s address, said he would be out of town. House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi said she hoped the speech “doesn’t take place.”
Why all this animosity toward the leader of a long-standing ally, the only democracy in the middle east, to whom President Obama has long pledged his unswerving loyalty? Because the administration has made clear its fury at a supposed breach of protocol. The White House insists it was not consulted before the invitation was given. That breach of etiquette, it stoutly maintains, trumps any benefit Congress might gain from the insights of the Prime Minister of the country to be most immediately and severely affected by the present negotiations being concluded with Iran.
Remarkably, this is not the first time the issue of protocol lies at the heart of an Iranian threat to destroy the Jewish people. There is biblical precedent. Eerily echoing today’s story, the Book of Esther recounts the first recorded instance of attempted genocide against Jews in the ancient empire of Persia, today known as Iran. When, more than two millennia ago, Mordecai learns of Haman’s plot “to destroy, to slay and to exterminate all Jews, young and old, children and women, in a single day” (Esther 3:13), he prevails upon his adopted daughter Esther, now Queen, to intercede.
But Esther is afraid. If she were to approach her husband to appeal Haman’s decree, she would be breaking royal protocol. “All the king’s servants and the people of the king’s provinces are well aware,” Esther responds to Mordecai, “that if anyone, man or woman, approaches the king in the inner court without being summoned, there is but one law for him: that he be put to death, except for the person to whom the king shall extend the gold sceptre so that he may live. Now I have not been summoned to come to the king for the past thirty days” (Esther 4:11).
Nonetheless, the Book of Esther tells us that after begging the Jews to pray and fast on her behalf, Esther chose to disregard protocol in the face of possible extermination of her people. Esther succeeded in averting the evil decree. As a result, Jews to this day around the world celebrate the Festival of Purim.
And so perhaps the most remarkable aspect of Prime Minister Netanyahu’s speech is that it is scheduled for the very day before Jews will be observing the Fast of Esther and Purim this year, to recall a time when a heroic Queen decided that the survival of her people took precedence over protocol.


Quote from Jerusalem Post (Israel) February 16, 2015 6:45 am
Netanyahu is the greatest spokesman in the world today for the realist worldview, emphasizing the threat of radical Islam and the need to take it seriously. He understands that some problems cannot be solved, but that we instead need to make sure we are kept in the best possible position, considering the existence of these problems.
Obama thus wants a deal with Iran; Netanyahu opposes a bad deal, and does not believe a good deal can be reached.
Netanyahu is an obstacle to Obama's attempt to apply his policy. Knowing how dangerous the American president's policies are, we can conclude that Netanyahu is one of the only things protecting the Western world from Obama's folly.
In this way, Netanyahu is to Obama what Winston Churchill was to Neville Chamberlain – as Churchill was one of the fiercest critics of Chamberlain's appeasement of Nazi Germany. The difference is that Obama's appeasement of Iran is an even more dangerous threat to the Western world than the Nazis were – since while the hateful ideologies of Islamism and Nazism are similar, this time, nuclear weapons are involved.
This is why Obama cannot stand Netanyahu and wants his defeat in the elections in March: The prime minister won't let him make the mistakes he so dearly wants to make. This is also why Obama will do anything he can to stop Netanyahu from speaking to the US Congress, to ensure he does not convince Congress to stop the Iranian nuclear deal he is trying to broker.
History will be defined by the outcome of the battle between Obama and Netanyahu.

We watch with great interest the developments regarding this speech and the upcoming elections in Israel.
If Netanyahu is ousted, as Obama wants, then Isaiah 3:1-5 may come true.
The Jerusalem Post says: History will be defined by the outcome of the battle between Obama and Netanyahu. Wrong J.P.! God will decide the outcome and we know from Bible Prophecy that Iran will commence their attack, they are driven to do that by the Satanic forces that control them. They and their allies will all go down into the Abyss. Ezekiel 32:24-25, Psalm 83:1-18, Amos 1:6-8, Ezekiel 30:1-5
 

Straightshot

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The stage is setting up as we speak

The prophetic scriptures = the boots of reality on the ground for all to see

A few get this .... unfortunately for most they do not

The gate is narrow and the few that find it will never die .... it is the wide gate that must be avoided

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffnfN4rITiI
 
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Danoh

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We cannot have it both ways.

We cannot, on the one hand, assert there was to be a long gap in time...

...between the Lord's 1st and...

...His 2nd Advent...

...Israel's prophetic clock stopped, as prophesied...

...this mystery Age inserted during said prophesied gap...

...in Israel's prophetic clock...

...til that clock starts back up again, sometime after...

...the fulness of this Unprophesied, Gentile mystery age be come in...

... and then, on the other hand, assert...

...things are moving forward for Israel prophetically.

Prophecy and Mystery are not the same schedule...

...nor on the same schedule.
 
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ebedmelech

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Watch Jesus work His will...and show that none of this is correct. This is clearly nothing but the fact that the
dominant futurist view is pretty much trying to be a self fulfilling prophecy.

Jesus is on the throne...not Obama nor Netanyahu! The US grows weaker still in the grand scheme of things!
 
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keras

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We cannot have it both ways.

We cannot, on the one hand, assert there was to be a long gap in time...

...between the Lord's 1st and...

...His 2nd Advent...

...Israel's prophetic clock stopped, as prophesied...

...this mystery Age inserted during said prophesied gap...

...in Israel's prophetic clock...

...til that clock starts back up again, sometime after...

...the fulness of this Unprophesied, Gentile mystery age be come in...

... and then, on the other hand, assert...

...things are moving forward for Israel prophetically.

Prophecy and Mystery are not the same schedule...

...nor on the same schedule.

It depends on who you call 'Israel'.
If you mistakenly believe that the current inhabitants of the State of Israel are all of the descendants of Jacob, then the problem you cite is a difficulty.
However we have the New Testament proof that the Israel of God are all those who believe in Him and keep His Commandments. All true Christians from every race, nation and language. Revelation 7:9, Isaiah 56:1-8
Understand the prophecy Jesus made in Luke 13:32 I will work today and tomorrow, then come into My reward. Also Hosea 6:2. The 'days' referred to are days in heaven, where Christ is now. But we have two scriptures telling us that one day to God in heaven, equals 1000 years earthly time.
Confirmed by hindsight and the 2000 years is nearly completed!

Ebed, by now you should realise that your preterist pronouncements are wasted on us, who look forward to the fulfilment of God's promises to His righteous people. By denying those promises and how the Lord will destroy those 'evil neighbors' [Jer. 12:14] in the Middle East, you are denigrating a large part of our Bible. It cannot be and is not right to do that.
 
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Douggg

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Where we are right now is watching for that ten king (leader) form of the EU to materialize - so that the little horn can become the leader of them.

The person starts off as the little horn, leader of the EU
;
Then Gog/Magog threatens;
Then the little horn mobilizes to stave off the hostilities;
Then Gog/Magog takes place;
Then the little horn arrives in Israel, as the prince who shall come;
Then he is perceived in the aftermath of Gog/Magog as the messiah;
Then he confirms the Mt. Sinai covenant resetting the 7 year cycle;
Then 3 1/2 years later, thinks he has achieved God-hood;
Then Satan enters him to carry out the act of going into the temple;
Then God has him killed, Ezekiel 28:1-10;
Then he and Satan find themselves in hell, Isaiah 14, next to the pit;
Then God kicks him out of hell, bringing him back to life;
Then Satan frees the beast unclean spirit from the pit;
Then the unclean spirit enters the come back to life man of sin;
making the person the beast of Revelation 13 for that last 42 months.
 
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ebedmelech

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Ebed, by now you should realise that your preterist pronouncements are wasted on us, who look forward to the fulfilment of God's promises to His righteous people. By denying those promises and how the Lord will destroy those 'evil neighbors' [Jer. 12:14] in the Middle East, you are denigrating a large part of our Bible. It cannot be and is not right to do that.
That's fine keras...because when it doesn't come to pass as you think...what recourse do you have but to get back in the Book????

Of course, that's only *if* Jesus doesn't return before you figure out the error of you eschatology.

Once again, you use a passage that plainly tells you it refers to Judah, who is about to go into captivity by Nebuchadnezzar, whom God raised up for that purpose.

Note Jeremiah 12:14 plainly says it concerns Judah:
14 Thus says the Lord concerning all My wicked neighbors who strike at the inheritance with which I have endowed My people Israel, “Behold I am about to uproot them from their land and will uproot the house of Judah from among them.

So this prophecy concerns Judah which God sent Jeremiah to tell Zedekiah. Obviously you don't pay attention to context. Read Jeremiah 21 keras...but try not to read into it.

Ask yourself these questions:

*Who?

*What?

*When?

*Where?

*Why?

If you do that...you *might* get a clue. :thumbsup:
 
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keras

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Ebed, I read context very carefully and although it is possible to think Jeremiah 12 fits his times, careful reading proves it wasn't fulfilled then.
When were 'no birds or beasts left in the Land? Jer. 12:4, Hosea 4:3
When did the 'sword of the Lord devour every living thing'? Joel 1:15-20
Judah is in the Land now, but in apostasy, atheism and false religion. They will be uprooted, Jer 12:14-16, and only be allowed back IF they learn the ways [beliefs] of My people. That is: Christianity.
At that time, [not yet come to pass] any nation that refuses to accept the Lord will be destroyed. Jer 12:17
So the 'wicked neighbours AND Judah', the Jews, will be removed from the Holy Land. Amos 1:1-13 & 2:1-4 tells us how the Lord will do that: 'I will send fire...'

This is what you and many others are so determined to say won't happen. Sad really, the Bible has all the information about our future, but because of false beliefs, you are made incapable of seeing the truth. Isaiah 29:9-12
Just like - Ezekiel 33:30-33 - but the Day WILL come!
 
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TPeterY

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Many times we hear bible prophecy experts claim the next prophecy on the prophetic time clock is the rapture of the Church. That's not entirely true, there are many other prophecies relating to the tribulation that will come to pass just prior to the commencing of Daniel's 70th week or become visible that will be fulfill during the first half of the tribulation as God continues to set the stage in the Middle East.

Most of the prophecies concerning the tribulation is written in the old testament. Most of what happens to the Church during the tribulation is written in the new testament. It's very simple logic, the OT is for Israel. Israel stays on earth during the tribulation. The NT is about the Church. The Church goes to heaven. If you want to know more about the tribulation, study the OT. If you want to know about the rapture, the Judgement Seat of Christ, the Marriage Supper of the Lamb, the Wedding Feast, you'll only find it in the NT.

Once the Church age ends, Daniel 70th week commence. I can't see much of a delay or any type of gap in time between the two periods except maybe a 7 day period as what had happened in the days of Noah. Noah was in the ark for 7 days before the flood came. I only know 7 is the divine number for completion. God had mentioned in the bible (Daniel 9:2, 9:26, Ezekiel 38:8) once the desolation period of Jerusalem ended, Daniel's 70th will start. It's the same period of time Jesus coined in the NT as a generation. Other scriptures in the OT testifies this.

There's two major prophecies that must be fulfill or visible before the tribulation can begin: The 2nd regathering of Jews for the remaining remnant of Jacob, the house of Israel. They are the remaining 144,000 and must be back in Israel before the tribulation can start. The second is the ownership of Jerusalem. Israel's capital is not in Jerusalem, it's Tel Aviv. The Jews only occupy Jerusalem under a sharing agreement. Israel must own Jerusalem and the Temple in order for the the A/C's invasion and the AoD to take place. This will be taken care of sometimes after the last blood moon.

No country in the world except for Israel has recognized Jerusalem as Israel's capital. Many do not recognize it as a city that is properly Israel's. Many UN member states formally adhere to the United Nations proposal that Jerusalem should have an international status.​

Positions on Jerusalem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


.
Prophecies are flying off the shelf lately. Last week Netanyahu dropped a bombshell in connection to a major OT prophecy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/16/world/middleeast/netanyahu-urges-mass-immigration-of-jews-from-europe.html?_r=1

Netanyahu to Danish Jews: 'Israel Is Your Home' - Inside Israel - CBN News - Christian News 24-7 - CBN.com

Another major prophecy from the OT. The Middle East on the verge of complete chaos.

Moderate Sunni Islam leader blames Zionism and 'new colonialism' for Middle East collapse - Telegraph

Is the Middle East on the Verge of Exploding? - Op-Eds - Arutz Sheva

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/news/middle-east/17117-pa-on-the-verge-of-collapse-fatah-veteran-warns

The nation of Jordan heading to war. OT prophecy.

King Abdullah of Jordan promises his country will wage a 'relentless' war against Isis in wake of pilot's execution - Middle East - World - The Independent

Till we run 'out of fuel and bullets': Jordan's king vows to crush ISIS | Fox News

Jordan: 'We will eliminate Isil over death of our martyr pilot' - Telegraph


Recent smaller prophecies concerning the nations of Arabia: (OT prophecies)

The collapse of Yemen.

UN: Yemen on the verge of collapse | World | 3 News

Yemen on Brink of Civil War, Says UN Envoy - Middle East - News - Arutz Sheva

The death of King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia paving the way for the person who will be the Antichrist as the new most influential person in the Middle East.

Saudi Arabia's 'reformer' King Abdullah dies - CNN.com

All the prophecies above are to be fulfilled in the years just prior to Daniel's 70th week up to the first half of the tribulation. They are in it's early stages but these prophecies are now visible.


.
 
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ebedmelech

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Ebed, I read context very carefully and although it is possible to think Jeremiah 12 fits his times, careful reading proves it wasn't fulfilled then.
Most incorrect.
When were 'no birds or beasts left in the Land? Jer. 12:4, Hosea 4:3
When did the 'sword of the Lord devour every living thing'? Joel 1:15-20
Judah is in the Land now, but in apostasy, atheism and false religion. They will be uprooted, Jer 12:14-16, and only be allowed back IF they learn the ways [beliefs] of My people. That is: Christianity.
At that time, [not yet come to pass] any nation that refuses to accept the Lord will be destroyed. Jer 12:17
So the 'wicked neighbours AND Judah', the Jews, will be removed from the Holy Land. Amos 1:1-13 & 2:1-4 tells us how the Lord will do that: 'I will send fire...'
Did you understand that to be a PRAYER Jeremiah was making to God keras? You really didn't read as carefully as you think. Take a look at Jeremiah 12:1:
1 Righteous are You, O Lord, that I would plead my case with You;Indeed I would discuss matters of justice with You:
It's not a prophecy at all keras...Jeremiah is pleading with God for Judah. This is what I've been saying you do keras...IMPOSE on the passage. That proves it. This dialogue is between God and Jeremiah.

Do you know the sword is against Judah...or do you just disregard that keras?

This is what you and many others are so determined to say won't happen. Sad really, the Bible has all the information about our future, but because of false beliefs, you are made incapable of seeing the truth. Isaiah 29:9-12
Just like - Ezekiel 33:30-33 - but the Day WILL come!
It won't keras. The fact that you can't even read the passage for what it's saying is easily pointed out.

Now...Isaiah 29:9-12..once again CLASSIC misreading of the text. This is God saying through Isaiah that Jerusalem would be destroyed and even more . Listen to Jesus quoting this about Pharisees in Matthew 15:7-9:
7 You hypocrites, rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you:
8 ‘This people honors Me with their lips, But their heart is far away from Me.
9 ‘But in vain do they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.’”


..and you say you write about prophecy???
 
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Job8

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I am generally in agreement with you. However a few points need modifiction or revision:

There's two major prophecies that must be fulfill or visible before the tribulation can begin: The 2nd regathering of Jews for the remaining remnant of Jacob, the house of Israel.
I don't see where you get two regatherings of the Jews. The establishment of Zionist Israel in 1948 was not under Christ so I don't think that would be a biblical re-gathering. The Divine regathering will occur at the Second Coming of Christ (Ezek 34:11-15 and many others).
They are the remaining 144,000 and must be back in Israel before the tribulation can start.
The 144,000 are clearly a heavenly company of redeemed Israel "before the throne of God" (Rev 7:1-8; 14:1-5), possibly just a "representative sample" of redeemed and restored Israel on earth during the Millennium. They will not be subject to the Tribulation (Rev 7:3).
The second is the ownership of Jerusalem. Israel's capital is not in Jerusalem, it's Tel Aviv. The Jews only occupy Jerusalem under a sharing agreement.
And this is where the supernatural Satanic powers of the Antichrist come into play. Let's never forget that God will send strong delusion upon the earth so that this Man of Sin will be acknowledged as the Messiah by Orthodox Jews, as the Mahdi by Muslims, as the Christ by the rest of the world (including apostate Christendom). Indeed he will present himself as God (Dan 8:25; 2 Thess 2:4). Given this unusual state of affairs, it will be nothing for him to declare universal peace at the beginning of his reign, and somehow get the Arab occcupants of Jerusalem to move into a "more pleasant" location ("through his policy he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand" (Dan 8:25). At the same time he will make a pact with Israel ("he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries") so that they can resume Temple sacrifices and oblations ["he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week..." (Dan 9:27)].
Israel must own Jerusalem and the Temple in order for the the A/C's invasion and the AoD to take place. This will be taken care of sometimes after the last blood moon.
The Antichrist ("the prince that shall come", "a king of fierce countenance", "a little horn which waxed exceeding great") will not need to invade Israel at all. Since he will be the Jewish "Messiah", he will take control of Israel as the Messiah ("he shall do according to his own will" and "he shall stand in the glorious land", indeed "he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious and holy mountain").

As to current political developments and talk about "blood moons", that would all be in the realm of speculation. What we do know is that serious efforts are being made to rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem. This will be Antichrist's Temple. And the Antichrist can only appear once the Church is completed and is raptured.
 
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keras

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Ebed, I shouldn't bother to reply, but your assertions are just so ludicrous.

Jeremiah chapter 12:
I say it's prophecy, you say: 'Most incorrect' That is purely your unsupported opinion.
Jeremiah 12 is a prayer? So did Jeremiah pray for the Sword of the Lord to devour every living thing? Has the Lord sent fire yet?

Talk about 'classic'! You are the classic scoffer, you think things will continue on as they always have done, but you forget that God destroyed civilization once and Jesus prophesied that the world will again be 'as in the days of Noah' and this time He will send fire to destroy the ungodly. 2 Peter 3:7 says that very plainly, but you and most ignorant church members prefer not to believe this truth.
The Day will come, when all who have failed to understand what we have been plainly told will happen, will stand ashamed of how they never grasped the truth.

Job8, I see you quote Ezekiel 34:11-15 as proof of the gathering of the Lord's people, after the Return.
You should read verses 23-24 and understand that Jesus is not yet the King, as He will be during the Millennium. No, the great Second Exodus of all righteous people, happens soon after the Land is cleared and cleansed by the next event; the Sixth Seal destruction of the Middle east and a worldwide devastation.
It is those people, in Jerusalem, who say: Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord', when Jesus Returns in glory, AFTER all that is prophesied to happen before that Day.
 
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TPeterY

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I don't see where you get two regatherings of the Jews. The establishment of Zionist Israel in 1948 was not under Christ so I don't think that would be a biblical re-gathering. The Divine regathering will occur at the Second Coming of Christ (Ezek 34:11-15 and many others).

Guess what, we're not talking about the same thing. You're confusing the second gathering of scattered Jews around the world at the end of what God calls a period-of-Desolation and Christ calls a Generation to the gathering at the end of the tribulation in Matthew 24:29-31. This is not the same gathering, and that little country in the Middle East everyone wants to destroy is not true Israel. They only took the name Israel but a more accurate title would be the nation of Judah.

Israel and Judah - Life, Hope & Truth

The modern nation of Israel
When the modern nation of Israel was founded in 1948, it was established as a haven for Jews. Some have mistakenly assumed that because its founders chose the name Israel, this nation is now home for all of the descendants of ancient Israel. Several passages in the Bible make it clear that the modern nation of Israel does not represent all of the ancient Israelites.​
The Two Kingdoms of Israel | Jewish Virtual Library


If you want to understand bible prophecy, you need to know Israel. Without them, you don't understand the tribulation. Read those two links above. The first gathering back in 1948 was at the beginning of the desolation period (generation) that consisted the house of Judah and Benjamin along with the descendants of Esau. The second gathering happens near the end of the desolation period in the Jubilee year for the house of Israel along with other descendants of Esau. There's TONS of scriptures of two gatherings in the OT for the end times involving the reunion of the houses of Judah and Israel. I'm too lazy to dig them all up.

Isaiah 11:11-12 (NKJV) 11 It shall come to pass in that day
That the Lord shall set His hand again the second time
To recover the remnant of His people who are left,
From Assyria and Egypt, From Pathros and Cush, From Elam and Shinar,
From Hamath and the islands of the sea.
12 He will set up a banner for the nations, And will assemble the outcasts of Israel, And gather together the dispersed of Judah From the four corners of the earth.​


The 144,000 are clearly a heavenly company of redeemed Israel "before the throne of God" (Rev 7:1-8; 14:1-5), possibly just a "representative sample" of redeemed and restored Israel on earth during the Millennium. They will not be subject to the Tribulation (Rev 7:3).

They don't go to heaven. Again, if you don't know Israel, you don't know where the 144,000 will be during the tribulation. Using only Revelation as your source, you're just applying NT information onto OT prophecies. You need to read the old testament to get the complete picture about the Jews during the tribulation. All your references above are from Revelation. The wordings in Revelation 14:1-5 is misleading to those that don't know Israel.

If you really want to know what will happen to the 144,000 during the second half of the tribulation, this is what happens when they flee into the wilderness. God will reveal His mercy and they will accept Christ as their savior.

Jeremiah 31:1-14 (NKJV) 1 “At the same time,” says the Lord, “I will be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be My people.”
2 Thus says the Lord: “The people who survived the sword Found grace in the wilderness—Israel, when I went to give him rest.”
3 The Lord has appeared of old to me, saying: “Yes, I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore with lovingkindness I have drawn you.
4 Again I will build you, and you shall be rebuilt, O virgin of Israel! You shall again be adorned with your tambourines, And shall go forth in the dances of those who rejoice.
5 You shall yet plant vines on the mountains of Samaria; The planters shall plant and eat them as ordinary food.
6 For there shall be a day When the watchmen will cry on Mount Ephraim,
‘Arise, and let us go up to Zion, To the Lord our God.’”
7 For thus says the Lord: “Sing with gladness for Jacob, And shout among the chief of the nations; Proclaim, give praise, and say, ‘O Lord, save Your people, The remnant of Israel!’
8 Behold, I will bring them from the north country, And gather them from the ends of the earth, Among them the blind and the lame, The woman with child And the one who labors with child, together; A great throng shall return there.
9 They shall come with weeping, And with supplications I will lead them. I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters, In a straight way in which they shall not stumble; For I am a Father to Israel, And Ephraim is My firstborn.
10 “Hear the word of the Lord, O nations, And declare it in the isles afar off, and say, ‘He who scattered Israel will gather him, And keep him as a shepherd does his flock.’
11 For the Lord has redeemed Jacob, And ransomed him from the hand of one stronger than he.
12 Therefore they shall come and sing in the height of Zion,
Streaming to the goodness of the Lord—For wheat and new wine and oil, For the young of the flock and the herd; Their souls shall be like a well-watered garden, And they shall sorrow no more at all.
13 “Then shall the virgin rejoice in the dance, And the young men and the old, together; For I will turn their mourning to joy, Will comfort them,
And make them rejoice rather than sorrow.
14 I will satiate the soul of the priests with abundance, And My people shall be satisfied with My goodness, says the Lord.”​

Compare Jeremiah 31:11-12 to Rev 14:1-5. It's the same prophecy.

Jeremiah 31:11-12 (NKJV) 11 For the Lord has redeemed Jacob, And ransomed him from the hand of one stronger than he.
12 Therefore they shall come and sing in the height of Zion
, Streaming to the goodness of the Lord—For wheat and new wine and oil, For the young of the flock and the herd; Their souls shall be like a well-watered garden, And they shall sorrow no more at all.

Revelation 14:1-5 (NKJV) 1 Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father’s name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps. 3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.​

Here's what it means to be redeem or ransom in the bible.

https://bible.org/illustration/redemption-means%E2%80%A6

Redemption means to free someone from bondage. It often involves the paying of a ransom, a price that makes redemption possible. The Israelites were redeemed from Egypt. We were redeemed from the power of sin and the curse of the Law (Gal. 3:13) through Jesus (Rom. 3:24; Col. 1:14). We were bought with a price (1 Cor. 6:20; 7:23).​

What is Christian redemption? What does it mean to be redeemed?


Redemption is a biblical word that means "a purchase" or "a ransom." Historically, redemption was used in reference to the purchase of a slave's freedom. A slave was "redeemed" when the price was paid for his freedom. God spoke of Israel's deliverance from slavery in Egypt in this way: "I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, and I will deliver you from slavery to them, and I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great acts of judgment" (Exodus 6:6). The use of redemption in the New Testament includes this same idea. Every person is a slave to sin; only through the price Jesus paid on the cross is a sinful person redeemed from sin and death.​

And this is where the supernatural Satanic powers of the Antichrist come into play. Let's never forget that God will send strong delusion upon the earth so that this Man of Sin will be acknowledged as the Messiah by Orthodox Jews, as the Mahdi by Muslims, as the Christ by the rest of the world (including apostate Christendom). Indeed he will present himself as God (Dan 8:25; 2 Thess 2:4). Given this unusual state of affairs, it will be nothing for him to declare universal peace at the beginning of his reign, and somehow get the Arab occcupants of Jerusalem to move into a "more pleasant" location ("through his policy he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand" (Dan 8:25). At the same time he will make a pact with Israel ("he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries") so that they can resume Temple sacrifices and oblations ["he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week..." (Dan 9:27)].

Why are you preaching something that has nothing to do with the current capital of Israel?

The Antichrist ("the prince that shall come", "a king of fierce countenance", "a little horn which waxed exceeding great") will not need to invade Israel at all. Since he will be the Jewish "Messiah", he will take control of Israel as the Messiah ("he shall do according to his own will" and "he shall stand in the glorious land", indeed "he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious and holy mountain").

You need to do more studying. The Antichrist does invade Jerusalem.

Ezekiel 38:11-12 (NKJV)11 You will say, ‘I will go up against a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’— 12 to take plunder and to take booty, to stretch out your hand against the waste places that are again inhabited, and against a people gathered from the nations, who have acquired livestock and goods, who dwell in the midst of the land.

Daniel 11:31-32 (NKJV) 31 And forces shall be mustered by him, and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation. 32 Those who do wickedly against the covenant he shall corrupt with flattery; but the people who know their God shall be strong, and carry out great exploits.​

As to current political developments and talk about "blood moons", that would all be in the realm of speculation. What we do know is that serious efforts are being made to rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem. This will be Antichrist's Temple. And the Antichrist can only appear once the Church is completed and is raptured.

It's only speculation to those that don't understand bible prophecy as a result of the materials they're reading or lack of information. People are expecting the rapture of the church at any moment because of what they read in Joel 2:30-31, Acts 2:19-20 and Rev 6:12. The truth is, the rapture is not yet imminent. Not only is there plenty of prophecies prior the rapture, people just don't realize the blood moon tetrads of 1492, 1949 & 1950 and 1967 are all Israel related, NOT the church. They had nothing to do with the Church. In other words, what happened to Israel from past tetrads does not mean the remaining two blood moons in April and Sept this year will immediately produce the rapture.

What will end up happening is a bunch of Christians expecting the rapture after those blood moons later this year will be disappointed and begin to lose faith and probably criticize Mark Biltz and John Haggee as false prophets. There WILL be a blood moon just before the rapture, it's just not the ones you're hearing in the news because the a tetrad blood moon is a sign about Israel, not the church.

You also don't need to rely on outside sources concerning the rebuilding of the temple. The bible said it right here. This is all you need and it'll be rebuild in the first half of the tribulation ending the desolation period of Jerusalem.

Zechariah 1:16 (NKJV) ‘Therefore thus says the Lord:
“I am returning to Jerusalem with mercy;
My house shall be built in it
,” says the Lord of hosts,
“And a surveyor’s line shall be stretched out over Jerusalem.”’

Daniel 9:2 (NKJV) in the first year of his reign I, Daniel, understood by the books the number of the years specified by the word of the Lord through Jeremiah the prophet, that He would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.

Daniel 9:26-27 (NKJV) 26 “And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; And the people of the prince who is to come Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end of it shall be with a flood, And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate.”

Ezekiel 38:8 (NKJV) After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you will come into the land of those brought back from the sword and gathered from many people on the mountains of Israel, which had long been desolate; they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely.​



.
 
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Douggg

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There is one camp that views the Antichrst as being an evil person who is against Christ, and is a muslim or an Assyrian, etc. Never in any of those theories is the person embraced as the King of Israel.

Then the various theories are that the person makes some sort of peace treaty with Israel for 7 years, then breaks it. Then the theories go that the person breaks the covenant and invades Israel and commits the abomination of desolation, etc.

Okay, I see the rationale if the person were called the AntiIsrael person, or the AntiJew person, but how is any of those theories in action make him the Anti-Jesus person? The Antichrist.

Israel is not holding that Jesus is the messiah, so what would all of his invading Israel, persecuting the Jews - make him that his mainstay as being Anti-Jesus, the Antichrist?
 
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Douggg

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The Antichrist ("the prince that shall come", "a king of fierce countenance", "a little horn which waxed exceeding great") will not need to invade Israel at all. Since he will be the Jewish "Messiah", he will take control of Israel as the Messiah ("he shall do according to his own will" and "he shall stand in the glorious land", indeed "he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious and holy mountain").

I would not say take control of Israel, but that the Jews are going embrace as their long awaited messiah - right after Gog/Magog, and his ego will cater to that. Control of Israel will be handed to him on a silver platter.

Later, after he is no longer embraced by the Jews as their messiah, because he claims to have achieved God-hood which is where Daniel 11:36 picks up, he has had his armies from Europe and the West all throughout the middle east already because they are going to be controlling oil in the region - ever since after Gog/Magog right before the 7 years.

When he gets attacked by the South and then the North, his armies are going to be moving in and out of Israel into the neighboring countries. At a certain point in those battles when he makes his strategic headquarters camp between the seas and holy mountain - that's when Jesus is going to appear to the world.

The point I am making here is that once the person reveals himself as the man of sin - his stint as the Antichrist, perceived messiah, King of Israel, to the Jews is over. Which will be just before the middle of the 7 years.

The remainder of the time, he is something else, the beast.
 
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tranquil

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Isaiah 11:11-12 (NKJV) 11 It shall come to pass in that day
That the Lord shall set His hand again the second time
To recover the remnant of His people who are left,
From Assyria and Egypt, From Pathros and Cush, From Elam and Shinar,
From Hamath and the islands of the sea.
12 He will set up a banner for the nations, And will assemble the outcasts of Israel, And gather together the dispersed of Judah From the four corners of the earth.​




They don't go to heaven. Again, if you don't know Israel, you don't know where the 144,000 will be during the tribulation. Using only Revelation as your source, you're just applying NT information onto OT prophecies. You need to read the old testament to get the complete picture about the Jews during the tribulation. All your references above are from Revelation. The wordings in Revelation 14:1-5 is misleading to those that don't know Israel.

If you really want to know what will happen to the 144,000 during the second half of the tribulation, this is what happens when they flee into the wilderness. God will reveal His mercy and they will accept Christ as their savior.

Jeremiah 31:1-14 (NKJV) 1 “At the same time,” says the Lord, “I will be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be My people.”
2 Thus says the Lord: “The people who survived the sword Found grace in the wilderness—Israel, when I went to give him rest.”
3 The Lord has appeared of old to me, saying: “Yes, I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore with lovingkindness I have drawn you.
4 Again I will build you, and you shall be rebuilt, O virgin of Israel! You shall again be adorned with your tambourines, And shall go forth in the dances of those who rejoice.
5 You shall yet plant vines on the mountains of Samaria; The planters shall plant and eat them as ordinary food.
6 For there shall be a day When the watchmen will cry on Mount Ephraim,
‘Arise, and let us go up to Zion, To the Lord our God.’”
7 For thus says the Lord: “Sing with gladness for Jacob, And shout among the chief of the nations; Proclaim, give praise, and say, ‘O Lord, save Your people, The remnant of Israel!’
8 Behold, I will bring them from the north country, And gather them from the ends of the earth, Among them the blind and the lame, The woman with child And the one who labors with child, together; A great throng shall return there.
9 They shall come with weeping, And with supplications I will lead them. I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters, In a straight way in which they shall not stumble; For I am a Father to Israel, And Ephraim is My firstborn.
10 “Hear the word of the Lord, O nations, And declare it in the isles afar off, and say, ‘He who scattered Israel will gather him, And keep him as a shepherd does his flock.’
11 For the Lord has redeemed Jacob, And ransomed him from the hand of one stronger than he.
12 Therefore they shall come and sing in the height of Zion,
Streaming to the goodness of the Lord—For wheat and new wine and oil, For the young of the flock and the herd; Their souls shall be like a well-watered garden, And they shall sorrow no more at all.
13 “Then shall the virgin rejoice in the dance, And the young men and the old, together; For I will turn their mourning to joy, Will comfort them,
And make them rejoice rather than sorrow.
14 I will satiate the soul of the priests with abundance, And My people shall be satisfied with My goodness, says the Lord.”​

Compare Jeremiah 31:11-12 to Rev 14:1-5. It's the same prophecy.

Jeremiah 31:11-12 (NKJV) 11 For the Lord has redeemed Jacob, And ransomed him from the hand of one stronger than he.
12 Therefore they shall come and sing in the height of Zion
, Streaming to the goodness of the Lord—For wheat and new wine and oil, For the young of the flock and the herd; Their souls shall be like a well-watered garden, And they shall sorrow no more at all.

Revelation 14:1-5 (NKJV) 1 Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father’s name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps. 3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.​

Here's what it means to be redeem or ransom in the bible.

https://bible.org/illustration/redemption-means…

Redemption means to free someone from bondage. It often involves the paying of a ransom, a price that makes redemption possible. The Israelites were redeemed from Egypt. We were redeemed from the power of sin and the curse of the Law (Gal. 3:13) through Jesus (Rom. 3:24; Col. 1:14). We were bought with a price (1 Cor. 6:20; 7:23).​

What is Christian redemption? What does it mean to be redeemed?


Redemption is a biblical word that means "a purchase" or "a ransom." Historically, redemption was used in reference to the purchase of a slave's freedom. A slave was "redeemed" when the price was paid for his freedom. God spoke of Israel's deliverance from slavery in Egypt in this way: "I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, and I will deliver you from slavery to them, and I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great acts of judgment" (Exodus 6:6). The use of redemption in the New Testament includes this same idea. Every person is a slave to sin; only through the price Jesus paid on the cross is a sinful person redeemed from sin and death.​



Why are you preaching something that has nothing to do with the current capital of Israel?



You need to do more studying. The Antichrist does invade Jerusalem.

Ezekiel 38:11-12 (NKJV)11 You will say, ‘I will go up against a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’— 12 to take plunder and to take booty, to stretch out your hand against the waste places that are again inhabited, and against a people gathered from the nations, who have acquired livestock and goods, who dwell in the midst of the land.

Daniel 11:31-32 (NKJV) 31 And forces shall be mustered by him, and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation. 32 Those who do wickedly against the covenant he shall corrupt with flattery; but the people who know their God shall be strong, and carry out great exploits.​



It's only speculation to those that don't understand bible prophecy as a result of the materials they're reading or lack of information. People are expecting the rapture of the church at any moment because of what they read in Joel 2:30-31, Acts 2:19-20 and Rev 6:12. The truth is, the rapture is not yet imminent. Not only is there plenty of prophecies prior the rapture, people just don't realize the blood moon tetrads of 1492, 1949 & 1950 and 1967 are all Israel related, NOT the church. They had nothing to do with the Church. In other words, what happened to Israel from past tetrads does not mean the remaining two blood moons in April and Sept this year will immediately produce the rapture.

What will end up happening is a bunch of Christians expecting the rapture after those blood moons later this year will be disappointed and begin to lose faith and probably criticize Mark Biltz and John Haggee as false prophets. There WILL be a blood moon just before the rapture, it's just not the ones you're hearing in the news because the a tetrad blood moon is a sign about Israel, not the church.

You also don't need to rely on outside sources concerning the rebuilding of the temple. The bible said it right here. This is all you need and it'll be rebuild in the first half of the tribulation ending the desolation period of Jerusalem.

Zechariah 1:16 (NKJV) ‘Therefore thus says the Lord:
“I am returning to Jerusalem with mercy;
My house shall be built in it
,” says the Lord of hosts,
“And a surveyor’s line shall be stretched out over Jerusalem.”’

Daniel 9:2 (NKJV) in the first year of his reign I, Daniel, understood by the books the number of the years specified by the word of the Lord through Jeremiah the prophet, that He would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.

Daniel 9:26-27 (NKJV) 26 “And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; And the people of the prince who is to come Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end of it shall be with a flood, And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate.”

Ezekiel 38:8 (NKJV) After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you will come into the land of those brought back from the sword and gathered from many people on the mountains of Israel, which had long been desolate; they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely.
.

This is a very good and well thought out post. Thanks.

A few things here. Gog in Ezek 38 is not the "antichrist". Gog is not the beast from the sea either.

Daniel 7
11 “I looked then because of the sound of the great words that the horn was speaking. And as I looked, the beast was killed, and its body destroyed and given over to be burned with fire. 12 As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away, but their lives were prolonged for a season and a time.

This beast, the 11th horn, that is killed is the Assyrian/ Tyre/ the beast from the sea. There is a conglomeration of 6 nations left that have no dominion. This is Gog.

Gog is what is left over after the Assyrian is killed (the Assyrian gets 1260 days.) Gog is who is having their lives prolonged for a season and a time (which I assume to be 490 days/ 70 weeks - the Gog war would take place at the end of this time.)

That's why the people are living in safety, they found grace in the wilderness after the sword scattered them (this is Armageddon - in Hosea 1, it talks about the day of Jezreel - the valley of Jezreel is underneath Har Meggido/ Armageddon. Jezreel means "God sows/ scatters" (seed).

Finding grace in the wilderness is what is understood to be the "rapture", going to the place prepared by God for 1260 days in Rev 12.
Rev 17
9 This calls for a mind with wisdom: the seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman is seated; 10 they are also seven kings, five of whom have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come, and when he does come he must remain only a little while. 11 As for the beast that was and is not, it is an eighth but it belongs to the seven, and it goes to destruction. 12 And the ten horns that you saw are ten kings who have not yet received royal power, but they are to receive authority as kings for one hour, together with the beast. 13 These are of one mind, and they hand over their power and authority to the beast. 14 They will make war on the Lamb, and the Lamb will conquer them, for he is Lord of lords and King of kings, and those with him are called and chosen and faithful.”

15 And the angel[c] said to me, “The waters that you saw, where the prostitute is seated, are peoples and multitudes and nations and languages. 16 And the ten horns that you saw, they and the beast will hate the prostitute. They will make her desolate and naked, and devour her flesh and burn her up with fire, 17 for God has put it into their hearts to carry out his purpose by being of one mind and handing over their royal power to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled. 18 And the woman that you saw is the great city that has dominion over the kings of the earth.”

These verses have often confused me until recently. Who is the 6th king that John says, "is"? It is "Rome". The point being that it is "Rome" until it is the 7th king in the sequential lineage. It is Rome until it isn't. It is Rome until the "harlot is burned" then the 10 kings and the 11th horn will rule. The 11th horn being the 7th in the lineage. These burn the harlot of Rome. At the star sign of Revelation 12, Rosh Hashanah 2017.

When the 6th king/ harlot of Babylon is burned, that is Armageddon. Then the woman who was burned will find grace in the wilderness for 1260 days. The Assyrian gets 1260 days. The Assyrian is killed. Then starts the 70 weeks, at the end of which is the Gog war occurs, killing the leftovers of the 7 headed Satan coalition. The "millenium" is merely the "day of the lord" which is when the 7 trumpets and 7 bowls are poured out (which is when Armageddon/ the scattering occurs). Then the New Jerusalem 'comes down" after "being up here".
 
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TPeterY

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This is a very good and well thought out post. Thanks.

Sup Tranquil. Sorry I couldn't answer your question. There is just way too many information I have accumulated on the timing of Christ's return that I can't explain everything through private message. Only thing I could of done was list the year but that won't seem credible without sufficient evidence. A belated Happy New Years though.
 
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ebedmelech

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Ebed, I shouldn't bother to reply, but your assertions are just so ludicrous.
Well see shortly, because as usual, instead of letting scripture say what's happening you decide to impose what you want it to be
Jeremiah chapter 12:
I say it's prophecy, you say: 'Most incorrect' That is purely your unsupported opinion.
Jeremiah 12 is a prayer? So did Jeremiah pray for the Sword of the Lord to devour every living thing? Has the Lord sent fire yet?
As I pointed out, let's look at Jeremiah 12:1
Righteous are You, O Lord, that I would plead my case with You; Indeed I would discuss matters of justice with You: Why has the way of the wicked prospered?
Jeremiah is talking to God Keras...and he's questioning God about the situation as it was in that day as he was God's prophet. This verse says it plain.

Look at what he says in verse 4:
4 How long is the land to mourn And the vegetation of the countryside to wither? For the wickedness of those who dwell in it, Animals and birds have been snatched away, Because men have said, “He will not see our latter ending.”


Once again, clearly Jeremiah is asking about the present conditions as they existed in his day. God has caused the land not to produce...and the result is that the animals have left because there's nothing there. Obviously you didn't read Jeremiah 11!!! This is about Israel's disobedience...and God chastening them for it. Can't you even hear Deuteronomy 28:15-68 in what's happening???? Obviously not!

What Jeremiah does from verse 7 on is speak for God HIS ANSWER TO HIM. That is God's answer to Jeremiah! Jeremiah asked these questions of God because of what God said in Jeremiah 11 of Judah forsaking the covenant!!!

If you read chapter 13 Keras, it starts with God sending Jeremiah to be another message to Judah, so once again if you read letting scripture tell you the answers...you won't have these erroneous conclusions you have Keras.

Jeremiah
Talk about 'classic'! You are the classic scoffer, you think things will continue on as they always have done, but you forget that God destroyed civilization once and Jesus prophesied that the world will again be 'as in the days of Noah' and this time He will send fire to destroy the ungodly. 2 Peter 3:7 says that very plainly, but you and most ignorant church members prefer not to believe this truth.
The Day will come, when all who have failed to understand what we have been plainly told will happen, will stand ashamed of how they never grasped the truth.
You think I'm the "classic scoffer"...and that's what I'd expect the way you read scripture. However I won't call you a scoffer, because I know you believe what you think. You're just in error...and as thing go on in this present world, you'll find out how erroneous you are.

Also, note the difference in how I stay in Jeremiah. I don't have to jump around as you do, pulling scripture out of context to support my view because right there in the passage your error is clearly seen.

So no Keras, you shouldn't bother to reply, because you only show what you don't understand.
 
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Straightshot

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Keras understands for sure


The preterist theology denies the coming judgment by the Lord upon the earth

In other words they scoff at His intent to judge this present world [Matthew 24:36-39] just as He has done twice before in the past [Genesis 1:2; Genesis 6]

Anyone who understands the preteristic dogma of varying degees know this truth
 
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