Happy Hanukkah

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

True - and thanks for noting.

As another noted best:

As Orthodox Christians, we know that Hanukkah, the Jewish holiday that falls near the time of Christ 's Nativity, celebrates the re-dedication of the Temple in Jerusalem after its re-capture from the pagan Greeks who were led by Antiochus (who had begun referring to himself as "Epiphanís "- "illustrious" or "divine manifestation "; his enemies called him "Epimanís "- "raving madman"). What is of special significance to us is that this popular Jewish festival is based on an oral tradition related to the events recorded in the First Book of Maccabees (4:36-59). So there are two noteworthy lessons for us here: 1) the importance of unwritten holy tradition for the Jewish people of that time, as well as for the holy Apostles-see II Thess. 2:15, for example; and, 2) the fact that the feast of Hanukkah, so beloved of the Jewish people today, is based on an account recorded in a book found today only in the Septuagint text of the Old Testament, and not in contemporary Jewish and Protestant bibles! The Septuagint, of course, is the text of the Old Testament used by the Orthodox Church. So, in this sense, Hanukah belongs more to our Orthodox Christian Biblical tradition than it does to the contemporary Jewish people.

​

Happy Hannukah to you as well

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Dewi, I get a sense that I am approaching twice your age, and have actually thought about all these things. On the other hand, I have a feeling you have NOT given deep thought to what "anti-Semitism" is, and I certainly do not equate Judaism with paganism.

I never said "do not pray to the holy Forefathers". I say, "Do not celebrate specifically Jewish holidays that have been superceded by the Church of Christ, the holy, catholic and apostolic Church.

There is nothing Protestant in my own thought about all of this. Please stop Judaizing. The ancient Jews were right on. We accept Jewish Tradition up to 33AD, though it has been fulfilled and transformec. Two thousand years ago, those that did not join the Church went OFF the tracks, and we have no business trying to bring that post and anti-Christian tradition into the Church. I'm not ure how trong I have to say that, but I'd say that it is anathema for an Orthodox Christian to celebrate Hannukah. It certainly means going out of communion with the Orthodox Church, and would require confession and repentance.

We have NOT "superceded" but are a "continuation"...you might want to read Romans 11:18 again.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I'm 6'5" and 248 lbs. I will be a formidable adversary in the feats of strength! And yet Matt has military experience. A truly epic battle in the style of Costanza! LOL

I'll get the pole out of the crawl space, it's time for the feats of strength. until you pin me gurney, Festivus is not over. LET'S RUMBLE!

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I'm not sure why you refer to our Lord in Aramaic in that His holy Name has been translated to "Jesus" for we Orthodox and likewise it is best to refer to Him as Lord. And I must concur wholeheartedly with Rus that you tend toward a fine line of Judaizing with this talk of Hannukah and the Jewish festivals and remembrances of Our Lord's day. We're not Jewish. We celebrate the beginning of the Feast of the Nativity today in my Orthodox calendar. The repose of St. Herman, the wonderworker of Alaska, is today as well along with the holy martyrs and confessors Gurias, Samonas, and Abibus of Edessa. Now if you want to wish us all a happy beginning to the Feast of the Nativity, I'm all for that. Or if you want to commemorate the great saints of the day, I'm with ya...but to be so fascinated with the Jewish festival of lights that has nothing to do with Holy Orthodoxy or our ecclesiastical calendar, that's when I fail to see the relevance.

We don't use Aramaic terms in Holy Orthodoxy. We don't refer to God as Al-Shaddai, Elohim, Yaweah, Adonai, and all the other Jewish terms. We call Him Lord, God, and Most Holy Trinity. We don't say, "Yehuda," we say Judah. We don't said "Duwid," we say David. We don't say "Shmuel" but Samuel. I don't see the point in turning Orthodoxy into a quasi-Semitic setup, but I digress.....

I didn't know that Yeshua celebrated Kwanza and Festivus (whatever that is). Was that in John or Luke? ;-)

 

[ArmyMatt]

I'm 6'5" and 248 lbs. I will be a formidable adversary in the feats of strength! And yet Matt has military experience. A truly epic battle in the style of Costanza! LOL

stop crying and fight your net buddy..... this is the best Festivus ever!

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

The upper cut and right cross I just gave you left you THINKING I was crying! You're seeing stars! Now get up and grab the pole if you must, and then we'll air out our grievances! After that we'll observe the Festivus Miracles!

stop crying and fight your net buddy..... this is the best Festivus ever!

 

[ArmyMatt]

The upper cut and right cross I just gave you left you THINKING I was crying! You're seeing stars! Now get up and grab the pole if you must, and then we'll air out our grievances! After that we'll observe the Festivus Miracles!

HA! you think you can tag me? I shimmied up the pole and outta your range like a ring tailed lemur (I learned to climb in the Pacific Northwest), and the pole, being aluminum, has great strength to weight ratio. and now I wait. but those are not stars I see, that's tinsel.....do you find it distracting?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

We don't use Aramaic terms in Holy Orthodoxy. We don't refer to God as Al-Shaddai, Elohim, Yaweah, Adonai, and all the other Jewish terms. We call Him Lord, God, and Most Holy Trinity. We don't say, "Yehuda," we say Judah. We don't said "Duwid," we say David. We don't say "Shmuel" but Samuel. I don't see the point in turning Orthodoxy into a quasi-Semitic setup, but I digress.....

Is that what "WE" do? Russians call Him "Bogh", what would a Hebrew Christian call Him? Using the original Names offends you? Golgotha is not an Aramaic term? How about Yeshua's own words on the Cross..."Eli Eli lama sabachthani"?? Grow up.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I don't recall using the word "offend" anywhere, and your last admonition is NOT an Orthodox attitude, but a rude one.

Is that what "WE" do? Russians call Him "Bogh", what would a Hebrew Christian call Him? Using the original Names offends you? Golgotha is not an Aramaic term? How about Yeshua's own words on the Cross..."Eli Eli lama sabachthani"?? Grow up.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

I don't recall using the word "offend" anywhere, and your last admonition is NOT an Orthodox attitude, but a rude one.

Obviously you were offended otherwise you would not have said what you did. What was rude is you and Rus basically telling me that if I use Hebrew or even speak of Hanukkah (something Yeshua/Jesus Himself as well as all the Apostles celebrated...very likely even after 33 AD) I can not be Orthodox. THAT is not an Orthodox "attitude"...and to your comments of "WE" Orthodox not using Aramaic terms...I properly replied "grow up".

 

[Chesterton]

Obviously you were offended otherwise you would not have said what you did. What was rude is you and Rus basically telling me that if I use Hebrew or even speak of Hanukkah (something Yeshua/Jesus Himself as well as all the Apostles celebrated...very likely even after 33 AD) I can not be Orthodox. THAT is not an Orthodox "attitude"...and to your comments of "WE" Orthodox not using Aramaic terms...I properly replied "grow up".

You're just trying to be provocative. What's the point? You know we don't celebrate Hanukkah.

 

[ArmyMatt]

c'mon guys, it's the fast. let's not do this

 

[Ioustinos]

c'mon guys, it's the fast. let's not do this

Agreed. Let us follow a lesson I'm sure we have all been taught -- If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.

Let us be thankful today for family, friends, and the coming of the day we celebrate when God came down from heaven and became one of us to save us and heal us.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I'm with Matt on this. I'm not going to debate Hanukkah with you, bro. If you want to play Jewish and celebrate Jewish holidays, that's your business. You can spin dradles and make matzo, speak Yiddish, wear curls, whatever floats your boat. But I would consider listening to your Orthodox brethren in Christ on this Judaizing stuff.

Yes, Jesus the Lord (note I'm using the common English for his name! ) celebrated Hannukah. Does that mean that we need to? Jesus's contemporaries observed Levitical laws, stoned people to death, killed a child for dishonoring them, and a host of other things. Just curious, but did you read the whole New Testament thing about the Judaizers? You are aware that there was a camp of Christians who thought that circumcision, temple laws, festivals, and Jewishshness must be maintained, right? And Paul rightly opposed the bizarre phenomenon and explained that the Gentiles were not bound to circumcision and such. The Church did not celebrate Hanukkah and for 2,000 years it has continued not to do so. If I am forced to choose on this issue between one poster in CF who is fascinated with all things Jewish and tries to impose them on Orthodoxy, and the 2,000 years of history that teaches us the Church IS the fullness of Christ and our traditions are our own in Christ and not Jewish, then I will follow the Holy Orthodox Church.

There is nothing wrong with loving the Old Testament and the Jewish heritage that led up to Christ historically speaking. And there is nothing particularly wrong with wishing Jewish people a Happy Hanukkah either. But to continually attempt to push Jewish holidays and names and other various things on Orthodox posters is odd and, for me at least, unprecedented.

I'm done debating this. This is my final word. All I can say is OY VEY!

Obviously you were offended otherwise you would not have said what you did. What was rude is you and Rus basically telling me that if I use Hebrew or even speak of Hanukkah (something Yeshua/Jesus Himself as well as all the Apostles celebrated...very likely even after 33 AD) I can not be Orthodox. THAT is not an Orthodox "attitude"...and to your comments of "WE" Orthodox not using Aramaic terms...I properly replied "grow up".

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Amen

Agreed. Let us follow a lesson I'm sure we have all been taught -- If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.

Let us be thankful today for family, friends, and the coming of the day we celebrate when God came down from heaven and became one of us to save us and heal us.

 

[rusmeister]

Is that what "WE" do? Russians call Him "Bogh", what would a Hebrew Christian call Him? Using the original Names offends you? Golgotha is not an Aramaic term? How about Yeshua's own words on the Cross..."Eli Eli lama sabachthani"?? Grow up.

Following this logic, I am justified in posting in Russian here.
Making the charitable assumption, that you really do not intend to drag modern Judaism into the Church, I'll say that if anyone else did that in their language, you would at best feel that they were showing off, if not irritated.

Стоит только немножко так писать Вам, перед тем как это Вам надоест.

It is RUDE to speak to people in a language foreign to them if you can speak their language.

We are ready to appreciate your sentiments when you express them in English.

We are ready to joyfully join you when you invite us to celebrate Orthodox holy days. But not when you invite us to commemorate Jewish holidays that the Church has NOT continued.

Oh, and the Aramaic you cite... Was TRANSLATED, and as a huge exception to the overwhelming rule of Scripture, which does not include original language in accepted translations.

To all and sundry: "Happy Thanksgiving!!!

 

[inconsequential]

If you are a Jewish convert to Orthodoxy, I don't think it would be nearly as big a deal as if you were just wanting to celebrate Hanukkah to "get back to the basics" or something. If you are Jewish, no one expects you to abandon your culture. I'm in the "Bible Belt" and though, now Orthodox, would not hesitate to go to "Decoration Day" at a family member's Baptist church. I wouldn't participate in the service but I would place flowers on the graves of family members and remember them.

I wouldn't turn my nose up at the huge feast either. I mean, that would just be rude. Fried chicken, squirrel dumplings, fried okra (boiled too!!), black-eyed peas.........

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

I'm with Matt on this. I'm not going to debate Hanukkah with you, bro. If you want to play Jewish and celebrate Jewish holidays, that's your business. You can spin dradles and make matzo, speak Yiddish, wear curls, whatever floats your boat. But I would consider listening to your Orthodox brethren in Christ on this Judaizing stuff.

Yes, Jesus the Lord (note I'm using the common English for his name! ) celebrated Hannukah. Does that mean that we need to? Jesus's contemporaries observed Levitical laws, stoned people to death, killed a child for dishonoring them, and a host of other things. Just curious, but did you read the whole New Testament thing about the Judaizers? You are aware that there was a camp of Christians who thought that circumcision, temple laws, festivals, and Jewishshness must be maintained, right? And Paul rightly opposed the bizarre phenomenon and explained that the Gentiles were not bound to circumcision and such. The Church did not celebrate Hanukkah and for 2,000 years it has continued not to do so. If I am forced to choose on this issue between one poster in CF who is fascinated with all things Jewish and tries to impose them on Orthodoxy, and the 2,000 years of history that teaches us the Church IS the fullness of Christ and our traditions are our own in Christ and not Jewish, then I will follow the Holy Orthodox Church.

There is nothing wrong with loving the Old Testament and the Jewish heritage that led up to Christ historically speaking. And there is nothing particularly wrong with wishing Jewish people a Happy Hanukkah either. But to continually attempt to push Jewish holidays and names and other various things on Orthodox posters is odd and, for me at least, unprecedented.

I'm done debating this. This is my final word. All I can say is OY VEY!

Just to let you in on something...there ARE Orthodox Christians that are Jewish in heritage...yes, here...on this very forum...and I am not "playing" as you say. How rude of you to call it "playing". I am not pushing ANYTHING on you or anyone else here.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Shalom

Just to let you in on something...there ARE Orthodox Christians that are Jewish in heritage...yes, here...on this very forum...and I am not "playing" as you say. How rude of you to call it "playing". I am not pushing ANYTHING on you or anyone else here.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Стоит только немножко так писать Вам, перед тем как это Вам надоест.

So why write to me at all then?