Sabbath was made for man

[from scratch]

Sophrosyne, I have made that "call" for myself and it is also your "call" for yourself.

You're making that call to and about us as well. Your personal beliefs and requirements aren't the subject of discussion.

 

[Gibs]

We're in 2 very different worlds and must not be speaking the same language.

First you say the Jews didn't fulfill the law.

I respond with neither do the Gentiles.

Then you talk about finding the straight gate and narrow way. And state - We know that a very large number are professing to be Christians and it is the few that the great amount can't see with.

Personally I don't see either comment as on topic but accusatory. This is called flaming here.

Then you have the audacity to post you're not judging. Really?

The tenor or over all theme of your posts is one must observe the law. This is a full rejection of grace. But you say you believe in and need grace. I ask why you have the law. Problem is you violate the law which requires death. You abhor death and wish to escape it and claim grace. Cheap grace is talked about here. But you make the law worthless. Personally I see no difference. What it really boils down to is grace is cheep like its said we promote. You can't separate the flesh and the soul in your mind as the Bible does. Everything you relate to is based on the flesh and its performance to the law. The Sabbath gives the flesh rest. The Sabbath doesn't give rest for the soul that Jesus promised if one comes to Him. Jesus didn't offer them what they already had.

I invite you to the peace (rest) of God He provides through unmerited favor and declaration.

On flaming, no, I do not. I merely pointed out scripture that may be of concern to you.

And on finding His rest, I have no problem and I enter in, in a special way Sabbaths and then through the rest of the coming week trusting and having full faith and trust in Him. I do not fail to enter in because of unbelief.

On the law, it is a law of love and it is in my heart, He has instilled His love in me, and so the law of love is now my law and my love actually to do and so I do keep it and it is the automatic service of the heart.

Love does no wrong to God or our fellow man in any way.

The litmus test then if we truly have love to God first and best and our fellows as ourselves is whether we are automatically fulfilling the law by love.

My theme, tenor is not by straining that the law is fulfilled but can only be fulfilled by love. Nothing but love will suffice.

 

[Gibs]

You're making that call to and about us as well. Your personal beliefs and requirements aren't the subject of discussion.

I only pointed out that you and I are free to make our own call and judge our beliefs and we surely want to be honest with ourselves.

There is an old song, "be honest with me dear" but it is far more important to be honest with ones self.

Then we will be far more apt to be honest with others.

 

[from scratch]

On flaming, no, I do not. I merely pointed out scripture that may be of concern to you.

Then you're not really trying to apply those passages to me. The above statement clearly shows you are. Otherwise why should I be concerned about them?

And on finding His rest, I have no problem and I enter in, in a special way Sabbaths and then through the rest of the coming week trusting and having full faith and trust in Him. I do not fail to enter in because of unbelief.

As you say I must accept. But you can't require that of anyone else as the only way to enter God's rest. No I'm not promoting many ways to God.

On the law, it is a law of love and it is in my heart, He has instilled His love in me, and so the law of love is now my law and my love actually to do and so I do keep it and it is the automatic service of the heart.

Why don't you keep it is accordance with its requirements found on the stone tablets? Since you don't the reality is you observe an amended version and not the commandment. Thus you're self dishonest about what you do.

Love does no wrong to God or our fellow man in any way.

This has nothing to do with keeping the 7th day Sabbath.

The litmus test then if we truly have love to God first and best and our fellows as ourselves is whether we are automatically fulfilling the law by love.

My theme, tenor is not by straining that the law is fulfilled but can only be fulfilled by love. Nothing but love will suffice.

The law is fulfilled (notice past tense) and we don't need (continue) to fulfill the law (keep the Sabbath - really worship only on Saturday).

 

[from scratch]

I only pointed out that you and I are free to make our own call and judge our beliefs and we surely want to be honest with ourselves.

There is an old song, "be honest with me dear" but it is far more important to be honest with ones self.

Then we will be far more apt to be honest with others.

Why did you point out we are free to make a choice then talk about the choice we must make in order to possess salvation? Essentially you intend us to think and believe we haven't entered the straight gate and narrow way.

 

[Gibs]

Why did you point out we are free to make a choice then talk about the choice we must make in order to possess salvation? Essentially you intend us to think and believe we haven't entered the straight gate and narrow way.

Scratch, I only presented my council and this is what you do also, allow me the same freedom.

 

[from scratch]

Scratch, I only presented my council and this is what you do also, allow me the same freedom.

Why are you giving us your counsel to keep the law? What you're really trying to do is bring others into your council. This activity is called evangelizing.

 

[VictorC]

I don't judge you or no one, each must do that for himself and one day we all will learn at the great judgment throne as to whether we judged ourselves aright.

His Word is our guide to judge ourselves.

So are you saying those who refuse to keep the Sabbath can be allowed in heaven or not?

Sophrosyne, I have made that "call" for myself and it is also your "call" for yourself.

What's wrong with this picture?
There is absolutely no objectivity in your non-answer, Gibs. That means there is no object (Scripture) used as a reference in how you reason. It isn't reason at all when you literally make up whatever feels good to you! There is no such thing as making "that call for myself", and there is no such thing as a 'judgment' convened to evaluate performance against whatever feels good.
This is worthless new-age mumbo-jumbo at its worst.

 

[VictorC]

Scratch, I only presented my council and this is what you do also, allow me the same freedom.

You're getting bad counsel from whatever council you got it from, counselor. That's what happens when the Bible is reduced to sound-bites and mutated to force unBiblical doctrines into it.

 

[Gibs]

Then you're not really trying to apply those passages to me. The above statement clearly shows you are. Otherwise why should I be concerned about them?As you say I must accept. But you can't require that of anyone else as the only way to enter God's rest. No I'm not promoting many ways to God.Why don't you keep it is accordance with its requirements found on the stone tablets? Since you don't the reality is you observe an amended version and not the commandment. Thus you're self dishonest about what you do.This has nothing to do with keeping the 7th day Sabbath.The law is fulfilled (notice past tense) and we don't need (continue) to fulfill the law (keep the Sabbath - really worship only on Saturday).

No, that is a misconception that Christ fulfilled the law so as you don't have to keep it and do your own self's free will. It is self that must be crucified and kept crucified.

He set the example as your champion or Big Brother of fulfilling it by doing it Himself as one of us and not God. That fact rings out as He was tempted in all points as we are and yet did no sin.

Now, God cannot be tempted so that clears up that He took upon Himself our fallen nature that He inherited of being made of Woman.

Those commandments as wrote in stone are also wrote in my heart and now from the love God has instilled in me they are kept automatically from the service of love of the heart. God's law is a law of love as God is love and only God is Good!

 

[Gibs]

Why are you giving us your counsel to keep the law? What you're really trying to do is bring others into your council. This activity is called evangelizing.

Are you not guilty of the same? Is it a crime? Are we free or not? Or would you have that I not have the same freedom?

 

[VictorC]

I'm sure you really don't expect him to say something else. After all he's under orders to not listen (accept) any thing you say unless it is what he says.

How about it, Gibs? Is this true?

From Scratch has proven his observation to be true.

 

[from scratch]

Are you not guilty of the same? Is it a crime? Are we free or not? Or would you have that I not have the same freedom?

No sir. I'm responding not initiating.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Sophrosyne, I have made that "call" for myself and it is also your "call" for yourself.

I disagree and consider this yet another evasive answer from you. The fact you are advocating Sabbath keeping far beyond voluntary here shows to me that you consider it beyond trivial in nature. I won't ever keep a Sabbath in my life so either you have to consider that Sabbath keeping is unnecessarily for salvation or it is necessary and if it isn't necessary then it doesn't need to be kept at all for a person to be saved.... in other words the entirety of Christianity can throw out the Sabbath and not lose a thing because of it.

 

[Sophrosyne]

The tenor or over all theme of your posts is one must observe the law. This is a full rejection of grace. But you say you believe in and need grace. I ask why you have the law. Problem is you violate the law which requires death. You abhor death and wish to escape it and claim grace. Cheap grace is talked about here. But you make the law worthless. Personally I see no difference. What it really boils down to is grace is cheep like its said we promote. You can't separate the flesh and the soul in your mind as the Bible does. Everything you relate to is based on the flesh and its performance to the law. The Sabbath gives the flesh rest. The Sabbath doesn't give rest for the soul that Jesus promised if one comes to Him. Jesus didn't offer them what they already had.

I invite you to the peace (rest) of God He provides through unmerited favor and declaration.

One could consider those who rely on Grace to escape the punishment of the Law..... having a cheapened version of the Law... or cheap Law.

 

[Gibs]

From the answers I'm getting here I wonder how you who are not keeping Sabbath see this verse.

Re 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Does that say anything against those who do?

 

[from scratch]

From the answers I'm getting here I wonder how you who are not keeping Sabbath see this verse.

Re 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Does that say anything against those who do?

You and John are talking about different sets of commandments. We're not crying that anyone keeps some form of the Sabbath. When you say you're keeping the Sabbath of Ex 20:8-11 you're lying.

 

[Gibs]

You and John are talking about different sets of commandments. We're not crying that anyone keeps some form of the Sabbath. When you say you're keeping the Sabbath of Ex 20:8-11 you're lying.

Now, now there Scratch you should not say that, but I have a ducks back and it did slide off.

John did if you notice stated "commandments of God."

 

[VictorC]

Now, now there Scratch you should not say that, but I have a ducks back and it did slide off.

John did if you notice stated "commandments of God."

Yes, he did - and John also stated exactly what the commandments of God are (present tense) in his first epistle. Are you feigning ignorance of God's commandments in an effort to violate them?
Indeed.
Look at your immediately preceding post on this thread:

From the answers I'm getting here I wonder how you who are not keeping Sabbath see this verse.

Re 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Does that say anything against those who do?

There isn't anything about the Sabbath in God's commandments.

Here's a question to ponder: Is it any worse to ignore a commandment that God actually did deliver to you, than to make up a commandment God didn't issue to you and claim He did? What do you think?

 

[Sophrosyne]

From the answers I'm getting here I wonder how you who are not keeping Sabbath see this verse.

Re 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Does that say anything against those who do?

Sophrosyne, I have made that "call" for myself and it is also your "call" for yourself.

You are trying to make the call for us too here..... to get us to keep the Sabbath so tell me why contradict yourself here?