Things to consider about the Ten Commandments

[Sophrosyne]

None of us would have your definition of grace, if your definition = PERFECT blissful, cakewalk, roses and sunshine for the rest of your life!

Until we have that perfect and sinless body, we will continue to sin, and the perfect and Holy God will always judge that sin. Sin = missing and going against the Will and Word of God. Being saved by grace through faith, does not make you sinless. You will still miss the mark and will need to repent.

Scriptures like God forgets our sins as far as the east is from the west become meaningless to you then. Being saved IS in God's eyes a state of sinlessless even though we sin it is not imputed to us because our sins were taken to the cross. One has to equate when we sin again Jesus either has to jump on the cross and take yet another sin of ours or we have to take it ourselves and somehow get rid of it all. It is the grace of God that if we keep our faith in him (and what he did) our sins are not accounted unto ourselves. It is NOT a license to sin, and those who choose sin instead of God may discover unto themselves that they salvation may have just been lip service and not a true declaration.

You must lead a perfect, trial free life Soph. James 1 must’ve not been written for you…it was written for men like Noah and Adam who went through trials and tribulation.

Far from it, I know that I sin and try to not sin but as Paul equates it is an impossible task but my faith in God shows me that if I focus on not sinning more than faith in God then I miss it entirely. Noah sinned but his faith in God was what God saw in him not his sins.

you calling his theology garbage? Where do you get yours? Do you subscribe to name it and claim it? Come to Jesus and EVERYTHING will be perfect?
That’s not what the Word of God teaches.

I call theology that elevates the Old Covenant above the New Covenant garbage because it throws out the accomplishment of Jesus like it was nothing but dirty bathwater.

The difference between David as an unbeliever and David as a believer saved by grace is that he now has an Advocate when he sins. He can repent and restore his right-standing with the Almighty! As a child of God, David still suffered the consequences of his sin, just like I do today.

lol
I seriously just chuckled. Jesus Christ was the Lamb of God slain before the foundation of the world!
Everyone that has ever been saved, everyone who has been redeemed, from Adam until the one redeemed this very second are saved by THE WAY, THE TRUTH and THE LIFE. There is NO OTHER way to be saved then by grace through faith in the Messiah!

I have no argument in this, however they were not saved UNTIL the cross occurred. This is why the parable of Abraham in paradise was equated these OT saints were stuck there till AFTER the cross.

So before you go throwing Abraham…THE FATHER of your faith out of the body of Christ…you might want to think twice and go back to basics.

I don't throw him out at all, I just don't attach him to the Law, the Sabbath, not exalt his deeds into being the vehicle of his salvation nor do I saw he was saved prior to the cross either. God can impute his salvation based upon that time in the future but it is like putting money on an item in layaway awaiting the final payment.. which is the blood spilled on the cross itself. One could consider the statement about the Lamb slain before time as being that of God choosing it so and in God when he decides something it 100% happens it is a guarantee even if one has to wait. To God the deed was done but to man we had to wait till after Jesus walked the earth and went to the cross and his words had to be heard spoken by the man Jesus. If I were to stop on the idea that the lamb was already slain before time and take it as some here do then Jesus never needed to come and go to the cross AT ALL. This is the problem in reconciling scripture in that you weave it into a tangled web to deceive and when unraveled all the garbage theology does is catch flies.

 

[from scratch]

Was Mt Sinai the first covenant?

In relationship to the subject of discussion, absolutely yes.

 

[from scratch]

Do you understand that the 10 commandments were not given just to jews? Now if the commandments were symbolic of Hagar, Hagar is not an Israelite, she is an Egyptian. Your agrument that the 10 commandments were just for jews is logically defeated; because HAGAR is a foreigner, an Egyptian slave.

And Moses is a pathological liar not worthy of trusting. There goes your whole argument.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Are you now a judge of swine? Do you eat swine? Do you like the taste of pig intestines or pig feet? I guess it is expedient to wash the pig before you eat it?

Look up the definition of the word... it pretty much applies in the way I presented it.

hog·wash

noun \-ˌwȯsh, -ˌwäsh\ : foolish or meaningless talk





Full Definition of HOGWASH

1
: swill 2a, slop

2
: nonsense, balderdash

 

[tzadik]

And Moses is a pathological liar not worthy of trusting. There goes your whole argument.

So you would disagree with the fact that Gentiles, strangers, foreigners and Egyptians all entered into a covenant with the God of Israel at Mt. Sinai?

...and again when Joshua re-committed the covenant in Joshua?

 

[from scratch]

Perhaps I missed it, but I don't see the word covenant ANYWHERE in the verse you quote at the end there. Definitely not in the Greek.

Uncle!!!!!

 

[mercy1061]

And Moses is a pathological liar not worthy of trusting. There goes your whole argument.

Be honest, do you obey Moses? Why don't you obey Moses?

Luke 16
31 So Abraham said, “If they won’t pay attention to Moses and the prophets, they won’t listen even to someone who comes back from the dead.”

 

[from scratch]

RIGHTEOUS JUDGMENTS are contrary to scripture? Now I know, you want to be right, you seek to establish your own righteousness that can not be clearly explained; you do not have a "willingness to be wrong" so that you may repent.

Of course that can't possibly apply to you.

 

[mercy1061]

Look up the definition of the word... it pretty much applies in the way I presented it.

hog·wash

noun \-ˌwȯsh, -ˌwäsh\ : foolish or meaningless talk





Full Definition of HOGWASH

1
: swill 2a, slop

2
: nonsense, balderdash

Since "hogwash" means foolish talk, now will you honestly answer my question; do you wash hogs before you eat them? Do you eat bacon, swine, swine intestines or pig feet? Please answer these very simple questions.

 

[from scratch]

Where there Gentiles, foreigners and strangers present when God spoke on Mt. Sinai?

Did Gentiles, foreigners, strangers and Egyptians also enter into covenant with the God of Israel at Sinai?

No sir. Who did God tell Moses to call together?

 

[mercy1061]

Of course that can't possibly apply to you.

I like PHARISEE Shaul uphold torah; you do not.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Do you understand that the 10 commandments were not given just to jews? Now if the commandments were symbolic of Hagar, Hagar is not an Israelite, she is an Egyptian. Your agrument that the 10 commandments were just for jews is logically defeated; because HAGAR is a foreigner, an Egyptian slave.

I'm sorry but becoming a slave to a Jew suddenly makes you under the Law pretty much blows away your argument because it shows that a persons standing changes in Judaism when they are enslaved. A slave is no longer considered a person as far as the Law goes they are more akin to property and have different rights than a Jew does. The distinction of a slave having different standing cannot be elevated to prove those who are NOT slaves were given the 10 commandments at all. What you are trying to do is say that all those who are not Jews are slaves to Jews so they can be said to be given the Law which is a rather flawed argument.

 

[from scratch]

I can not answer your question, because your question assumes a falsehood as truth. Where it is EXACTLY written that he took away the covenant at Mt. Sinai?

You act like every verse is a stand alone verse totally independent of even those in the same narrative.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Since "hogwash" means foolish talk, now will you honestly answer my question; do you wash hogs before you eat them? Do you eat bacon, swine, swine intestines or pig feet? Please answer these very simple questions.

I buy my meat already processed no need to wash it, saying I need to wash it after the pig itself alive was washed THEN killed has no bearing on my use of the word hogwash. Your question is also hogwash as it relates to this topic at hand.

 

[from scratch]

It's like me asking you "how do pigs fly?"
ANSWER THE QUESTION.

I must first prove to you that pigs fly.

Hebrews 10:9 says NOTHING about getting rid of a covenant.

Lambster launches them from a fighter/bomber jet.

 

[Sophrosyne]

You act like every verse is a stand alone verse totally independent of even those in the same narrative.

It is like reading a chapter in the book in the middle and making up the rest of the story to fit it an at times it comes out nothing like the story where that chapter was torn from is.

 

[from scratch]

MOD HAT

This thread has had a clean up and will have more of a clean up in all likelyhood.

Flaming the other member is not necessary. Keep your post about the content and topic and NOT the other member.

Must keep you all busy.

 

[mercy1061]

I'm sorry but becoming a slave to a Jew suddenly makes you under the Law pretty much blows away your argument because it shows that a persons standing changes in Judaism when they are enslaved. A slave is no longer considered a person as far as the Law goes they are more akin to property and have different rights than a Jew does. The distinction of a slave having different standing cannot be elevated to prove those who are NOT slaves were given the 10 commandments at all. What you are trying to do is say that all those who are not Jews are slaves to Jews so they can be said to be given the Law which is a rather flawed argument.

Hagar was sent away with Abraham's firstborn, Ishmael; father of Jethro.

 

[tzadik]

No sir. Who did God tell Moses to call together?

Read Deuteronomy 29 and Joshua 8.

 

[Sophrosyne]

I thought you may like to eat unclean pigs or hogs that have been washed?

Therein lies the problem, reading into what is said what you desire to think not what truly is by trying to understand the author behind what is being said. If you had even tried to understand me you would know I wasn't talking literally about washing pigs that doesn't make any sense so you would have checked a search engine and looked for an alternative definition of the word "hogwash" and then see if that was more fitting instead of asking questions which show IMO a lack of observative awareness on your part.