The books of Hebrews and Revelation prove the unchangeableness of God's Holy Law. (2)

[CFTerminator]

Sdaly, they haven't really helped the cause of the Christian Reformation/Protestism very much, and in fact, they take it backwards...IMHO

Seventh-day Adventist Church - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Seventh-day Adventist Church is the largest of several Adventist groups which arose from the Millerite movement of the 1840s in upstate New York, a phase of the Second Great Awakening. William Miller predicted on the basis of Daniel 8:14–16 and the "day-year principle" that Jesus Christ would return to Earth between the Spring of 1843 and the Spring of 1844.

Say what?! The SDAs are the only global denomination that are still pointing out the fact that most professed Protestant churches have bowed the knee to Rome, by their Sunday observance, which is based on man made tradition.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by progmonk

You make two assumptions that noone agrees with outside of Judaism and your sect.
​

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus

​

*Sadly, they haven't really helped the cause of the Christian Reformation/Protestism very much, and in fact, they take it backwards...IMHO

Seventh-day Adventist Church - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.
​

Say what?!
The SDAs are the only global denomination that are still pointing out the fact that most professed Protestant churches have bowed the knee to Rome, by their Sunday observance, which is based on man made tradition.

You can take that up with the RCs, EOs and Protestant churches that worship on Sunday.......

http://www.christianforums.com/t7444322/#post63628383
Is Sunday worship mark of the beast?

Originally Posted by TruthWarrior

No, that is nonsense. I use to believe it myself, but I realized I was in error.
I do believe in keeping the 7th day Sabbath because it's one of the ten commandments, but Sunday worship is NOT the mark of the beast.
The early Christians would gather together on both the Sabbath and Sunday to worship God. There is absolutely nothing wrong with going to church on Sunday. In the book of Acts, there is a verse where the apostles would gather together seven days a week.
​

Originally Posted by GladiatorforGod

You are wrong, on this issue, Bro. I base this on the long history of the Papacy. The Antichrist could not be Islam, because it is not a professed Christian faith. The Antichrist has to profess to be Christian, but is not really Christian in reality. Its a close impersonator.
Almost every Protestant commentator during the Reformation period ID'd the Pope as the Antichrist.
​

.
​

 

[Keachian]

Say what?! The SDAs are the only global denomination that are still pointing out the fact that most professed Protestant churches have bowed the knee to Rome, by their Sunday observance, which is based on man made tradition.

And we've been over this before, your legalism and your view of Justification and Sanctification (which were the main Theological critiques of the Reformation) put you back in the middle of the Pelagian controversy.

 

[CFTerminator]

And we've been over this before, your legalism and your view of Justification and Sanctification (which were the main Theological critiques of the Reformation) put you back in the middle of the Pelagian controversy.

Who are you to point out legalism? The Baptists are well known as being legalistic, about the wrong day! They worship on Sunday, and day based on man made tradition, all the while the Baptist preachers say they need to come to church and worship on Sunday, but have no biblical basis for doing so!

 

[Keachian]

Who are you to point out legalism? The Baptists are well known as being legalistic, about the wrong day! They worship on Sunday, and day based on man made tradition, all the while the Baptist preachers say they need to come to church and worship on Sunday, but have no biblical basis for doing so!

All the Reformers would argue that having your doctrines of Justification and Sanctification correct is far more important than what day of the week you worship on. Oh and by the by, my church has had in the past and hopes to in the future have a congregation which meets on a Saturday, we also have a congregation which meets every month on a Monday. I am training to be a "Baptist preacher" and will continue to preach as Paul did that no day is better than any other day.

 

[robinvanpersie]

I am training to be a "Baptist preacher" and will continue to preach as Paul did that no day is better than any other day.

Unfortunately Romans 14:1 tells us that the passage deals with MAN'S OPINIONS.

The 4th commandment, is not "MAN'S OPINION" but rather the commandment of God.
---

But for the sake of argument, let's take verse 5 and "insert" the Sabbath day in there.

5. One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.
--Right off the bat you should be alerted by the fact that it's saying that "a person regards one day above another" --again you should notice the complete absence of God's regarding. Leviticus 23 clearly tells us that GOD regards the 7th day Sabbath as HIS HOLY DAY. If this isn't enough for ya, let's continue...

Let's take verse 5 and put in the Sabbath day as an example. You would have.

Example 1.
"One person regards the Sabbath day above the rest of the days, and another regards EVERY day as "non-Sabbath days"--working every day, delighting in his own desires every day, carrying heavy burdens every day and never sanctifying any days to the Lord." -- You want to be this guy?

Example 2.
"One person regards the Sabbath day above the rest of the days, and another regards EVERY day as Sabbath days ---Never working, always resting, never causing anyone to work (business transactions), never kindling fires to cook and never spending any time delighting in any of his own desires." -- Perhaps you're tempted to be this guy?

--
So you see...putting the Sabbath day in context of Romans 14:5 completely does not work. Verse 1 clearly and thankfully tells us that the entire passage deals with "man's opinions' and not God's commandments---which last time I checked, are not open to "man's discussions".

 

[Keachian]

Leviticus 23 clearly tells us that GOD regards the 7th day Sabbath as HIS HOLY DAY.

Through the damning of the lip-service of the Israelites by the Prophets and the writer of Hebrews' identification of Christ as the true rest which was promised by God we know that this is no longer the case.

So today if you hear his voice, enter into the rest that he made at the foundation of the world, which as he swore in his wrath was not given to the children of Israel, but now has been given today.

 

[robinvanpersie]

Through the damning of the lip-service of the Israelites by the Prophets and the writer of Hebrews' identification of Christ as the true rest which was promised by God we know that this is no longer the case.

I guess "interpretation" makes such clear words as EVERLASTING, THROUGHOUT ALL YOUR GENERATIONS and FOREVER from the mouth of God as completely erasable eh?

"Every sabbath day he shall set it in order before the LORD continually; it is an everlasting covenant for the sons of Israel."

"But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, `You shall surely observe My sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the LORD who sanctifies you.

`So the sons of Israel shall observe the sabbath, to celebrate the sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant.'
----

What's next...are you going to tell me that "interpretation" also eradicates this everlasting covenant?

"When the bow is in the cloud, then I will look upon it, to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth."

 

[Keachian]

"Every sabbath day he shall set it in order before the LORD continually; it is an everlasting covenant for the sons of Israel."

"But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, `You shall surely observe My sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the LORD who sanctifies you.

`So the sons of Israel shall observe the sabbath, to celebrate the sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant.'

So Gentiles are obviously exempted.

 

[from scratch]

Unfortunately Romans 14:1 tells us that the passage deals with MAN'S OPINIONS.

The 4th commandment, is not "MAN'S OPINION" but rather the commandment of God.
---

But for the sake of argument, let's take verse 5 and "insert" the Sabbath day in there.

5. One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.
--Right off the bat you should be alerted by the fact that it's saying that "a person regards one day above another" --again you should notice the complete absence of God's regarding. Leviticus 23 clearly tells us that GOD regards the 7th day Sabbath as HIS HOLY DAY. If this isn't enough for ya, let's continue...

Let's take verse 5 and put in the Sabbath day as an example. You would have.

Example 1.
"One person regards the Sabbath day above the rest of the days, and another regards EVERY day as "non-Sabbath days"--working every day, delighting in his own desires every day, carrying heavy burdens every day and never sanctifying any days to the Lord." -- You want to be this guy?

Example 2.
"One person regards the Sabbath day above the rest of the days, and another regards EVERY day as Sabbath days ---Never working, always resting, never causing anyone to work (business transactions), never kindling fires to cook and never spending any time delighting in any of his own desires." -- Perhaps you're tempted to be this guy?

--
So you see...putting the Sabbath day in context of Romans 14:5 completely does not work. Verse 1 clearly and thankfully tells us that the entire passage deals with "man's opinions' and not God's commandments---which last time I checked, are not open to "man's discussions".

I like the part in blue.

 

[CFTerminator]

All the Reformers would argue that having your doctrines of Justification and Sanctification correct is far more important than what day of the week you worship on. Oh and by the by, my church has had in the past and hopes to in the future have a congregation which meets on a Saturday, we also have a congregation which meets every month on a Monday. I am training to be a "Baptist preacher" and will continue to preach as Paul did that no day is better than any other day.

Ignoring a Commandment written by the very finger of God trumps the doctrines of Sanctification and Justification, since the 4th Commandments is so clear, that a 12 year old child can understand it. While Protestants and Evangelicals have various spins on Sanctification and Justification.

 

[Keachian]

Ignoring a Commandment written by the very finger of God trumps the doctrines of Sanctification and Justification, since the 4th Commandments is so clear, that a 12 year old child can understand it. While Protestants and Evangelicals have various spins on Sanctification and Justification.

Yes Orthopraxy is somewhat more important than Orthodoxy, however Orthodoxy will always inform our praxy, you've put the cart in front of the horse. And bow to Rome on how one will be Justified and Sanctified (do the right things, say the right words and maybe if God is willing you will be saved)

If you believe that Sabbath is more important than J&S then you shouldn't appeal to the Reformers for anything. The Reformers based their cry of Rome and the Pope being Babylon and Antichrist from the Roman Catholic doctrines of Justification and Sanctification (yours are surprisingly similar to pre-Reformation Catholic Justification and Sanctification)

 

[robinvanpersie]

I like the part in blue.

Gotta love that liberty God gives us for things not specifically commanded in the Scriptures.

On the other hand, there's absolutely no wavering when it comes to God's commandments.

 

[robinvanpersie]

Leviticus 23 clearly tells us that GOD regards the 7th day Sabbath as HIS HOLY DAY.

Through the damning of the lip-service of the Israelites by the Prophets and the writer of Hebrews' identification of Christ as the true rest which was promised by God we know that this is no longer the case.

So today if you hear his voice, enter into the rest that he made at the foundation of the world, which as he swore in his wrath was not given to the children of Israel, but now has been given today.

I guess "interpretation" makes such clear words as EVERLASTING, THROUGHOUT ALL YOUR GENERATIONS and FOREVER from the mouth of God as completely erasable eh?

"Every sabbath day he shall set it in order before the LORD continually; it is an everlasting covenant for the sons of Israel."

"But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, `You shall surely observe My sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the LORD who sanctifies you.

`So the sons of Israel shall observe the sabbath, to celebrate the sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant.'
----

What's next...are you going to tell me that "interpretation" also eradicates this everlasting covenant?

"When the bow is in the cloud, then I will look upon it, to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth."

So Gentiles are obviously exempted.

So are you now agreeing with me that believing Jews today are still part of said EVERLASTING covenant?

 

[Stryder06]

Yes Orthopraxy is somewhat more important than Orthodoxy, however Orthodoxy will always inform our praxy, you've put the cart in front of the horse. And bow to Rome on how one will be Justified and Sanctified (do the right things, say the right words and maybe if God is willing you will be saved)

If you believe that Sabbath is more important than J&S then you shouldn't appeal to the Reformers for anything. The Reformers based their cry of Rome and the Pope being Babylon and Antichrist from the Roman Catholic doctrines of Justification and Sanctification (yours are surprisingly similar to pre-Reformation Catholic Justification and Sanctification)

I get the feeling you don't get what Justification and Sanctification actually is.

 

[from scratch]

Ignoring a Commandment written by the very finger of God trumps the doctrines of Sanctification and Justification, since the 4th Commandments is so clear, that a 12 year old child can understand it. While Protestants and Evangelicals have various spins on Sanctification and Justification.

The law doesn't trump the New Covenant.

 

[robinvanpersie]

The law doesn't trump the New Covenant.

The New Covenant contains the Law as part of its makeup. (Jeremiah 31:33)

 

[CFTerminator]

The law doesn't trump the New Covenant.

The Modern Evangelical interpretation of the NC is the problem, the take it to mean that the Law of God was done away with Moses, but what explodes that is the fact that Jesus in the NT keep all of the 10 Commandments perfectly, leaving an example for us.

 

[CFTerminator]

The New Covenant contains the Law as part of its makeup. (Jeremiah 31:33)

Thanks, for your comments, regarding Jeremiah 31, it explodes the idea that the Law would be done away with in the OT or the NT. Modern Evangelicals don't realize that they are promoting a Lawless Gospel, devoid of moral boundaries. Its a strange theology, that in a word, lets every Christian make up his own laws, all the while ignoring what the finger of God himself wrote in stone: The 10 Commandments.

 

[FredVB]

So, though I can't see it from scripture, if living according to commandments from Yahweh God is finished and done away, not to be done now, what morality is there in its place to be done?