How some creationists pushed me away from christianity

[Non sequitur]

No it is like I am saying that if one experiences the reality of God you don't doubt His existence.

So, all Christians on here who have experienced his reality, but have doubts sometimes, are called what?

 

[Skaloop]

I see.

And FYI, just got home; no voicemail for Jason.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I said it once (I think) and I'll say again. Confirmation bias.

Plenty of people lost their jobs, went out of work, and were generally screwed over in the last couple years. Given the recent economic troubles and U.S.'s high Christian population, that means that there were millions of people praying who were given no help.

What percentage of these people were praying and how many people were given no help?

It seems illogical to take this one exception and make a sign out of it. It's the earthquake effect. An entire city is devastated, but one small child is pulled from the ruins unharmed. People praise God for this miraculous occurring, but were they right to do so? Because of the large population being exposed to the earthquake, it was bound to happen. It also begs the question, why didn't God just stop the earthquake if we was in the business of saving people?

First of all, I put it out there and if you feel it is illogical for me to attribute it to God then that is your right. Like I said I don't feel I need to defend my experience and I understand that my experience doesn't prove anything.

Secondly, death to God is quite different than it is to us. Is it right to claim one small child as a miracle? I think we always celebrate life over death.

But lets continue, where do you live? That are places where Aurora Borealis is quite common.

Once again, Nebraska.

 

[Oncedeceived]

And FYI, just got home; no voicemail for Jason.

Another day perhaps.

 

[Oncedeceived]

So, all Christians on here who have experienced his reality, but have doubts sometimes, are called what?

Uh...Christians.

If you know someone exists it is pretty hard to doubt their existence after that. We doubt in other things, but once you know God is real how do you unknow that?

 

[Skaloop]

Uh...Christians.

If you know someone exists it is pretty hard to doubt their existence after that. We doubt in other things, but once you know God is real how do you unknow that?

Apparently, by not being given a sign when sincerely asking for one during a period of doubt.

 

[MoonLancer]

Uh...Christians.

If you know someone exists it is pretty hard to doubt their existence after that. We doubt in other things, but once you know God is real how do you unknow that?

happens all the time? People don't unknow other peoples existence.

Many Christians unknow Gods existence and become nonbelievers. You can claim they were simply not christian, but the truth is that they were at one point just like you.

God is not a someone but an idea people desperately want to be true.

 

[Paul 5]

I do believe that I struck a nerve,the reason that modern science cannot be superior to the christian faith is that it begins with a lie and everyone knows that it is a lie,we all can see and experience that our world is full to the brim of intelligent design,however the world of science cannot admit to intelligent design lest it move people toward a creator,then to a God, and then to a Saviour, and then all those folks miss hell, can't have that.

 

[Simply_Amazing]

What percentage of these people were praying and how many people were given no help?

I don't know how many were praying, but we have 9.1 percent unemployment, a widening gap between rich and poor, and an overwhelmingly Christian population.

First of all, I put it out there and if you feel it is illogical for me to attribute it to God then that is your right. Like I said I don't feel I need to defend my experience and I understand that my experience doesn't prove anything.

That's fine then. As long as you don't try to use your subjective experience to convince others, then we're fine here.

Secondly, death to God is quite different than it is to us. Is it right to claim one small child as a miracle? I think we always celebrate life over death.

I understand the Christian concept of preferring death (and going to heaven) over life and I abhor it. But regardless, my argument only works if you are trying to claim the child as a miracle in the first place.

Once again, Nebraska.

In that case, it wouldn't be something that happens all the time, but not uncommon.

 

[Oncedeceived]

And FYI, just got home; no voicemail for Jason.

Just a little piece of advice:

save the number, remember the name.

There maybe a time later down the road that you find this coming into your life. It maybe a certain twist to the event, God always leaves room for doubt.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Apparently, by not being given a sign when sincerely asking for one during a period of doubt.

I am going to change my response slightly here. You may be right. God does always leave an avenue open for our choices to come in. In my life, I don't doubt God's existence because it has been proven to me beyond doubt. I shouldn't have assumed that to be the case with everyone. I stand corrected.

 

[FrenchyBearpaw]

I do believe that I struck a nerve,the reason that modern science cannot be superior to the christian faith is that it begins with a lie and everyone knows that it is a lie,we all can see and experience that our world is full to the brim of intelligent design,however the world of science cannot admit to intelligent design lest it move people toward a creator,then to a God, and then to a Saviour, and then all those folks miss hell, can't have that.

Then why do men get hernias? 'Cause having your testes migrate through your abdominal wall, leaving a weak spot isn't so intelligent. Or wisdom teeth? A good designer would have done well to leave those out. Not to mention nipples on males. Or a coccyx? Or an appendix? Or a yolk sack? Body hairs for crying out loud - what's with that in humans? Or erector pili muscles, thats just frivolous don't you think? No, I'm going to go with unintelligently designed unless you can demonstrate otherwise. Ok?

 

[Oncedeceived]

I don't know how many were praying, but we have 9.1 percent unemployment, a widening gap between rich and poor, and an overwhelmingly Christian population.

Yes, true. I could say that the United States was at its best, Christians were pretty united in faith, at least in most of the basic tenets of faith. That has changed, and some Christians have decided that those things that were once considered tenets of the faith are not. Our culture has changed and so has the way some in our faith have come to believe. I think that has something to do with it, but that is just opinion. Again, no proof, just thoughts.

That's fine then. As long as you don't try to use your subjective experience to convince others, then we're fine here.

Then we are fine.

I understand the Christian concept of preferring death (and going to heaven) over life and I abhor it.

You misunderstood what I said. I said God sees death differently, not Christians.

But regardless, my argument only works if you are trying to claim the child as a miracle in the first place.

I would have no idea.

In that case, it wouldn't be something that happens all the time, but not uncommon.

I guess that would depend on what you mean by uncommon.

 

[Oncedeceived]

happens all the time? People don't unknow other peoples existence.

What?

Many Christians unknow Gods existence and become nonbelievers.

I would like to ask these Christians about their knowing God's existence prior to them becoming unbelievers.

You can claim they were simply not christian, but the truth is that they were at one point just like you.

I never claimed any such thing.

God is not a someone but an idea people desperately want to be true.

Thanks for your opinion.

 

[Skaloop]

Just a little piece of advice:

save the number, remember the name.

There maybe a time later down the road that you find this coming into your life. It maybe a certain twist to the event, God always leaves room for doubt.

OK, what would you say to this (which is what happened):

I was trying to think of a good example of a really specific thing that could happen to make me question my views about God-given signs. As I was thinking, my cell phone rang. It was a number I didn't recognize, but I answered. The guy apologized for the wrong number. So, that's why I decided to use a wrong number situation for my example.

Now, some might call that in itself a sign, by giving me the inspiration. And if so, should the specific number and name I mentioned ever come up, it would be an ever bigger deal. Essentially, it comes down to sending me a sign that I wouldn't recognize as a sign (since wrong numbers are far from uncommon) in order to set me up for a sign that I would recognize as one!

 

[Cabal]

I do believe that I struck a nerve,the reason that modern science cannot be superior to the christian faith is that it begins with a lie and everyone knows that it is a lie,we all can see and experience that our world is full to the brim of intelligent design,however the world of science cannot admit to intelligent design lest it move people toward a creator,then to a God, and then to a Saviour, and then all those folks miss hell, can't have that.

Scientists wish for people to go to hell?

Who exactly is the liar here, Paul?

 

[Oncedeceived]

OK, what would you say to this (which is what happened):

I was trying to think of a good example of a really specific thing that could happen to make me question my views about God-given signs. As I was thinking, my cell phone rang. It was a number I didn't recognize, but I answered. The guy apologized for the wrong number. So, that's why I decided to use a wrong number situation for my example.

Now, some might call that in itself a sign, by giving me the inspiration. And if so, should the specific number and name I mentioned ever come up, it would be an ever bigger deal. Essentially, it comes down to sending me a sign that I wouldn't recognize as a sign (since wrong numbers are far from uncommon) in order to set me up for a sign that I would recognize as one!

I agree. Here is another thing, what if you decided to call that number and Jason answered. Then you could say, well that isn't the sign I asked for. Room for doubt...yes?

 

[AV1611VET]

So, all Christians on here who have experienced his reality, but have doubts sometimes, are called what?

Normal.

 

[AV1611VET]

Scientists wish for people to go to hell?

YES or NO -- did Darwin [hopefully] make a deathbed conversion?

In your opinion, of course.

 

[Cabal]

YES or NO -- did Darwin [hopefully] make a deathbed conversion?

In your opinion, of course.

Not answering this question - I already explained why it doesn't imply what you think it does when we last discussed it. It does not involve wishing for Darwin to be in hell, so kindly address the topic instead.

Oh, and just to remind you, some of your brothers in Christ are scientists also, so I'd be careful what you imply.