Why do some people think Hell isn't real?

[P1LGR1M]

I PM'd Satan and he said that all those bibles are ok, but he really doesn't like the Young's literal translation. He says he's not scary enough in that one.

PM him back and ask him how them gates are holding up.

God bless.

 

[dollarsbill]

I PM'd Satan and he said that all those bibles are ok, but he really doesn't like the Young's literal translation. He says he's not scary enough in that one.

You're in contact with Satan?

 

[Exjunkman]

You're in contact with Satan?

I was joking!


For the most part I ignore Satan. I think people give him way too much attention.

Resist the Devil and he will flee.

 

[SilenceInMotion]

I was joking!


For the most part I ignore Satan. I think people give him way too much attention.

Resist the Devil and he will flee.

Being that your very nature is Satanic, I doubt you are going to score high marks for benevolence.

 

[Stephen Kendall]

Kinda confused about that...

Can someone who doesn't believe in Hell give me a simple list of reasons why?

Just my belief. I believe that without God, it will be Hell for anyone. They in a sense will create their own hell by being neglected by God since they neglected him. Is God merciful to end their hell existence that they created? Otherwords, will he simply turn them to dust, nonexistence, to be merciful? I believe in God and trust him. I can not believe that he would not be involved in a correction of things, even the things that he did not create (their own hells). I believe that he will resolve their hells, turn them to dust. However, it is my hope that he will find a way to even save them after death (not part of scripture though). Either way, I can believe in him. I could not believe in a God who stokes the fires of Hell and tortures peoples there forever. For one thing, scriptures says that the evil die; but in a torturing Hell, they never die.

When I tell people about Jesus, I don't tell them a lot of things that the norm of Christianity does. I work for Jesus and not the Churches. I could never follow things and teach them to others that I don't believe in. We can be wrong in our lives, but we are still the ones that have to believe in things and to live them out. Let us be honest within ourselves. Our number one job as a Christian is to love God. I can do that by what I believe. Let no man or woman try to change my faith in obeying & following my Lord Jesus.

 

[strangertoo]

Just my belief. I believe that without God, it will be Hell for anyone.

one cannot be 'without God' , God is the spirit and it is the spirit that gives one physical life[soul] ... the spirit is not yours, it is God's , and it's only a temporary 'loan' of transient temporal life/lives as a man - :-

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

They in a sense will create their own hell by being neglected by God since they neglected him.

one has tribulation in life because of one's sin and that of most others , that ain't hell ... hell is a sleep in death according to Jesus , from which we all awake [Rev 20:13] ... also hell is used by some to describe the rubbish dump outside Jerusalem , 'gehenna' , Valley of the son of Hinnom, symbolic of the final trial of Love of the wicked after turning to Love after two lives of sin, baptism of fire in the lake of fire... all very symbolic, but it really isn't hell cos Jesus and all saints are trialled in Love by baptism of fire and its in life, not in death... also Jesus went to hell in death and called it a sleep , no mention of anything but unconciousness ... and frankly the dead are not alive, not souls until resurrected ,,, from the spirit... so hell is just a poetic concept reflecting the continuity of the soul between one life and the next, but that continuity is by the spirit, not by the soul [life] , nor could it be, the dead are unsurprisingly not alive, know nothing about being dead... don't even complain about being burned with fire to dust , in cremation...
the spirit however is of God, immortal, indestructible, and fully capable of creating, even re-creating souls in the new earth kingdom come...

Is God merciful to end their hell existence that they created?

I think you misunderstood, the dead know nothing in death in hell:-

Ecclesiastes 9:5 ... the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward...

the wages of sin is simply death, life is sufficient to deter folks from sin once they stop their denial that sin is the cause of almost all human unhappiness...

Otherwords, will he simply turn them to dust, nonexistence, to be merciful?

all very fine to kill sinners for sin, but God cannot destroy Himself, thespirit , and ALL men are resurrected by the spirit from death -Rev 20:13- fred of sin [Rom 6:7] to be baptised of the spirit at last [Joel 2:28] and countless many be saved [Rev 7:9-10] by works at judgement day [Rev 20:13] ...

I believe in God and trust him. I can not believe that he would not be involved in a correction of things, even the things that he did not create (their own hells).
I think that you created this whole idea and it is time it was destroyed

However, it is my hope that he will find a way to even save them after death (not part of scripture though).

just read a bit more scripture [or stop sinning so God can baptise you now] and you will see it is of scripture :-

all are freed from hell -Rev 20:13 - and those that die a second death in the kingdom come of Jesus in the new earth will accept Jesus in the lake of fire , Jesus' promise on that, also much prophecy of God that His pleasure is that the wicked will turn from sin to Love... and He WILL do ALL His pleasure...

Revelation 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.


Philippians 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

Either way, I can believe in him. I could not believe in a God who stokes the fires of Hell and tortures peoples there forever. For one thing, scriptures says that the evil die; but in a torturing Hell, they never die.

well good for you , now you can read the scripture and see that your intuition about God's Love is written down too

there really is nothing gained by flogging dead horses for ever ,or dead people... it really is quite inane that Satan managed to con folks into being afraid of such a bizrre unloving tale , nut the more impossible the more folks believe it [Hitler said that, even wrote it down ! ]

When I tell people about Jesus, I don't tell them a lot of things that the norm of Christianity does.

good for you , look where christianity of sinners is headed -Rev 13:3-4 - all the world worshipping Saran as the wrong god...

I work for Jesus and not the Churches.

saints have no time for churches any more [since the seven churcges of God were destroyed by Rome in the Roman take-over of Christ's name for its pagan religion and killing of so many saints for keeping sabbaths against orders of the pagan Roman emperor [who crucified Peter and is now claimed to have been given power by Peter ... more than unlikely as Peter was never given power over Jesus' church, Jesus said he would ALWAYS lead it himslef, even in the new earth... saints are too busy anyway helping the poor and looking for new saints worldwide as Jesus instructed

I could never follow things and teach them to others that I don't believe in.

well done, but you are outnunbered of course , as are the saints... one in millions, but it is enough for God's Declared foolproof Plan...

We can be wrong in our lives, but we are still the ones that have to believe in things and to live them out.

indeed faith in Love is enough to get one baptised of the spirit if one does the Love and not sin...

Let us be honest within ourselves. Our number one job as a Christian is to love God.

yes , and we Love God by obeying His commands , which involves loving even those foolish enough not to love us. even those who kill us and ours...

I can do that by what I believe. Let no man or woman try to change my faith in obeying & following my Lord Jesus.

awesome friend understand all three baptisms and the foundation of God, and help Jesus run the kingdom in the new earth where the many are saved :-

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

 

[he-man]

all are freed from hell -Rev 20:13 - and those that die a second death in the kingdom come of Jesus in the new earth will accept Jesus in the lake of fire , Jesus' promise on that, also much prophecy of God that His pleasure is that the wicked will turn from sin to Love... and He WILL do ALL His pleasure...

Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Jas 2:26 For as the body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

 

[P1LGR1M]

Being that your very nature is Satanic, I doubt you are going to score high marks for benevolence.

Since when is a bad sense of humor...satanic?

God bless.

 

[SilenceInMotion]

Since when is a bad sense of humor...satanic?

God bless.

God invented humor. It is centrifugal to our very nature as being His image- notice that humans are the only ones that can interpret humor- we are the only species who can find something to be hilarious.

To be honest, I was just pea-shooting. I have no idea the course of this thread

 

[ByGraceOnly]

just read a bit more scripture [or stop sinning so God can baptise you now] and you will see it is of scripture :-

all are freed from hell -Rev 20:13 - and those that die a second death in the kingdom come of Jesus in the new earth will accept Jesus in the lake of fire , Jesus' promise on that, also much prophecy of God that His pleasure is that the wicked will turn from sin to Love... and He WILL do ALL His pleasure...

Revelation 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.


Philippians 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;.

The Bible doesn't teach eventual salvation for all. Phil 2 is just showing that all in the next world will not be able to deny anymore that Jesus is God. They'll see it.

It says in Ecclesiastes that God has set eternity in all our hearts. We'll exist forever. And death often refers to physical death in the Bible, not death of the spirit. Late in Revelation, for example, John sees the dead standing. So they'd died physically but were still alive spiritually.

Other verses of note:

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal. Matthew 25:46

Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25

He that believes on him is not condemned; but he that believes not is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. John 3:18

Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuousness, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I’ve warned you before, those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21

Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life and that they may enter the city by the gates. Outside are the dogs and sorcerers and the sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood. Revelation 22:14, 15

 

[Hillsage]

The Bible doesn't teach eventual salvation for all. Phil 2 is just showing that all in the next world will not be able to deny anymore that Jesus is God. They'll see it.

You're right, they'll SEE...just like 'doubting Thomas saw...and believed AFTER HE SAW. You do believe he is saved I hope.

It says in Ecclesiastes that God has set eternity in all our hearts. We'll exist forever. And death often refers to physical death in the Bible, not death of the spirit. Late in Revelation, for example, John sees the dead standing. So they'd died physically but were still alive spiritually.

So is orthodoxy correct or not, since they say everybody is spiritually dead to start with? If that's what you believe then don't you also have to believe that all these 'dead people' who are alive, are alive because they must have somehow got a 'born again' in spirit....PRAISE BE TO GOD.

1PE 4:6 For this is why the gospel was preached even to the dead, that though judged in the flesh like men (EG DEAD), they might live in the spirit like God.

I think it is wonderful that God preached to these 'dead people' so that they too might SEE and believe and "live in the spirit like God"?

Other verses of note:

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal. Matthew 25:46

Is this a judgment based upon not believing Jesus was savior, or is it a judgment based upon works?

MAT 25:45 Then he will answer them, 'Truly, I say to you, as you did it not to one of the least of these, you did it not to me.'

Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25

Is not your God omniscient? How come He is now throwing people into a fire made only for the devil and his angels? The fire of hell is simply the tool given to the devil and his angels to bring us into submission and humbleness.

1TI 1:20 Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

When one understands that Satan is merely a tool created by God to be used for God and His plans/purposes, then they will see a more awesome plan than they were taught IMO.

Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuousness, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I’ve warned you before, those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21

As I look at the sins on this list, it's pretty obvious that 'the church' has no hope then. Especially since this verse is written to the church concerning how 'they' are to act. You take it out of context to think it is only speaking of the unsaved.

Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life and that they may enter the city by the gates. Outside are the dogs and sorcerers/PHARMAKOS and the sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood. Revelation 22:14, 15

And since sorcerer in this verse means anyone taking prescription drugs, then once again it sounds like there's not much hope for 'the church'. I guess that 'narrow gate' may be narrower than most sinning, pill popping Christians really realize.

5333 pharmakos: a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extens.) a magician.

Or, maybe they don't realize 'the truth' as much as they think they do.

 

[ByGraceOnly]

Hillsage: "As I look at the sins on this list, it's pretty obvious that 'the church' has no hope then. Especially since this verse is written to the church concerning how 'they' are to act. You take it out of context to think it is only speaking of the unsaved."

Paul is saying that those who consistently practice such things as a lifestyle are not saved. After the list of sins, he says, "I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God."

So he is NOT speaking of saved people here, because saved people WILL inherit the kingdom of God.

My Bible commentary on this verse says, "The unregenerate are barred from entering the spiritual kingdom of redeemed people over whom Christ rules, and they will be excluded from his millennial kingdom and the eternal state of blessing that follows it."

 

[strangertoo]

2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

consider that it's a mistranslation that has misled you ... see also the Rotherham Emphasised Bible translation similar to this by Robert Young Ll.D.:-

2Thess 2:9 {YLT] who shall suffer justice—destruction age-during—from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,

to wait an age for resurrection is a common fate indeed... of all sinners

 

[Hillsage]

Paul is saying that those who consistently practice such things as a lifestyle are not saved. After the list of sins, he says, "I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God."

I find it ironic that your username is By GRACE ONLY. Based upon what you just posted shouldn't you be adding 'plus those who don't' "consistently practice those things as a lifestyle."? I personally don't see Paul adding that qualifier, I think sin is sin. And if you can justify "Adultry and Fornication" (from that scripture) as being OK 'once in a while' as long as they aren't a "lifestyle"...well lets just say I disagree.

And we will differ on another point also, because I don't believe he is talking about heaven in the hereafter in that verse, I believe he is talking about the Kingdom of God here and now. 'That' kingdom of promises and blessings which are received 'here and now' when you meet the requirements of submission to His Lordship. Notice Galatians says you choose to receive/inherit His life now by choosing to "walk in the spirit". It's contrasting the "flesh" list of sins, with the fruit of the spirit (Gal 5:22). And if you don't 'walk in the spirit', then you are still under the temporal consequences of the law and subsequent death here and now.

Question; Do you receive an inheritance when you die, or when someone else dies? The answer is someone else. And what do we inherit from the death of Jesus?

ROM 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not food and drink but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit; We inherit the Fruits of the Spirit in the kingdom of God here and now. But only if we cultivate them with a lifestyle of being 'spirit led'.

So he is NOT speaking of saved people here, because saved people WILL inherit the kingdom of God.

Hopefully you see why I disagree.

My Bible commentary on this verse says, "The unregenerate are barred from entering the spiritual kingdom of redeemed people over whom Christ rules, and they will be excluded from his millennial kingdom and the eternal state of blessing that follows it."

I believe that Christ only rules in me if I submit to him and his lordship here and now. Does your church not teach that you are to rule and reign WITH Christ in the hereafter?

 

[strangertoo]

I don't believe he is talking about heaven in the hereafter in that verse, I believe he is talking about the Kingdom of God here and now. 'That' kingdom of promises and blessings which are received 'here and now' when you meet the requirements of submission to His Lordship. Notice Galatians says you choose to receive/inherit His life now by choosing to "walk in the spirit". It's contrasting the "flesh" list of sins, with the fruit of the spirit (Gal 5:22). And if you don't 'walk in the spirit', then you are still under the temporal consequences of the law and subsequent death here and now.

the kingdom is certainly in the heart and minds of the few saints of this earth [Matt 7:14] and the rest are destroyed for sin[Matt 7:13] , but that is hardly the end of salvation when Jesus takes the few 144,000 saints of this earth and destroys everyone else and this earth and heavens... for we know the few rule as kings and priests on earth and that Jesus says his kingdom is not in THIS earth and Peter says that righteousness is in the new earth and heavens, not in this earth and heavens...

and we know that countless many are saved later [Rev 7:9-10] after the millennium :-

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

clearly the kings and priests have to rule and minister to someone and the only ones they can so so for are the billions of sinners resurrected from this earth to the new earth kingdom of Jesus [Rev 20:13] , freed from sin by death [Rom 6:7] so they can be baptised by God at last [Joel 2:28] and countless many saved [Rev 7:9-10] at judgement day by works [Rev 20:13] not grace which saves only the first few in this earth...

2 Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

 

[he-man]

consider that it's a mistranslation that has misled you ... see also the Rotherham Emphasised Bible translation similar to this by Robert Young Ll.D.:-

2Thess 2:9 {YLT] who shall suffer justice—destruction age-during—from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,

to wait an age for resurrection is a common fate indeed... of all sinners

destruction age-during- age everlasting, aions of aions, forever, never to see the face of God.

2 Thessalonians 1:9 (WEY)
9 They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, being banished from the presence of the Lord and from His glorious majesty,
2 Thessalonians 1:9 (ESV)
9 ...eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,

Codex Sinaiticus ...an eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might;

 

[Hillsage]

destruction age-during- age everlasting, aions of aions, forever, never to see the face of God.

2 Thessalonians 1:9 (WEY)
9 They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, being banished from the presence of the Lord and from His glorious majesty,
2 Thessalonians 1:9 (ESV)
9 ...eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,

Codex Sinaiticus ...an eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might;

YLT 2TH 1:9 who shall suffer justice - destruction age-during - from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,

CLT 2Th 1:9 who shall incur the justice of eonian extermination from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of His strength --

When these two translations are considered, the consistency and relevancy of what they say is good and they reveal a pattern that's supportive of 'the truth'. Your translations are neither. Either the noun is wrong or the verb is wrong. You either have ETERNAL DESTRUCTING or you can have and AGE LONG DESTRUCTION. Anything that is being destroyed for ALL eternity is obviously INDESTRUCTIBLE. Your translations simply reveal indoctrinated hearts that are bound to defend where they are at. But unfortunately that is a position which is also in opposition to being led by the Spirit of truth...wherever it may lead.

Hearts believing eternal torture for ever and ever simply portray a likeness of God that is reflective of the hearts of men and not the God of purposeful 'endless mercy' and 'love'.

 

[he-man]

YLT 2TH 1:9 who shall suffer justice - destruction age-during - from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,

CLT 2Th 1:9 who shall incur the justice of eonian extermination from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of His strength --

When these two translations are considered, the consistency and relevancy of what they say is good and they reveal a pattern that's supportive of 'the truth'. Your translations are neither. Either the noun is wrong or the verb is wrong. You either have ETERNAL DESTRUCTING or you can have and AGE LONG DESTRUCTION. Anything that is being destroyed for ALL eternity is obviously INDESTRUCTIBLE. Your translations simply reveal indoctrinated hearts that are bound to defend where they are at. But unfortunately that is a position which is also in opposition to being led by the Spirit of truth...wherever it may lead.


Hearts believing eternal torture for ever and ever simply portray a likeness of God that is reflective of the hearts of men and not the God of purposeful 'endless mercy' and 'love'.

That is what I said, eternal destruction is t[FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]he [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]destruction [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]that one experiences, [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]annihilation [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]both complete and in process, [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ruin, [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif](so usu. LXX; Ep. Arist. 167; Philo, Aet. M. 20; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]74; Jos., Ant. 15, 62, Vi. 272; Test. Dan 4: 5; but [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]also in Polyb., Plut., Epict. et al. [Ndgeli 35]; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]therm. Wr. 12, 16; PGM 4, 1247f [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]παραδιδωμι[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]σε[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]εις[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]το[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]μελαν[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]χαος[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]εν[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]τηρηοις[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]απωλειαις[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif] Ac 25: 16 t.r.; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif](w. [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ολεθρον[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif])[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]βυθιζειν[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ειςο[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]και[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]απωλεια[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif],[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]plunge into utter [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]destruction [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]1 Ti 6: 9; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ειωαι[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]εισ[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]απωλεια[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif],[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]perish [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]Ac 8: 20; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]-[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]προς[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]τηρηοις[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ιδιαν[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]απωλεια[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif],[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]to their own ruin [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]2 Pt 3: 16; [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif](w. [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]πλανη[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]) 2 Cl 1: 7. Esp. of eternal destruction.

1. [FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]JH Moulton and G Milligan[/FONT]
2. [FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]A Greek-English Lexicon[/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]by William Arndt and F Wilbur Gingrich[/FONT]

[/FONT]Their only punishment is that they will never see the Face of God and they will be vaporized like smoke, into a state of oblivion not to be remembered ever, for all eternity. No second chance.

 

[Hillsage]

That is what I said, eternal destruction is t[FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]he [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]destruction [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]that one experiences, [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]annihilation [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]both complete and in process, [/FONT][FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]ruin, [/FONT]

[FONT=Bookman Old Style, serif]I do see where you are coming from, I just disagree with the word 'ETERNAL'. That's why I quoted the two references I did. They didn't say "eternal", they said "age during", and "aionion" which is the adjective form of the noun 'aion/age'. Therefore "aionion" means pertaining to an age.[/FONT] In the context of this verse it is the destruction which pertains to 'that age' that it takes place in.

Their only punishment is that they will never see the Face of God and they will be vaporized like smoke, into a state of oblivion not to be remembered ever, for all eternity. No second chance.

I agree with you, 'that' is their "punishment"...which is different than eternal punishing. But I believe they are only punished "during" "the "age" of punishing. And the purpose of punishment/judgment is corrective and not annihilative. Its purpose is to eternally eliminate sin, or anything else, which is contrary to God. It is not to eliminate sinners whom God loves, but to fulfill God's desire that they too may be "saved; yet so as by fire." (1Cor 3:15)

 

[strangertoo]

destruction age-during- age everlasting, aions of aions, forever, never to see the face of God.

2 Thessalonians 1:9 (WEY)
9 They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, being banished from the presence of the Lord and from His glorious majesty,
2 Thessalonians 1:9 (ESV)
9 ...eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,

Codex Sinaiticus ...an eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might;

it's just a mistranslation
the literal meaning in KJV :
who shall suffer justice—destruction age-during—from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,

we already know the MANY are destroyed for an age - Matt 7:13
only FEW saved at Jesus' return Matt 7:14
and the MANY, rest of the dead , do not live again until after the Millennium
Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.
then countless MANY are saved by works [Rev 20:13, Rev 7:9-10] after all the MANY are resurreceted from hell [so there is no 'eternal hell' either , that is exactly the same mistranslation]... we know hell ends here because death is denied after the hell and death thrown into the lake of fire....

so it's as wel to use a literal translation whenever you see the words 'eternal, forever, for ever and ever, etc... there is no infinity of time, as Jesus says, he is the END ... there would be no end if time could be infinite... but all creations end, only God is endless , and God is ONE, not many spirits...

You should also also realise that God says His pleasure is that the wicked turn to Love instead and that God has said from the begining that He will do all His pleasure , Jesus too says that when he is king all creation will accept him, and that ALL are resurrected from hell [Rev 20:13] so Jesus says the same that all will bow to him accepting his command to Love, not sin any more...

so that proves the mistranslation ... also Jesus was destroyed ]'apoleia'] in crucifixion... destruction is not permanent because it cannot be, nothing can destroy the spirit of a man because it is of God... God is one spirit and there is no other ...nothing can destroy or punish or harm God...