Why dont SDA's and Sabbath keepers also keep the Feast Days of Leviticus 23 too???

[BobRyan]

Please do so and I'll quote your formal debate with bugkiller again.

It can be found here for any interested party -

http://www.christianforums.com/t7680094/#post61167700

Please do - you never explain why you think that would help your case at all.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus

Why dont SDA's and Sabbath keepers also keep the Feast Days of Leviticus 23 too???
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Is that why you are not a member of the Messianic Judaism sect, as that Christian sect appears to keep the feast days of Leviticus. I could be wrong, so I would welcome an MJ's input on that.

​

of course they do, theyre jewish, why wouldn't they?

Some of them may be Jewish by birth, but not all of them are Jewish.
Perhaps Gentiles join MJudaism to be closer in beiliefs as the apostate non-Christian Jews? Just confused on that.

http://www.christianforums.com/t66196/#post1197572
Messianic Jew or Gentile

Originally Posted by A.J.

If asked, would I be considered a Messianic Jew or Gentile. I don't go to church, I observe the feasts, I worship on Saturday, but I also celebrate Christmas and Easter, but only because my parents always have. It's more of a family tradition then part of my religion. My heritage is of mostly all Christian descent, but I also have some Jewish mixed in.
​

While not the definition most of us (there I go assuming) would like to associate with MJism - the fact that most of non-Jew MJism easily fits into your description - sooooo - you qualify as normative Messianic.....

Since you are not Jewish (at least you make no claim to Jewish parentage) you are non-Jewish, a.k.a. Gentile.......

That equals Messianic Gentile by my reckoning

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[BobRyan]

When these will know Christian groups are referenced as examples of accepting ALL TEN of the TEN Commandments - but not claiming the ceremonial laws are applied today.

The "Baptist Confession of Faith"
The "Westminster Confession of Faith"
The Catholic Catechism
D.L. Moody
R.C Sproul
Andy Stanley
Thomas Watson

And when it is pointed out that Heb 10:4-12 also makes the case for the ended sacrifices and offerings of the ceremonial law.

The response we get is sometimes of the form "do not disturb me with the details and substance of the topic - what about just having some acrimony or vitriol" -

Which is a point of logic i do not understand in their argument.

Im seeing nothing but excuses form the SDA's and Sabbatarins as to why is is okay for them to Keep the Saturday Sabbath in Lev 23 and disregard all the rest of the Sabbaths, yet have the nerve to say... .

"The nerve" on this thread is that the groups cited above - and also the Seventh-day Baptist and the Seventh-day Adventist all claim that the TEN Commandments are included in the Moral Law of God AND that the Heb 10 statement ending the ceremonial law at the cross - makes perfect sense.

So far a number of people here seem to struggle with that point at least enough to respond with something like a bible text from hebrews 10 showing why you think that the ceremonial law must be kept if one is going to "honor their parents" or "obey ALL TEN of the TEN commandments".

in Christ,

Bob

 

[stone]

Some of them may be Jewish by birth, but not all of them are Jewish.
Perhaps Gentiles join MJudaism to be closer in beiliefs as the apostate non-Christian Jews? Just confused on that.

http://www.christianforums.com/t66196/#post1197572
Messianic Jew or Gentile





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just because you don't understand them lloj doesn't mean that you shouldn't give them a break.

 

[MoreCoffee]

When these will know Christian groups are referenced as examples of accepting ALL TEN of the TEN Commandments - but not claiming the ceremonial laws are applied today.

Not one of the groups you mention teaches seventh day observance and not one of them teaches that worshipping God on Sunday is the mark of the beast in the last days. SDA theology on these matters is eccentric to an extreme. Eccentric and very harmful.

 

[mmksparbud]

Not one of the groups you mention teaches seventh day observance and not one of them teaches that worshipping God on Sunday is the mark of the beast in the last days. SDA theology on these matters is eccentric to an extreme. Eccentric and very harmful.

And yet your catechism teaches that not keeping Sunday and the other "days of obligation" is a grave sin. If you do not confess and repent and keep them, you will burn in hell forever and ever--like I said, though--there are indugences that you can buy to help you with that.

 

[MoreCoffee]

.. your catechism teaches that not keeping Sunday and the other "days of obligation" is a grave sin. ...

Since you are not an active Catholic you need not worry about the issue you've raised. Your comment is simply an attempt to deflect the thread. Stick to the thread's topic, please.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus

Some of them may be Jewish by birth, but not all of them are Jewish.
Perhaps Gentiles join MJudaism to be closer in beliefs as the apostate non-Christian Jews? Just confused on that.

http://www.christianforums.com/t66196/#post1197572
Messianic Jew or Gentile
​

just because you don't understand them lloj doesn't mean that you shouldn't give them a break.

Point taken.
Guess I should also give the SDAs, RCs, JW's, Mormons, etc a break


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[stone]

And yet your catechism teaches that not keeping Sunday and the other "days of obligation" is a grave sin. If you do not confess and repent and keep them, you will burn in hell forever and ever--like I said, though--there are indugences that you can buy to help you with that.

I just read about the sabbath in the catechism and the day of resurection and it doesn't read anything about burning in hell forever for not attending on sunday.

 

[stone]

Point taken.
Guess I should also give the SDAs, RCs, JW's, Mormons, etc a break


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Yes! you should.

*but I know you won't* lol

 

[mmksparbud]

I just read about the sabbath in the catechism and the day of resurection and it doesn't read anything about burning in hell forever for not attending on sunday.

Are you kidding??--It is considered a "grave sin"--you need to find what they mean by a grave sin as opposed to other sins.


2177 The Sunday celebration of the Lord's Day and his Eucharist is at the heart of the Church's life.
"Sunday is the day on which the paschal mystery is celebrated in light of the apostolic tradition and is to be observed as the foremost holy day of obligation in the universal Church."110"Also to be observed are the day of the Nativity of Our Lord Jesus Christ,
the Epiphany,
the Ascension of Christ,
the feast of the Body and Blood of Christi,
the feast of Mary the Mother of God,
her Immaculate Conception,
her Assumption,
the feast of Saint Joseph,
the feast of the Apostles Saints Peter and Paul, and the feast of All Saints."111


2181 The Sunday Eucharist is the foundation and confirmation of all Christian practice. For this reason the faithful are obliged to participate in the Eucharist on days of obligation, unless excused for a serious reason (for example, illness, the care of infants) or dispensed by their own pastor.119 Those who deliberately fail in this obligation commit a grave sin.

 

[stone]

Are you kidding??--It is considered a "grave sin"--you need to find what they mean by a grave sin as opposed to other sins.


2177 The Sunday celebration of the Lord's Day and his Eucharist is at the heart of the Church's life.
"Sunday is the day on which the paschal mystery is celebrated in light of the apostolic tradition and is to be observed as the foremost holy day of obligation in the universal Church."110"Also to be observed are the day of the Nativity of Our Lord Jesus Christ,
the Epiphany,
the Ascension of Christ,
the feast of the Body and Blood of Christi,
the feast of Mary the Mother of God,
her Immaculate Conception,
her Assumption,
the feast of Saint Joseph,
the feast of the Apostles Saints Peter and Paul, and the feast of All Saints."111


2181 The Sunday Eucharist is the foundation and confirmation of all Christian practice. For this reason the faithful are obliged to participate in the Eucharist on days of obligation, unless excused for a serious reason (for example, illness, the care of infants) or dispensed by their own pastor.119 Those who deliberately fail in this obligation commit a grave sin.

well i can't argue with that. If you think about it, most people only work monday through friday, off saturday and sunday and go to church on sunday.

Sunday is a day set aside to celebrate Jesus, because it is the day he resurrected.

He instituted his day with the Eucharist, and it deserves to be celebrated.

I'll see you guys at mass on Sunday.

 

[mmksparbud]

The day of the Resurrection: the new creation
2174 Jesus rose from the dead "on the first day of the week."104 Because it is the "first day," the day of Christ's Resurrection recalls the first creation. Because it is the "eighth day" following the sabbath,105 it symbolizes the new creation ushered in by Christ's Resurrection. For Christians it has become the first of all days, the first of all feasts, the Lord's Day (he kuriake hemera, dies dominica) Sunday:
We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead.106
Sunday - fulfillment of the sabbath
2175 Sunday is expressly distinguished from the sabbath which it follows chronologically every week; for Christians its ceremonial observance replaces that of the sabbath. In Christ's Passover, Sunday fulfills the spiritual truth of the Jewish sabbath and announces man's eternal rest in God. For worship under the Law prepared for the mystery of Christ, and what was done there prefigured some aspects of Christ:107
Those who lived according to the old order of things have come to a new hope, no longer keeping the sabbath, but the Lord's Day, in which our life is blessed by him and by his death.108











I. The Sabbath Day
2168 The third commandment of the Decalogue recalls the holiness of the sabbath: "The seventh day is a sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the LORD."92
2169 In speaking of the sabbath Scripture recalls creation: "For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and hallowed it."93
2170 Scripture also reveals in the Lord's day a memorial of Israel's liberation from bondage in Egypt: "You shall remember that you were a servant in the land of Egypt, and the LORD your God brought you out thence with mighty hand and outstretched arm; therefore the LORD your God commanded you to keep the sabbath day."94
2171 God entrusted the sabbath to Israel to keep as a sign of the irrevocable covenant.95 The sabbath is for the Lord, holy and set apart for the praise of God, his work of creation, and his saving actions on behalf of Israel.
2172 God's action is the model for human action. If God "rested and was refreshed" on the seventh day, man too ought to "rest" and should let others, especially the poor, "be refreshed."96 The sabbath brings everyday work to a halt and provides a respite. It is a day of protest against the servitude of work and the worship of money.97
2173 The Gospel reports many incidents when Jesus was accused of violating the sabbath law. But Jesus never fails to respect the holiness of this day.98 He gives this law its authentic and authoritative interpretation: "The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath."99 With compassion, Christ declares the sabbath for doing good rather than harm, for saving life rather than killing.100 The sabbath is the day of the Lord of mercies and a day to honor God.101 "The Son of Man is lord even of the sabbath."102






It's not as though Catholic church does not recognize the Sabbath, they very much do--they have transfered the solomnity of it to Sunday--that's all.

So, if they have still insisted on keeping the new sabbath--why do they not keep the rest Levitical laws also--they transfered the 7th day holiness to the 1st day (or what they call the 8th day)--they can certainly then keep the rest of Leviticus as others have said we should. How does a man make something holy that God never did???

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by stone

I just read about the sabbath in the catechism and the day of resurection and it doesn't read anything about burning in hell forever for not attending on sunday.
​

Are you kidding??--It is considered a "grave sin"--you need to find what they mean by a grave sin as opposed to other sins.........................


Those who deliberately fail in this obligation commit a grave sin.

Do you yourself believe Christian non Fri-Sat sabbath keepers will go to hell?

http://www.christianforums.com/t5037325-3/
Non Sabbath-Keepers go to hell?

I'm not 7th Day Adventist (I'm Messianic, so I do keep the Sabbath) , but I do listen to Doug Bachelor's Amazing Facts program every week. About 90% of what he says I agree with. I have heard him say, and I agree, that people do what they know & God knows the intent of the heart. There will be those who keep the Sabbath, yet do not know the Messiah & follow God's ways by rote instead of out of a spirit of love, who will not be in the Kingdom.

There will be those who do not keep the Sabbath yet love God & they WILL be in the Kingdom. Yeshua HAS paid the penalty for our sins, but that's not to say that when we know better we shouldn't do better. When you know better you do better, correct ? If you have come to the understanding that the 7th day Sabbath has NOT been done away with, then you do have the responsibility to keep it. If you love God anyway, then you should delight in keeping his laws.

If you think about it, if you now know that you are sinning by not keeping the Sabbath, then are you going to break the Sabbath & then ask forgiveness every week with no intention of ever obeying ? Is that something a believer should do ? I don't think so, do you ?

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[mmksparbud]

Do you yourself believe Christian non Fri-Sat sabbath keepers will go to hell?

http://www.christianforums.com/t5037325-3/
Non Sabbath-Keepers go to hell?



.[/quo

&*%## NO!!!!--I firmly believe that many 7thday keepers will be lost and many 1st day or what day keepers will be saved---God searches the heart--He knows who loves Him, and who obeys Him out of love--there will be those who have never heard the Name Jesus who will be there--How??--Because they heard His voice and followed what He told them. Just because you keep sabbath does not entitle anyone to sit next to Christ!--Those who teach that are wrong no mater what faith they are. What we do we do for love of God. At the same time, if you have been shown truth, and you purposely reject it--it's not convenient, it doesn't fit into your lifestyle, it would alianate your friends--whatever--then you stand in opposition to His spoken word to you.

 

[mmksparbud]

We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead.106
Sunday

Does nobody get this??

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Do you yourself believe Christian non Fri-Sat sabbath keepers will go to hell?

http://www.christianforums.com/t5037325-3/
Non Sabbath-Keepers go to hell?

.

&*%## NO!!!!--
I firmly believe that many 7thday keepers will be lost and many 1st day or what day keepers will be saved---God searches the heart--He knows who loves Him, and who obeys Him out of love--there will be those who have never heard the Name Jesus who will be there--How??--Because they heard His voice and followed what He told them. Just because you keep sabbath does not entitle anyone to sit next to Christ!--Those who teach that are wrong no mater what faith they are. What we do we do for love of God.
At the same time, if you have been shown truth, and you purposely reject it--it's not convenient, it doesn't fit into your lifestyle, it would alianate your friends--whatever--then you stand in opposition to His spoken word to you.

Thanks for that clarification.
So the RCC and Protestants don't have to worry about it.


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[stone]

We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead.106
Sunday

Does nobody get this??

Sun-day?

 

[mmksparbud]

2188 In respecting religious liberty and the common good of all, Christians should seek recognition of Sundays and the Church's holy days as legal holidays. They have to give everyone a public example of prayer, respect, and joy and defend their traditions as a precious contribution to the spiritual life of society. If a country's legislation or other reasons require work on Sunday, the day should nevertheless be lived as the day of our deliverance which lets us share in this "festal gathering," this "assembly of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven."125


This observance of the new sabbath should be sought by legal legislation. We in no way teach that we should ever make the 7th day a legal day of observance.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

2188 In respecting religious liberty and the common good of all, Christians should seek recognition of Sundays and the Church's holy days as legal holidays. They have to give everyone a public example of prayer, respect, and joy and defend their traditions as a precious contribution to the spiritual life of society. If a country's legislation or other reasons require work on Sunday, the day should nevertheless be lived as the day of our deliverance which lets us share in this "festal gathering," this "assembly of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven."125


This observance of the new sabbath should be sought by legal legislation. We in no way teach that we should ever make the 7th day a legal day of observance.

Intead of posting randomly, why not respond to member's posts and stay on topic.

We already know what your agenda is concerning the 4th Commandemnt



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