the Apostle Paul kept the Torah!

[bugkiller]

Hi bro, I dont getcha?

Maybe it is a pronoun problem. I do not think MoreCoffee is talking about the first century, but more like now. They (current time as in our day 22nd century) need it to be referring to pagans to support their theology.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

It seems to me, the cf site is allowing certain mj's to define mj here. Leaving out many jews and messianics in the process. It really ought not be done, but it sadly is.

Is that in the MJ section of the forum or the discussion here? I do not go to the MJ section as a rule for a couple obvious reasons.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

What is the place of the Law for someone who is NOT relying on it for redemption?

None, zero, zippo, nadda. The law or any law and grace are not compatable.

bugkiller

 

[Frogster]

What is the place of the Law for someone who is NOT relying on it for redemption?

yet why does scripture support faith righteousness? yeah sure, the law showed good boy, or bad boy, we know that, the elementals for children, the blocks in a row, the abc's of 4:3, the child of 4:1, under the strict pedagogue of 3:25, i don't need a pedagogue, i am a son, the wordage there means mature in gal 4:6 for sons.

 

[annier]

So who has the final authority to determine who is or is not MJ?

Evidently the powers that be here believe they do.

 

[annier]

Is that in the MJ section of the forum or the discussion here? I do not go to the MJ section as a rule for a couple obvious reasons.

bugkiller

Yes, the so called mj section which is nothing more than a hebrew roots/ one law forum.

 

[Frogster]

Maybe it is a pronoun problem. I do not think MoreCoffee is talking about the first century, but more like now. They (current time as in our day 22nd century) need it to be referring to pagans to support their theology.

bugkiller

yup.

 

[annier]

He observed the feasts.

Acts 18:20 NKJV
When they asked him to stay a longer time with them, he did not consent, 21 but took leave of them, saying, “I must by all means keep this coming feast in Jerusalem;[c] but I will return again to you, God willing.” And he sailed from Ephesus.

Not always.... for 3 years he did not
Gal 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.

However, He did go up to Jerusalem to keep the law. Nobody is keeping the feasts of the law anymore.

 

[annier]

I wonder if there is a difference in Torah observance and observing Jewish customs.

bugkiller

Yep, Jews call it a passover SEDER, for a reason. But to some here that does not matter they are gonna define what is and isn't Judaism, what is and isn't law. It is it's own replacement theology.

 

[Frogster]

Not always.... for 3 years he did not
Gal 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.

However, He did go up to Jerusalem to keep the law. Nobody is keeping the feasts of the law anymore.

good point, then there was the 14 year period, which could be 17, if it were after the peter visit there when he says again in 2:1, that he went to jerusalem, all proving no feasts.

 

[Steve Petersen]

Not always.... for 3 years he did not
Gal 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.

However, He did go up to Jerusalem to keep the law. Nobody is keeping the feasts of the law anymore.

Jews are keeping the Law by not doing the sacrifices. The Torah prohibits sacrificing anywhere but the place God chose in Jerusalem. No Temple, no sacrifice PER THE TORAH.

 

[Frogster]

Jews are keeping the Law by not doing the sacrifices. The Torah prohibits sacrificing anywhere but the place God chose in Jerusalem. Not Temple, no sacrifice PER THE TORAH.

well...bro, she has a good point, no jerusalem for 17 years.

i mean.... the temple was up with paul.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Jews are keeping the Law by not doing the sacrifices. The Torah prohibits sacrificing anywhere but the place God chose in Jerusalem. Not Temple, no sacrifice PER THE TORAH.

The Torah does not require sacrifices in the TEMPLE. The Torah predates the temple, doesn't it? Yes, it does. The Torah was about the tabernacle and the tabernacle was not in Jerusalem until David's time, wasn't it? Yes, it wasn't in Jerusalem until David's time. In fact, there was no Jerusalem until that time because it is a Jebusite town/village/city until that time.

So, Neither Jerusalem nor the temple is needed.

 

[bugkiller]

Yes, the so called mj section which is nothing more than a hebrew roots/ one law forum.

That is not even close to one of my considerations for not participating in that forum.

bugkiller

 

[Frogster]

paul did not go to temple for the passover, or to get undefiled for touching unclean things.

yep, he became as the gentiles in gal 4;12.

 

[bugkiller]

Not always.... for 3 years he did not
Gal 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.

However, He did go up to Jerusalem to keep the law. Nobody is keeping the feasts of the law anymore.

His purpose was not to keep the law.

Paul said he wanted to keep (observe) the feast and not the law. Paul's explicit purpose was to evangelize the Jew. One must realize the advantage to doing so at the feast. Jews would take this back home with them and spread it. It would be akin to what can happen at a truck stop with drivers from every part of the country. They take what they learn back home with them and talk about it.

bugkiller

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The Torah does not require sacrifices in the TEMPLE. The Torah predates the temple, doesn't it? Yes, it does. The Torah was about the tabernacle and the tabernacle was not in Jerusalem until David's time, wasn't it? Yes, it wasn't in Jerusalem until David's time. In fact, there was no Jerusalem until that time because it is a Jebusite town/village/city until that time.

So, Neither Jerusalem nor the temple is needed.

I bet the 4 groups of the 12 tribes of Israel camped around the tabernacle of Moses was an awesome sight!

Studies In The Scriptures - Tabernacle Shadows - Chapter 1

THE TYPICAL TABERNACLE​

The Camp--The Court--The Tabernacle--The Brazen Altar--The Laver-- The Table--The Lampstand--The Golden Altar--The Mercy Seat and Ark--The Gate--The First Veil--The Second Veil--The Significance of These and Their Antitypes.

 

[annier]

Jews are keeping the Law by not doing the sacrifices.

No, they are not breaking the law by attempting to keep an ACTUAL PASSOVER. They are not keeping the feasts of the law.

Le 23:37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:

The Torah prohibits sacrificing anywhere but the place God chose in
Jerusalem. Not Temple, no sacrifice PER THE TORAH.

Exactly, that is why they are not keeping a passover feast, but a SEDER.

 

[bugkiller]

Yep, Jews call it a passover SEDER, for a reason. But to some here that does not matter they are gonna define what is and isn't Judaism, what is and isn't law. It is it's own replacement theology.

I am sorry but I think you do not grasp what I ask/said.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

The question is, did Paul keep the Torah after his conversion?

Not if he was living like a Gentile in Antioch.

bugkiller